Which saddle is for you?

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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby TDC » Mon Feb 18, 2013 2:39 pm

misterhorsey wrote:
Pottsy wrote:
sumgy wrote:You are setting it up wrong then


SMP saddles have to much of a cut out & not enough "chair" to place your sit bones on


There are actually two different Selle shapes. Broadly speaking the 'Forma' model shape is a little wider cupping type shape while the 'Composit' model is a narrow perch type shape. The SMP website confidently informs me that the Composit shape is suited to my waist measurement, but having tried both types I went for the Forma model shape (in the Dynamic model, minimal padding).

I haven't tried a more comfortable saddle. The first two weeks are a little strange. But I can now do 100kms + without any discomfort at all. Previous saddles brought on numbness and burning. Basically the SMP, if used correctly, is intended to engage with the sit bones only. This allows all the mushy undercarriage bits to be themselves and free of pain.


Now if anyone is going to know something about saddles, if would have to be this guy :D
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by BNA » Mon Feb 18, 2013 4:56 pm

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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby outnabike » Mon Feb 18, 2013 4:56 pm

Jesmol wrote:
The Walrus wrote:Tested about five saddles so far. The names escape and confuse me! I have saw sit bones...all terrible.

Lol, its great isn't , my list of test saddles so far (Many of these bought and sold at a loss)

Prologo Scratch Ti
Specialized Toupe
Specialized Romin
Fizik Aliante
Fizik Aliante Versus
Selle Italia Max SLR
WTB Rocket V
WTB Silverado
WTB Pure V
SMP Dynamic.

Out of this list so far, the Rocket V has been closest, but still wasn't quite there.....


Based on how I fitted my wife to her new bike, are you sure you have given yourself some time in between the different saddles?
If you are pretty sore and persevere it makes it hard to get a decision. Not knocking your system at all though. :D
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby Jesmol » Mon Feb 18, 2013 5:08 pm

outnabike wrote:
Jesmol wrote:
The Walrus wrote:Tested about five saddles so far. The names escape and confuse me! I have saw sit bones...all terrible.

Lol, its great isn't , my list of test saddles so far (Many of these bought and sold at a loss)

Prologo Scratch Ti
Specialized Toupe
Specialized Romin
Fizik Aliante
Fizik Aliante Versus
Selle Italia Max SLR
WTB Rocket V
WTB Silverado
WTB Pure V
SMP Dynamic.

Out of this list so far, the Rocket V has been closest, but still wasn't quite there.....


Based on how I fitted my wife to her new bike, are you sure you have given yourself some time in between the different saddles?
If you are pretty sore and persevere it makes it hard to get a decision. Not knocking your system at all though. :D

See the strange thing is I dont get any post ride soreness, its just painful during the ride, or areas of my body go numb.... :?
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby sumgy » Mon Feb 18, 2013 5:14 pm

Jesmol wrote:
The Walrus wrote:Tested about five saddles so far. The names escape and confuse me! I have saw sit bones...all terrible.

Lol, its great isn't , my list of test saddles so far (Many of these bought and sold at a loss)

Prologo Scratch Ti
Specialized Toupe
Specialized Romin
Fizik Aliante
Fizik Aliante Versus
Selle Italia Max SLR
WTB Rocket V
WTB Silverado
WTB Pure V
SMP Dynamic.

Out of this list so far, the Rocket V has been closest, but still wasn't quite there.....


Given the wide variety of saddles that you have tried there and their associated variety of shapes; some curved from front to rear (SMP and Specialized), some flat (WTB and Prologo), some sloping from the centre to the edges (Fizik), I would have to wonder what you are doing wrong.
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby Jesmol » Mon Feb 18, 2013 5:30 pm

sumgy wrote:
Jesmol wrote:
The Walrus wrote:Tested about five saddles so far. The names escape and confuse me! I have saw sit bones...all terrible.

Lol, its great isn't , my list of test saddles so far (Many of these bought and sold at a loss)

Prologo Scratch Ti
Specialized Toupe
Specialized Romin
Fizik Aliante
Fizik Aliante Versus
Selle Italia Max SLR
WTB Rocket V
WTB Silverado
WTB Pure V
SMP Dynamic.

Out of this list so far, the Rocket V has been closest, but still wasn't quite there.....


Given the wide variety of saddles that you have tried there and their associated variety of shapes; some curved from front to rear (SMP and Specialized), some flat (WTB and Prologo), some sloping from the centre to the edges (Fizik), I would have to wonder what you are doing wrong.

