New to longer rides....bonking

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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby casual_cyclist » Fri Jun 14, 2013 11:22 am

Wakatuki wrote:But do most of us agree, Durianrider is bananas?

Definintely!
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by BNA » Fri Jun 14, 2013 12:55 pm

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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby Mulger bill » Fri Jun 14, 2013 12:55 pm

Bananas like a fox.
Leaving trails of search hits all round the place like yer back veranda after the possums've had a party.
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby foo on patrol » Fri Jun 14, 2013 1:59 pm

I wanna know how eating 20 bananas a day, you stop your potassium levels going through the roof? :?

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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby Wakatuki » Fri Jun 14, 2013 2:59 pm

foo on patrol wrote:I wanna know how eating 20 bananas a day, you stop your potassium levels going through the roof? :?

Foo

Ohhh Foo! Thats just an invite for it all to start again..
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby iaintas » Fri Jun 14, 2013 4:41 pm

foo on patrol wrote:I wanna know how eating 20 bananas a day, you stop your potassium levels going through the roof? :?

Foo


Actually that is pretty easy to understand if you have a few minutes

http://ajprenal.physiology.org/content/274/5/F817.full

if you dont want to read it ignore the fact i posted the actual link, but it basically says "it is genetics from clinically obese mothers that have spawned monkey children :wink:"

Madeup, I., Ifino, F. (2006), Potassium and your mother, Australian Journal of fruitloops 1(1) doi:666 jcrap01011
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby Venus62 » Fri Jun 14, 2013 5:22 pm

iaintas wrote:Madeup, I., Ifino, F. (2006), Potassium and your mother, Australian Journal of fruitloops 1(1) doi:666 jcrap01011


I shall have to ask my library if we can get a subscription to this journal. It looks like something I would enjoy. :D
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby trailgumby » Fri Jun 14, 2013 6:33 pm

I think they let durian rider go off the front and out of sight to give the air time to clear, so they don't have to smell the results of his banana-induced jet propulsion, erm, exhaust gases, erm, unignited afterburner.

I certainly would.

Has anyone got a match? :D
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Sat Jun 15, 2013 5:08 pm

trailgumby wrote:I think they let durian rider go off the front and out of sight to give the air time to clear, so they don't have to smell the results of his banana-induced jet propulsion, erm, exhaust gases, erm, unignited afterburner.

I certainly would.

Has anyone got a match? :D

The better strategy is to take off a little quick and getting out in front of him.

Other than his own claims it is damned hard to find anything that indicates that durian beats anyone at all. Indeed that he even competes. (I've seen a DNF or DNS recorded somewhere but not much else.)

Unless you find the stuff that is sourced from FIGJAM himself. There is plenty of that in a google listing. I can't take his recent superhuman KOM brags seriously either.

Amazing for an accomplished international athlete to not show up anywhere on results sheets. Amazing even for anyone who competes at the back of the pack for that matter.

I'm suspecting hallucinogenic effects of smoking dried banana skins taking him to another reality. You might instead offer the match to Durian to light up said banana skins. :mrgreen:
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby durianrider » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:20 pm

ColinOldnCranky wrote:
trailgumby wrote:I think they let durian rider go off the front and out of sight to give the air time to clear, so they don't have to smell the results of his banana-induced jet propulsion, erm, exhaust gases, erm, unignited afterburner.

I certainly would.

Has anyone got a match? :D

The better strategy is to take off a little quick and getting out in front of him.

Other than his own claims it is damned hard to find anything that indicates that durian beats anyone at all. Indeed that he even competes. (I've seen a DNF or DNS recorded somewhere but not much else.)

Unless you find the stuff that is sourced from FIGJAM himself. There is plenty of that in a google listing. I can't take his recent superhuman KOM brags seriously either.

Amazing for an accomplished international athlete to not show up anywhere on results sheets. Amazing even for anyone who competes at the back of the pack for that matter.

I'm suspecting hallucinogenic effects of smoking dried banana skins taking him to another reality. You might instead offer the match to Durian to light up said banana skins. :mrgreen:



Yes its true, I have DNF'd in a race back in 2011 after crashing out down a rock slope. Did anyone see the results for the south australian road champs today? Who won that?

