i dont want to start a storm, but?

Old Hutcho
Posts: 64
Joined: Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:48 pm

i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby Old Hutcho » Sun Dec 11, 2016 7:42 pm

I appreciate this may have been done to death on other forums but the reading is super confusing.

I have been speaking with the Highway Patrol Sergeant where I work (local Police Station) about available kits for powering my trike (if I ever do it that is). He tells me flat out the Bafang 250w and above is illegal in NSW. In fact ANYTHING over 200 w is illegal.

He has provided me with some legal advisings requested by Police in the street to the Crown Solicitors Office and I have to agree that his advice seems to be correct.

What do we do?

regards

Old Hutcho

eldavo
Posts: 1592
Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2009 12:21 am
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Contact:

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby eldavo » Sun Dec 11, 2016 7:43 pm

Use a 200W kit?

Old Hutcho
Posts: 64
Joined: Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:48 pm

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby Old Hutcho » Sun Dec 11, 2016 8:05 pm

Yes, that is the very obvious answer. Then I read all the stuff about people wanting/needing/using 350w and higher rated motors. Is a 200w motor useful for general riding.

regards

Old Hutcho

User avatar
Cycleops70
Posts: 258
Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2014 10:56 am
Location: Perth
Contact:

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby Cycleops70 » Sun Dec 11, 2016 8:53 pm

My understanding is;
200w if you have a throttle control
250w if the motor is only engaged by pedalling & cuts out at 25kph (might be 20kph, not sure)

eldavo
Posts: 1592
Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2009 12:21 am
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Contact:

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby eldavo » Sun Dec 11, 2016 9:17 pm

200W is fine for general riding*.

It's 25kph where 250W pedelec no throttle applies.

My point is if you've confirmed legal advice that only 200W is legal, and you don't want to skirt that law, then just look at 200W products.

* People always want more, but do they need it? Some do, but the system doesn't cater to exceptions or case by case, so you're left to skirt the law and operate in stealth.

Without knowing your need in detail, just general riding and your effort to confirm the legality, I'd suggest 200W assuming that advice is correct, but also try to find your own confirmation of the law.

Try PM cj7hawk here to get his attention, with his projects and research to clarify the laws, his opinion would be worthwhile.

User avatar
Cycleops70
Posts: 258
Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2014 10:56 am
Location: Perth
Contact:

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby Cycleops70 » Sun Dec 11, 2016 10:44 pm

I have a bike with a 200w kit on it I use for towing kids & cargo.
200w is enough.
I like the throttle set up, as I get to choose when the motor is on & how much.

cj7hawk
Posts: 1144
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2015 9:00 pm

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby cj7hawk » Mon Dec 12, 2016 2:31 pm

The main difference between 200w and 250w is that 250w bikes can actually put out more than a kilowatt at lower speeds than 25 kph, but must cut off before 25kph and the cop is absolutely right about the kits - they are all illegal in every state. I'm impressed they knew their stuff that well.

So 200W kits are really important for local projects.

The good news is that 200W kits, if well made, will go faster - With a tailwind, I can easily sit on 30 kph - pretty good when you consider that I rarely go below 19 kph, and any realistic 250W bicycle should start to lose power rapidly about 19 kph.

I may not have as much oomph going up hills, but I have the equivalent of an extra adult pedaling, and it only weighs about an extra 15 kg and never tires out. It's enough.

Happy to share ideas about building a legal 200W kit - I overvoltaged mine, with the result that I only get the full output at about 30 kph, so I sit on about 24 kph in no-wind flat terrain instead of about 25.

cj7hawk
Posts: 1144
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2015 9:00 pm

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby cj7hawk » Mon Dec 12, 2016 3:03 pm

I should add that I use a 500W (AT) 48V motor, de-rate it to 125W (AT) 24v, then offset back-EMF to about 180W and I leave it there so it won't risk going over 200W.

My new system is going even lower - 22.2v, as I try to get new levels of efficiency out of the power system ( 250 Miles per gallon is my next objective, just over 100 km/liter, or around 64 km from a 600ml tank of fuel... With a battery-only range of around .5 kWH, or nearly 2 hours, roughly 40km.