I'm not sure I'm doing anything wrong, overall bike fit is pretty good , I just have an awkward shape to fit, the Rocket V was the best so far, perfect on the sit bones, but to get ride of frontal numbness I had to tilt it , which did not feel right at all.
Other areas, wearing good knicks (either Pearl Izumi or Castelli Free Race depending on the day), Saddle height is adjusted when each new saddle is fitted, set them up level , then tilt down as need to remove frontal pressure. Maybe I'm not tucking things away properly.
Last edited by Jesmol on Mon Feb 18, 2013 5:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby ZepinAtor » Mon Feb 18, 2013 5:34 pm

sumgy wrote:
Jesmol wrote:
The Walrus wrote:Tested about five saddles so far. The names escape and confuse me! I have saw sit bones...all terrible.

Lol, its great isn't , my list of test saddles so far (Many of these bought and sold at a loss)

Prologo Scratch Ti
Specialized Toupe
Specialized Romin
Fizik Aliante
Fizik Aliante Versus
Selle Italia Max SLR
WTB Rocket V
WTB Silverado
WTB Pure V
SMP Dynamic.

Out of this list so far, the Rocket V has been closest, but still wasn't quite there.....


Given the wide variety of saddles that you have tried there and their associated variety of shapes; some curved from front to rear (SMP and Specialized), some flat (WTB and Prologo), some sloping from the centre to the edges (Fizik), I would have to wonder what you are doing wrong.


He's prolly facing the wrong way :?

But in all seriousness riding nude is going to hurt on any saddle.
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby sumgy » Mon Feb 18, 2013 5:51 pm

Jesmol

As I said, there is a big variety of shapes there.
For all of those to hurt there is something strange going on.

How have you set up the SMP?
It should be approx 3deg's down at the front.
Put a book or something else flat on top of the saddle and then adjust the saddle tilt from there.
I downloaded an app to give me a digital display of how many deg's the nose was down.
I found WTB and Prologo's best set up dead flat.
I found Fizik best set up not at all.
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby Tim » Mon Feb 18, 2013 6:38 pm

I ride three different bikes with three totally different saddles. A Prologo, Kappa pas on my lightweight roadie, a WTB, progel speed She (I am a bloke) on my heavyweight touring bike and a generic Cannondale saddle on a flat bar roadbike.
Each saddle came supplied with the bike. Not one of them felt comfortable when I first rode the bike/s.
The worst was the WTB womens saddle that I commuted on for 8 months, all the time thinking that I would replace it. I never got around to swapping it out and it never felt comfortable. I took it on a 600 km fully loaded tour this summer, spending up to 5-6 hours a day on it. The first day of touring it rubbed some nasty little saddle sores that hurt like hell for several days. Then I rested for 4 days and took off again after the chaffing and sores had mended. Lo and behold I can now ride on that saddle perfectly comfortably. I've since done a smaller 4 day tour, spending nearly seven hours in the saddle on dirt roads on one of those days and the saddle is still beautifully comfortable.
The Prologo felt bad for at least six months. It took me at least that long to get fit when I first bought the bike. Nowadays, three years and about 20,000 km's later I don't even think about it. It is very comfortable. Other body parts ache, but not my rear end.
The Cannondale is a soft, cheapish saddle that I became accustomed to the most rapidly of them all. I only occasionally ride that bike now and it is fine for short distances. Anything over 20 k's and it feels too soft and not too good.
My point is that a lot of saddle and bike fit issues are more related to a lack of fitness and time in the saddle than faulty products or poor fit. In my opinion the body can adjust to almost any saddle and adapt to just about any bike. 20 years ago I raced on a bike that was far too big for me but caused no problems. Look at all the people in India and Asia riding bikes, often with enormous loads and big distances that are in no way properly fitted for them. God knows what their saddles look like, they just spend a heck of a lot of time on them and got used to it.
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby Jesmol » Mon Feb 18, 2013 6:51 pm

sumgy wrote:Jesmol

As I said, there is a big variety of shapes there.
For all of those to hurt there is something strange going on.

How have you set up the SMP?
It should be approx 3deg's down at the front.
Put a book or something else flat on top of the saddle and then adjust the saddle tilt from there.
I downloaded an app to give me a digital display of how many deg's the nose was down.
I found WTB and Prologo's best set up dead flat.
I found Fizik best set up not at all.

Yep tried the SMP like that, will give it another go, still have the trial saddle, using the iphone app.
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby sumgy » Mon Feb 18, 2013 7:15 pm

Jesmol wrote:
sumgy wrote:Jesmol

As I said, there is a big variety of shapes there.
For all of those to hurt there is something strange going on.

How have you set up the SMP?
It should be approx 3deg's down at the front.
Put a book or something else flat on top of the saddle and then adjust the saddle tilt from there.
I downloaded an app to give me a digital display of how many deg's the nose was down.
I found WTB and Prologo's best set up dead flat.
I found Fizik best set up not at all.

