Australian Cycling Forums - Bicycles Network Australia

AndyTheMan wrote:Look, I just had to sign in and comment on this!

I am a CEO and as such I am responsible for all the employees in my organisation.

Quite frankly, I am frustrated that someone would consider taking a sick day to go riding by themselves in the sunshine

It is COMPLETELY unacceptable for any of my staff to have a day off to go cycling, UNLESS they ensure that I am invited, that I am informed well in advance so that I can also chuck a sickie (and let my PA know to cancel all meetings), and that we make the most out of it my getting in at least 100kms....

Seriously, its selfish to have a sick day and go riding without inviting your boss to come along with you!

hahaha, I had to chuckle at this. Im one of the Directors in my firm also and feel exactly the same way. How rude, not to be invited.

But on a serious note, asking for a day off to go riding if the employee asking is up front and transparent about it is one thing. Taking a paid sickie while not being sick and going for a ride to 'fool' the boss is another. There is some abuse of trust there. Not all bosses are !! BAN ME NOW FOR SWEARING !!, and some will be happy to let ya do it, if your honest. I know I would if your normally a hard worker.

Not an issue for me. I work 4 on, 4 off. I get more ride days in without having to get up at 0 dark hundred or having to chuck a sickie.

I have to say 99% of the sickies I do have are actually as carers leave to look after the kids or my wife when they are crook.

If one of my employees ASKED me if they could have the day off to ride and we weren't busy I would say fine, maybe even join them, and treat as leave without pay or annual leave. But when one of them takes they day off without notice and is not good. I have some people that have used all their sick leave entitlements (10/year) by July so if they really get sick there is no pay left for them. Sick days really hurt our production so the fewer fake one we have the better we can run the business, compete with China and keep people employed.

But on a serious note, asking for a day off to go riding if the employee asking is up front and transparent about it is one thing. Taking a paid sickie while not being sick and going for a ride to 'fool' the boss is another. There is some abuse of trust there. Not all bosses are wonderful people, and some will be happy to let ya do it, if your honest. I know I would if your normally a hard worker

Yeah, point taken.

I am really flexible with my staff and find it pays off in spades - I would like to think that if one of them wanted a day (or a half day) off for something that they would tell me whats its for - and to be honest I'm pretty sure that's exactly what they do.

I'm a relatively young CEO (mid 30's) and I remember a decade ago when my first bosses were old school - start at 9am, lunch from 12 til 1, leave at 5pm - what happened? all the young, talented, enthusiastic staff just left those places to find somewhere they liked to be. All the old school, 'this is how we did it in my day' people stayed and those places stagnate.

The most successful companies in the world are run by kids, in jeans, who turn up late and ride skateboards down the corridors (seriously, who wouldn't want to say they were responsible for google, or apple, or facebook or reddit, or skype, or ebay) - these places don't just let their staff take a day off to go riding, you can bet your ar$e they would PAY for the best bikes and probably build the staff a private velodrome, AND fly Bradley Wiggins over to have lunch with the guys after the ride.....

I take that attitude that if you have good staff, you need to work to retain them, and whilst my staff know that they can come in at 9.30 if they feel like it, you can bet your ar$e that they make up for if for the time they are in the office/with clients.

As a matter of fact, I have one staff member in particular who I have to FORCE to go home... seriously!, it will be 7 or 8pm, I'll be leaving and he is still in the office. Its crazy. Having said that, I did buy him a new company car as a bonus at the end of last financial year.... I'm yet to convince him that cycling is the future, but I'll get there.....

but if I find one of my staff on a ride without inviting me...so help me god....!!

AndyTheMan wrote:

But on a serious note, asking for a day off to go riding if the employee asking is up front and transparent about it is one thing. Taking a paid sickie while not being sick and going for a ride to 'fool' the boss is another. There is some abuse of trust there. Not all bosses are wonderful people, and some will be happy to let ya do it, if your honest. I know I would if your normally a hard worker

Yeah, point taken.

I am really flexible with my staff and find it pays off in spades - I would like to think that if one of them wanted a day (or a half day) off for something that they would tell me whats its for - and to be honest I'm pretty sure that's exactly what they do.

I'm a relatively young CEO (mid 30's) and I remember a decade ago when my first bosses were old school - start at 9am, lunch from 12 til 1, leave at 5pm - what happened? all the young, talented, enthusiastic staff just left those places to find somewhere they liked to be. All the old school, 'this is how we did it in my day' people stayed and those places stagnate.

