Buying new wheelset

Questions about purchasing bicycles and parts

Buying new wheelset

Postby vitualis » Mon Apr 09, 2007 12:30 am

I have a Cell Team that I bought about 2 months ago that I'm thoroughly enjoying. I'm thinking about upgrading the wheelset with my next service and have been looking at a few that are available at Cell Bikes. My budget is about $400. Of those available are:
  • American Classic - Victory
  • Mavic Askium
  • Shimano WH-561


Any advice on which one I should choose or pros and cons between them?

Cheers.

Regards.
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by BNA » Mon Apr 09, 2007 6:20 am

BNA
 

Postby sogood » Mon Apr 09, 2007 6:20 am

Don't upgrade for the sake of upgrade. Work out for yourself the reason why and what you need the second wheelset for. Without significant differentiation b/n the two, it's $$$ wasted.
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Postby moosterbounce » Mon Apr 09, 2007 12:15 pm

I ride the Aksiums and find them excellent. They have stayed true and look great :wink:

I agree with sogood though - don't upgrade for the sake of upgrading. I don't know what came with your bike, but I would suggest 2 months isn't very long so they won't be worn. Unless you were spending $1000+ you probably won't notice a difference.

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Postby mikesbytes » Mon Apr 09, 2007 1:31 pm

Hey Vitualis, welcome to the forum, its been a while since I've seen your Avator.

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I thought you lived in Wollongong?

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Postby vitualis » Mon Apr 09, 2007 2:33 pm

I used to live in the 'Gong.

I live in Surry Hills now. Cheers!
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Postby mikesbytes » Mon Apr 09, 2007 6:27 pm

Hey Vitualis,

Regarding the wheel upgrade, we really need to know your riding habits to advise, as different components suit different riders and different riding profiles.

I'd recommend that you go out on a beginners club ride (sogood's and my club Dulwich Hill Bicycle Club (DHBC)) next Saturday Morning, departing 6.30am Mick Mazza's at 299 Marrickville rd, Marrickille (a few metres from Illarware road) and talk to our resident expert Lindsay. Don't worry, they ride at the pace of the slowest rider, the rides called "Saturday Slowies".

Let sogood and I know your riding and well drop by and say hello.

If I remember correctly, your in the medical industry, appoligies if I have it wrong. Have a look at this thread;

The anatomy of a cyclist - which muscles are used to ride

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Postby vitualis » Mon Apr 09, 2007 7:33 pm

Cheers. Thanks for the invitation.

Unfortunately, with regards to a number of committments, I don't think I'll be able to attend that ride... :(

The more I think about it, I think that sogood is probably right... I'll probably wait before buying about another wheelset.

I'm currently riding mostly for fitness. Currently, I ride laps at Centennial Park about twice a week for about 1.5 hours. At the moment, I'm getting about 26.5 km/h (which has actually improved in the past month or so!)

Out of interest, what are the major pros and cons with these wheelsets?

Cheers.
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Postby mikesbytes » Mon Apr 09, 2007 8:37 pm

That ride actually goes to Centennial Park. Also a favourite riding ground for Sogood.

John Swanson, wrote up this summary of what to look for in a wheel, the other day, I have lifted it from another forum. Have a look at his website, at the bottom of the quote.

In summary I'd say that Stiffness is the most important aspect, followed by aerodynamics, then internal friction. Weight is not that important.

Whats wrong with your current wheels?

Originally Posted by ScienceIsCool
From the wheels I've measured, I've been able to notice some trends in the data. The following are important for good performance:

- Aerodynamics improves with rim depth. A deeper rim also makes the wheel more rigid laterally.
- Rotational aerodynamics is better with fewer spokes. However, this makes the wheel less rigid laterally.
- For aerodynamics, smaller spokes are better than large spokes and bladed are better than round.
- Good hubs that are well adjusted reduce the amount of bearing friction. A good amount of the friction is in the bearing seals. They rub (they're supposed to in order to keep out water) and cause drag.

I should also add that durability is a completely separate issue. It's possible to make a wheel with fantastic performance, but does not hold up to regular riding. I don't know of any real way to measure that. I guess looking for reviews for a particular wheelset would give some info.

What is not important:

- Weight is not very important. The differences in weight and moment of inertia that I have measured amount to incredibly small changes in performance.
- Ceramic bearings do not make a large difference. SKF has come up with an excellent "bearing drag model" that is heavy on the physics and engineering. Using that tool, I figure the average improvement will be ~0.2 Watts per wheel at 40 km/hr. That should be a good approximation, anyways.

And without analyzing any data, my personal bias is that good tires make a big difference in ride quality if not performance. I just bought an expensive set of Deda Tre "Open Tubular RS Corsa" tires. I'll be taking them out on their first ride in a few minutes...

I hope that helps.

John Swanson
www.bikephysics.com


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Postby sogood » Mon Apr 09, 2007 8:53 pm

mikesbytes wrote:That ride actually goes to Centennial Park. Also a favourite riding ground for Sogood.

I do like it for the fact that you can do intervals without any traffic concerns. The little hill there is also the right gradient and length for a few good workout loops. Just hate the ride across the city to get there, a definite no no around weekday peak hours.
Last edited by sogood on Mon Apr 09, 2007 9:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby sogood » Mon Apr 09, 2007 9:07 pm

vitualis wrote:The more I think about it, I think that sogood is probably right... I'll probably wait before buying about another wheelset.

I'm currently riding mostly for fitness. Currently, I ride laps at Centennial Park about twice a week for about 1.5 hours. At the moment, I'm getting about 26.5 km/h (which has actually improved in the past month or so!).

Definitely ride some more and get to know what you really need before deciding on what kind of upgrade will give you the most bang for your buck. If you just ride laps in Centennial and for fitness, your present wheelset is more than adequate for the relatively flat course there. And even with the best aero wheels, you are not going to be going much faster on top of your present 26.5kph. Aero advantage would become significantly greater at much higher speeds, and we are talking about at least greater than 30kph and into 40+kph pro speed on the flat. As a matter of fact, pros use training wheels that aren't as light nor aero as their racing wheels, and your present wheels are just perfect for training and fitness.

Given your present riding style, the only "rational" excuse for coughing up for a wheelset upgrade is for bling bling. :D
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