Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

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RonK
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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby RonK » Sat Jul 09, 2016 10:23 pm

Yeah, the Sypre kits come with the two IS/PM adapter as well. The assumption seems to be that the bike will have the correct length posts.

I don't know if diferent brands of adapters can be interchanged, but they do look similar on the web. To be sure I'd stick with TRP parts so would either get the TRP adapter or the the TRP 160mm rotor.
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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby uad782 » Sun Jul 10, 2016 8:01 am

Thanks. It is interesting as I wonder if bike24 change the kit somehow. The trp website which also sells the kit says it comes with the pm 20 mm adaptor.

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby RonK » Sun Jul 10, 2016 9:32 am

uad782 wrote:Thanks. It is interesting as I wonder if bike24 change the kit somehow. The trp website which also sells the kit says it comes with the pm 20 mm adaptor.

Yes, that is what confused me - TRP makes no mention of separate front and rear kits.
Why not contact Bike 24 and tell them the adapter is missing, ask them to send one?
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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby uad782 » Sun Jul 10, 2016 10:34 am

Unfortunately I don't think they would agree. It is my fault for not reading their description. They describe it with only the two is adapters which is what they sent me.

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby }SkOrPn--7 » Sun Jul 10, 2016 5:34 pm

uad782 you have a Salsa Marrakesh is that correct with forks like below?

Image

If that is the case you have IS mounts which means the supplied hardware will fit you don't need PM adaptors.

This is Post Mount

If you have Post Mount this is the kind of adaptor you need.

Image

Ricky
Last edited by }SkOrPn--7 on Sun Jul 10, 2016 7:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby RonK » Sun Jul 10, 2016 6:04 pm

[quote="}If that is the case you have IS mounts which means the supplied hardware will fit you don't need PM adaptors.[/quote]
So it is. My bad - I though the Marrakesh fork was the same as the Fargo.
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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby RonK » Tue Aug 02, 2016 8:21 pm

Question: did you get a 6-bolt or a centerlock PD-8X?

The Spyre calipers are fairly wide and may not have adequate spoke clearance, so spacers may be necessary.

For 6-bolt you can get these spacers from Syntace. I used three on the Fargo.

For centerlock I think you may be able to bodge a cassette spacer to fit.
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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby Espresso_ » Wed Aug 03, 2016 9:34 pm

RonK wrote:Question: did you get a 6-bolt or a centerlock PD-8X?

The Spyre calipers are fairly wide and may not have adequate spoke clearance, so spacers may be necessary.

For 6-bolt you can get these spacers from Syntace. I used three on the Fargo.

For centerlock I think you may be able to bodge a cassette spacer to fit.


Yeah I had to do something similar with shims on my Spryes with the 6-bolt PD8.

E

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby Warin » Thu Aug 04, 2016 9:06 am

Running spykes with 26" wheels, 160mm 6 bolt rotors, shimano hubs = ok no shimming required.

If you go with 29" then maybe go with 180mm rotors to space things further out? Humm from the photos looks like some are using 180mm rotors.
Last edited by Warin on Fri Aug 05, 2016 8:02 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby uad782 » Thu Aug 04, 2016 10:42 pm

Hi everyone

Sorry for going dark but I have just moved into my new house which has put the build on hold. I will look at the forks tomorrow but I thought they had PM but I will double check.

Ron I have a pd8x with 6 bolt on front. Thanks for the recommendation for Craftworx. Wheels looks great and done in a quick time with min fuss. Unfortunately they are still sitting in box in new garage.

After seeing your Fargo Ron I am itching to keep going but the boss at home has other ideas for the moment.

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby uad782 » Thu Aug 04, 2016 10:45 pm

Also forgot to add the Low rider alternator 135 is now available. It appears to have a mass limit of 27 kg instead of 15 kg.

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby RonK » Fri Aug 05, 2016 10:41 am

New bike, new house - things must going well out near Malabugilmah. :D

Good to know all went smoothly with the wheels - Crafty does good work.

I can't see the low rider alternator rack on the Salsa web site. What is the difference that it has so much more load capacity - cromo instead of alloy?
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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby uad782 » Fri Aug 05, 2016 9:37 pm

Yes Ron, things are looking up here!

I have been hassling Salsa for the rack so that is how I know. The local distributor will order it in if I want one. This will take three weeks and he wants to charge $20 above the RRP for postage. I would have thought he was on a good wicket as he would be getting the LBS cut anyhow. It makes Bike24 sound good.

With regards to capacity it was actually a document you pointed me to that showed the capacity:
http://salsacycles.com/files/tech/12834_SAL_Alt_Rack_INST_F.pdf. I wonder how they rate them as both Alternator 135s are made from the same material (Al 6061) so the only way it could be stronger is element shape,thickness or geometry of the rack.

BTW I opened the forks and they are IS mount- so there you go and thanks to SkOrPn--7!

I hope to get building soon!

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby baabaa » Sat Aug 06, 2016 10:45 am

Relax on the lug weight stuff, just had a look at my "budget" wanderlust in hand next to a Topeak Super Tourist Tubular and I gotta "wonder" how you you could bend or break it. Its a fair lump of a rack and while I looked at the steel option, happy I went the lighter option. The welds are pretty beefy. Even looks stronger than my old nitto.
I have only busted one rack and that was one of the original blackburns which just came apart at the welds on the rear top so it still works.Guess I could post some side by side pics of the wanderlust if I knew /wondering how. Again I would just chill on the weights (even if salsa have gone to the effort of having a heavy stamped max load of 33 lbs/ 15 kg on the top of the rack...)

