New crankset for my MTB

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New crankset for my MTB

Postby redcorpsjames » Thu Jun 23, 2011 3:23 pm

Hey guys can anyone tell me if I can change my original crankset from this http://www.srsuntour-cycling.com/index. ... &tnid=3006 to this http://www.shimano.com.au/publish/conte ... ype-..html I do not know much about Mountain bikes
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by BNA » Thu Jun 23, 2011 3:55 pm

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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby familyguy » Thu Jun 23, 2011 3:55 pm

Both seem to be square taper, so they should swap over and be fine. I'd save a little bit more and go for another level or two up in terms of crank quality though, but thats me.

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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby redcorpsjames » Thu Jun 23, 2011 4:01 pm

I can spend up to 150 any other ideas
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby silentbutdeadly » Thu Jun 23, 2011 4:12 pm

Yep http://www.shimano.com.au/publish/conte ... ype-..html

from

http://www.evanscycles.com/products/shi ... query=m590

for around $80 including a new bottom bracket (an SM-BB51).

Or you could step up to http://www.evanscycles.com/products/shi ... t-ec008629 for an extra $15 or so but the only difference is the bottom bracket (an SM-BB50)

But I've no idea how the BB's differ either!
Last edited by silentbutdeadly on Thu Jun 23, 2011 4:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby Nobody » Thu Jun 23, 2011 4:14 pm

redcorpsjames wrote:Hey guys can anyone tell me if I can change my original crankset from this http://www.srsuntour-cycling.com/index. ... &tnid=3006 to this http://www.shimano.com.au/publish/conte ... ype-..html I do not know much about Mountain bikes
I can't see any good reason why you need to go a higher level in Shimano for general MTB. Just get them. Most MTB stuff has a hard life and you may trash any cranks you own in a relatively short time.

Two problems with Deore (and up) besides the extra cost are you need to get you BB shell faced for the external bearings. Also the bearings don't last as long as your current type because the seals are exposed to the spray of the front wheel. The advantage of the Deore is lighter weight and stiffer design. I have noticed a minor difference in stiffness, but I don't know whether it is worth the extra money and durability problem. If you are heavy it may be worth it.

I have two piece:
Tiagra 4500
R600
105 5600
XT M770

I also have some cheaper square taper cranks like the Alivio.
Last edited by Nobody on Thu Jun 23, 2011 6:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby m@ » Thu Jun 23, 2011 4:40 pm

Square-taper Deore will fit the existing BB and as a bonus is ten bucks cheaper than the two-piece set... I've run one on my commuter/shopping bike/occasional MTB for the last couple of years. They're getting hard to find though.
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby zero » Thu Jun 23, 2011 5:54 pm

m@ wrote:Square-taper Deore will fit the existing BB and as a bonus is ten bucks cheaper than the two-piece set... I've run one on my commuter/shopping bike/occasional MTB for the last couple of years. They're getting hard to find though.


Yeah there is an alivio 9 speed group now, and 10 speed deore, so they stopped making those.

I wouldn't worry about running 8 speed alivio cranksets anyway - so long as you are happy with a 42 rather a 44 big chainring - which is about 99% of all casuals. The crankset was never the weakpoint of the group, and I know the crankset works fine with 9 speed chains in an otherwise purely 9 speed group. The RD and shifters are the meh bits.

About 3 years ago, alivio cranksets got the deore style scoop-hollow (old is new), crank arms anyway, so I'm not convinced that other than maybe a slightly less durable middle ring, a few grams and the particular BB they fit, there is much difference.
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby brokenbus » Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:13 pm

I just stuck one of these on my Giant Boulder http://www.jensonusa.com/store/product/ ... AID=389818
Easy to do but you will need the right BB tools and some patience to set up the front deraileur. Its not a brazed one is it as you mighten have enough room to move it as it needs to come down about 10mm?
LBS says I will also need a 9sp chain- It runs ok with the 8sp one but rubs slightly when in little little and big big rings which you shouldnt do anyway. I am due for anew chain in the next month or so- Maybe its time for a 9speed shifter and um hydrolic brakes and------!!!
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby legsrburnin » Fri Jun 24, 2011 9:20 am

IMHO square taper BB's have their place, but you would rarely choose on over an external BB unless you're moving to something like a Tune Fastfoot crank

I dont mean to sound like a wonderful person, but-

Having raced MTB's for close to 10 years and raced bikes generally on and off for 30 years, but I've been through my share of cranks.

