Ay Ups - which beam for road riding?

[casual_cyclist]

I know, I know, Ay Ups again

Since they are selling out the old road kit (http://www.ayup-lights.com/products/1/) for $275 I am now seriously considering picking up a set.

The type of riding I want them for is non-metro unlit roads and unlit bike paths.

So, which beam would you recommend? Intermediate or Medium? What are the pros and cons of each?

Thanks

Greg

[Aushiker]

Hi Greg

From the Ay-Up website:

We recommend:

Narrow for helmet use, great for riding at high speed - awesome throw.

Intermediate for the Handlebars, great combo with the narrow - throw and spread.

Medium is a great handlebar light with a wide spread but less throw, also a perfect light for Headband use.

Regards
Andrew

[casual_cyclist]

Hi Greg

From the Ay-Up website:

We recommend:

Narrow for helmet use, great for riding at high speed - awesome throw.

Intermediate for the Handlebars, great combo with the narrow - throw and spread.

Medium is a great handlebar light with a wide spread but less throw, also a perfect light for Headband use.

Regards
Andrew

Thanks Andrew

I guess then Intermediate? I was hoping to hear from some people who have them but maybe I have posed the question wrong?

I have been comparing a lot of lights. I looked at the MiNewts today (mini and X2). They seem ok but a bit $$$. The other lights seem to have quite expensive batteries. I think the Ayup lights are overpriced but the batteries seem good in terms of value for $$$

Cheers

Greg

[Jacobite]

I have the medium set, and also the narrow or intermediate (sorry forgot which one exactly ).
The medium does not throw out enough light into the distance, I'd definitely recommend narrow/interm for a longer beam.

[msn]

Also got the intermediates, bar mounted, on my road commuter. Pretty good in most areas.

The type of riding I want them for is non-metro unlit roads and unlit bike paths

Going to also consider adding narrow beams to my helmet because some of the "metro" streets and bike baths in Western Sydney have cr*p lighting.
Turning into tight corners, a helmet light will let you see what is in your intended path.
Narrow + intermediate sets (MTB kit) and more $. I recall other posts (somewhere here) where AYUP have customized kits by request.
- buy road kit with dual charger instead of single as an option, add an extra light and battery later.

Cheers,

Mark.

[black4tress]

I think the Ayup lights are overpriced but the batteries seem good in terms of value for $$$

I have intermediates on my road bike. Placed on handle bar with 2 x 3 hour packs.
At first it seem quite excessive to pay $280 for lights but 4 months into it its been one of the best purchases I have made. I'm not the fussy type that compares one model to another just to try and get the absolute best deal there is and tend to go with what most are getting as you can see from what I have. I have giant bikes, ayup lights, shimano this and that - they are popular for a reason and that reason is, they work well (infact really well) packaged well, look hot and more importantly reliable so far. If these lights last for more than 3 years then its less than $100 a year - peanuts if you ask me esp if you compare what ppl pay for their bikes and other accessories.

Go the Ayups.

Tony

[Super Commuter]

I have intermediates on my road bike. Placed on handle bar with 2 x 3 hour packs.
At first it seem quite excessive to pay $280 for lights but 4 months into it its been one of the best purchases I have made. I'm not the fussy type that compares one model to another just to try and get the absolute best deal there is and tend to go with what most are getting as you can see from what I have. I have giant bikes, ayup lights, shimano this and that - they are popular for a reason and that reason is, they work well (infact really well) packaged well, look hot and more importantly reliable so far. If these lights last for more than 3 years then its less than $100 a year - peanuts if you ask me esp if you compare what ppl pay for their bikes and other accessories.

Go the Ayups.

Tony

+1 to all that. Recently bought the intermediate beam for handlebar use and they are great for the commute home although sensitive to adjust so you don't end up blinding people. Il Padrone wrote a great comparison somewhere about the advantages and disadvantages of the concentric beam on these things compared to other types, which is worth reading. I reckon his dynamo setup would be the ultimate but I would buy the Ayups again just for the simplicity / light weight and I have no issues with charging / battery life. I don't like the helmet mounted narrow beam option because it would blind too many people on my commute and I don't need the extra light. If you are out on your own though and moving fast it could be useful if you need more light but you will still need the intermediate beam for general use IMO anyway so perhaps best to start with that?

[casual_cyclist]

Intermediate it is then. Thanks for all the feedback from everyone. Decided to bite the bullet and get the MTB kit. Of course they are sold out

[Aushiker]

Go the Ayups.

