Ideal MTB (See requirements)

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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby kunalraiker » Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:16 pm

trailgumby wrote:
uglybob wrote:a head-turning dualie for $1k? brand new? :|

Indeed. :|

Budget for a decent and capable dually brand with basic (that is, functional and reliable but heavy) components new starts at $2k if you scrounge runouts on last year models.

If this $1k is a hard limit, I would then seek to clarify what is meant by head-turning. Is it while you are riding? Hmmm, might be difficult. If, on the other hand, it's your own head after you've hit the deck and someone is putting you in the recovery position while emergency services is on the way, then that is achieved much more cheaply. ;) Cheap, light, strong: choose any two.

if you want a dually that fits most of the above requirements (including the head-turning WT? requirement) and has mostly XTR components I have a Cannondale that I *might* consider letting go for around $900. People who don't appreciate quality need not apply. It isn't new, naturally, for that price but is in outstanding condition and hasn't had much use. Includes carbon bars, tubeless tyre conversion and full-length cable housing for reliability. Will post a photo tonight if there is interest. Was my son's bike until he outgrew it. Medium frame size (he now rides my old bike, a Large).


Unfortunately I'am not in the same STATE as yourself.
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by BNA » Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:21 pm

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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby kunalraiker » Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:21 pm

Kenzo wrote:What sorts of bikes are your mates riding?
If you want them to turn their head to your bike, it probably should be more interesting / better than their bike...

However if they all know your budget and you manage to stretch to a Trance X3 or X2, then their heads will turn anyway... 'cause it is still better than they would have expected considering your lofty goal and your meagre budget to achieve it.



Sorry Sir, but I will have to disagree.
What qualifies as a good bike, most of the MTB's come with lifetime warranty on frame and parts so if something is broken they replace it right ?
I mean any bicycle that has rockshock or Fox shocks will be built to last right ?

Same with decent Shimano derailleurs and shifters.
I don't really need a carbon frame, what else am I looking out for.

Rather then pointing out at my budget, it would probably help if seasoned MTBers could point out some parts which I should definitely not sacrifice and what justifies getting them, not a reason like - it will lean out 250 more grams.
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby kunalraiker » Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:33 pm

silentbutdeadly wrote:
drubie wrote:
clackers wrote:You're an evil man, SBD! :-D


Evil is right - you'd never get a Recon to fit that frame cos it doesn't have the right head tube size :mrgreen:

However, if you did go to the trouble of fitting one, I'd be staring at you and the bike for a l-o-o-o-o-o-o-n-g time. Probably scratching my chin, noise-lessly wording "what the..."


With a decent hammer and a welder from SupercheapAuto I could get a Recon on the BSO...

But if you want a dual suspension bike for a grand that makes all who see it drop their jaws in awe AND you want it to move? That might be a bridge too far. I do believe, Sir, that you might be taking the mickey...


I visited a store today, had this extremely helpful Sales man talk me through different bike makes and models.Long Story Short, he's recommended a 29er for my requirements, brands we were discussing were GIANT and Specialist.
models Anthem and Camber Elite.
He reckons Elite is a worthy upgrade from the base model with the rear derailleur being the 2nd best among MTB's, plus other bits and pieces.
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby trailgumby » Mon Jan 23, 2012 7:42 pm

Lifetime warranty covers only frame, and on Cannondale the structural parts of the fork (ie, not the internals, which are usually made by the likes of Fox or Rockshox). The rest of the components such as drive train, bars, saddle, brakes aetc re warranted for a maximum of 2 years.

Now, you need to understand this clearly: in most cases warranty is only against faults in manufacturing. Crash or abuse damage is almost never covered by warranty although I seee Van Nicholas is advertising a crash replacement policy on their Titanium frames. So if you're taking six foot drops to flat on a Cannondale Scalpel or Giant Anthem, and it breaks, you're not covered. And they're pretty good at pickup up on that sort of stuff, through practice. Neither is general in-use wear and tear covered.

The reason people have focussed on your unrealistic budget and have responded as I have with "Tell 'im 'e's dreamin'!" is because ... you are. Decent new, duallies are to be had around the $2.5k mark or higher. That is just a market fact unless you are able to sniff out a very rare bargain, lowest of whch I've seen for something I'd consider able to take the work I'd give it is $1.7k.