Correct, I never won a race when I raced in Belgium. Means my advice is meaningless. Better to listen to the overweight doctor at the clinic you just paid 80$ to get some more cholesterol lowering meds. Its just genetic NOTHING to do with diet and lifestyle.. :roll:

Oh, all my strava data, I just made it all up. I hooked up a power meter to a motor scooter and just ride that around everywhere. Im actually 6ft and 90kg. Its all muscle though! honest!
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby durianrider » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:25 pm

Venus62, how nice of you to glaze over my request for you to link that study.

I knew I was right.

That was a good excuse 'Ive got a secret password, its CONFIDENTIAL TOP SECRET data regarding the sodium intake minimum indicated by Dahl. L. I know you would get 20 years in prison for putting up a screenshot of the paragraph where Dahl. L gave his minimum sodium recommendations.

Maybe next time you pass me on a climb you can give me a bit of a push so I can catch my breath. ;)
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby durianrider » Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:33 pm

Toolish wrote:
durianrider wrote:Even Ironman triathlon runners competing in 12-hour long races require no sodium supplementation.


That is a big call to make. Craig Alexander and Chris McCormack both heavily suppliment with salt tablets, both pretty good athletes. McCormack actually credits learning how to replace his salt lost through sweat as one of the keys to unlocking Kona as without the salt he kept blowing up with cramps during the marathon.

From a personal viewpoint even for a 70.3 taking salt helps me perform.

There is some medical research out there suggesting the salt is not required, but the day to day evidence seems to suggest it is. Given the medical profession really does not understand cramping properly I am going to go with what I know for now.


Crowie & Macca would be on a bit more than salt tablets mate. McCormack contradicts himself in his book saying 'gatorade is crap! full of sugar!'. Then a few chapters later he says 'coke is my race secret, the sugars keep the muscles working and the caffeine gives you a bit of a pick up'.

Maybe they are running sub 2:40 marathons AFTER solo TT of 180km in humid and hot conditions from drinking a bit of sea water on the swim leg?
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Sun Jun 16, 2013 1:50 am

durianrider wrote:Yes its true, I have DNF'd in a race back in 2011 after crashing out down a rock slope. Did anyone see the results for the south australian road champs today? Who won that?

Correct, I never won a race when I raced in Belgium. Means my advice is meaningless.


To avoid the significant point I raise you focus on the irrelevancy in there. Get your head into gear and read what I am saying bananas - the signficant issue being that there is little indication that you have done ANYTHING other than your own claims. Still waiting for a list of such that is somewhat as comprehenisve as your claims. I am sure you will have something somewhere. Bor for quantity I have no trouble finding your many claims.

durianrider wrote:Better to listen to the overweight doctor at the clinic you just paid 80$ to get some more cholesterol lowering meds.

Weight and condition of those who disagree with you is irrelevant, as indeed is your own particular body. The guy that researches to a high standard and publishes in peer reviewed journals for all to pick to pieces is the guy that has somehthing to offer. Even if he is wheelchair bound, fat, eats poorly or whatever.

My own condition is pretty damned good and I have around thirty years age on you. THe probablility is that you will not be as fit as me when you are my age. But I eat a diet that I do not recommend. In science the significance of a sample of one is not very great. Many have told you this so I don't imagine that my comment will change anything though.

durianrider wrote:Oh, all my strava data, I just made it all up. I hooked up a power meter to a motor scooter and just ride that around everywhere. Im actually 6ft and 90kg. Its all muscle though! honest!
Quite likely. More likely than your claim anyway.

I never saw your response whenTim W' pointedly unearthed some of your supporting documentation, courtesy of photoshop apparently. (http://www.bicycles.net.au/forums/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=61166&hilit=durian%2A+base+mile&start=225 Tim W post of Feb 20th)

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I do trust however that you did go go back and either delete all trace of the graph or went back and did a better edit of it. Comment?
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby Venus62 » Sun Jun 16, 2013 7:19 am

durianrider wrote:Venus62, how nice of you to glaze over my request for you to link that study.

I knew I was right.

That was a good excuse 'Ive got a secret password, its CONFIDENTIAL TOP SECRET data regarding the sodium intake minimum indicated by Dahl. L. I know you would get 20 years in prison for putting up a screenshot of the paragraph where Dahl. L gave his minimum sodium recommendations.