That's my Christmas project anyway - Some neat-new concepts such as additive power supplies, so that I can add different batteries of different capacities to the bike ad-hoc and just add-up their total capacity. For me, it's about total range, and designing a bicycle I can commute on... Whether I want to sit on the motor or add my own effort to get the time down.

User avatar
find_bruce
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 6958
Joined: Mon May 09, 2011 8:42 pm
Location: Sydney

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby find_bruce » Mon Dec 12, 2016 4:16 pm

Short story: the cop is correct - you need to be under 200w to be legal. This is not just a question of the number printed on the box.

Long story: One of the reasons it is confusing is because the power produced will depend on the combination of voltage & current delivered by the system as a whole & there are 3 essential parts to that system - motor, battery & controller. Power (watts) = current (amps) x voltage. It is relatively easy to make a "200w" motor produce higher power by increasing the voltage, which probably means changing the controller. Similarly you can de-rate a "250w motor", by either reducing the voltage or decreasing the current.

The controllers are not exactly high tech & can be adjusted to reduce (or increase) the maximum power. One grey area is whether the de-rating needs to be hardware based or whether wiring or software changes are sufficient. A switch probably isn't enough - you can still break the law even if the motor is not operating.

In NSW the limitations are in the definition of bicycle in the road rules
bicycle means a vehicle with 2 or more wheels that is built to be propelled by human power through a belt, chain or gears (whether or not it has an auxiliary motor), and includes:
(a) a pedicab, penny-farthing and tricycle, and
(b) a power-assisted pedal cycle within the meaning of vehicle standards, as amended from time to time, determined under section 7 of the Motor Vehicle Standards Act 1989 of the Commonwealth other than one that has an internal combustion engine or engines,
but does not include:
(c) a wheelchair, wheeled recreational device, wheeled toy, or
(d) any vehicle with an auxiliary motor capable of generating a power output over 200 watts (whether or not the motor is operating), other than a vehicle referred to in paragraph (b), or
(e) any vehicle that has an internal combustion engine or engines.

It takes a bit of tracing to find the definition of a pedalec, but you end up at the Vehicle Standard (Australian Design Rule - Definitions and Vehicle Categories) 2005 which say:
PEDALEC - A vehicle meeting European Committee for Standardization EN 15194:2009 or EN 15194:2009+A1:2011 Cycles - Electrically power assisted cycles - EPAC Bicycles
A "kit" is not going to meet the requirements for a pedelec, so you need to have a motor, battery & controller so that the system generate less than 200w.

In the real world, the Police officers are practical people - they can read "200w" or "250w" on the case & may be alert enough to notice if you are going uphill at 30+ km/h without pedaling.

Your options for a trike are going to depend on which hub fits for your set-up. Like David, I am happy to chat about what you can do to ensure whatever hub you choose, the system is under 200w.

Old Hutcho
Posts: 64
Joined: Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:48 pm

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby Old Hutcho » Tue Dec 13, 2016 5:57 pm

To those people who replied, thanks for your input. I have had further talks with said Sergeant who said words to me similar to "How do we know its 200w?"

So how does he know? I haven't actually held a Bafang in my hand so I have no idea what the branding/inscriptions are. My first impulse (generally the worst one for me :lol: ) is to grab a 500watt jobbie and do that. But it seems that it might be overkill, seeing as how all I want to do it get me over the difficult phases of a ride without killing my 68 year old self. Ideally I would like to be inputting with some pedal power, so I guess the next question is:- 250w, 350w or 500w?

Now I am the first to declare that I am technically minded, but that doesn't extend to white mans magic, electricity. From what I have read including here, it seems that I can get a unit and "hot rod" it, or conversely grab a bigger unit and de rate the controller to bring the output down, and maybe thereby lengthening the life of the componentry?


regards

Old Hutcho

cj7hawk
Posts: 1144
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2015 9:00 pm

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby cj7hawk » Tue Dec 13, 2016 7:10 pm

As was described to me by a police officer, they would have to have a reasonable belief that your bicycle was not under 200W to act - that is to say, something you did or something written on you bicycle would have to be present to support that belief. Otherwise they can't really act.

