Vivente Randonneur

Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby Jonno » Mon Sep 16, 2013 6:18 pm

I test rode one today... <3

Apparently some '12 models are clearing for ~1200 clams.
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by BNA » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:30 am

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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby the_real_jimbob » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:30 am

http://www.viventebikes.com/main/page_t ... sting.html

Posted May 29th 2013

Three of us on three models of VWR are ready to depart for Kununurra to ride the Gibb River Road. 700km of dirt to Derby through the Kimberley. One of the bikes will be testing the new Rohloff set-up. This bike has Nitto drop bars, a Gilles Berthoud shift lever, 44-16 gearing and dual disc BB7 brakes. Two of the bikes have 40C Marathon rear tyres and 35C fronts.


Looking for a touring bike with a Rohloff hub and drop bars. Been looking online at the Tout Terrain but that has the flat bar.
This setup seems exactly what I want.

Anyone heard any news about this?
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby RonK » Thu Sep 26, 2013 6:51 am

the_real_jimbob wrote:http://www.viventebikes.com/main/page_travelling_travel_information_road_testing.html

Posted May 29th 2013

Three of us on three models of VWR are ready to depart for Kununurra to ride the Gibb River Road. 700km of dirt to Derby through the Kimberley. One of the bikes will be testing the new Rohloff set-up. This bike has Nitto drop bars, a Gilles Berthoud shift lever, 44-16 gearing and dual disc BB7 brakes. Two of the bikes have 40C Marathon rear tyres and 35C fronts.


Looking for a touring bike with a Rohloff hub and drop bars. Been looking online at the Tout Terrain but that has the flat bar.
This setup seems exactly what I want.

Anyone heard any news about this?

Only what is on that page. I suggest you email Noel McFarlane at Vivente for information. See their contact page.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby rifraf » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:04 pm

the_real_jimbob wrote:http://www.viventebikes.com/main/page_travelling_travel_information_road_testing.html

Posted May 29th 2013

Three of us on three models of VWR are ready to depart for Kununurra to ride the Gibb River Road. 700km of dirt to Derby through the Kimberley. One of the bikes will be testing the new Rohloff set-up. This bike has Nitto drop bars, a Gilles Berthoud shift lever, 44-16 gearing and dual disc BB7 brakes. Two of the bikes have 40C Marathon rear tyres and 35C fronts.


Looking for a touring bike with a Rohloff hub and drop bars. Been looking online at the Tout Terrain but that has the flat bar.
This setup seems exactly what I want.

Anyone heard any news about this?


44/16? for 700c?
I cant help feeling Vivente seem to make their line up overgeared for loaded touring.
Probably just me but I dont like walking up hills and road rises and there always seems to be no shortage in the areas where I've ever lived.
I'll stick with 34/16 myself

To be clear, a minor and easily fixed niggle on what appears to be a great package, and one I've considered myself.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby rjk » Tue Oct 01, 2013 1:02 pm

rifraf wrote:
the_real_jimbob wrote:http://www.viventebikes.com/main/page_travelling_travel_information_road_testing.html

Posted May 29th 2013

Three of us on three models of VWR are ready to depart for Kununurra to ride the Gibb River Road. 700km of dirt to Derby through the Kimberley. One of the bikes will be testing the new Rohloff set-up. This bike has Nitto drop bars, a Gilles Berthoud shift lever, 44-16 gearing and dual disc BB7 brakes. Two of the bikes have 40C Marathon rear tyres and 35C fronts.


Looking for a touring bike with a Rohloff hub and drop bars. Been looking online at the Tout Terrain but that has the flat bar.
This setup seems exactly what I want.

Anyone heard any news about this?


44/16? for 700c?
I cant help feeling Vivente seem to make their line up overgeared for loaded touring.
Probably just me but I dont like walking up hills and road rises and there always seems to be no shortage in the areas where I've ever lived.
I'll stick with 34/16 myself

To be clear, a minor and easily fixed niggle on what appears to be a great package, and one I've considered myself.



i wondered when they would be doing a dual disc model i have been hanging back for that
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby Kaete » Mon Oct 07, 2013 12:03 pm

My second oldest niece and her husband have each a VWR, and both swear by them.