G'day

Not for me, not for the new Ay-Up kits which are more expensive for less. Now going the DiNotte route I think as I can get a full setup that will allow me to meet Audax riding requirements whilst having two decent lights. To do the same in Ay-Up is just more dollars.

Andrew

[black4tress]

Go the Ayups.

G'day

Not for me, not for the new Ay-Up kits which are more expensive for less. Now going the DiNotte route I think as I can get a full setup that will allow me to meet Audax riding requirements whilst having two decent lights. To do the same in Ay-Up is just more dollars.

Andrew

Sounds like they are doing a Malvern Star. Get the product out there at a reasonable/low price then once it gets better reputation and everyone talking, up the price . Maybe thats why they are called Ay up

[Redbull]

You can still get the neoprene multisport kit for $275

If you go to the online tab and click then kits you can scroll down for the multisport kit.

Hell its easier to just post the LINK

[damhooligan]

Hell its easier to just post the LINK

true , here is a link for the beam shots

[trailgumby]

This year for the extra money (a whole $60) you get a hard case (better than the neoprene wetsuit thingy I have), a choice of high and low beam, and about 25% more light, if the Mountain Biking Australia review is correct. Oh, and a much better helmet mounting system as well, that I have bought separately as an upgrade.

Still get the same battery life on high beam even with the greater output.

Dunno where the "pay more for less" comment comes from... I confused.

There are other local manufacturers that are getting closer in price/perfromance, but I reckon Ayup still has the lead for now.

I have the mtb kit (strangely enough ) and find that the helmet mounted light is a major blessing. I tend to look slightly left when other cyclists approach, but I take the view that a little pain for peds and sometimes drivers is a guarantee that they've actually seen me, resulting in a net safety improvement for everybody and especially me.

[casual_cyclist]

This year for the extra money (a whole $60) you get a hard case (better than the neoprene wetsuit thingy I have), a choice of high and low beam, and about 25% more light, if the Mountain Biking Australia review is correct. Oh, and a much better helmet mounting system as well, that I have bought separately as an upgrade.

Still get the same battery life on high beam even with the greater output.

Dunno where the "pay more for less" comment comes from... I confused.

There are other local manufacturers that are getting closer in price/perfromance, but I reckon Ayup still has the lead for now.

I have the mtb kit (strangely enough ) and find that the helmet mounted light is a major blessing. I tend to look slightly left when other cyclists approach, but I take the view that a little pain for peds and sometimes drivers is a guarantee that they've actually seen me, resulting in a net safety improvement for everybody and especially me.

I think the more for less comment relates to number of lights and run time on high.
Prev MTB kit had 2 lights and 12 hours miniumum battery life for $440
New equivalent has 2 lights and 12 hours miniumum battery life for $550

All the bells and whistles are fine if that is what you are looking for but for basic functionality IMO value for money has gone down.

[Baalzamon]

This year for the extra money (a whole $60) you get a hard case (better than the neoprene wetsuit thingy I have), a choice of high and low beam, and about 25% more light, if the Mountain Biking Australia review is correct. Oh, and a much better helmet mounting system as well, that I have bought separately as an upgrade.

Still get the same battery life on high beam even with the greater output.

Dunno where the "pay more for less" comment comes from... I confused.

There are other local manufacturers that are getting closer in price/perfromance, but I reckon Ayup still has the lead for now.

I have the mtb kit (strangely enough ) and find that the helmet mounted light is a major blessing. I tend to look slightly left when other cyclists approach, but I take the view that a little pain for peds and sometimes drivers is a guarantee that they've actually seen me, resulting in a net safety improvement for everybody and especially me.

I think the more for less comment relates to number of lights and run time on high.
Prev MTB kit had 2 lights and 12 hours miniumum battery life for $440
New equivalent has 2 lights and 12 hours miniumum battery life for $550

All the bells and whistles are fine if that is what you are looking for but for basic functionality IMO value for money has gone down.

Old MTB kit which is what I have, is 1 6hr battery, 2 3hr batteries = 12hrs. New kit has flashing batteries so 1 6hr battery is now capable of 6hrs on high, 12hrs on low, 24hrs on flashing.12v car adaptor. Heck if you don't want those extra's, I'll sell you my MTB kit for the retail price and I'll buy the new one.