If you have a big 250W label on the bicycle, it might be enough, but they'd have to prove it wasn't a Pedelec. That's going to be difficult. In fact, you could probably ride with a 500w bicycle and if it was electric, the police probably wouldn't do anything. However, if you have an accident, it's not going to be terribly difficult to prove you were riding an unlicensed motorbike and that's going to count against you regardless of fault.

My wheel does say "500W" in a big string of numbers, but it's hard to so, so I affixed a plate to the battery that states the last measurements I took of the bike, the method under which they were taken, and what the final power output of the bicycle is - and it's about 190W ( peak ). This rather official looking certificate is placed in a prominent position just in case Mr Plod looks at it. And it's not exaggerating either - it's a very realistic figure that was measured. I would genuinely be somewhere around 180w to 190w.

If you do it this way, then even if there's a 250w label on the bicycle, you can demonstrate 200W, so it's all good.

I guess the important decision you need to make - Do you want a Pedelec ( pedal for throttle ) or do you want a throttle?

I have to say I love having a throttle.... If I am tired, I just twist the throttle and off it goes... I can stop pedaling for a while and rest while still covering ground and the only downside is that my hand gets tired, so I'm thinking of adding a cruise control. Keep in mind though that if you're consuming 200W at the wheel, you're going to suck about 250W at the battery.

Also, I've just purchased a decent ( 15000 ) mAH battery at 22.2v, so that will give me 333 Wh, so I should get a full hour's riding out of it without stressing the battery. Those batteries cost about $180 each, and weigh 4 Kg, so are very good value... Add a little for a battery management system and you have a half-decent powerplant for around $200 all up capable of protecting around 440W maximum draw. ( 2C ) -

Old Hutcho
Posts: 64
Joined: Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:48 pm

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby Old Hutcho » Tue Dec 13, 2016 7:27 pm

cj7Hawk. Many thanks for the informed reply. I haven't got a clue to be honest how these things work in relation to throttles/pedelec etc. I have no concept of how the power is applied via the pedelec system. I am quite happy to pedal and would think that I would wish to continue to do so, after all this is my fitness regime I am talking about. Do you have an opinion as to whether a 250watt system is adequate for a Greenspeed GTO weighing about 18 kg and a rider weighing 95kg? My longest ride looks to be about 100km, (Sydney to the Gong) with the hilly national park in the middle.


regards

Old Hutcho

eldavo
Posts: 1592
Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2009 12:21 am
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Contact:

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby eldavo » Tue Dec 13, 2016 8:01 pm

Bear in mind that the BBS kits are programmable.
You can have a legal 200W tune to keep the throttle, choice od pedelec on or off.
If you deem 250W is legal and drop throttle, you just leave the throttle unplugged off of the bike, pedelec modes only.
If you then do as David has with testing result and method on a placard, something you are confident you can demonstrate to be legal to a magistrate, then you can carry this upstream to "show your papers" to the Police. Cheaper being proactive to deflect an eager sergeant.

There is a place selling 200W peak power cheap petrol kits with test and dyno chart signed by an engineer to give this kind of "no hassles" ownership, or at least some confidence for people of reason to hold onto something when attacked for being on petrol.

User avatar
Comedian
Posts: 5289
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2010 7:35 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby Comedian » Wed Dec 14, 2016 12:27 pm

I've seen heaps of electric bikes up her in QLD that aren't even close to legal, yet I'm not aware of anyone ever being prosecuted.

cj7hawk
Posts: 1144
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2015 9:00 pm

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby cj7hawk » Wed Dec 14, 2016 1:31 pm

Old Hutcho wrote:cj7Hawk. Many thanks for the informed reply. I haven't got a clue to be honest how these things work in relation to throttles/pedelec etc. I have no concept of how the power is applied via the pedelec system. I am quite happy to pedal and would think that I would wish to continue to do so, after all this is my fitness regime I am talking about. Do you have an opinion as to whether a 250watt system is adequate for a Greenspeed GTO weighing about 18 kg and a rider weighing 95kg? My longest ride looks to be about 100km, (Sydney to the Gong) with the hilly national park in the middle.

regards

Old Hutcho


The difference between a pedal throttle and a handlebar throttle is that with a pedelec, you just pedal and it cuts in power automatically, whereas a throttle, you just twist it like a motorbike. In truth, you end up pedaling both ways, but the main difference is a Pedelec will only provide power below 25 kph - such as when you go up hills, and if you can find a legal pedelec, they can provide up to a kilowatt of power when climbing - quite a bit - when under 19 kph. None of this will prevent you pushing on the pedals though - on either type. BTW, it's complete legal to have a throttle on a Pedelec, as long as the throttle doesn't function at speeds greater than 6kph. That's a part of the standard to allow hill starts... Or crawling up hills slowly when you are exhausted.

