XACD Project...

XACD Project...

Postby Crawf » Wed May 08, 2013 9:46 am

After months of planning the frame has finally arrived, let the fun begin...

The bike in a nutshell - An all weather commuter/trainer, with disc brakes, dynamo and Di2.
The wheelset pictured is a test fit set.

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by BNA » Wed May 08, 2013 12:13 pm

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Re: XACD Project...

Postby neild » Wed May 08, 2013 12:13 pm

Crawf you've done it again. That's a fantastic looking bike. How is the routing for rear brake? I was starting to plan a similar build but with a generic carbon frame like the FM059 or FM166, but now you've got me thinking...

If you don't mind me asking what's the specs on the frame and rough price?

Look forward to seeing some more pics.

Cheers
Neil.
Norco VFR1 Disc, Merida 903, Mofo Single Speed, Giant MTB, soon to be vintage Gazelle fixie
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby Crawf » Thu May 09, 2013 2:03 pm

Hi Neil, rear brake routing goes internally through the top tube, then pops out and runs down the NDS seat stay externally.
Wanted to keep everything clean hiding most of the cables internally where possible, when looking at the bike from the drive side, no cables will be visible besides at the bars and popping out at the RD.
Price depends on what you spec, its been a while since I checked the off the shelf prices but I think it would start in the $600-800 range now, all change$ go up from there.
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby neild » Thu May 09, 2013 5:20 pm

Thanks Crawf, after posting my question I noticed the hole in the top tube in the last pic. I assume you're also going to run an internal battery for the Di2?

So I'm thinking I'd be right in assumming you'd be up for say $300-400 more than a carbon frame based on the range you quoted? That's not too much when you take in the whole price of the build and that you can get custom. Obvisouly it also means you're taking on more risk because it's custom and you have to be 100% sure of what you're getting built.

Still something to consider.
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby biker jk » Thu May 09, 2013 5:58 pm

The welds look pretty good. That's some tapering of the headtube! Is it the angle or is there very little clearance between the seat tube and rear tyre/mudguard?
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby Crawf » Thu May 09, 2013 6:35 pm

Yeh shes a chunky head tube, at first I thought ewww doesnt look right. But its growing on me as the bike builds up.
The head tube decision was more future proofing as 1-1/8"-1-1/2" becomes more common place, more disc brake carbon forks (at reasonable prices) will become available.
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby Crawf » Fri May 10, 2013 8:35 am

biker jk wrote:Is it the angle or is there very little clearance between the seat tube and rear tyre/mudguard?


It's very tight, I wanted to keep it still somewhat racey but just enough for some mudguard clearance - 28mm max, 32mm certainly won't fit.
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby barefoot » Fri May 10, 2013 9:34 am

Your photo host is blocked by the protectors of taste and decency that rule over my work network :roll:, but I'll be watching this thread with great interest ;-)

tim
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby Crawf » Fri May 10, 2013 10:03 am

barefoot wrote:Your photo host is blocked by the protectors of taste and decency that rule over my work network :roll:, but I'll be watching this thread with great interest ;-)

tim


Try this.
Should be finished tonight and out for its maiden ride tomorrow! Along with some day time pics...
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby barefoot » Fri May 10, 2013 11:14 am

Crawf wrote:Try this.
Should be finished tonight and out for its maiden ride tomorrow! Along with some day time pics...


Ah, that's tasty.

What length chainstays are they?

You've gone for some very chunky seat stays. What's your thinking there? At least, they look chunky to me now I'm used to looking at mine, which I slimmed down... from the 19mm they put on my first drawing down to 16mm I had them build. Shouldn't be any appreciable load on my seatstays anyway (with brake mounted on chainstay).

