Troubles in Brissie

[il padrone]

Cyclists to be banned from the Supreme Court precinct - a major bike route through the CBD

[ZepinAtor]

Cyclists to be banned from the Supreme Court precinct - a major bike route through the CBD

You can actually just ride around this area quite easily on a big fat green painted bike path..........but alas it is a straight through connection across the pavers at the moment which is obviously more convenient for all travelling in that general direction.

[fat and old]

Is this it?

https://www.google.com.au/maps/search/B ... a=!3m1!1e3" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

No biggie, just ride around? Nice path in George St by the looks of it?

[RonK]

As it happens, I live in Tank Street, opposite the Supreme Courts plaza.

This is a very hight traffic area - lots of peds moving between the CBD and Roma Street Station, and a crossroads for cycle routes coming from both banks of the river and also the northern suburbs. And frequently, large attendances at court particularly when high profile cases are being heard, also atracting the media throng.

Quite right, there is a green bike lane around the entire court precinct. But it is convenient to cross the plaza, and I trundle across twice a day on my CityCycle.

Sadly there are a great many cyclists who seem unable to ride appropriately in such a high traffic area, so it's not surprising, and perhaps inevitable that such a ban would be imposed.

[Comedian]

As it happens, I live in Tank Street, opposite the Supreme Courts plaza.

This is a very hight traffic area - lots of peds moving between the CBD and Roma Street Station, and a crossroads for cycle routes coming from both banks of the river and also the northern suburbs. And frequently, large attendances at court particularly when high profile cases are being heard, also atracting the media throng.

Quite right, there is a green bike lane around the entire court precinct. But it is convenient to cross the plaza, and I trundle across twice a day on my CityCycle.

Sadly there are a great many cyclists who seem unable to ride appropriately in such a high traffic area, so it's not surprising, and perhaps inevitable that such a ban would be imposed.

Here's an idea... get the cops to stand there and catch them and let all the responsible adults get on with their lives.

[Lukeyboy]

As it happens, I live in Tank Street, opposite the Supreme Courts plaza.

This is a very hight traffic area - lots of peds moving between the CBD and Roma Street Station, and a crossroads for cycle routes coming from both banks of the river and also the northern suburbs. And frequently, large attendances at court particularly when high profile cases are being heard, also atracting the media throng.

Quite right, there is a green bike lane around the entire court precinct. But it is convenient to cross the plaza, and I trundle across twice a day on my CityCycle.

Sadly there are a great many cyclists who seem unable to ride appropriately in such a high traffic area, so it's not surprising, and perhaps inevitable that such a ban would be imposed.

Here's an idea... get the cops to stand there and catch them and let all the responsible adults get on with their lives.

Here's the right idea. Build the bridge that was supposed to be built years ago.

[Comedian]

As it happens, I live in Tank Street, opposite the Supreme Courts plaza.

This is a very hight traffic area - lots of peds moving between the CBD and Roma Street Station, and a crossroads for cycle routes coming from both banks of the river and also the northern suburbs. And frequently, large attendances at court particularly when high profile cases are being heard, also atracting the media throng.

Quite right, there is a green bike lane around the entire court precinct. But it is convenient to cross the plaza, and I trundle across twice a day on my CityCycle.

Sadly there are a great many cyclists who seem unable to ride appropriately in such a high traffic area, so it's not surprising, and perhaps inevitable that such a ban would be imposed.

Here's an idea... get the cops to stand there and catch them and let all the responsible adults get on with their lives.

Here's the right idea. Build the bridge that was supposed to be built years ago.

Absolutely the flyover is the go. It would be a moot point if they did that...

[RonK]

Here's an idea... get the cops to stand there and catch them and let all the responsible adults get on with their lives.

Here's the right idea. Build the bridge that was supposed to be built years ago.

Absolutely the flyover is the go. It would be a moot point if they did that...

I doubt it - the proposed flyover crosses Roma Street and would not make any difference.
The Kurilpa Bridge should have landed on Herschel Street, not Tank Street.

[il padrone]

What? A bridge over the law court plaza? Sounds a rather extreme solution to me

Or is there some other factors I don't know about ?

[Comedian]

What? A bridge over the law court plaza? Sounds a rather extreme solution to me

Or is there some other factors I don't know about ?

The magistrates court (next to the Supreme Court) was built to have a flyover from the parklands. If it was built I'd use it rather than going down through the lights on Roma street.

That ramp (already built) goes onto the George st cycleway.