I have a 2010 Gazelle Fuente Trekker http://www.gazellebicycles.com.au/products/gazelle/2-content/tutorials/200-fuente-trekking12, bought 2011, $2000, as a sixtieth birthday present, from Civic Bikes here where I live in Newcastle.

It is pictured, with my daughter standing behind, on a ride we did together last year, Sydney to Wollongong, at: http://kaete.files.wordpress.com/2009/08/img_20120114_121205.jpg .

Whilst the GFT has been a great bike, and one which has taken me hundreds of kilometres so far without problem, in retrospect, talking with niece, and reading this list, the VWR I think may have been the better buy.

http://kaete.org/bicycling/
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby singlespeedscott » Mon Oct 07, 2013 4:59 pm


"Holy handlebar rise batman" :shock: :P
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby australiantourer » Thu Mar 13, 2014 4:06 pm

This is just a general comment on my experience over a year or so with my VWR. I have now clocked up 4000 km, including a couple of major tours on it, and am very happy with it. However, the rear rack supplied was too narrow and had no hooks on the front to prevent luggage slipping forward, so I've swapped it for a Tubus Cosmo, which doesn't look as elegant, but works as it should. Believe it or not, I've converted it to an 8 speed because it's quieter, stronger, cheaper etc. I had a thread started some time ago about drive chain noise on 9 and 10 speeds (I have both), but didn't seem to find much resonance from people that on a seven speed, all you hear is tyre noise. Which for me is really important. Seven speed componentry is pretty ordinary, but 8 speed is still ok, so that's the direction I went. Allow me another stab at heresy: I've replaced the front disc brake with a rim brake after a bag hook scored the disc. Cable disc seems no better to me than cable rim brakes in terms of stopping power (I have a mountain bike with hydraulic discs, which are awe inspiring, so I am qualified to compare). And -- you guessed it -- the rim brakes are quieter! (squeals and wind buzz). An added bonus was that the front tubus S rack could then be aligned dead horizontal -- the rotor lug was using the hole needed for my rack set up. It has been an interesting process, personalising the VWR.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby octagonalman » Thu Mar 13, 2014 8:09 pm

I've been a little disappointed having done my first tour on a 24 speed Kona Dew that I had tweaked and then moving to a 2013 VWR. My observations are similar regarding the 9 speed at the back and disc brakes. I have decided not to try clean out the brakes more because it can make my presence known to pedestrians on shared paths without having to touch my bell. I ended up buying a wider bottom bracket (122.5mm up from 113mm) to try move the chainline out so I wouldn't get rubbing at both ends of the gear spectrum. Now I have noticed that the combination of the Sugino crank shape and chainline mean that noise in 3x9 is pretty much unavoidable. I've even painted the outside of the derailleur cage to see whether it is struck by the crankarm. I think my 46t chainring is also showing noticeable wear!

Australiantourer, do you mind sharing the model names of the 8 speed parts you ended up using? Thanks.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby singlespeedscott » Fri Mar 14, 2014 12:58 pm

All you would need to do is change your rear cassette to an 8speed. The chainrings and the derailleurs currently on your bike are backwards compatible all the way to 7 speed. Be aware though that chain rub on the front derailleur is always inevitable when on the edges of the cassette and all that it requires is a minor trimming of the derailleur. Not a big issue.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby australiantourer » Fri Mar 14, 2014 1:17 pm

octagonalman wrote:I've been a little disappointed having done my first tour on a 24 speed Kona Dew that I had tweaked and then moving to a 2013 VWR. My observations are similar regarding the 9 speed at the back and disc brakes. I have decided not to try clean out the brakes more because it can make my presence known to pedestrians on shared paths without having to touch my bell. I ended up buying a wider bottom bracket (122.5mm up from 113mm) to try move the chainline out so I wouldn't get rubbing at both ends of the gear spectrum. Now I have noticed that the combination of the Sugino crank shape and chainline mean that noise in 3x9 is pretty much unavoidable. I've even painted the outside of the derailleur cage to see whether it is struck by the crankarm. I think my 46t chainring is also showing noticeable wear!

Australiantourer, do you mind sharing the model names of the 8 speed parts you ended up using? Thanks.