The most successful companies in the world are run by kids, in jeans, who turn up late and ride skateboards down the corridors (seriously, who wouldn't want to say they were responsible for google, or apple, or facebook or reddit, or skype, or ebay) - these places don't just let their staff take a day off to go riding, you can bet your ar$e they would PAY for the best bikes and probably build the staff a private velodrome, AND fly Bradley Wiggins over to have lunch with the guys after the ride.....

I take that attitude that if you have good staff, you need to work to retain them, and whilst my staff know that they can come in at 9.30 if they feel like it, you can bet your ar$e that they make up for if for the time they are in the office/with clients.

As a matter of fact, I have one staff member in particular who I have to FORCE to go home... seriously!, it will be 7 or 8pm, I'll be leaving and he is still in the office. Its crazy. Having said that, I did buy him a new company car as a bonus at the end of last financial year.... I'm yet to convince him that cycling is the future, but I'll get there.....

but if I find one of my staff on a ride without inviting me...so help me god....!!

Your a good bloke Andy. Im the same age mate. Gone are the days you mentioned of old school bosses. Things have certainly changed, but yeah if work was a bit slow and we had someone to cover the work load I see no problem if the invite was extended. hehe

jimsheedy wrote:Ok whats worse. Taking a sickie to go cycling or chatting on an internet cycling forum while you're at work?

Welll, seeing as my previous post was on company time...

We're allowed a certain amount of private use of the IT gear as long as we follow the rules and I have no problem using it between tasks. More than once I've logged in, read one post then got back to it after a dozen or so moves to find out my quota time has gone. Meh, enjoy it when yer can.

Seems to me the less one earns, the less flexibility ones employer will grant. I know several people who were sacked for taking a sickie and not getting a medical certificate. Just happened to need less staff did that pos company.

I left them when they billed me for a chair i broke by sitting on it!

Over the last 11-12 years with my employer I've accrued approx 90 sick/personal leave days and I still have 59 left. Thisincludes two occassions over those years where I've needed to stay home ill for a weeks period, so it's a rarity where I'll take a day off. Unless Iam sick enough to need it.

As a result both my Manager and the Director of our team have both told me on numerous occassions that if I ever want to take any "mental health days", that is perfectly fine.

Probably the only reason I don't is that it would leave my team to pick up the slack for the day (which they can easily do and would not have an issue with it at all), but it still wouldn't feel right to me.

Doing behind everyone's back I don't agree with but if its pre-arranged and people know about it then I think its fine.

Dave

What about another conundrum (before starting Ill let you know I wasnt being paid this was a work placement for university). I had the day off sick I wasnt feeling great but I probably could of gone in and possibly would of been worse the next day. I was sick but not terribly and after a sleep in and multiple hours of doing nothing I went for a ride (about 30min before I would of finished work anyway), it was just a really cruisy ride so nothing too serious but while out I was hit by a car ended up in hospital and havent been back to placement yet (as I cant do physio with a broken finger). Now my conundrum is I was not feeling great at all but now my boss thinks I was just faking it, and I still have to recieve a mark from him. Just somthing to think about.

Flexi hours are a blessing in this regard. I usually work 9 hours a day, instead of the required 7.5 hours because I find it such an effort to have to wake up, get dressed and commute to work every day and then back. I figure that once I am at work and the weather is average I may as well slog it out and have a longer day. Once I accumulate my 7.5 hours I will wait for a good weather forecast and then give a couple of days notice to my manager that I will be having the day off to go cycling or surfing. They know I work hard and do the hours, so it's not an issue. Everyone wins. It's a good policy.

vander wrote:What about another conundrum (before starting Ill let you know I wasnt being paid this was a work placement for university). I had the day off sick I wasnt feeling great but I probably could of gone in and possibly would of been worse the next day. I was sick but not terribly and after a sleep in and multiple hours of doing nothing I went for a ride (about 30min before I would of finished work anyway), it was just a really cruisy ride so nothing too serious but while out I was hit by a car ended up in hospital and havent been back to placement yet (as I cant do physio with a broken finger). Now my conundrum is I was not feeling great at all but now my boss thinks I was just faking it, and I still have to recieve a mark from him. Just somthing to think about.

Tell your boss that you were riding to the chemist to get pain killers?

thecaptn wrote:Hi all,

In the past I've known "people" who have rung in to work sick just because the weather is nice and they want to ride their bike. Is this ok or is bad practice?

