Courtesy when passing

Equipment and On Road Behaviour, Laws and Rules. Cycling Promotion and Advocacy

Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby Aushiker » Mon Apr 01, 2013 1:56 pm

Apple wrote:
twizzle wrote:And can you find the "negligent driving" offence in the road rules? Bicycles move sideways to avoid obstacles, all cyclists have observed the behaviour. It is a foreseeable event.


Sent from my iThingy...

I would have to agree with Twizzle.


Same here. Moving six inches is hardly a change of "line within a lane."

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by BNA » Mon Apr 01, 2013 2:08 pm

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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Mon Apr 01, 2013 2:08 pm

Aushiker wrote:
Apple wrote:
twizzle wrote:And can you find the "negligent driving" offence in the road rules? Bicycles move sideways to avoid obstacles, all cyclists have observed the behaviour. It is a foreseeable event.


Sent from my iThingy...

I would have to agree with Twizzle.


Same here. Moving six inches is hardly a change of "line within a lane."

Andrew

I have several people a day passing close enough that, if I deviated that much, we would both be in trouble. I don't need a bell but I do wish following riders would act as though I may occasionally have a need to move a little back to the centre.
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby trailgumby » Mon Apr 01, 2013 3:18 pm

I often have roadies passing me on the climb up Parriwi Road Mosman, especially on my cruisey days. It irritates me quite a bit when they pass really close, especially with my wide mountain bike bars. If they clip me I am going down. Don't need to bust another collarbone.

I realise they're used to that, riding in large bunches, but I do find it startling when I don't hear them coming.

I did have a policy of calling which side I was passing on, but dropped it due to the random nature of pedestrian responses. Might be time to revisit the policy with riders, especially if the amount of room is limited.

Half-wheeling = supremely stupid.
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby SEQrider » Mon Apr 01, 2013 5:53 pm

Well, there has been a bit of discusion on the point of passing safely, and that is the reaction I was hoping for.We live in a democracy, so we may not agree with everyones comments or feelings, but we hear them and think it over. If this post has made some people aware, then I'm pleased. If it makes 1 or 2 think about it, that's great! If it prevents 1 rider from having a spill then I am very happy. The whole point of the post was raise some awareness that a little bit of courtesey could mean that you and I both enjoy the ride and the work we've put in, and come back and do it again tomorrow.
Cheers eveybody, safe riding.
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby Philipthelam » Mon Apr 01, 2013 7:27 pm

It is hard to know the exact details but I find it a little hard to believe that someone will halfwheel/draft someone when the guy at the front is in the small space between the curb and tarmac.
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby trailgumby » Mon Apr 01, 2013 7:40 pm

Philipthelam wrote:It is hard to know the exact details but I find it a little hard to believe that someone will halfwheel/draft someone when the guy at the front is in the small space between the curb and tarmac.

Well, no, it's not rational is it? But then hindsight is always 20/20.

Sometimes people have lapses in judgement and do things they would not, if only they had thought more about it, or had more experience.

There is on average - I've been led to believe - one bike crash a week on the Sydney harbour bridge bike path that requires an ambulance's attendance. Clearly, plenty of people do dumb things from time to time.

So someone half-wheeling someone else in the circumstances outlined by the OP does not require the suspension of disbelief.
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby richbee » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:27 am

Overlapping wheels is discouraged very simply because it's dangerous as the OP found out. In a bunch even more so because an incident has the potential to take out just more than the two protagonists when (not if) their wheels touch.
As for drafting, well I'm more than happy to give anyone who latches on my back wheel a tow, after all he's a fellow cyclist and we're all comrades are we not? Besides he might return the favour on the next hill. Two cyclists working together are more efficient than one on his own, and unless you're one of those grim northern England time-triallists that refuse to socialise and should be shunned like recumbent riders :wink: , you should encourage the opportunity to make a new cycling buddy.