95kg is in my weight class, but add another 15 Kg to the bike for the motor/battery/stuff. I am a pretty weak on the pedals. On my last ride home, my system failed and I had to ride about 15km under my own power with a heavy bike, and I just took it easy - though I had some battery left and used that on hills to help. I do have some very hilly areas nearby though and while I can't make it up them at all on pedal alone, I can easily keep up about 16~20 kph with the assist operating. 200W continuous power assist really is a big difference. Even on hub-drive motors.

If you mix pedal and throttle, or set a pedelec to low-speed operation, a small battery will go a long long way.

The good thing about having enough battery power and a 200W system though - if you have a bicycle failure ( eg, Pedals, Chain, Gears etc ) you can still get around. I had one with a chain snapped and rode home, up hills, in an emergency because I thought someone had attacked my family ( turns out it was as elaborate a situation as a rube goldberg machine launching random engine parts through a window, caused by a cat... ) - The other time, my rear sprockets shattered as I went over a bridge, and I had to rely on the motor to get me 16km to work, and 26km back home.... A little slower, but I got both ways OK.

At 100km? Well, if you just want assist on hills, and don't mind flattening the battery, you should go 200W regardless of throttle or pedal selection, but go for about 700 Wh of battery for a trike - If you get that up to about 1000 Wh or even 1500 Wh with a mid-drive, every trip is going to be like magic, and you will feel like you have bionic legs.

El-Davo and Find-Bruce have some good ideas also - and I tend to the side of cycling where I do pedal, but I have 100% assist at all times, since I'm a commuter and rarely cycle for pleasure. As a result, I go through batteries pretty quickly and developed petrol/battery hybrid technology to handle the range I ride. But there are ways to only apply the power when needed and those systems don't need nearly as much battery.

Regards
David

User avatar
find_bruce
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 6958
Joined: Mon May 09, 2011 8:42 pm
Location: Sydney

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby find_bruce » Wed Dec 14, 2016 3:41 pm

Comedian wrote:I've seen heaps of electric bikes up her in QLD that aren't even close to legal, yet I'm not aware of anyone ever being prosecuted.
Low probability of being caught, but massive fines if you are. I am aware of a couple of prosecutions in NSW & if the cop doesn't like you, unregistered motorbike $650, no motorbike licence $796, no motorbike helmet $325

User avatar
Comedian
Posts: 5289
Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2010 7:35 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby Comedian » Wed Dec 14, 2016 4:14 pm

find_bruce wrote:
Comedian wrote:I've seen heaps of electric bikes up her in QLD that aren't even close to legal, yet I'm not aware of anyone ever being prosecuted.
Low probability of being caught, but massive fines if you are. I am aware of a couple of prosecutions in NSW & if the cop doesn't like you, unregistered motorbike $650, no motorbike licence $796, no motorbike helmet $325

Interesting.. that's certainly pretty steep. As I said I've never heard of it here so don't know what they would do.

icicic
Posts: 43
Joined: Tue May 22, 2007 1:10 pm

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby icicic » Mon Mar 13, 2017 2:33 pm

cj7hawk wrote:I should add that I use a 500W (AT) 48V motor, de-rate it to 125W (AT) 24v, then offset back-EMF to about 180W and I leave it there so it won't risk going over 200W.

My new system is going even lower - 22.2v, as I try to get new levels of efficiency out of the power system ( 250 Miles per gallon is my next objective, just over 100 km/liter, or around 64 km from a 600ml tank of fuel... With a battery-only range of around .5 kWH, or nearly 2 hours, roughly 40km.

That's my Christmas project anyway - Some neat-new concepts such as additive power supplies, so that I can add different batteries of different capacities to the bike ad-hoc and just add-up their total capacity. For me, it's about total range, and designing a bicycle I can commute on... Whether I want to sit on the motor or add my own effort to get the time down.