Does it depend on the level of professionalism expected of their occupation ie, a) a heart surgeon or b) shopping trolley collector?

Has anyone on the site ever heard of "someone" who has done this?

Any feedback will be greatly appreciated, ta,
Pete

Profession is irrelevant. It comes down to work ethic....

As much as I'd love to take a sickie and go for a ride I just can't do it.. it makes my blood boil when I see the same people taking sick days when it's clear as day they're not sick - not only are they cheating the boss but also their workmates who may have to pick up their slack

More flexibilty in the work hours would definitely help i think.. a nine day fortnight would be awesome.

I've found going for a run at lunchtime (shower after) works wonders

skcycle wrote:

thecaptn wrote:Hi all,

In the past I've known "people" who have rung in to work sick just because the weather is nice and they want to ride their bike. Is this ok or is bad practice?

Does it depend on the level of professionalism expected of their occupation ie, a) a heart surgeon or b) shopping trolley collector?

Has anyone on the site ever heard of "someone" who has done this?

Any feedback will be greatly appreciated, ta,
Pete

Profession is irrelevant. It comes down to work ethic....

I agree, profession is irrelevant, its about the professionalism of the person and flexibility of the organisation.

How many times have we seen bosses/managers who will not allow flexiblity? My brother had a boss who would not give him leave at the time when his wife was due to have a baby..... but then it was OK for the boss to pop out for lunch with the mates, or a game of golf every other day!

Its got to be consistent - how can you be a boss, and get all !! BAN ME NOW FOR SWEARING !! for your staff taking sickies, when you yourself see the benefits in 'flexibility' to hit the golf course, or to deal with your own personal stuff....

Everything has to apply equally across the board. Thats how I work it. If I expect that work will be flexible for me, then it needs to be the same for everyone - otherwise you end up with people being disheartened, annoyed and quite frankly they then don't give a rats about taking a sick day...

Haha gee take a guess who are the managers/bosses in this thread.

I would take a sickie and have but then again I'm in a low position and easily replaceable for the day.

rpmspinman wrote:
Your a good bloke Andy. Im the same age mate. Gone are the days you mentioned of old school bosses. Things have certainly changed, but yeah if work was a bit slow and we had someone to cover the work load I see no problem if the invite was extended. hehe

Not quite gone i'm sorry to say, that's how my last employer lost me, ridiculous petty stuff. In 4 years i never got a thank you. Current place of work couldn't be more different, mutual respect, a much more relaxed, healthier environment. It should be obvious, but when staff are happy and healthy, they do a MUCH better job.

Get back to work you whinging bludgers. Someone has to keep the country running.

Give my regards to the working classes

master6 wrote:Get back to work you whinging bludgers. Someone has to keep the country running.

Give my regards to the working classes

cowering; I'll never go to the pub again. Promise. And I'll give you back your $2.00 too. Promise.

Ah yes, work, the curse of the cycling class

ldrcycles wrote:

rpmspinman wrote:
Your a good bloke Andy. Im the same age mate. Gone are the days you mentioned of old school bosses. Things have certainly changed, but yeah if work was a bit slow and we had someone to cover the work load I see no problem if the invite was extended. hehe

Not quite gone i'm sorry to say, that's how my last employer lost me, ridiculous petty stuff. In 4 years i never got a thank you. Current place of work couldn't be more different, mutual respect, a much more relaxed, healthier environment. It should be obvious, but when staff are happy and healthy, they do a MUCH better job.

Well I dont agree with the way your last employer treated you. I for one worked for a boss (before I chose to run my own business) who thought I should be fortunate to have a job let alone ANY time off, a pay rise, or any benefits at all (he avoided paying Super back then too thru legal loopholes). All he ever did was sprout off his race cars in our faces on a weekly basis, flashed his cash, no word of thanks or gratitude. Rocking up to work 5mins late was frowned upon by the management and dealt with strictly. Internet usage was banned, laughing or enjoying yourself in the office was looked upon as not doing work, and any mistakes you made you were hauled over the coals severely. When it did come to mistakes, everyone would blame someone else out of fear, and you had to keep a minute by minute log of all your activities to prove your innocence. Guilty until proven innocent as they say. I withstood 3 years of stress and grief in that office before I moved on. So I kinda know how you felt. I promised myself to never treat MY staff that way and that respect needs to be a 2 way street. An enjoyable working environment is a productive one and employees will want to stay. Your service/product is as good as the staff your hire.

Haha gee take a guess who are the managers/bosses in this thread.