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby }SkOrPn--7 » Sat Aug 06, 2016 12:36 pm

Yeah I wouldn't worry too much about rack weights they build into them a safety factor for safe work load you can bet that 15kg maximum has been tested to not break to 25kg or more. They just don't want to have warranty issues hence the maximum set weight limit well below what it can really take.

Ricky

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby avolve » Tue Oct 11, 2016 1:15 pm

Wondering how the Marrakech build is going uad782?

Charlie the Bike Monger has 2016 frame sets going for ~730 (~$930 at Bike24) plus delivery. Not sure yet the diff between 2016/2017.

Considering a build and using my Pug for bike packing rather than the (extra) expense of a 2017 Fargo... (I already have a frame bag for the Pug)

[The Marrakesh would also fit the bill as a commuter, whereas not sure I would fit my panniers on the Fargo: there is 10mm difference which might be inconsequential??]

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby uad782 » Tue Oct 11, 2016 10:02 pm

Thanks for asking avolve.

Unfortunately very very slowly. Soon after purchasing I enrolled in a Master of Engineering course which means head back in books :(. That's why I have been so quiet.

It finishes in a couple of weeks and I will start then. Between work, studying and riding and family I have had no time. I have all the parts in the garage except for a low rider rack which I will order soon. I am looking forward to riding it instead of my 29er.

I have been relooking at the new Fargo in what spare time I have...maybe I need to sell a bike!

Also what 10mm difference?

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby avolve » Thu Oct 13, 2016 8:03 pm

uad782 wrote:Also what 10mm difference?


Chainstay length

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby uad782 » Sun Nov 27, 2016 4:06 pm

Hi Everyone,

I have finally got going on the Marrakesh. I am very impressed with the frame and wheelsets fromCraftworx.

I am wondering about the headset/stem. As you can see the steerer is very long as I have two sets of spacers in there. Can I cut the steerer at the top of the spacers?

I am also wondering how I get the headsets mounted as they done fit easily in the recessions on the frame. I am hoping when I preload the steerer when it is shorter it should force everything into place.

Any comments appreciated.

Thanks

Image

Image

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby RonK » Sun Nov 27, 2016 5:02 pm

Well - as a master of engineering you should be familiar with Booker rod. It is 12mm threaded rod and is available from Bunnings so go buy a length, a couple of nuts and heavy plate washers. That is all you need to pull the headset caps in. Liberally grease the headtube recess and cups before pulling in. You are likely to damage the bearings if you try to pull the cups in by using preload.

I'm assuming that you have the Cane Creek Forty headset and the fork has a steel steerer.

To install the crown race you will need a length of appropriate diameter tubing and a hammer. Even plastic pipe may be sufficient. It's best to hold the fork off the ground while driving the crown race, but it may be ok placed on a softwood block.

According to Salsa's General Fork Instructions 2016+ the spacer stack between the headset and stem must not exceed 50mm (figure 4). You could probably get away with more spacers with a steel steerer but that is your call. For carbon steerers you must also fit a 10mm spacer on top, but I think this looks tidy for steel steerers too - or perhaps a 5mm spacer if you have one, looks like you do.

Once the headset cups and crown race are installed, assemble the fork with the spacers and the stem, and mark the cutting length. Then cut the steerer around 3mm shorter to allow for the top cap. If it is cut too long you won't be able to adjust the preload correctly.

To cut the steerer, use a pair of worm-drive hose clamps as a cutting guide, and cut with a fine toothed (32 tpi) bladed hacksaw.

If you don't have a star nut setter, a long bolt and a good whack with a hammer may do the trick, but they are bloody awkward things to get started. May cause a few ouches, so be careful of your fingers.
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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby }SkOrPn--7 » Sun Nov 27, 2016 6:06 pm

uad782 wrote:Hi Everyone,

I have finally got going on the Marrakesh. I am very impressed with the frame and wheelsets fromCraftworx.

I am wondering about the headset/stem. As you can see the steerer is very long as I have two sets of spacers in there. Can I cut the steerer at the top of the spacers?

I am also wondering how I get the headsets mounted as they done fit easily in the recessions on the frame. I am hoping when I preload the steerer when it is shorter it should force everything into place.

Any comments appreciated.

Thanks


Image


That's one awesome tire your shoving on that build riding on water are we? :P

Ricky

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby uad782 » Sun Nov 27, 2016 6:17 pm

Thanks Ron,

Have you been to NZ yet?

I am not a master of eng yet with quite a few subjects to go :(. I am ,only going to be a master of soils and roads.

I will do what you say with the booker rod.

With regards to the crown race I tried heating it but it did not expand enough so I found a steel pole that fit over the fork and used kinetic energy. I held the fork in my hand. The crown race is just a reduced as I ended up using a set of Hope bearings.

As I am using Hope bearings I will not be using a star nut but the Hope system. It appears to be a solid cylinder that fits into the fork and expands when the bolts is screwed in.

I would appreciate any comments you have.

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby uad782 » Sun Nov 27, 2016 6:18 pm

Ricky, wait until you see its brakes!

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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby RonK » Sun Nov 27, 2016 7:34 pm

No, have not been to NZ yet as work commitments got in the way. I'm now hoping to go in April. That's about as late as I can leave it before it gets to cold.

Expander plug is fine and essential if the steerer is carbon. It probably has a hex socket on top to expand it.
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Re: Surly vs Soma vs Salsa

Postby uad782 » Mon Nov 28, 2016 6:43 am

Thanks again Ron.

I am uncertain as to what height to have the handlebars. In this case would it be best to add the full 50mm of spacers. From this I can raise and lower the stem.

Any comments please?

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