I love Breezer dropouts. I probably should have put more time into seeing whether they could do caliper mounts on the chainstay with Breezers, rather than the big chunky dropout plates I got. Oh well. Next time :lol:

I like your chainstays too. Lots of clearance. You won't have the chainring clearance problems I have. I'm still trying to work out a long-term solution there... possibly even going back to square-taper crankset with a longer BB spindle :? . I'm having another play with MTB BB and road cranks and spacers tonight to see if I can do something better than my current setup.

tim
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby Crawf » Fri May 10, 2013 12:12 pm

This frame is a near copy of my first XACD frame which I love the ride of. So I thought why change what ain't broke and stuck with a similar geom only lengthening the chainstays for mudguard clearance.
Their off the shelf stock frames have a rep for being flexy, so the rear triangle has been beefed up.
Next time around I'd probably just go bigger tubing to save weight over thicker walls to get a stiffer frame. 'Apparently' bigger tubing will be lighter than smaller tubing with thick walls.
Chainstays - 410mm
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby jacob_T » Mon May 13, 2013 8:43 pm

This looks so great!
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby Crawf » Tue May 14, 2013 8:29 am

In it's native habitat this morning on the commute in, with a wet training session at Muzz throw in...

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Re: XACD Project...

Postby MichaelB » Tue May 14, 2013 1:09 pm

Lookin' good !!!
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby biker jk » Tue May 14, 2013 3:42 pm

How's the braking in the wet on those carbon rims?
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby barefoot » Tue May 14, 2013 3:51 pm

biker jk wrote:How's the braking in the wet on those carbon rims?


Pretty much the same as in the dry, I should imagine!

*cough*discbrakes*cough* :wink:

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Re: XACD Project...

Postby Peterjvh » Wed May 15, 2013 12:53 am

Great project Crawf! In fact I've been seriously contemplating a XACD Ti frame to build a light touring/commuting bike, then I ran across your topic! Your's is my dream bike!
I'm very much a novice so haven't got the nerve to pull the trigger and order from them. Do you have some words of wisdom for me? What do I need to be aware of with XACD? Anything else?
Many thanks.
Peter


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Re: XACD Project...

Postby biker jk » Wed May 15, 2013 10:42 am

barefoot wrote:
biker jk wrote:How's the braking in the wet on those carbon rims?


Pretty much the same as in the dry, I should imagine!

*cough*discbrakes*cough* :wink:

tim


I'm off to OPSM. :lol:
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby barefoot » Wed May 15, 2013 4:52 pm

Peterjvh wrote:Great project Crawf! In fact I've been seriously contemplating a XACD Ti frame to build a light touring/commuting bike, then I ran across your topic! Your's is my dream bike!
I'm very much a novice so haven't got the nerve to pull the trigger and order from them. Do you have some words of wisdom for me? What do I need to be aware of with XACD? Anything else?
Many thanks.
Peter


Hi Peter,

You might also be interested in my XACD frame from late last year, which is kinda the same but different.

The main things to be aware of with XACD:
1) The guy you deal with there, who calls himself Porter, is Chinese. Stating the obvious. But there's plenty of threads you'll find around the forums of people who expect him to have perfectly nuanced command of the English language and American standards of subservient customer service. If you want that, go buy a Moots or Litespeed, and pay accordingly. Work with Porter respectfully and in good faith, and you'll get a good outcome. Some say he's obnoxious and difficult to work with - I found him no different to any other business dealings I've had in China. That's how they do things there.

2) Assume nothing. Check everything. That's your job, not theirs. My mistake was not checking chainring clearance. On my drawings, they had a stepped line marking chainring position relative to the chainstays. Plenty of clearance, so I didn't pay any more attention. I later realised that they were showing a MTB triple... smaller rings, at a wider chainline than the road double I intended to use. My small ring interfered with the chainstay when I installed it. I've worked around it using a MTB bottom bracket and some spacers, so my entire crankset is offset slightly to the right, and my pedals are asymmetrical relative to the frame. Not an ideal outcome, but not a complete disaster.

3) XACD have built a lot of frames, and the vast majority of them have been fine. Anything they've done a thousand times, they will be able to do again without drama. If you do something radical, expect to have problems. If you don't want problems, be conservative.