I would take a sickie and have but then again I'm in a low position and easily replaceable for the day.

My admin staff might be 'easily replaced' but they are also the face of the organisation - they are the people that everyone deals with, they answer the phones, unlock in the morning and are the first faces people see when they turn up to events in our boardroom. They are just as important as the management team, perhaps more so, because if a manager is in a bad mood, he can hide in the office - the 'front of house' people are out there, up front, everyday.

It pays to ensure that they are just as happy as everyone else, and get to feel respected and looked after. A team is as good as its weakest link.

As an example, you could have the best bike store in the country, with the best back of house mechanic, super awesome gear, unreal prices - but if the young guy that serves me is a dick, I'm probably unlikely ever to go back there... we see this ALL THE TIME On this forum, where people have been disheartened by service form the guy out front.

For all we know, that guys serving is a bit disheartened and doesn't really care - you see, his boss sees him as a lowly sales person, unimportant.... he can't take a few hours for an early morning ride in the sun.

The boss/owner on the other hand, comes and goes as he pleases..has all the flexibility. Turns up when he likes and then ducks out for coffee with his mates..

Which one would have the potential to have the most impact on a successful business?

Last night I had an interesting conversation with my MD.. I asked him if I could take the 26th off because I was going to see a physio to get fitted properly once and for all. He offered to take it out of my sick pay (as I hadnt taken a sick day in the 6 years I have been working here!) While I was on the subject of cycling I posed the question about whether he would like to sponsor me for next years ride to conquer cancer and he is willing to donate 2k to the cause.....My MD isn't really into cycling but he understands that i love riding... So there are company's out there that understand that a happy worker is a productive worker and I hope that when I open my firm I follow in those some values and beliefs.

AndyTheMan wrote:

Haha gee take a guess who are the managers/bosses in this thread.

I would take a sickie and have but then again I'm in a low position and easily replaceable for the day.

My admin staff might be 'easily replaced' but they are also the face of the organisation - they are the people that everyone deals with, they answer the phones, unlock in the morning and are the first faces people see when they turn up to events in our boardroom. They are just as important as the management team, perhaps more so, because if a manager is in a bad mood, he can hide in the office - the 'front of house' people are out there, up front, everyday.

It pays to ensure that they are just as happy as everyone else, and get to feel respected and looked after. A team is as good as its weakest link.

As an example, you could have the best bike store in the country, with the best back of house mechanic, super awesome gear, unreal prices - but if the young guy that serves me is a dick, I'm probably unlikely ever to go back there... we see this ALL THE TIME On this forum, where people have been disheartened by service form the guy out front.

For all we know, that guys serving is a bit disheartened and doesn't really care - you see, his boss sees him as a lowly sales person, unimportant.... he can't take a few hours for an early morning ride in the sun.

The boss/owner on the other hand, comes and goes as he pleases..has all the flexibility. Turns up when he likes and then ducks out for coffee with his mates..

Which one would have the potential to have the most impact on a successful business?

You, Sir deserve to be sitting on a bigger pile than Gina, respect.

Shaun

I had a situation this week where I read my roster wrong and took Tuesday off when I was supposed to be working. It was a perfect 22 degrees and Sunny. 45kms into my ride, I take a quick break and check my phone. Two missed calls from work asking where the hell I was. I had to sprint the 15km home and get my arse over there! Felt pretty crap afterwards for letting people down. I think it might have been my cycling oriented unconscious mind telling me 'no, you're on Wednesday, Tuesday is for cycling!'

If you're company allows for a certain number of sick days or personal leave days, why not take them? I don't see any problem with it. Unfortunately I have worked some jobs where I've just about been falling over (flu + tonsillitis) for 15 hours, coughing and hacking like a madman and had to battle through because our teams were so small and I couldn't really take days off. That was hell.

The litmus test for me is whether or not you need to lie about it. It's clearly wrong if call up work and have to lie about feeling sick to go for a bike ride. If there is a no questions asked attitude to sick days, and it's pretty clear decent workers take days to go to the snow or beach, then I'd be doing so too.

I have another spin on this too. If you are worried about taking a sickie for this reason, you could ask your boss whether or not you could occasionally take a last minute annual leave day when the weather is brilliant, your work load is not critical and you feel like a big bike ride. They might appreciate your attitude towards it and encourage you to take such a day as personal leave day, assuming they are that sort of boss at all. It could be a good way to test the water if you don't feel good about taking a sickie to bike ride.