Second hand is more achievable within your budget if you are prepared to look at bikes a couple of years old.

Minimum component level I'd accept on any bike for frequent off-road use is Shimano Deore or SRAM X5, and that's the whole shebang not just a rear derailleur tacked onto a bike with supermarket level everything else. Shimano's stuff is generally better though at this entry level point. At the extreme other end of the price range SRAM XX is almost as good as XTR, where it comes down to being a little lighter but more agricultral-feeling (SRAM) versus giving a way a couple of grams and feeling *really* nice to use (Shimano).

On a Deore level bike I'd be looking closely at shocks and forks. The Anthem will still be functional with a non-pedal platform shock as it uses chain tention to tighten up the suspensin under pedalling loads, not so sure about the Camber.
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Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby Kenzo » Mon Jan 23, 2012 8:08 pm

kunalraiker wrote:
Kenzo wrote:What sorts of bikes are your mates riding?
If you want them to turn their head to your bike, it probably should be more interesting / better than their bike...

However if they all know your budget and you manage to stretch to a Trance X3 or X2, then their heads will turn anyway... 'cause it is still better than they would have expected considering your lofty goal and your meagre budget to achieve it.



Sorry Sir, but I will have to disagree.
What qualifies as a good bike, most of the MTB's come with lifetime warranty on frame and parts so if something is broken they replace it right ?
I mean any bicycle that has rockshock or Fox shocks will be built to last right ?

Same with decent Shimano derailleurs and shifters.
I don't really need a carbon frame, what else am I looking out for.

Rather then pointing out at my budget, it would probably help if seasoned MTBers could point out some parts which I should definitely not sacrifice and what justifies getting them, not a reason like - it will lean out 250 more grams.


trailgumby wrote:The reason people have focussed on your unrealistic budget and have responded as I have with "Tell 'im 'e's dreamin'!" is because ... you are. Decent new, duallies are to be had around the $2.5k mark or higher. That is just a market fact unless you are able to sniff out a very rare bargain, lowest of whch I've seen for something I'd consider able to take the work I'd give it is $1.7k.


Your budget of $1k is a seriously limiting factor if you want to create "wow". I used to have a Santa Cruz Blur, the frame and rear shock alone retailed for almost $3k... Now that is a seriously fantastic bike! But my 2012 Giant Anthem rides just as well as the Blur and as a complete bike fitted with XT group set was at $2999 RRP.

As for swapping out parts, then you start spending real money as buying complete bikes the manufacturers get massive discounts 'cause they buy in bulk but you'd be buying a piece at a time... Plus the cost of someone fitting the parts or buying the bike tools to do it yourself..

You mentioned the salesman talking about Giant Anthem 29ers.
The Anthem 29er X1 is a great buy, I'm sure they can bring the price down to get very close to $2k... Just be prepared to fork out more $ for a better saddle made for cruising and not racing. Plus be ready for the Elixir brake squeal which can be sorted out by replacing the brake pads with 'organic' pads.. I recommend EBC Green pads at around $25 per brake/end.
http://www.giant-bicycles.com/en-au/bik ... 712/50967/
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby Gabe » Mon Jan 23, 2012 8:23 pm

Have a look at CUBE bikes, they're starting to establish themselves in Australia now (or at least the MTBs are, the road bikes are already common) and they are sweet looking machines. My next MTB is almost certainly going to be a CUBE, probably a Stereo. They're a bit pricey but it's German engineering, and they're not common here (yet) so people will take notice. Mind you, the main reason for getting a bike should be that it's awesome to ride.. and I would recommend above all else taking a bike you're interested in for a test run, different people like different bikes
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby kunalraiker » Mon Jan 23, 2012 8:38 pm

Gabe wrote:Have a look at CUBE bikes, they're starting to establish themselves in Australia now (or at least the MTBs are, the road bikes are already common) and they are sweet looking machines. My next MTB is almost certainly going to be a CUBE, probably a Stereo. They're a bit pricey but it's German engineering, and they're not common here (yet) so people will take notice. Mind you, the main reason for getting a bike should be that it's awesome to ride.. and I would recommend above all else taking a bike you're interested in for a test run, different people like different bikes

I totally agree with you, and as I did mention in one of my previous post, the wow factor I iterated has been taken way out of proportion, seems like its lit a few fires, but hey will check out the CUBE.
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby kunalraiker » Mon Jan 23, 2012 8:42 pm

Kenzo wrote:
kunalraiker wrote:
Kenzo wrote:What sorts of bikes are your mates riding?
If you want them to turn their head to your bike, it probably should be more interesting / better than their bike...