[trailgumby]

Old MTB kit which is what I have, is 1 6hr battery, 2 3hr batteries = 12hrs. New kit has flashing batteries so 1 6hr battery is now capable of 6hrs on high, 12hrs on low, 24hrs on flashing.12v car adaptor. Heck if you don't want those extra's, I'll sell you my MTB kit for the retail price and I'll buy the new one.

+1.

[casual_cyclist]

Old MTB kit which is what I have, is 1 6hr battery, 2 3hr batteries = 12hrs. New kit has flashing batteries so 1 6hr battery is now capable of 6hrs on high, 12hrs on low, 24hrs on flashing.12v car adaptor. Heck if you don't want those extra's, I'll sell you my MTB kit for the retail price and I'll buy the new one.

+1.

Why would I pay full retail for a secondhand kit

I am now looking seriously at the Dinotte 200L Dual.

Ayup V4 Adventure has two lights, 12 hours high, 24 hours low for $550

Dinotte 200L Dual has two lights, 16 hours high, 32 hours medium, 64 hours low for $439.

Shipping is $15 for the Ayup and $17.50 for Dinotte.

If you look at http://www.mtbr.com/beamcomparisoncrx.aspx the Ayup bar and 200L is roughly equivalent. Ayup Combo (one bar, one helmet) is a lot brighter than 200L double. However, 200L double is all I am looking for.

Better value for money IMO.

[trailgumby]

Why would I pay full retail for a secondhand kit

Um, it's been broken in?

If the Dinotte has a helmet light and bar light inclusive for that price, and the helmet unit's in the same ballpark weight-wise as the Ayup then, sure, why not.

Some thngs I like about how Ayup do business:
* If you damage a light unit you can swap it for the price of postage
* You can upgrade light units on a trade-up scheme when more effficient (brighter) models are released.

Let us know how you get on

[Aushiker]

Old MTB kit which is what I have, is 1 6hr battery, 2 3hr batteries = 12hrs. New kit has flashing batteries so 1 6hr battery is now capable of 6hrs on high, 12hrs on low, 24hrs on flashing.12v car adaptor. Heck if you don't want those extra's, I'll sell you my MTB kit for the retail price and I'll buy the new one.

G'day

For someone like me (eyesight) and/or who are using these lights on long distance Audax rides, then battery life is pretty important. For me personally I don't want flashing and the low will be, I suspect, a waste of time for me (based on my experience with my current lights and others reports on low in what I believe are similar powered lights; that said I can't find the specifications on the Ay-Up website which also does not inspire me), so I am interested in battery life on high and using that for comparison purposes. The new base kit offers a half EPIC battery which is three hours, so it offers three hours of burn time for $319.

As to the case, well I fit my lights to the bike and I use them. I can't see any need for the case in my circumstances so this adds no value for me.

Based on this, the new kits offer less value for more dollars. Not a good buy for me. For Audax I also would like 12 hours of burn time, so will need to fork out an extra $176.00 on the new kits to get that outcome (two batteries versus three), bringing the cost to $495. I will also still need to carry a second Ay-Up light engine and mount which is at a cost of $127.60 on top of the $495, i.e., a total of $622.60.

The old $275 kit offers a six hour battery for $275. So for less dollars you get twice the battery life. For my Audax set-up I would be looking at $468.60 based on the old kit.

In comparison a DiNotte 200L Dual with 2 x 4 cell batteries costs $439.11. It provides two DiNotte 200L light engines which are mounted separately therefore meeting the Audax requirements whilst providing 200 lumens of light from each engine. The 4 cell batteries provide 8 hours of run time each on full power. Cavebear reports that for a lot of riding one can get away with medium power (not low) which provides 16 hours from each battery. The also for interest sake offer a number of flash options.

In summary:

New Ay-Up Kit setup for Audax - $622.60
Old Ay-Up Kit setup for Audax - $468.60
DiNotte 200L Dual setup for Audax - $439.11

I suspect that Greg is also looking at the options along similar lines to me. I also appreciate I could run a lesser light as the second light thus reducing the cost, however, I value being able to be seen and seeing and really don't see value in comprising the setup.

In any input into the above would be valued.

