Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

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Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby DaveQB » Thu Sep 08, 2016 12:57 am

Hi all,
What value would put on a di2 6770 10 speed front derailleur and a rear derailleur of same? ebay has a HUGE range of prices for them, so hard to say their real value.

Thanks.
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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby 2wheels_mond » Thu Sep 08, 2016 7:10 am

Looking at this:

http://www.ebay.com.au/sch/i.html?_from ... 5573.m1684

Somewhere between $50-$110 for FD and $100-$200 for RD depending on condition.

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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby DaveQB » Thu Sep 08, 2016 9:36 am

Thanks 2wheels_mond
My ebay search returned prices from $35 to $360

I think I used "di2 6770 derailleur"

PS why would people buy these when the shifters (including 6770) all work with the 6870 derailleurs just the same?
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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby Ross » Thu Sep 08, 2016 7:08 pm

Because they want to upgrade their existing 10 speed mechanical bike to Di2 without the added expense of having to buy 11 speed wheels, cassette and chain as well.

Or they have trashed their 6770 derailleur in a crash and need to replace it.

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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby Duck! » Thu Sep 08, 2016 7:18 pm

DaveQB wrote:PS why would people buy these when the shifters (including 6770) all work with the 6870 derailleurs just the same?

Because with Di2 it's the derailleurs, not the shifters that contain the gear indexing, so these are necessary for a 10-sp. system.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.

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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby DaveQB » Fri Sep 09, 2016 1:29 am

Ross wrote:Because they want to upgrade their existing 10 speed mechanical bike to Di2 without the added expense of having to buy 11 speed wheels, cassette and chain as well.

Or they have trashed their 6770 derailleur in a crash and need to replace it.


I see. Never considered that. Thanks.
I need a new crank and don't want to invest in a 10 speed crank (old tech). So looking at changing my derailleurs and get an 11 speed crank.
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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby DaveQB » Fri Sep 09, 2016 1:30 am

Duck! wrote:
DaveQB wrote:PS why would people buy these when the shifters (including 6770) all work with the 6870 derailleurs just the same?

Because with Di2 it's the derailleurs, not the shifters that contain the gear indexing, so these are necessary for a 10-sp. system.


So less disruption to their "10 speed ecosystem"? I see, I see.
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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby Strawburger » Fri Sep 09, 2016 7:02 am

Cranks are the same for 10sp and 11sp. It's the rings that may need changing, but only rarely. So if you need cranks and rings then yes, you need the upgrade :)
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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby DaveQB » Fri Sep 09, 2016 9:17 am

Strawburger wrote:Cranks are the same for 10sp and 11sp. It's the rings that may need changing, but only rarely. So if you need cranks and rings then yes, you need the upgrade :)


Isn't there a little more spacing between the rings on 11 speed cranksets? I could spend $85 on a Shimano Tiagra 10 speed crankset but I am reluctant to put money into 10 speed. I think I am better off having both bikes on 11 speed making parts more interchangeable. That's my excuse :D


I need shorter crank arms. Going 165mm due to a lower quad issue from multiple right knee surgeries. With my saddle at the right height from bike fits, I get pain from too much repeated flexion. Raising the saddle 10-15mm resolves it but then I'm too high and get hip rocking.
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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby Strawburger » Fri Sep 09, 2016 10:16 am

If by spacing you mean the horizontal distance between rings, then it's minuscule. Plenty of people run 10sp cranks/rings on 11sp chains successfully too. If you need to save money, the cranks would be the last thing to get when upgrading to 11sp.

If you need to change crank lengths and the rest of your system is 11sp then go for the 11sp.
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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby DaveQB » Fri Sep 09, 2016 10:21 am

Strawburger wrote:If by spacing you mean the horizontal distance between rings, then it's minuscule. Plenty of people run 10sp cranks/rings on 11sp chains successfully too. If you need to save money, the cranks would be the last thing to get when upgrading to 11sp.

If you need to change crank lengths and the rest of your system is 11sp then go for the 11sp.


Right, yes horizontal spacing is what I am referring to. I am running a 10 speed crank on my 11 speed road bike. Front chainring shifts are ok, but not the best. I have an 11 speed, 165mm crankset on the way.

Crank arm length change is what I need...11 speed upgrade (to the TT bike) would be the bonus :)
I didn't know I only needed to change the derailleurs to go from 10 to 11 speed on di2. That's very cool.
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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby Duck! » Fri Sep 09, 2016 1:51 pm

DaveQB wrote:
Strawburger wrote:Cranks are the same for 10sp and 11sp. It's the rings that may need changing, but only rarely. So if you need cranks and rings then yes, you need the upgrade :)


Isn't there a little more spacing between the rings on 11 speed cranksets? I could spend $85 on a Shimano Tiagra 10 speed crankset but I am reluctant to put money into 10 speed. I think I am better off having both bikes on 11 speed making parts more interchangeable. That's my excuse :D

Yes & no. :P

2nd-generation 10-sp. (7900/6700/5700/4600/4700) and 1st-generation 11-sp. spacing is the same. 1st-gen 10-sp. (7800/6600/5600) has narrower spacing, 2nd-gen 11-sp. (not yet out in the wild R9100 Dura-Ace) has slightly wider spacing.