Regarding etiquette when passing, a simple call of "Bike Back" should suffice as a warning. Calling out "Passing" is like a red rag to a bull. Don't do it.

BTW, Half wheeling is when one of two cyclists riding alongside rides with his front wheel half a wheel ahead of the other. Also discouraged but for totally different reasons entirely.
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby twizzle » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:41 am

First rule of commuting - only draft people you know!

And even then, sometimes people you know will surprise you in a bad way... (twizzle rubs his shoulder, 11 months later and it still hurts some days :x ).
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby twizzle » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:48 am

richbee wrote:Regarding etiquette when passing, a simple call of "Bike Back" should suffice as a warning. Calling out "Passing" is like a red rag to a bull. Don't do it.

In my experience, 90+% of people can't hear what you say anyway. And I've never had someone take it as a challenge... but everyone else is soft compared to me anyway. :P But what you should definitely NOT say is anything with the word "LEFT" or "RIGHT" as they will do the opposite of what you expect.
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby warthog1 » Tue Apr 02, 2013 10:52 am

ldrcycles wrote:Ride fast enough that no one can sit on your wheel, problem solved :) .

(I wish :oops: ).

That's what I try to do also :lol: and I wish too. :( :)
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby Summernight » Tue Apr 02, 2013 2:01 pm

twizzle wrote:
richbee wrote:Regarding etiquette when passing, a simple call of "Bike Back" should suffice as a warning. Calling out "Passing" is like a red rag to a bull. Don't do it.

In my experience, 90+% of people can't hear what you say anyway. And I've never had someone take it as a challenge... but everyone else is soft compared to me anyway. :P But what you should definitely NOT say is anything with the word "LEFT" or "RIGHT" as they will do the opposite of what you expect.


Agreed. And IMO 'passing' is an easier word to understand than 'bike back'. If you aren't a cyclist who knows the lingo I would have to ask what 'bike back' meant to the person who said it. What does it mean exactly?

Anyone who decides to go all 'bull with a red rag' because someone else says 'passing' is being childish. All I want to do when I'm cycling and passing someone else is enjoy myself, go my own pace without worrying about others and get to my destination safely. But then again, I'm predominantly a commuter so maybe that's why I don't have a crazy notion to speed up to prevent a person from passing me.
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby richbee » Tue Apr 02, 2013 4:54 pm

Summernight wrote: But then again, I'm predominantly a commuter so maybe that's why I don't have a crazy notion to speed up to prevent a person from passing me.


[Condescension]Oh, you're merely a commuter.[/Condescension]
I'm a commuter too, only I do it on a bling CF bike with 11 speed gizmo's at a high speed. Should you want to use my slipstream to speed up your commute, don't worry I won't do silly things to get you off my wheel, I'll just continue at my chosen pace happy that I'm helping someone get to their destination that little faster. I'll even point out the broken glass and potholes so you can avoid them too.

And the call will be "Bike Back" when I'm coming up behind to overtake, learn what it means, everyone on a bling CF bike with 11 speed gizmo's uses it.
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby RonK » Tue Apr 02, 2013 5:18 pm

Summernight wrote:And IMO 'passing' is an easier word to understand than 'bike back'. If you aren't a cyclist who knows the lingo I would have to ask what 'bike back' meant to the person who said it. What does it mean exactly?

What does it matter - they could be whistling Dixie. As long as you can hear them then you know they are there.
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby Apple » Tue Apr 02, 2013 8:35 pm

RonK wrote:
Summernight wrote:And IMO 'passing' is an easier word to understand than 'bike back'. If you aren't a cyclist who knows the lingo I would have to ask what 'bike back' meant to the person who said it. What does it mean exactly?

What does it matter - they could be whistling Dixie. As long as you can hear them then you know they are there.