I dont know how many miles you plan on doing on it or what you're trying to achieve by upgrading the crank, but an external bearing BB is stiffer, places less strain on bearing and sorry to disagree with posts above, but will last as long as a square taper or longer when looked after (clean the bike!).
Think about it. There's a reason all low end cranks are square taper and high end are external BB.

External BB's any day. Cleaner, easier and tend to have less issues.

I've learnt a valuable lesson with bike components from the major brands. You tend to get what you pay for.

Go the Deore cranks if you can swing it.
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby zero » Fri Jun 24, 2011 1:26 pm

Speaking as an owner of the 2010 deore HT II crankset. meh.

no way of detecting stiffness. no impact on performance whatsoever even for a heavy, fit rider. (suspension moves first - 30psi tires would also move first). My road bike is sooo way stiff with an internal despite having a heavy rider and 177.5mm cranks, that the only blind test effect you'd ever notice is changing to cheap wheels, or a slow leak.

More frequent maintenance, and rather than just tightening, I have to buy new bearings seasonally too.

The -GOOD- thing about external cranks is the reliable attachment of the left crank arm.
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby alchemist » Fri Jun 24, 2011 1:51 pm

zero wrote:The -GOOD- thing about external cranks is the reliable attachment of the left crank arm.


You've not used FSA cranks then :P
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby m@ » Fri Jun 24, 2011 2:12 pm

alchemist wrote:
zero wrote:The -GOOD- thing about external cranks is the reliable attachment of the left crank arm.


You've not used FSA cranks then :P

They're not called Faulty Spares Attached for nothing ;)

Have to admit I knackered the NDS square-taper Deore by under-tightening it, but that's just user error. Not sure whether outboard BB cranks are any more reliable in this regard if not installed correctly?
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby Alistair » Fri Jun 24, 2011 2:32 pm

I would go for these, with the necessary external bearing bb. I switched from low-end shimano cranks to XT on one bike recently and couldn't believe the weight difference. Deore will be a fraction heavier, but the modern design is much better than the old stuff - in my opinion anyway.
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby DarrylH » Fri Jun 24, 2011 7:44 pm

Nobody: I don't know how you can say the seals are exposed to front wheel spray. They are between the crank and the bearing and as the cranks fit flush against the bearing they are more protected than previous types.
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby trailgumby » Fri Jun 24, 2011 8:06 pm

Nevertheless, their life can be shorter, although for some brands more than others. For example, FSA have a very poor reputation for BB longevity. The ones in my commuter died horribly. :wink:

The painful thing is that while FSA cranks are nominally 24.0mm, they're just a poofteenth too big for an XT bottom bracket to accept them. Just that weeny bit too tight to get them all the way into the correct lateral position. :( The new FSA BB seems to be OK so far.

OTOH, the Gigapipe BB in my original Mongoose hardtail went gritty on my first off-road ride. Now that sucked worse than the original FSA BB.
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby zero » Mon Jun 27, 2011 12:47 am

DarrylH wrote:Nobody: I don't know how you can say the seals are exposed to front wheel spray. They are between the crank and the bearing and as the cranks fit flush against the bearing they are more protected than previous types.


The crank sits against the rotating part of the bearing, not against the stationary part. The necessary split between the rotating and the stationary is outside the circumference of the crank - you can see the rotating part of the bearing clearly over the crank. My crank is grease stained in this area from a washing out effect, which started up pretty much first time I got rained on.