I think the bike traffic through the Supreme Court would be significantly reduced if it was built. I'm not alone in thinking that.

[RonK]

What? A bridge over the law court plaza? Sounds a rather extreme solution to me

Or is there some other factors I don't know about ?

The magistrates court (next to the Supreme Court) was built to have a flyover from the parklands. If it was built I'd use it rather than going down through the lights on Roma street.

That ramp (already built) goes onto the George st cycleway.

I think the bike traffic through the Supreme Court would be significantly reduced if it was built. I'm not alone in thinking that.

If the crossing is ever built the ramp will direct traffic through the forecourt of the Magistrates Courts, an even narrower and more congested space passing close to the forecourt cafe and exiting onto the busy George/Turbot Street intersection. You would almost certainly be required to dismount.
And it would not change the through traffic crossing the Supreme Courts plaza to enter or leave the Tank Street access to the Kurilpa Bridge.
If the bridge had landed on Hershel Street there would have been a direct through route to both George and Roma Streets and the Parklands, as well as direct access to the Hershel Street ramp to/from the Bicentennial Bikeway.

[cj7hawk]

First they came for the petrol powered bicycles, and the cycling community did not speak out, because their leaders did not ride petrol powered bicycles...

When a supreme court judge says bicycles are too dangerous here, what if they hit someone ?, and then they are banned lest they offend the judge, it's a matter that should be fought, because you can be sure that this same argument is equally valid in any place where there are pedestrians...

Caveat Birotatio

David.

[Lukeyboy]

What? A bridge over the law court plaza? Sounds a rather extreme solution to me

Or is there some other factors I don't know about ?

The magistrates court (next to the Supreme Court) was built to have a flyover from the parklands. If it was built I'd use it rather than going down through the lights on Roma street.

That ramp (already built) goes onto the George st cycleway.

I think the bike traffic through the Supreme Court would be significantly reduced if it was built. I'm not alone in thinking that.

If the crossing is ever built the ramp will direct traffic through the forecourt of the Magistrates Courts, an even narrower and more congested space passing close to the forecourt cafe and exiting onto the busy George/Turbot Street intersection. You would almost certainly be required to dismount.
And it would not change the through traffic crossing the Supreme Courts plaza to enter or leave the Tank Street access to the Kurilpa Bridge.
If the bridge had landed on Hershel Street there would have been a direct through route to both George and Roma Streets and the Parklands, as well as direct access to the Hershel Street ramp to/from the Bicentennial Bikeway.

But it would funnel everyone into a particular corridor that's short and isolated instead of everyone hoping for the best.


If they really wanted to prevent cyclist/pedestrian interaction because all cyclists are dangerous they can block access to the footpath then reclaim a small section of the grass and make it a cyclist only on/off ramp. Similar to what we can see out near the showgrounds.

[Ross]

It would probably cost millions of dollars to build a flyover (would it be dedicated for cyclists or would peds be able to use it as well?) and if there is an alternate path already there that goes around the area and might take a minute longer to navigate then I don't see why it shouldn't be used instead.

[dzzmzz]

Here is an RTI release from the Courts on this very issue - where Channel 7 got their information from.

http://rtidocs.justice.qld.gov.au/15158 ... File01.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The justice talks about inevitable injuries - you know what makes injuries inevitable? Forcing cleated cyclists to dismount and walk.

This whole scheme is antagonistic and will not do anyone any favours.

What really grates my gears is that not only has there been no record of any bike incident here but the courts and police turn a blind eye to the media parking their vehicles on the footpath several metres away making it more difficult for pedestrians/cyclists and anyone needing help to access the court (such as those in wheelchairs).

[jasonc]

The media cause more of an issue that the people riding bikes do there. I swear at the media vehicle operators these days when they block the whole path. had one try to have a go at me. response "come and get me"

[fat and old]

The justice talks about inevitable injuries - you know what makes injuries inevitable? Forcing cleated cyclists to dismount and walk.

Except no-one is forcing a cleated cyclist to do that. In fact I'd have thought that being a cleated cyclist would infer experience enough to just go around if it's going to be too dangerous to walk it?

[dzzmzz]

Unfortunately, the way the bikeway is constructed around the courts doesn't encourage that kind of go around behaviour. Regardless if they took it, they would still have to unclip, get off their bike to hit the bike cross light to turn right at kuripla bridge.