:lol: :lol: :lol: +1
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby foo on patrol » Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:10 am

I just say on your right. :wink:

Bike Back :lol: yuppies

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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby twizzle » Thu Apr 04, 2013 1:01 pm

foo on patrol wrote:I just say on your right. ;)

... and over to the right they go.
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby wurtulla wabbit » Thu Apr 04, 2013 1:05 pm

foo on patrol wrote:I just say on your right.



NO !!!


Your other right !!! :D
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby darkelf921 » Thu Apr 04, 2013 6:35 pm

I just shout out "morning". I've never had a problem when passing and almost always get a "morning" reply. Simple.
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby Apple » Thu Apr 04, 2013 9:10 pm

darkelf921 wrote:I just shout out "morning". I've never had a problem when passing and almost always get a "morning" reply. Simple.

I say that and I get, a grunt.
That reminds me, has anyone ever done a bush nose blow just as someone passes. Maybe thats why it is also a good idea to say you are there, or you may land with a nice boogy on your face or leg. :mrgreen:
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby eeksll » Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:18 pm

as far as i am concerned, while commuting on roads, if you feel you need to say "passing" your too close. I only pass when I get the car lane.

alot of cyclist who pass me are too close, they put too much faith that i CAN keep my line.

Isn't there some lobbying by people on this site for "a meter matters" I don't see why the same should not apply for a cyclist passing a cyclist.
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby citywomble » Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:11 pm

Isn't there some lobbying by people on this site for "a meter matters" I don't see why the same should not apply for a cyclist passing a cyclist.


There are also the same reasons why it should apply to a cyclist passing a pedestrian. If you can't give the metre that matters then slow right down to a fast walking speed to overtake.
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby elStado » Thu Apr 04, 2013 11:56 pm

I also use a mirror. Makes life a little easier being able to see someone approaching.

The only time I will call out 'passing' or 'bike back' etc is when there's a few people and I am worried someone will decided to overtake just as I am going past.

Yesterday I was about to overtake but saw a guy in front of me was sitting close behind another bike, so I sat behind and told him to go for it, waited for him to pass the guy in front and then I passed them both.

Much easier and safer that way to hang back and let people do their thing, especially during peak hour on the paths.
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby FuzzyDropbear » Fri Apr 05, 2013 10:13 am

I usually say 'morning', 'bike', 'passing on your right' etc. when coming up behind someone. Just to say hello and let them know I'm there, I've often followed cyclists (staying approx. 3 bike lengths behind) for up to 4km without them even looking back to see what traffic is coming. That is why I talk to people, lot of people just ignore me, but now and again have a quick chat with people as I'm passing (or being passed).

Apple wrote:...
That reminds me, has anyone ever done a bush nose blow just as someone passes. Maybe thats why it is also a good idea to say you are there, or you may land with a nice boogy on your face or leg. :mrgreen:


I don't see the point in doing a bushy on the bike, I've never had to blow my nose when I'm on the bike, maybe when stopped if it's incredibly dusty. Or I've bitten the dust. Though, last night I caught up with a couple of roadies on my way home and every 500m or so, one of the guys would do (or attempt) a bushy. Thought about riding up to him and suggesting he see a doctor if there's something that big in there that he can't get it out :lol:. I slowed down and let them go. But yes, another reason not to get too close if they don't know you're there.
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby Summernight » Fri Apr 05, 2013 12:29 pm

I can't do a bushy on the bike - I have gloves on!!! And no, I won't snot out without using a hand to guide its trajectory - knowing me it'd go all over my clothes, not to mention I wouldn't want the poor car drivers having heart attacks if I snorted as I rode past on the commute. I might meet them in a work context later in the day!

But if no-one is around and I'm out running in the cold and the nose is streaming then I will do a surreptitious snort into the hand and flick it off (no gloves... phew!). But only after I've looked all around to make sure no-one can see or hear me do so, of course!

What a dirty little secret!!!
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Re: Courtesy when passing

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Fri Apr 05, 2013 2:05 pm

How this thread wanders. :mrgreen:
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