worth upgrading my brakes?

defy1
Posts: 712
Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:40 pm

worth upgrading my brakes?

Postby defy1 » Thu Jun 01, 2017 4:15 pm

My mtb has Shimano M365 disc brakes, pretty low budget, and to be honest I haven't had any issues with it so far in the rides I do. Unfortunately, I've got a serious case of upgradeitis and constantly tinkering with my bike. :D :P I see some deore XT m8000 brakes for about $200. Is it worth upgrading ? would there be any noticeable benefit at all between the two models?

User avatar
Duck!
Expert
Posts: 6338
Joined: Tue May 21, 2013 8:21 pm
Location: On The Tools

Re: worth upgrading my brakes?

Postby Duck! » Thu Jun 01, 2017 7:04 pm

Are you running out of brakes? If not, there's not a lot to be gained, as you're probably not likely to be making the most of the extra capability of the XTs.

However, if you are finding the current set a bit short on grunt, you will notice the difference. The big plus is that - with suitable rotors - the XTs will give you the option of using metal compound pads, which offer better overall stopping power, better heat tolerance and better modulation, but a slightly softer initial bite. The second advantage, less earth-shattering, but a nice further boost to modulation is the "ServoWave" stroke ratio-altering mechanism. Basically it's a cam between the lever and master piston which boosts the early stroke to get the pads onto the rotor, then backs off deeper in the stroke for finer control of the brake.
M7000 SLX, which are probably a bit cheaper, are essentially the same brakes.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.

defy1
Posts: 712
Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:40 pm

Re: worth upgrading my brakes?

Postby defy1 » Fri Jun 02, 2017 7:30 am

Thanks Duck..I don't think I am running out of brakes in terms of my current ability and tracks I ride. Always pull up fine when I need to. The "ServoWave" stroke is something I am really interested in though, currently I don't like the free play in the lever before the pad meets the rotor.
Looks like though, if I get the XTs, might as well need new rotors and pads lol :)

User avatar
bychosis
Posts: 5043
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:10 pm
Location: Lake Macquarie

Re: worth upgrading my brakes?

Postby bychosis » Fri Jun 02, 2017 8:45 am

What Duck said. If you aren't feeling deficiencies in your setup, you don't NEED to upgrade. Fortunately, needing and wanting are two separate things so if you feel you want to and have sufficient funds, I can't give you a reason not to do it.

One thing I can say is that most upgrades are not a wise financial investment. You won't get your money back if you sell.
bychosis (bahy-koh-sis): A mental disorder of delusions indicating impaired contact with a reality of no bicycles.

Calvin27
Posts: 1567
Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2013 5:45 pm

Re: worth upgrading my brakes?

Postby Calvin27 » Fri Jun 02, 2017 10:39 am

defy1 wrote: The "ServoWave" stroke is something I am really interested in though, currently I don't like the free play in the lever before the pad meets the rotor.


If you are buying brakes for feel, you really have to try them out on bikes. 'Free play' could mean a whole different bunch of sensations for different riders. For example I prefer the feel of avids (but for the live of me cannot stand their constant requirements for bleeding). Switching from avid to shimano is a very different feel. Some people like a hard lever, others like it on/off, me, I prefer a mashy but firm - something like magura offers. But like I said descriptions are daft and you just have to have a squeeze to know if you will like it or not.
Fast light bike
Cushy dirt bike
Workhorse bike
No brakes bike
Ebike :)

User avatar
Duck!
Expert
Posts: 6338
Joined: Tue May 21, 2013 8:21 pm
Location: On The Tools

Re: worth upgrading my brakes?

Postby Duck! » Fri Jun 02, 2017 1:59 pm

defy1 wrote:The "ServoWave" stroke is something I am really interested in though, currently I don't like the free play in the lever before the pad meets the rotor.

ServoWave doesn't fix that; the absence of friction inherent in hydraulic actuation means you're always going to have that "free" feeling until the pads hit the rotor.
Calvin27 wrote:If you are buying brakes for feel, you really have to try them out on bikes. 'Free play' could mean a whole different bunch of sensations for different riders. For example I prefer the feel of Avids (but for the live of me cannot stand their constant requirements for bleeding). Switching from avid to Shimano is a very different feel. Some people like a hard lever, others like it on/off, me, I prefer a mashy but firm - something like Magura offers. But like I said descriptions are daft and you just have to have a squeeze to know if you will like it or not.


Giving a squeeze on the shop floor will not fully reveal the brake's "feel"; you won't get a proper idea until you're riding. Pad choice also affects "feel". Many people criticised the previous generation of Shimano's ServoWave brakes as being too grabby with poor modulation. Yes the cam profile was rather aggressive, and the current generation have a smoother cam curve, but further digging tended to reveal that the critics were using resin pads, which do offer more bite than metal. I use metal pads, which are a lot more progressive, and learning how to ride the cam rather than just mashing a fistful of brake opens up bucketfuls of modulation.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.

defy1
Posts: 712
Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:40 pm

Re: worth upgrading my brakes?

Postby defy1 » Sun Jun 04, 2017 7:54 am

Thanks all for the feedback. I ended pulling the trigger on the brakes and ice tech rotors :). All under $300 so it wasn't too bad. Probably isn't going to make me a better rider or go any faster, but oh well you only live once right?
Should I go metal pads or stick with resin?

User avatar
trailgumby
Posts: 12859
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:30 pm
Location: Northern Beaches, Sydney
Contact:

Re: worth upgrading my brakes?

Postby trailgumby » Sun Jun 04, 2017 12:14 pm

Metal pads, with the cooling fins. They make a noticeable difference.

The previous generation XTs I had on my Cannondale Rize used to stink and the rotors sizzle and turn blue after a long Blue Mountains descent, like the train brakes after the descent into Wynyard Station. They also used to pump up from fluid expansion.

The current model are much better. A few months ago we did the All Mountain and Flow Trails at Thredbo. You need the chairlift to get to the top. I used my Trigger AM 29er. The XT Ice Tech brakes were just barely warm at the bottom, and no noticeable fluid expansion.

After you've bed in the pads, take it easy for the first few rides, until you adapt, as you can easily throw yourself over the bars. Set up the lever positioning so that you use only the index finger in the crook of the lever. You seriously don't need any more effort on the lever, and it will improve your control with 3 fingers on the grips, helping to reduce arm pump. :)

User avatar
Duck!
Expert
Posts: 6338
Joined: Tue May 21, 2013 8:21 pm
Location: On The Tools

Re: worth upgrading my brakes?

Postby Duck! » Sun Jun 04, 2017 8:36 pm

Go metallic pads, but do take the time to bed them in properly, especially on new rotors, and don't just throw yourself straight into the trails, because they really do feel crap at first! But once they're bedded in they're so worth it - much better fine control, more grunt and much better heat tolerance.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.

defy1
Posts: 712
Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2013 10:40 pm

Re: worth upgrading my brakes?

Postby defy1 » Mon Jun 05, 2017 8:03 am

Metal pads it is :)
what pads will the new brakeset come with? probably resin?

User avatar
Duck!
Expert
Posts: 6338
Joined: Tue May 21, 2013 8:21 pm
Location: On The Tools

Re: worth upgrading my brakes?

Postby Duck! » Mon Jun 05, 2017 11:19 am

Could come with either, although it should have been specified in the product listing.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users