Hi CJ,

I want to put a 250W mid-drive on my Yuba Mundo to transport fresh produce around my local area. It's a little business and I want a good strong reliable motor. So through a dealer (that a friend has had excellent experience with) I've found a Bafang motor described as

"36V 25A 250W BBS02 kits (same as the 36V 500W, but marked as a 250W). So, you can have the more powerful and robust 500W kit, and have it detuned to 250W or 350W power levels, as you require. Or run it at the full 25A and have the 500W rating (~900W Max input power) if preferred. Please state clearly in comments that you need the motor to state 250W, as we still have a few in stock that are marked as 500W. All our stock is the latest version, with the revised case design and with GearSensor connector.

Apart from the issue of whether it ought to be set at 200W or 250, Is there a legal issue with a detuned 200 vs a 200, straight up

cj7hawk
Posts: 1144
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2015 9:00 pm

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby cj7hawk » Mon Mar 13, 2017 3:28 pm

icicic wrote:
cj7hawk wrote:I should add that I use a 500W (AT) 48V motor, de-rate it to 125W (AT) 24v, then offset back-EMF to about 180W and I leave it there so it won't risk going over 200W.

My new system is going even lower - 22.2v, as I try to get new levels of efficiency out of the power system ( 250 Miles per gallon is my next objective, just over 100 km/liter, or around 64 km from a 600ml tank of fuel... With a battery-only range of around .5 kWH, or nearly 2 hours, roughly 40km.

That's my Christmas project anyway - Some neat-new concepts such as additive power supplies, so that I can add different batteries of different capacities to the bike ad-hoc and just add-up their total capacity. For me, it's about total range, and designing a bicycle I can commute on... Whether I want to sit on the motor or add my own effort to get the time down.


Hi CJ,

I want to put a 250W mid-drive on my Yuba Mundo to transport fresh produce around my local area. It's a little business and I want a good strong reliable motor. So through a dealer (that a friend has had excellent experience with) I've found a Bafang motor described as

"36V 25A 250W BBS02 kits (same as the 36V 500W, but marked as a 250W). So, you can have the more powerful and robust 500W kit, and have it detuned to 250W or 350W power levels, as you require. Or run it at the full 25A and have the 500W rating (~900W Max input power) if preferred. Please state clearly in comments that you need the motor to state 250W, as we still have a few in stock that are marked as 500W. All our stock is the latest version, with the revised case design and with GearSensor connector.

Apart from the issue of whether it ought to be set at 200W or 250, Is there a legal issue with a detuned 200 vs a 200, straight up



Technically, all 250W kits are illegal, since a kit-fitted bicycle couldn't have been pretested and so doesn't comply with EN15194 ( which requires the kit to be tested on the bicycle post-fitting ) - Only 200W kits comply because of this, though I can't imagine police prosecuting anyone over a <250W bicycle anyway, so it's not a bad idea to go for 250W over 500W. Better still, "tune" it and get 500W from a 250W motor, which probably won't be obvious unless it goes faster than 25 kph under assist. Most likely the detuning isn't perfect anyway and this is how it will work, so it sounds fine. With a heavy load, more power at lower speeds would be useful to you and this is the case with Pedelec kits - or at least should be.

As for (de)tuning? It's never been tested in court, but from what's been said in existing court cases, as long as the vehicle was a bicycle prior to fitting, and you can't access more than the proscribed amount of power while riding, it's probably legal.

NSW went one further and tried to say that petrol were all illegal because even the 200W models could have the power increased, but if this was truly the case, then every electric motor in the world would be illegal, so I wouldn't worry too much about it.

Generally, unless you're going way too fast, and police have a reason to take issue with you, you're not going to get trouble even if you went for the 500W bicycle. It would have to be something really major to get police attention - like being known to them for having a license revoked for DD or similar, then being seen doing 40 kph on an electric bicycle, while drunk, without a license. Otherwise, police have better things to do than chase cyclists for blatantly ignoring power limit laws since they don't carry dyno's with them. If the motor says 250W, they will just assume it's all cool. Stuff like riding without a bell though is easy to enforce, so just make sure all other aspects of the law are followed.