Maybe next time you pass me on a climb you can give me a bit of a push so I can catch my breath. ;)


I provided a direct quote from the article about minimum sodium recommendation but you chose not to believe it. I tried to explain why I couldn't post a direct link but once again you have turned it into a conspiracy theory. And once again you have ignored the point that YOU were citing an article you hadn't read, nor even seen. In my line of work that is misconduct. Frankly I don't care as long as others don't believe the crap you are making up.

And as you have no intelligent comment, it's back to "I'm better than you on a bike". Thankfully I have a very balanced life (as well as diet) and my prowess on a bike does not define me. Now please go and bore someone else.
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby iaintas » Sun Jun 16, 2013 7:39 am

Venus62 wrote:
durianrider wrote:Venus62, how nice of you to glaze over my request for you to link that study.

I knew I was right.

That was a good excuse 'Ive got a secret password, its CONFIDENTIAL TOP SECRET data regarding the sodium intake minimum indicated by Dahl. L. I know you would get 20 years in prison for putting up a screenshot of the paragraph where Dahl. L gave his minimum sodium recommendations.

Maybe next time you pass me on a climb you can give me a bit of a push so I can catch my breath. ;)


I provided a direct quote from the article about minimum sodium recommendation but you chose not to believe it. I tried to explain why I couldn't post a direct link but once again you have turned it into a conspiracy theory. And once again you have ignored the point that YOU were citing an article you hadn't read, nor even seen. In my line of work that is misconduct. Frankly I don't care as long as others don't believe the crap you are making up.

And as you have no intelligent comment, it's back to "I'm better than you on a bike". Thankfully I have a very balanced life (as well as diet) and my prowess on a bike does not define me. Now please go and bore someone else.


Actually a significant number of journals are password protected! its pretty normal in the world of "peer reviewed, statistically relevent scientific research". A screen shot wouldnt help as these studies are often significanly longer than one screen and would require someone with basic statistical knowledge to understand. I am sure Durian if you want you could pay to access scientific journals and maybe you could go to university to undertake some courses in mathamatics and statistics, or maybe even some biochemistry and physiology. That certainly would help your course in converting people to Raw Vegan and might even paint you as an expert.

Uni enrolements are probably open for next sememster if your interested!
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby Toolish » Sun Jun 16, 2013 7:51 pm

durianrider wrote:
Toolish wrote:
durianrider wrote:Even Ironman triathlon runners competing in 12-hour long races require no sodium supplementation.


That is a big call to make. Craig Alexander and Chris McCormack both heavily suppliment with salt tablets, both pretty good athletes. McCormack actually credits learning how to replace his salt lost through sweat as one of the keys to unlocking Kona as without the salt he kept blowing up with cramps during the marathon.

From a personal viewpoint even for a 70.3 taking salt helps me perform.

There is some medical research out there suggesting the salt is not required, but the day to day evidence seems to suggest it is. Given the medical profession really does not understand cramping properly I am going to go with what I know for now.


Crowie & Macca would be on a bit more than salt tablets mate. McCormack contradicts himself in his book saying 'gatorade is crap! full of sugar!'. Then a few chapters later he says 'coke is my race secret, the sugars keep the muscles working and the caffeine gives you a bit of a pick up'.

Maybe they are running sub 2:40 marathons AFTER solo TT of 180km in humid and hot conditions from drinking a bit of sea water on the swim leg?


I said that they used salt tablets...not that they ONLY used salt tablets. It has been a while since I read Maccas book but I am pretty sure he was refering to Gatorade being crap in regards to salt supplementation. It advertises itself as a 'sports' drink when it is really just sugar.

Either way Macca and Crowie both use salt, Pete Jacobs raves about Shots electrolyte tablets (salt supplementation) so the last 6 mens Kona have been won by guys that salt supplement, even though you say it is not required.
Not sure what that last sentence of yours is meant to mean?
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby Magnum9 » Sun Jun 16, 2013 9:04 pm

Regarding strava data, digitalepo.com can make you the best athlete in the world without anyone being the wiser.
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby Wakatuki » Mon Jun 17, 2013 9:11 am

Magnum9 wrote:Regarding Strava data, digitalepo.com can make you the best athlete in the world without anyone being the wiser.

This is horrific... You're only cheating yourself, as a mate found out. He always got PB's and KOM when out on his own, then a new fast guy joined our group of misfits. He soon got caught. :lol: very :oops: Won't even ride with us now. (he was using his car)
Back on topic....
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby casual_cyclist » Mon Jun 17, 2013 12:27 pm

ColinOldnCranky wrote:
durianrider wrote:Yes its true, I have DNF'd in a race back in 2011 after crashing out down a rock slope. Did anyone see the results for the south australian road champs today? Who won that?