I've no doubt someone fitting XTR couldn't care less if preventative maint includes replacing the bearings frequently, but it doesn't fit the rationale behind deore.
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby Bentnose » Sat Jul 02, 2011 4:58 pm

Nobody wrote:
redcorpsjames wrote:Hey guys can anyone tell me if I can change my original crankset from this http://www.srsuntour-cycling.com/index. ... &tnid=3006 to this http://www.shimano.com.au/publish/conte ... ype-..html I do not know much about Mountain bikes
I can't see any good reason why you need to go a higher level in Shimano for general MTB. Just get them. Most MTB stuff has a hard life and you may trash any cranks you own in a relatively short time.

Two problems with Deore (and up) besides the extra cost are you need to get you BB shell faced for the external bearings. Also the bearings don't last as long as your current type because the seals are exposed to the spray of the front wheel. The advantage of the Deore is lighter weight and stiffer design. I have noticed a minor difference in stiffness, but I don't know whether it is worth the extra money and durability problem. If you are heavy it may be worth it.

I have two piece:
Tiagra 4500
R600
105 5600
XT M770

I also have some cheaper square taper cranks like the Alivio.


I can see a good reason to go higher than Deore, bling factor and I couldn't bring myself to ride a bike that has Alivio cranks, its just not the done thing!
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby Nobody » Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:01 pm

Bentnose wrote:I can see a good reason to go higher than Deore, bling factor and I couldn't bring myself to ride a bike that has Alivio cranks, its just not the done thing!
The el cheapo Shimano cranks I had on the MTB last year served me well. The only reason I changed was I wanted to go to shorter cranks.
Last edited by Nobody on Sun Jul 03, 2011 4:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby Bentnose » Sun Jul 03, 2011 2:05 pm

Nobody, everybody's different but I consider Alivio to be the high end groupset for people who ride on bike paths and Deore to be the entry level off-road groupset, I prefer higher than entry level so run SLX and XT. I had a set of Deore shifters for 7 years and still have a set of 8 year old Deore hubs I'll retire this year, but for me, I wouldn't buy a bike with any Alivio on it and I wouldn't replace any component with less than SLX.
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby trailgumby » Sun Jul 03, 2011 2:40 pm

Agreed on all counts. Additionally, I find the ergonomics of the lower end stuff to be horrible (read: tendonitis from the shifters) , it doesn't stay in adjustment very long, and wears out proportionately quickly (XTR* excluded). If you're a regular rider, anything less than Deore won't keep its reliability and consistency very long.

While it was my learner bike, being my first LBS-sourced bike and the first one I used heavily for commuting, my experience of the SX-4 transmission on my dear departed Mongoose Tyax hardtail was it constantly required adjustment, and the 8-speed transmission needed replacing completely every 1,500-2,000kms. If I'd spent more for a higher level spec (27-speed instead of 24) it would have cost less over its service life, and would have been much more reliable.

*With XTR its more about performance and weight, so while it lasts very well the price jump is a bit hard to digest. I do like the XTR chains, though... longest lasting of the ones I've found so far, now that Rohloff is out of production (hopefully only temporarily)
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby Nobody » Sun Jul 03, 2011 4:11 pm

That may be the case but we are only talking about cranks here. There are no bearings and only chainwheels to wear out (which don't wear out very fast anyway).The associated UN54 square taper BB would easily outlast any external bearing BB anyway and are cheap. I still don't think it is a bad choice.

Anyway this should be my last post in this thread.
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby Bentnose » Sun Jul 03, 2011 5:07 pm

So is this thread closed or does the OP need anymore advice, I feel we went a little off topic
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Re: New crankset for my MTB

Postby jules21 » Mon Jul 04, 2011 9:47 pm

familyguy wrote:Both seem to be square taper, so they should swap over and be fine.

actually i just bought a replacement set of Alivio square taper cranks that swapped over just fine. except that they sit further out on the BB, out of reach of the FD! presumably i need a narrower BB spindle. so not all square taper cranks are compatible.
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