User avatar
bychosis
Posts: 5008
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:10 pm
Location: Lake Macquarie

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby bychosis » Mon Mar 13, 2017 5:32 pm

I saw two electric bikes on the weekend.

One during loop the lake. The rider had a legal pedalec MTB, power dropped off at 26km/h. Was cruising downhill when he caught me. Sitting nice and upright and pulled away on the hills without looking like working, but most were catching him on the downs.

The second was flying along a cycleway at what looked like warp speed, but probably 40ish.

I know which one the police would have had an issue with and looked further into.
bychosis (bahy-koh-sis): A mental disorder of delusions indicating impaired contact with a reality of no bicycles.

User avatar
Mububban
Posts: 1041
Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2008 12:19 pm

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby Mububban » Tue Mar 14, 2017 12:40 am

Old Hutcho wrote: Is a 200w motor useful for general riding.


200W and throttle control is like having your own personal tailwind, and Usain Bolt helping you launch off the line.
Your average speed is a true average - you don't slow down for modest inclines, but you'll max out around 30kph on the flat too depending on what kind of bike you convert.

We all want to go faster (I used mine for commuting) but 200W is an amazing boost. For general riding you will never need more than that.
When you are driving your car, you are not stuck IN traffic - you ARE the traffic!!!

ChrisR24
Posts: 49
Joined: Sat Feb 11, 2017 10:29 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby ChrisR24 » Tue Mar 14, 2017 8:08 pm

bychosis wrote:The second was flying along a cycleway at what looked like warp speed, but probably 40ish.


There's at least one of these types on my commute route. Barely pedalling and ripping along.

Mububban wrote:Your average speed is a true average - you don't slow down for modest inclines, but you'll max out around 30kph on the flat too depending on what kind of bike you convert.


For a lot of the hills around here I can maintain close to 25 km/hr. Even on some of the tougher hills it's 17 km/hr+ and I fully expect to do better as I get fitter and stronger. My max pedalling speed for my top gear seems to be about 45 to 50 km/hr - after that I can't pedal fast enough to add anything to it. I expect to be able to eventually cruise along the flats at over 30 km/hr - it's me that's the limiting factor at this time.

uart
Posts: 930
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2016 9:15 pm
Location: Newcastle

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby uart » Tue Mar 28, 2017 7:53 pm

bychosis wrote:I saw two electric bikes on the weekend.

One during loop the lake. The rider had a legal pedalec MTB, power dropped off at 26km/h. Was cruising downhill when he caught me. Sitting nice and upright and pulled away on the hills without looking like working, but most were catching him on the downs.

The second was flying along a cycleway at what looked like warp speed, but probably 40ish.

I know which one the police would have had an issue with and looked further into.


At the moment pedalecs don't really seem to be high priority to police. As long as you're pedalling (and are otherwise riding safely) then it just doesn't seem to be something that's on their proverbial radar (or their actual radar lol).

I suspect that they may be somewhat on the lookout for illegal "throttle" control e-bikes that are much more obvious with riders clearly zooming about without even pedalling.

After borrowing my bother's speed modified pedalec for a week, I had plenty of occasions where police cars pass me while I was doing around 30 to 40 km/hr (on road), and never even a second glance. For the moment at least, it seems to me that "if you're a pedalling then they ain't meddling".
Last edited by uart on Tue Mar 28, 2017 9:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
bychosis
Posts: 5008
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:10 pm
Location: Lake Macquarie

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby bychosis » Tue Mar 28, 2017 8:03 pm

uart wrote: "if you're a pedalling then they ain't meddling".


...unless you don't have a plastic bucket on your head and a ding-a-ling on the bars
bychosis (bahy-koh-sis): A mental disorder of delusions indicating impaired contact with a reality of no bicycles.

uart
Posts: 930
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2016 9:15 pm
Location: Newcastle

Re: i dont want to start a storm, but?

Postby uart » Tue Mar 28, 2017 8:41 pm

bychosis wrote:
uart wrote: "if you're a pedalling then they ain't meddling".


...unless you don't have a plastic bucket on your head and a ding-a-ling on the bars

Yep. Do anything else wrong and I'm certain that they'd be all over you like a rash. However it seems that as long as you are pedalling they just don't take a second glance at the bike.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users