Correct, I never won a race when I raced in Belgium. Means my advice is meaningless.


To avoid the significant point I raise you focus on the irrelevancy in there. Get your head into gear and read what I am saying bananas - the signficant issue being that there is little indication that you have done ANYTHING other than your own claims. Still waiting for a list of such that is somewhat as comprehenisve as your claims. I am sure you will have something somewhere. Bor for quantity I have no trouble finding your many claims.

- 2009 Australian 24hr Champs: DNF 17 12:01:31 Harley Johnstone DNF

- 2005 Mont 24hr: DNF 2 7:48:20 harley johnstone

- 2002 Canberra Tour, April 26-28; Dnf Harley Johnstone

I guess one could argue that if they didn’t actually finish a race, they weren’t truly beaten.

Then we have this claim:
“I am the 2008 South Australian 24-hour solo Cross Country Champion.”

I’d like to see Mr Johnstone direct people to a link that proves this and many of his results. I have been unable to verify many of his claims, which is odd given many results for state and national champs are often listed, with archives extending back to the early 2000′s in many cases.

You will need to scroll way down in the comments to find this:
http://paleozonenutrition.com/2011/03/05/30-bananas-a-day-durianrider-an-analysis-of-his-paleo-vegan-diet/
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby trailgumby » Mon Jun 17, 2013 2:56 pm

Well. well. :lol: Funny how the truth leaks out.

Seems like DR has been reading from the Lance Armstrong playbook: when challenged, sidestep the question and go on the attack. :roll:
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby casual_cyclist » Mon Jun 17, 2013 7:14 pm

trailgumby wrote:Well. well. :lol: Funny how the truth leaks out.

Seems like DR has been reading from the Lance Armstrong playbook: when challenged, sidestep the question and go on the attack. :roll:

He trolls lots of forums so it's easy to find this stuff.
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby durianrider » Mon Jun 17, 2013 7:28 pm

ColinOldnCranky wrote:
durianrider wrote:Yes its true, I have DNF'd in a race back in 2011 after crashing out down a rock slope. Did anyone see the results for the south australian road champs today? Who won that?

Correct, I never won a race when I raced in Belgium. Means my advice is meaningless.


To avoid the significant point I raise you focus on the irrelevancy in there. Get your head into gear and read what I am saying bananas - the signficant issue being that there is little indication that you have done ANYTHING other than your own claims. Still waiting for a list of such that is somewhat as comprehenisve as your claims. I am sure you will have something somewhere. Bor for quantity I have no trouble finding your many claims.

durianrider wrote:Better to listen to the overweight doctor at the clinic you just paid 80$ to get some more cholesterol lowering meds.

Weight and condition of those who disagree with you is irrelevant, as indeed is your own particular body. The guy that researches to a high standard and publishes in peer reviewed journals for all to pick to pieces is the guy that has somehthing to offer. Even if he is wheelchair bound, fat, eats poorly or whatever.

My own condition is pretty damned good and I have around thirty years age on you. THe probablility is that you will not be as fit as me when you are my age. But I eat a diet that I do not recommend. In science the significance of a sample of one is not very great. Many have told you this so I don't imagine that my comment will change anything though.

durianrider wrote:Oh, all my strava data, I just made it all up. I hooked up a power meter to a motor scooter and just ride that around everywhere. Im actually 6ft and 90kg. Its all muscle though! honest!
Quite likely. More likely than your claim anyway.

I never saw your response whenTim W' pointedly unearthed some of your supporting documentation, courtesy of photoshop apparently. (http://www.bicycles.net.au/forums/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=61166&hilit=durian%2A+base+mile&start=225 Tim W post of Feb 20th)

Image

I do trust however that you did go go back and either delete all trace of the graph or went back and did a better edit of it. Comment?



How confident are you Mr Anonymous? Im confident enough that everyone here knows my real name, what I look like and what part of Adelaide I live in. Would you be willing to put some wagers on the table to back up the claims you make about me? Mr Anonymous.
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby durianrider » Mon Jun 17, 2013 7:31 pm

Magnum9 wrote:Regarding strava data, digitalepo.com can make you the best athlete in the world without anyone being the wiser.