I'm really happy with mine, and Crawf was obviously happy enough with his first that he's gone back for a second. I expect I might end up doing the same next time I'm due a new bike.

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Re: XACD Project...

Postby Peterjvh » Fri May 17, 2013 2:00 am

Thanks Tim,
I have been talking to Porter. I understand the Chinese sales mentality (have loved in Asia for 23 years), no problem.
I suppose I'm expecting him to teach me into the right option, but it's not his style. Unfortunately I don't know enough to design my own frame, yet do believe their standard frame might be a little under designed.
One large concern is the head tube made of simple 0.9 tubing, thinking it might be a little weak and possibly warped or out of round during the welding process. This seems to be one complaint about their frame??
I'm not sure their standard dropouts are good either. And, like you I want curved chain stays with disk brake caliper mounts but I'm not knowledgeable enough to "design" them for XACD.
Porter sent me standard drawings for a 570mm frame and I asked for 580mm which he sent me. When I asked home why the top tube was the same length on both, he told me I don't understand. I guess he's right. Ha ha
Porter told me they would make the frame double butted, but doesn't give me any information or details on that.
Finally I asked him for a quote on Ti forks, but found them very expensive (suppose I understand that), but then again I'm not sure of their quality, or if I should go carbon (prefer an all Ti bike).
Looking at my message above, I guess I know why Porter isn't very responsive, but then again I want to try one of their frames. If he instilled an little more confidence in me I'd go for it.
Thanks again.
Peter (the novice)


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Re: XACD Project...

Postby barefoot » Fri May 17, 2013 6:53 am

Peterjvh wrote:Looking at my message above, I guess I know why Porter isn't very responsive, but then again I want to try one of their frames. If he instilled an little more confidence in me I'd go for it.
Thanks again.
Peter (the novice)


Maybe you'd be better off talking to Dmitry at http://tritonbikes.com/ . He gets more involved in the design decisions. I think they used to be competitive with XACD on price, but have been successful enough that they've been able to jack the price up a bit, and still have a fairly long queue of customers.

The definitive Triton thread is on the MTBR forum: http://forums.mtbr.com/bike-frame-discu ... 83688.html . There's some lovely work on display there.

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Re: XACD Project...

Postby im_no_pro » Fri May 17, 2013 7:29 am

Why oh why did I come into this thread..... *must not research XACD,* *must not research XACD*

Very nice machine. Who wouldve thunk that I could drool over something with mudguards :lol:

Peterjvh wrote: I understand the Chinese sales mentality (have loved in Asia for 23 years), no problem.


Amazing how 1 little letter changes a whole sentence :shock: :lol:
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby Crawf » Fri May 17, 2013 8:01 am

Have drooled over that Triton thread before, very nice, but with exposure comes price increases and a waiting list :(

I have also found a new player in the Ti market, you may want to Google 'Walty', I have a quote from them for another proj and it came in considerably cheaper, and I mean allot cheaper! than what XACD would charge with all the same bells and whistles. They also are somewhat friendlier!
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby barefoot » Fri May 17, 2013 10:07 am

Crawf wrote:I have also found a new player in the Ti market, you may want to Google 'Walty'


*google*google*google*

I think you must be referring to Waltly with another L. Seems Mr Spannerbikes found them a while ago, and I didn't notice.

OMFlyingspaghettimonster, this is the rear end I wanted and didn't even know I wanted!

Image

That. Is. Dead. Sexy.

I was thinking Breezer dropouts with disc mount braze-ons tacked on to the chainstay... but that cross-brace disc mount thing is even nicer.

Oh well. Next time ;-)

tim
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Re: XACD Project...

Postby Peterjvh » Fri May 17, 2013 11:36 am

Peterjvh wrote: I understand the Chinese sales mentality (have loved in Asia for 23 years), no problem.


Amazing how 1 little letter changes a whole sentence :shock: :lol:[/quote]

Oops, you caught me!

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