Regards
Andrew

[}SkOrPn--7]

I have to agree with Andrew AY-UP have always included a crap load of just that crap in my opinion that your paying for and will never use. The first MTB kit I got I have never used those neoprene pouches or that kit bag plus many other things. My lights are on my bike and if there taken of there tossed in my gear bag not placed away and rapped up in some nancy boy covering. I don't want to pay extra for a big plastic case with foam cut outs because my lights will never be back in there so why not give the customer a choice of a case or reduced price without all the hoopla. It looks perty as a selling point but it isn't for me and as for the batteries they also should be left out with a selection box like they do for the lights to make a choice of what you want not be told you will get "X" number of 3 hr batteries or "X" number of 6 hr batteries I want to choose my batteries when making a kit purchase. I think ay-up are starting to make bad decisions rather than offer choices so one can cut down on the crap they do not wish to pay for in order to keep costs down so that my opinion in a nut shell.

[casual_cyclist]

I suspect that Greg is also looking at the options along similar lines to me. I also appreciate I could run a lesser light as the second light thus reducing the cost, however, I value being able to be seen and seeing and really don't see value in comprising the setup.

The 2010 NiteRider MiNewt.200 looks like it is a good potential solution too with 2 kits being $430.52. However, I haven't been able to find decent shipping and the run time is only 7 hours high and 14 hours lot. Additional batteries are a bit $$$.

Dinotte give you 3 options of which batteries you want when you pick the kit. The Dinotte 200L Dual with 2x4 Cell batteries give a run time of 16 hours (AT) 100% or 32 hours (AT) 50%. The lights can be bar or helmet mounted and (unlike Ayups) two lights can be run off the same battery when extra light is needed ($439.11).

Looks the best deal I can find right now.

Cheers

Greg

[wombatK]

My lights are on my bike and if there taken of there tossed in my gear bag not placed away and rapped up in some nancy boy covering. I don't want to pay extra for a big plastic case with foam cut outs because my lights will never be back in there so why not give the customer a choice of a case or reduced price without all the hoopla.

It seems that Ayups were developed to suit MTB competitions - and those guys travel a lot. If a large part of Ayups's market wants to have something that is well-protected for throwing in airline luggage etc.,., they need to serve it. Perhaps lack of economies of scale or transaction costs would make this impossible on an opt-in purchasing basis.

While I've hardly used any of the pouches/packaging stuff for travelling, I found the fact that is was a complete solution appealing and was happy to have things included that I had no immediate need for. With too many other gadgets I've got, the cost of finding and buying good protective packaging when needed has been frustratingly high (e.g. mobile phone, 240V charger, car charger, headphones, car hands-free kit - keeping it altogether when travelling in rented cars and motels etc.,.). And I have found it very convenient to pack all the Ayup's bits away in the kit for summertime so that nothing gets lost. Worth it just for that.

[trailgumby]

I have to agree with the wombat.

My bike goes with me whrn I travel up the coast to see family, and we often ride the bush at night to escape the heat. So being able to wrap it all up in one package so it all stays together is a selling point for me. The lights don't stay on the bike while travelling or during the day. Too tempting for thieves.

While I joke about annoying drivers and peds with the brightness of my current lightset, if the new ones are 25% brighter like has been suggested in the MBA review, I think the ability to select a low beam would be necessary. While inflicting a little discomfort on others with an attitude problem is sometimes sweet revenge, I wouldn't want to be responsible for an accident or even a near miss.

A flasher operating on the bar set *could* be helpful in Sydney commuting traffic: most of my near misses have been from the front. I've found though that the constant-on from both helmet and bars both gets their attention and confuses drivers so that they're even more wary than they wold be normally, whhc is a nice change. So they jury's out for me w.r.t. the flashers.

But hey, if another manufacturer suits your needs better then go for it. It's what we have a marketplace for, isn't it?

[Aushiker]

While I joke about annoying drivers and peds with the brightness of my current lightset, if the new ones are 25% brighter like has been suggested in the MBA review, I think the ability to select a low beam would be necessary.

G'day

Do you have a link to the review?

A link to the specifications or anything from Ay-Up on the changes to the lights besides the battery would be nice too. I couldn't find any specs on the Ay-Up website which does not encourage me at all. Why wouldn't they include this information?

Also would a change in battery increase output and by this much? Wouldn't the light engine be the driver here?

With the DiNottes low is 10% of the output, i.e., 20 lumens. If the Ay-Ups where 10% with a 25% increase in output then for arguments sake then really that is only a 2.5% increase in output. I wouldn't think that was much at all.

Regards
Andrew

[trailgumby]

Sorry, it's a print magazine, Mountain Biking Australia (as distinct from Austalian Mountain BIke).

Should be in your local newsagency now.

It seems there's no (or minimal) change in battery capacity, just in the emitter. But that's just an impression and I could be wrong.