Yep tried the SMP like that, will give it another go, still have the trial saddle, using the iphone app.

Fond my links to Steve Hoggs site too. Read the links on Seat height and setback too. Sounds like you may be too far forward.
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby Jesmol » Mon Feb 18, 2013 7:45 pm

sumgy wrote:Fond my links to Steve Hoggs site too. Read the links on Seat height and setback too. Sounds like you may be too far forward.

How do you figure this ?
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby sumgy » Mon Feb 18, 2013 7:55 pm

Jesmol wrote:
sumgy wrote:Fond my links to Steve Hoggs site too. Read the links on Seat height and setback too. Sounds like you may be too far forward.

How do you figure this ?


Sorry.
Typing on my phone whilst riding my wind trainer (finished now).
Sounds like you could be too far forward on your saddle and not sitting back in the curve of the saddle (maybe).
Or you may be too high and reach down to the pedals (maybe).
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby Jesmol » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:27 am

sumgy wrote:
Jesmol wrote:
sumgy wrote:Fond my links to Steve Hoggs site too. Read the links on Seat height and setback too. Sounds like you may be too far forward.

How do you figure this ?


Sorry.
Typing on my phone whilst riding my wind trainer (finished now).
Sounds like you could be too far forward on your saddle and not sitting back in the curve of the saddle (maybe).
Or you may be too high and reach down to the pedals (maybe).

I'm fairly confident that both of those are not the issue. I find it extremely uncomfortable to sit on any saddle in a forward position.
As for saddle height, I have maintained the saddle height from my last fit, at around 740mm from top of saddle to BB centre point.

Interestingly last night I rode(on the trainer) for 1/2 hr with the SMP at -3 Deg, felt OK but quite harsh , then changed to the only seat I haven't tried yet, my MTB saddle (why didn't I think of this before ?) , a Zero Zealth Pro (Yep and cheapie...) and set it up at -1 deg, another 1/2hr on the trainer, felt quite good really, now for an extended road ride ...
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby The Walrus » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:41 am

Now the MTB saddle feels awful! Getting very bored with this...

It's interesting that my LBS said my original seat position from when I was fitted had been lost so every new saddle I try is in a general flat position. They will fine tune it when I find my saddle!

How true a test is it then? I might dismiss a saddle that might well be 'the one' with some correct fitting/positioning?

Are Brooks and SMP meant to be the best?
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby sumgy » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:45 am

The Walrus wrote:Now the MTB saddle feels awful! Getting very bored with this...

It's interesting that my LBS said my original seat position from when I was fitted had been lost so every new saddle I try is in a general flat position. They will fine tune it when I find my saddle!

How true a test is it then? I might dismiss a saddle that might well be 'the one' with some correct fitting/positioning?

Are Brooks and SMP meant to be the best?


I would not say that.
I love my SMP on my road bikes.
I like my Brooks on my MTB and also my WTB Silverado on my other MTB.
I dont even think I could get my Brooks in a useable position on my road bike.
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby Nobody » Tue Feb 19, 2013 9:19 am

The Walrus wrote:Are Brooks and SMP meant to be the best?
More people who try these saddles end up keeping them than any other saddle brands IMO. SMP are probably better suited to lower bar use than Brooks, but it is all highly debatable as individual experience varies as much as individual anatomy. As Sumgy indicated, saddle rail length can be a problem with Brooks saddles and steep seat tube angles.

I've got 3 Brooks saddles but never yet tried a SMP.
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby AUbicycles » Tue Feb 19, 2013 9:25 am

I am riding a Charge Spoon on the race bike, the Fizik Arione wasn't very nice.

For my fixed wheel and vintage road racer each a Brooks B17 imperial but I never really warmed up to them, looks nice though. For these I have spent the most time on adjusting saddle angles.

For my Commuter, a (generic) home brand Tattoo Velo - not that nice, it has actual screws in it but for short trips was ok.

For my MTB a generic cheapy that came with the bike... I think it is called "Made in Taiwan".
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby ZepinAtor » Tue Feb 19, 2013 9:58 am

There's been some great advice on here so far (apart from mine :oops: ) so I'll be sensible for a change & just ask where the discomfort is being felt. I'll talk saddle orientation & not anatomy to keep it less awkward.

Is it on the edges of the saddle at any particular point from end to end ? On the nose of the saddle or frontal portion ? or at the main weight bearing area on the rear of each side ?

I haven't noticed any mention of actual width or sit bone dimensions either as this can be crucial. I did mine on a big chunk of polystyrene while wearing what I actually ride in (bibs). The sit bone impression left two distinct 20c size dents so I measured from c - c & it was 145mm. I was riding a 135mm Fizik Arione for years & it was bought to my attention from an experienced bike fitter that my pelvis was twisted to accommodate the narrow saddle causing my left knee to track out wards. He used his squishy gel bumometer which can be found in most Specialized stores.