However if they all know your budget and you manage to stretch to a Trance X3 or X2, then their heads will turn anyway... 'cause it is still better than they would have expected considering your lofty goal and your meagre budget to achieve it.



Sorry Sir, but I will have to disagree.
What qualifies as a good bike, most of the MTB's come with lifetime warranty on frame and parts so if something is broken they replace it right ?
I mean any bicycle that has rockshock or Fox shocks will be built to last right ?

Same with decent Shimano derailleurs and shifters.
I don't really need a carbon frame, what else am I looking out for.

Rather then pointing out at my budget, it would probably help if seasoned MTBers could point out some parts which I should definitely not sacrifice and what justifies getting them, not a reason like - it will lean out 250 more grams.


trailgumby wrote:The reason people have focussed on your unrealistic budget and have responded as I have with "Tell 'im 'e's dreamin'!" is because ... you are. Decent new, duallies are to be had around the $2.5k mark or higher. That is just a market fact unless you are able to sniff out a very rare bargain, lowest of whch I've seen for something I'd consider able to take the work I'd give it is $1.7k.


Your budget of $1k is a seriously limiting factor if you want to create "wow". I used to have a Santa Cruz Blur, the frame and rear shock alone retailed for almost $3k... Now that is a seriously fantastic bike! But my 2012 Giant Anthem rides just as well as the Blur and as a complete bike fitted with XT group set was at $2999 RRP.

As for swapping out parts, then you start spending real money as buying complete bikes the manufacturers get massive discounts 'cause they buy in bulk but you'd be buying a piece at a time... Plus the cost of someone fitting the parts or buying the bike tools to do it yourself..

You mentioned the salesman talking about Giant Anthem 29ers.
The Anthem 29er X1 is a great buy, I'm sure they can bring the price down to get very close to $2k... Just be prepared to fork out more $ for a better saddle made for cruising and not racing. Plus be ready for the Elixir brake squeal which can be sorted out by replacing the brake pads with 'organic' pads.. I recommend EBC Green pads at around $25 per brake/end.
http://www.giant-bicycles.com/en-au/bik ... 712/50967/


Now that's valuable information, thanks mate !

As for the budget, I'am happy to wait a little longer,but need to ensure I make the right decision.
I'am looking to you guys for guidance along the way, for me all the rockshock rear suspensions look the same but it is your experience that will guide me and prevent me from making stupid mistakes.
I should mention that I have received some vital data so far, and happy to grasp more like a sponge.
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby silentbutdeadly » Mon Jan 23, 2012 9:16 pm

kunalraiker wrote:I should mention that I have received some vital data so far, and happy to grasp more like a sponge.


That's good because as you've no doubt learned, like the average two year old, we are really good at good natured dribble.

As long as you are an open minded sponge and don't discount Niner's simply because they are in an interesting shade of bronze...you'll be fine.

By the by, Rockshox don't make rear suspension...they do however make rear shock absorbers. Very good ones. There's one fitted to the latest top level Anthem (amongst innumerable others) for instance.

As for derailleurs, shifters and brakes.....they are almost disposable items. Warranties are shorter than their typical lifetimes assuming you are riding the bike to its capacity. Or (especially) in excess of your own.

Instead, focus on function,frame and fit...the rest is mere frippery. It might be nice having XX but X5 will still get you down the track just as fast...mostly!!
Ours is not to reason why...merely to point and giggle
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby population100 » Mon Jan 23, 2012 9:26 pm

trailgumby wrote:Your budget of $1k is a seriously limiting factor if you want to create "wow". I used to have a Santa Cruz Blur, the frame and rear shock alone retailed for almost $3k... Now that is a seriously fantastic bike! But my 2012 Giant Anthem rides just as well as the Blur and as a complete bike fitted with XT group set was at $2999 RRP.

As for swapping out parts, then you start spending real money as buying complete bikes the manufacturers get massive discounts 'cause they buy in bulk but you'd be buying a piece at a time... Plus the cost of someone fitting the parts or buying the bike tools to do it yourself..