Short version is aside from 1st-gen 10-sp. and everything earlier, they're not fussy.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.

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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby DaveQB » Fri Sep 09, 2016 3:37 pm

Duck! wrote:2nd-generation 10-sp. (7900/6700/5700/4600/4700) and 1st-generation 11-sp. spacing is the same. 1st-gen 10-sp. (7800/6600/5600) has narrower spacing, 2nd-gen 11-sp. (not yet out in the wild R9100 Dura-Ace) has slightly wider spacing.

Short version is aside from 1st-gen 10-sp. and everything earlier, they're not fussy.


I see. My road bike, 11 speed, has a 6600 Ultegra crank with Praxis chainrings. Like I said, the shifting if ok, but fails every 6-8 shifts. Not terrible though. Replacing it with a Sram Force22 crankset [Force22 derailleurs]

So a 10 speed Shimano 4700 [2015] Tiagra crank could run on an 11 speed system? Say, 11 speed Ultegra di2?
http://www.ribblecycles.com/au/shimano- ... -chainset/

Thanks for all of the information everyone.
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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby DaveQB » Fri Sep 09, 2016 5:39 pm

And from the other way around....I could run a Shimano Ultegra 6800 crankset on my 6770 10 speed di2 setup?
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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby Duck! » Fri Sep 09, 2016 7:56 pm

Not sure what the offsetting of the Praxis rings is like compared to the original 6600s, but if they're anything close to the originals they're too close for the Di2 derailleur to do its thing properly, 'cos it's set up to the wider 2nd-gen. spacing. It can be tuned to work, but is a bit of dicking around.

You could replace the rings with a 5700 pairing, or both of the cranks mentioned above will work fine, as all of those options will give the spacing the derailleur expects.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.

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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby DaveQB » Fri Sep 09, 2016 10:32 pm

Thanks Duck!
I think I may have confused matters.

Road bike, 11 speed Sram Force 22:
Is using my cranks from my old Trek for now, Ultegra 6600 but with Praxis Chainrings as originals had worn out about a year ago. That's being replaced with a 165mm Sram Force22 crankset

TT bike:
di2 10 speed 6770 setup
But with RS-671 aerobar shifters and Dura-Ace di2 Brake Levers
It has a 6700 Ultegra crankset. 172.5mm
Looking to replace that with a 165mm crankset (and possibly the RD and FD to 6870)

1. I could use an Ultegra 11 speed 6800 crankset on it, as it, without issue?
2. I could upgrade to 6870 RD and FD and use either the 6800 crankset or a 4700 Tiagra 10 speed crankset?

Thank you!
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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby Duck! » Sat Sep 10, 2016 12:03 am

DaveQB wrote:TT bike:
di2 10 speed 6770 setup
But with RS-671 aerobar shifters and Dura-Ace di2 Brake Levers
It has a 6700 Ultegra crankset. 172.5mm
Looking to replace that with a 165mm crankset (and possibly the RD and FD to 6870)

1. I could use an Ultegra 11 speed 6800 crankset on it, as it, without issue?
2. I could upgrade to 6870 RD and FD and use either the 6800 crankset or a 4700 Tiagra 10 speed crankset?

Thank you!

Yes to all of the above, but you will need to check the rear wheel is compatible with an 11-sp. cassette.

Also, if fitting 6870 derailleurs, you will probably need to have the bike plugged into the E-Tube software to ensure all components are using the same firmware versions; they are updated every so often, so if you have some components older than others they don't work together, but a system update will fix it.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.

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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby DaveQB » Sat Sep 10, 2016 1:22 am

Duck! wrote:Yes to all of the above, but you will need to check the rear wheel is compatible with an 11-sp. cassette.


Thank you. Learnt a lot from this (derailed) thread.
Is there anything about bikes you don't know? Did you invent the modern bicycle?

So why do some cranks get the 10 speed label (Tiagra 4700) and others the 11 speed (Ultegra 6800) if they are the same?
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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby Ross » Sat Sep 10, 2016 10:34 am

^Mostly marketing so Shimano can justify selling you new schwag every 18 months. In reality as Duck has pointed out there are minor differences/changes to the newer parts to make it slightly lighter or perform slightly better.