I'm now using a 155mm Specialized Romin Pro which does sound large (cause it is), but you seriously can not spot the difference from the 135mm unless you sit them on top of each other.

Hope that's been a little more helpful this time.
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby sumgy » Tue Feb 19, 2013 10:13 am

Also something I had forgotten is that in the same position the SMP will see you sit further setback.
A fitter I used wanted me further setback and had suggested a greater setback seatpost.
I instead bought an SMP Dynamic and for the purposes of installing it set it up at the same saddle nose to bar length.
Headed back over to the fitter who advised that my setback was now perfect.

So, your setback could be wrong with the SMP if you are trying to set it up at the same nose to bar distance that you had with the previous saddle.

But I also am wondering exactly where you are having pain.
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby The Walrus » Tue Feb 19, 2013 10:17 am

ZepinAtor wrote:There's been some great advice on here so far (apart from mine :oops: ) so I'll be sensible for a change & just ask where the discomfort is being felt. I'll talk saddle orientation & not anatomy to keep it less awkward.

Is it on the edges of the saddle at any particular point from end to end ? On the nose of the saddle or frontal portion ? or at the main weight bearing area on the rear of each side ?

I haven't noticed any mention of actual width or sit bone dimensions either as this can be crucial. I did mine on a big chunk of polystyrene while wearing what I actually ride in (bibs). The sit bone impression left two distinct 20c size dents so I measured from c - c & it was 145mm. I was riding a 135mm Fizik Arione for years & it was bought to my attention from an experienced bike fitter that my pelvis was twisted to accommodate the narrow saddle causing my left knee to track out wards. He used his squishy gel bumometer which can be found in most Specialized stores.

I'm now using a 155mm Specialized Romin Pro which does sound large (cause it is), but you seriously can not spot the difference from the 135mm unless you sit them on top of each other.

Hope that's been a little more helpful this time.


I find that most posts offer some kind of help! :D

The 'squishy gel bumometer which can be found in most Specialized stores' determined that I was 147mm but I cannot be sure as the guy didn't clarify that and just said 143mm saddle is for me!

I am finding the pain down the middle where the weight goes and a bit on the sit bones. Once off the saddle it goes quite quickly but I sat on a concrete wall yesterday and it felt like it was digging into my sit bones, possibly from trying so many saddles in a short time.

Toupe
Romin
Henge
Chicane
Phenom

They all feel very very hard and after 15 k's its getting painful. After 30 k's I have to stop riding!
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby ZepinAtor » Tue Feb 19, 2013 10:25 am

147mm :shock: :shock:

Do yourself a favor & give the 155mm saddle a test run.

If you were a little closer you could try mine although by the sound of it you have your saddle suppliers well organized :wink:

Without sounding like a stalker what do you weigh & what sort of body shape are you ? Giraffe or hippo ?
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby Jesmol » Tue Feb 19, 2013 10:27 am

Ummm, are you wearing good knicks ?
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby sumgy » Tue Feb 19, 2013 10:32 am

The Walrus wrote:
I find that most posts offer some kind of help! :D

The 'squishy gel bumometer which can be found in most Specialized stores' determined that I was 147mm but I cannot be sure as the guy didn't clarify that and just said 143mm saddle is for me!

I am finding the pain down the middle where the weight goes and a bit on the sit bones. Once off the saddle it goes quite quickly but I sat on a concrete wall yesterday and it felt like it was digging into my sit bones, possibly from trying so many saddles in a short time.

Toupe
Romin
Henge
Chicane
Phenom

They all feel very very hard and after 15 k's its getting painful. After 30 k's I have to stop riding!


You should not be sitting on the squishy part in the middle.
You should be sitting on the sit bones.

http://www.stevehoggbikefitting.com/wp- ... CN1239.jpg
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby The Walrus » Tue Feb 19, 2013 6:21 pm

ZepinAtor wrote:147mm :shock: :shock:

Do yourself a favor & give the 155mm saddle a test run.

If you were a little closer you could try mine although by the sound of it you have your saddle suppliers well organized :wink:

Without sounding like a stalker what do you weigh & what sort of body shape are you ? Giraffe or hippo ?


I want to get that measurement checked but the 155mm sounds better!

I'm 76/77 kilos about 178cm tall...short legs and longer body, so probably more Giraffe than hippo but not tall!
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Re: Which saddle is for you?

Postby The Walrus » Tue Feb 19, 2013 6:22 pm

Jesmol wrote:Ummm, are you wearing good knicks ?


The only knicks I have are Specialized own brand...they seem fine
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