You mentioned the salesman talking about Giant Anthem 29ers.
The Anthem 29er X1 is a great buy, I'm sure they can bring the price down to get very close to $2k... Just be prepared to fork out more $ for a better saddle made for cruising and not racing. Plus be ready for the Elixir brake squeal which can be sorted out by replacing the brake pads with 'organic' pads.. I recommend EBC Green pads at around $25 per brake/end.
http://www.giant-bicycles.com/en-au/bik ... 712/50967/


This is very helpful information! I have been toying between the 29er Anthem, Trek superfly 100 or Specalized Camber expert.

The Anthem seems great value with Sids and full XT drive train but I was wondering if you had any experience with either the trek or Specalized? I've had a weekend on Anthem and I thought it was fantastic.
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby kunalraiker » Mon Jan 23, 2012 9:42 pm

silentbutdeadly wrote:
kunalraiker wrote:I should mention that I have received some vital data so far, and happy to grasp more like a sponge.


That's good because as you've no doubt learned, like the average two year old, we are really good at good natured dribble.

As long as you are an open minded sponge and don't discount Niner's simply because they are in an interesting shade of bronze...you'll be fine.

By the by, Rockshox don't make rear suspension...they do however make rear shock absorbers. Very good ones. There's one fitted to the latest top level Anthem (amongst innumerable others) for instance.

As for derailleurs, shifters and brakes.....they are almost disposable items. Warranties are shorter than their typical lifetimes assuming you are riding the bike to its capacity. Or (especially) in excess of your own.

Instead, focus on function,frame and fit...the rest is mere frippery. It might be nice having XX but X5 will still get you down the track just as fast...mostly!!


There is no room in this thread to get emotional about your buddy, I don't like the Bronze Bike so be it - that's my opinion so be a man and accept it, unless!
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Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby Kenzo » Mon Jan 23, 2012 9:56 pm

population100 wrote:The Anthem seems great value with Sids and full XT drive train but I was wondering if you had any experience with either the trek or Specalized? I've had a weekend on Anthem and I thought it was fantastic.

you're referring to the Anthem X0 and that is getting a bit higher in the price bracket.
I used to be a 29er stalwart but one day decided I wanted to go back to riding 26".... I'm fickle like that :-) so I bought the anthem X1 26" from Ferry Rd cycles in Southport, Gold Coast (shameless plug for the store which did me a great deal).
So I'll leave the 29er reviews to those who still love 'em.
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby population100 » Mon Jan 23, 2012 10:06 pm

Kenzo wrote:you're referring to the Anthem X0 and that is getting a bit higher in the price bracket.


Yep, the XO. I've come across it for $3k which I think is pretty good value.
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby Mulger bill » Mon Jan 23, 2012 10:22 pm

I must've got in at just the right time. I picked up my TranceX2 2011 model for a lick under $2k. Best money spent on biking stuff ever 8)
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby kunalraiker » Tue Jan 24, 2012 6:09 am

Mulger bill wrote:I must've got in at just the right time. I picked up my TranceX2 2011 model for a lick under $2k. Best money spent on biking stuff ever 8)


I shall look out for one!, Let me know when you are visiting the city next with your bike.
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby trailgumby » Tue Jan 24, 2012 7:14 am

Kenzo wrote:I used to be a 29er stalwart but one day decided I wanted to go back to riding 26".... I'm fickle like that :-) so I bought the anthem X1 26" from Ferry Rd cycles in Southport, Gold Coast (shameless plug for the store which did me a great deal).
So I'll leave the 29er reviews to those who still love 'em.

Oh, interesting! :shock:

Sounds like there's a story to tell there. 8)

Some Bike store owners I know, having tried both, reckon 29ers aren't that great and are a fad that will blow over, others reckon they're the future and 80% of their sales are big wheel bikes.

Why did your views change and why did you swap back?
"People have a right to their own opinions, but not their own facts. Evidence must be located, not created, and opinions not backed by evidence cannot be given much weight." -- James W Loewen

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Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby Kenzo » Tue Jan 24, 2012 7:28 am

trailgumby wrote:
Kenzo wrote:I used to be a 29er stalwart but one day decided I wanted to go back to riding 26".... I'm fickle like that :-) so I bought the anthem X1 26" from Ferry Rd cycles in Southport, Gold Coast (shameless plug for the store which did me a great deal).
So I'll leave the 29er reviews to those who still love 'em.