I have 10 speed cranks (Ult 6700) with 11 speed Di2 and on another bike 10 speed Quarq crankset now with Praxxis chainrings (original Quarq/SRAM chainrings don't shift as well), also with 11 speed Di2. Both bikes also have 10 speed shifters

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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby DaveQB » Sat Sep 10, 2016 11:30 am

Ross wrote:^Mostly marketing so Shimano can justify selling you new schwag every 18 months. In reality as Duck has pointed out there are minor differences/changes to the newer parts to make it slightly lighter or perform slightly better.

I have 10 speed cranks (Ult 6700) with 11 speed Di2 and on another bike 10 speed Quarq crankset now with Praxxis chainrings (original Quarq/SRAM chainrings don't shift as well), also with 11 speed Di2. Both bikes also have 10 speed shifters


Thanks for the info Ross
I find it fascinating in a strange way. It's good to be in the know then.

I was thinking I would be needing to get the Tiagra 10 speed crank for my 10 speed 6770 B2 bike and then need to change the crank to an 11 speed when I upgrade to 11 speed. Hence why I was thinking of just jumping straight to 11 speed with 6870 RD, 6870 FD and an 11 speed Ultegra crank.

Thanks again Ross and Duck!

The next then is...Ultegra 6800 crank for $220 or the Tiagra 4700 for $80....
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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby Duck! » Sat Sep 10, 2016 9:14 pm

DaveQB wrote:Is there anything about bikes you don't know? Did you invent the modern bicycle?

So why do some cranks get the 10 speed label (Tiagra 4700) and others the 11 speed (Ultegra 6800) if they are the same?

Haha, I didn't invent the modern bike, but it's a very crucial part of my job to know this stuff.

The terms 9, 10, 11-sp. etc don't apply to cranks with any great validity, it's more by extension of the basis of the greater groupset/family the cranks are a part of. As pointed out previously, there are some generational changes that have occurred over the years, some in conjunction with cassettes sprouting more gears, some separately.

For example, the change in spacing that came with Shimano's second-generation 10-sp. groups came about from the increasing prevalence of compact cranksets, which have a greater difference between the chainring sizes than "traditional" cranks. This greater size difference tends to create a lot more noise when riding in the small ring on the front and the small sprocket at the rear, because the chain catches on the shifting pins & ramps on the inner face of the big ring. So moving the big ring outboard gives more clearance for chain flex and "gumby-proofs" the cranks against people who cross-chain that combination and then complain about the noise! :P In a similar vein, with the increasing use of disc brakes and the wider rear frame spacing dictated by them, next-generation Dura-Ace (R9100, which should be starting to become available in the next month or so) has a further increase in chainring spacing, which will presumably trickle down to next year's Ultegra and other subsequent new cranks.

The rings on "11-sp." cranks have slightly different tooth profiling, again to reduce noise, due to the wider range of lateral flex in the chain that comes with the wider cassette. The actual thickness of the rings is virtually unchanged since 7/8-sp.

The biggest difference between Tiagra and 105 & better cranks is that the crank arms are solid on the cheaper models, and hollow on the better ones. The manufacturing of the hollow cranks (and big chainrings on Ultegra and Dura-Ace) is quite complex and is the greatest contributor to the price difference.
I had a thought, but it got run over as it crossed my mind.

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Re: Value of Shimano di2 6770 RD and FD

Postby DaveQB » Sun Sep 11, 2016 1:36 am

Duck! wrote:For example, the change in spacing that came with Shimano's second-generation 10-sp. groups came about from the increasing prevalence of compact cranksets, which have a greater difference between the chainring sizes than "traditional" cranks. This greater size difference tends to create a lot more noise when riding in the small ring on the front and the small sprocket at the rear, because the chain catches on the shifting pins & ramps on the inner face of the big ring. So moving the big ring outboard gives more clearance for chain flex and "gumby-proofs" the cranks against people who cross-chain that combination and then complain about the noise! :P In a similar vein, with the increasing use of disc brakes and the wider rear frame spacing dictated by them, next-generation Dura-Ace (R9100, which should be starting to become available in the next month or so) has a further increase in chainring spacing, which will presumably trickle down to next year's Ultegra and other subsequent new cranks.


Very interesting. Makes sense. Thanks for sharing.

Duck! wrote: The rings on "11-sp." cranks have slightly different tooth profiling, again to reduce noise, due to the wider range of lateral flex in the chain that comes with the wider cassette. The actual thickness of the rings is virtually unchanged since 7/8-sp.


I see.

Duck! wrote:The biggest difference between Tiagra and 105 & better cranks is that the crank arms are solid on the cheaper models, and hollow on the better ones. The manufacturing of the hollow cranks (and big chainrings on Ultegra and Dura-Ace) is quite complex and is the greatest contributor to the price difference.


I have been trying to find the weight of the Tiagra crankset. I am thinking it is going to be substantially heavier than the Ultegra. But I don't know if I care for a TT bike.

Thanks again Duck!
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