Unless you use a power meter and have heart rate data to support your efforts....

Thats the only way a vegan like Durianrider could be so fast. He is a digital doper. All the anonymous riders here are super athletes that wish to remain nameless. I understand. Wouldnt want your competition getting a one up on you. ;)
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby durianrider » Mon Jun 17, 2013 7:36 pm

casual_cyclist wrote:
ColinOldnCranky wrote:
durianrider wrote:Yes its true, I have DNF'd in a race back in 2011 after crashing out down a rock slope. Did anyone see the results for the south australian road champs today? Who won that?

Correct, I never won a race when I raced in Belgium. Means my advice is meaningless.


To avoid the significant point I raise you focus on the irrelevancy in there. Get your head into gear and read what I am saying bananas - the signficant issue being that there is little indication that you have done ANYTHING other than your own claims. Still waiting for a list of such that is somewhat as comprehenisve as your claims. I am sure you will have something somewhere. Bor for quantity I have no trouble finding your many claims.

- 2009 Australian 24hr Champs: DNF 17 12:01:31 Harley Johnstone DNF

- 2005 Mont 24hr: DNF 2 7:48:20 harley johnstone

- 2002 Canberra Tour, April 26-28; Dnf Harley Johnstone

I guess one could argue that if they didn’t actually finish a race, they weren’t truly beaten.

Then we have this claim:
“I am the 2008 South Australian 24-hour solo Cross Country Champion.”

I’d like to see Mr Johnstone direct people to a link that proves this and many of his results. I have been unable to verify many of his claims, which is odd given many results for state and national champs are often listed, with archives extending back to the early 2000′s in many cases.

You will need to scroll way down in the comments to find this:
http://paleozonenutrition.com/2011/03/05/30-bananas-a-day-durianrider-an-analysis-of-his-paleo-vegan-diet/


Ha ha. Now some 50+ year old lady in NZ who only puts up one or two photos of herself so she looks like a teenager in order to sell more 'paleo protein powder' to her gullible followers, googles up some old race results from events I DNF'd in. Pro riders don't even finish 70% of the races they do each year and I DNF' 3. I got a flat in the Canberra Tour and actually did finish but out of the time cut. I had a vasectomy before the 2005 mont and lasted a lap before I realized it was stupid to continue (got 9th the year before with NO support team) and 2009 24hr solo champs I did pull out with achilles tendonitis. So 3 races out of over a 100 I have pulled out of. Not bad. If I do something good, people say Im on drugs. If I DNF a race for medical reasons then its cos I don't eat meat pies..

Can't win in the eyes of the haters.
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby durianrider » Mon Jun 17, 2013 7:43 pm

Venus62 wrote:
durianrider wrote:Venus62, how nice of you to glaze over my request for you to link that study.

I knew I was right.

That was a good excuse 'Ive got a secret password, its CONFIDENTIAL TOP SECRET data regarding the sodium intake minimum indicated by Dahl. L. I know you would get 20 years in prison for putting up a screenshot of the paragraph where Dahl. L gave his minimum sodium recommendations.

Maybe next time you pass me on a climb you can give me a bit of a push so I can catch my breath. ;)


I provided a direct quote from the article about minimum sodium recommendation but you chose not to believe it. I tried to explain why I couldn't post a direct link but once again you have turned it into a conspiracy theory. And once again you have ignored the point that YOU were citing an article you hadn't read, nor even seen. In my line of work that is misconduct. Frankly I don't care as long as others don't believe the crap you are making up.

And as you have no intelligent comment, it's back to "I'm better than you on a bike". Thankfully I have a very balanced life (as well as diet) and my prowess on a bike does not define me. Now please go and bore someone else.


blah blah 'venus62'. Where is the link you claim to have read? Does it even exist? Care to share the link to this article you are citing? How about a screen shot of this 'top secret data'. I understand if it would mean 50 years in a max security prison for posting a screen shot of a sodium minimum RDA information. I guess we will just have to trust you on this one. ;)

Durianrider: Dahl L said that 50mg of sodium is the minimum limit needed by an adult human.
Venus62: You are WRONG! Ive special data to show its wrong, I just can't share it though cos the CIA will bash down my front door!

:roll:
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Re: New to longer rides....bonking

Postby rheicel » Mon Jun 17, 2013 7:53 pm

I love this thread!
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