Oh, interesting! :shock:

Sounds like there's a story to tell there. 8)

Some Bike store owners I know, having tried both, reckon 29ers aren't that great and are a fad that will blow over, others reckon they're the future and 80% of their sales are big wheel bikes.

Why did your views change and why did you swap back?

29ers are no fad. They are fantastic bikes for XC riding and transitioning between trail and open road and back to trail. They just roll so well.
I still have my Niner MCR (in a beautiful root beer colour) however it is setup as full rigid. I then bought a duallie for two reasons, I wanted bring back "the flick" into my riding and comfort to my aging body. The fact it is a duallie is more important than the fact it is a 26er.
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby markusm » Tue Jan 24, 2012 7:33 am

trailgumby wrote:
Kenzo wrote:I used to be a 29er stalwart but one day decided I wanted to go back to riding 26".... I'm fickle like that :-) so I bought the anthem X1 26" from Ferry Rd cycles in Southport, Gold Coast (shameless plug for the store which did me a great deal).
So I'll leave the 29er reviews to those who still love 'em.

Oh, interesting! :shock:

Sounds like there's a story to tell there. 8)

Some Bike store owners I know, having tried both, reckon 29ers aren't that great and are a fad that will blow over, others reckon they're the future and 80% of their sales are big wheel bikes.

Why did your views change and why did you swap back?


As a possible 29er hardtail future purchaser im awaiting the reply to this :)

After reading through this dribble (cough, thread) i'm seeing that you have no choice but to get second hand. Take your time and find a good quality ride.

For $1000 you might find someone who has more dollars than sense and has bought a top of the range dual suspension XC bike (and trust me, i cant tell you how many people i see riding to the shops or along bike paths on top of the range XC bikes, and im sure they never see any dirt, let alone single track)
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby Mugglechops » Tue Jan 24, 2012 11:43 am

I went from rigid 29er to full sus 26er. But went a bit extreme and got a 6in dually. Currently paying off a 29er hardtail but keeping the dually for fun rides.
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby kunalraiker » Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:21 pm

markusm wrote:
trailgumby wrote:
Kenzo wrote:I used to be a 29er stalwart but one day decided I wanted to go back to riding 26".... I'm fickle like that :-) so I bought the anthem X1 26" from Ferry Rd cycles in Southport, Gold Coast (shameless plug for the store which did me a great deal).
So I'll leave the 29er reviews to those who still love 'em.

Oh, interesting! :shock:

Sounds like there's a story to tell there. 8)

Some Bike store owners I know, having tried both, reckon 29ers aren't that great and are a fad that will blow over, others reckon they're the future and 80% of their sales are big wheel bikes.

Why did your views change and why did you swap back?


As a possible 29er hardtail future purchaser im awaiting the reply to this :)

After reading through this dribble (cough, thread) i'm seeing that you have no choice but to get second hand. Take your time and find a good quality ride.

For $1000 you might find someone who has more dollars than sense and has bought a top of the range dual suspension XC bike (and trust me, i cant tell you how many people i see riding to the shops or along bike paths on top of the range XC bikes, and im sure they never see any dirt, let alone single track)


Let me re-iterate myself for the nth time, the budget is NOT restricted to $1000.00.
For all I know the bike could be well into to the mid 2000's
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby mitzikatzi » Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:01 pm

Xplora wrote: Do not get cheap SPDs, your body will hurt you.

trailgumby wrote:29ers are awesome.
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby DaveOZ » Tue Jan 24, 2012 2:08 pm

Different you say?

BMC Fourstroke on sale for a deal.

http://www.cyclingexpress.com/cycle/bmc ... naked.aspx
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby Mugglechops » Tue Jan 24, 2012 4:47 pm

You blokes are not helping him at all.

Here is one that may suit him
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Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby Kenzo » Tue Jan 24, 2012 7:34 pm

Mugglechops wrote:You blokes are not helping him at all.

Here is one that may suit him

that is a heap of X's in the spec list....
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Re: Ideal MTB (See requirements)

Postby Mugglechops » Tue Jan 24, 2012 7:40 pm

Kenzo wrote:
Mugglechops wrote:You blokes are not helping him at all.

Here is one that may suit him

that is a heap of X's in the spec list....



That's because it's bike porn :D
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