In three years of cycling this nearly every day, I have maybe once or twice seen someone use the bikeway beside the court because of (I believe) a) it's poor designed for bike traffic b) it's simply way easier and not actually dangerous to ride through the shared area despite what this judge thinks.

People are forgetting this shared area they want to close down is still actually a signed bike route. People use it because its direct and they're allowed to. Taking the alternate route, they have to go through 3 separate sets of lights.

[PiratePete]

People are forgetting this shared area they want to close down is still actually a signed bike route. People use it because its direct and they're allowed to. Taking the alternate route, they have to go through 3 separate sets of lights.

Yep, I agree. And further to that if you do go around, you still need to enter the shared footpath area on Herschel St to get onto the George St bike lane. Carefully riding across this to be banned area makes sense to me for heading to the Kurilpa Bridge or George St when coming from the Roma St Parklands. I normally go around if heading to the Bicentennial Bikeway via Herschel St (or more commonly for me heading the opposite way i.e. north), but if heading towards the Uni this is the most logical route.

What really concerns me is that this sets a very nasty precedent, which could help justify banning bicycles from any 'shared' environment...

[geoff_tewierik]

I did what I could and brought it up to a wider audience via Cycling Tips Daily Digest today.

I use the Brisbane City Council recommended route through the Court Precinct on my commute. The George Street bikeway is a piece of infrastructure that leads nowhere. To continue from south to north via the George Street Bikeway I would need to interact with cars on Herschel Street/Roma Street crossing lanes to get to the magic green paint or mix with pedestrians on the very narrow Herschel Street path and then Roma Street path and then cross over lanes again to get to the Roma Street Parklands and north. Or I could just continue across the court precinct, saving time, on road interactions and generally have less stress.

[Mulger bill]

People are forgetting this shared area they want to close down is still actually a signed bike route. People use it because its direct and they're allowed to. Taking the alternate route, they have to go through 3 separate sets of lights.

Yep, I agree. And further to that if you do go around, you still need to enter the shared footpath area on Herschel St to get onto the George St bike lane. Carefully riding across this to be banned area makes sense to me for heading to the Kurilpa Bridge or George St when coming from the Roma St Parklands. I normally go around if heading to the Bicentennial Bikeway via Herschel St (or more commonly for me heading the opposite way i.e. north), but if heading towards the Uni this is the most logical route.

What really concerns me is that this sets a very nasty precedent, which could help justify banning bicycles from any 'shared' environment...

This. Give 'em an inch...

Get up on your back legs and start barking Brissy riders. Forget the petty interdiscipline squabbles for a while and stand as one because once they've applied the hurt to commuters you can be sure that the sportives and trail riders will be next; each attack on the ride facilitated by the sucess of the previous.

[myforwik]

Yeah this happens all the time when some one with the right connections pulls the political strings.

In Logan they banned cycling on all the foot parts around the council buildings because some councillor had a cry about being supposidly brushed by a cyclist, and played it up as if it was a crazy life threatening situation.

Having said that, more cyclists should be be fined for not giving proper way to pedestrians.

[newbris]

..
Quite right, there is a green bike lane around the entire court precinct.
..

There isn't. Heading northbound the green paint stops and there is no way to cross unfortunately. And the southbound forces you to interact with traffic and is missing ramps off the road at the appropriate spot. You also can get in the way of cyclists crossing quickly straight across george. It is a significantly poorer option. Sticking to the footpath with all the pedestrians when going right around feels safer than the on-road route, but of course it is far narrower than the courts precinct crossing.

[newbris]

It would probably cost millions of dollars to build a flyover (would it be dedicated for cyclists or would peds be able to use it as well?) and if there is an alternate path already there that goes around the area and might take a minute longer to navigate then I don't see why it shouldn't be used instead.

There isn't a path around northbound unfortunately. The flyover is there to avoid the dangerous roma st intersection and road tunnel into roma st to connect to the inner northern bikeway. It would also greatly improve the very steep grade when entering the roma st parklands so open it up to more cyclists.

[jasonc]

It would probably cost millions of dollars to build a flyover (would it be dedicated for cyclists or would peds be able to use it as well?) and if there is an alternate path already there that goes around the area and might take a minute longer to navigate then I don't see why it shouldn't be used instead.

There isn't a path around northbound unfortunately. The flyover is there to avoid the dangerous roma st intersection and road tunnel into roma st to connect to the inner northern bikeway. It would also greatly improve the very steep grade when entering the roma st parklands so open it up to more cyclists.

you can ride around that ramp if you so wish. it doesn't even take much longer