Hello octagonal man. As it happens, the 9 speed transmission was only half worn out, so I have stored it in the boxes that the 8 speed stuff came in, and can provide the numbers. The chain and cassette are just standard shimano -- CN-HG70 and CS-HG41-8, respectively. Not expensive. I have bar end shifters (and love them) -- if you are running sti's, this experiment might be prohibitively expensive. The 8 speed shimano selectors are the same series as the ones they replaced -- SL-RS50-8. They were marked at $140, but Abbotsford Cycles gave me a terrific discount provided they could keep a couple of bits I apparently didn't need. I'm not sure that they are still in production.

They mentioned that a really economical approach would be to use cheap friction selectors on the down tube -- just like in the 1980s when I got my first touring bike. I can't say that option appeals at all to me -- there's really no looking back from an indexed cassette, I reckon. Rivendell bicycle works has other unfashionable options too advertised on their website.

I have found that the 8 speed is quieter than the 9 speed, but still not as quiet as the 7 speed (only tyre noise -- bliss!). The front selector is designed as a friction setting, unlike the rear shifter which is indexed (though you can turn that off and revert to friction, if things are going pear-shaped). There is a sweet spot for every gear combination where the transmission cliking noise is minimal -- if you are as fussy as me about this sort of noise, you can tweak the front derailleur position with every shift at the rear.

Most cyclists don't seem to understand what I'm talking about here. They may be mainly riding in traffic, or groups, or be chatting constantly. But if you are lost in the moment on a quiet country road, it does matter. I think it's a bit like trying to explain to someone who only listens to mp3 audio that they might be missing a depth of experience.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby singlespeedscott » Fri Mar 14, 2014 1:27 pm

australiantourer wrote:
octagonalman wrote:I've been a little disappointed having done my first tour on a 24 speed Kona Dew that I had tweaked and then moving to a 2013 VWR. My observations are similar regarding the 9 speed at the back and disc brakes. I have decided not to try clean out the brakes more because it can make my presence known to pedestrians on shared paths without having to touch my bell. I ended up buying a wider bottom bracket (122.5mm up from 113mm) to try move the chainline out so I wouldn't get rubbing at both ends of the gear spectrum. Now I have noticed that the combination of the Sugino crank shape and chainline mean that noise in 3x9 is pretty much unavoidable. I've even painted the outside of the derailleur cage to see whether it is struck by the crankarm. I think my 46t chainring is also showing noticeable wear!

Australiantourer, do you mind sharing the model names of the 8 speed parts you ended up using? Thanks.


Hello octagonal man. As it happens, the 9 speed transmission was only half worn out, so I have stored it in the boxes that the 8 speed stuff came in, and can provide the numbers. The chain and cassette are just standard shimano -- CN-HG70 and CS-HG41-8, respectively. Not expensive. I have bar end shifters (and love them) -- if you are running sti's, this experiment might be prohibitively expensive. The 8 speed shimano selectors are the same series as the ones they replaced -- SL-RS50-8. They were marked at $140, but Abbotsford Cycles gave me a terrific discount provided they could keep a couple of bits I apparently didn't need. I'm not sure that they are still in production.

They mentioned that a really economical approach would be to use cheap friction selectors on the down tube -- just like in the 1980s when I got my first touring bike. I can't say that option appeals at all to me -- there's really no looking back from an indexed cassette, I reckon. Rivendell bicycle works has other unfashionable options too advertised on their website.

I have found that the 8 speed is quieter than the 9 speed, but still not as quiet as the 7 speed (only tyre noise -- bliss!). The front selector is designed as a friction setting, unlike the rear shifter which is indexed (though you can turn that off and revert to friction, if things are going pear-shaped). There is a sweet spot for every gear combination where the transmission cliking noise is minimal -- if you are as fussy as me about this sort of noise, you can tweak the front derailleur position with every shift at the rear.

Most cyclists don't seem to understand what I'm talking about here. They may be mainly riding in traffic, or groups, or be chatting constantly. But if you are lost in the moment on a quiet country road, it does matter. I think it's a bit like trying to explain to someone who only listens to mp3 audio that they might be missing a depth of experience.

I would agree that 7 speed is very quiet. I have found 8 speed to be the same. Nothing with down tube friction shifters. I use them every day on my commuter, around 260km a week on day shift, and never have a problem with shifting.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby RonK » Fri Mar 14, 2014 1:33 pm

australiantourer wrote:Most cyclists don't seem to understand what I'm talking about here. They may be mainly riding in traffic, or groups, or be chatting constantly. But if you are lost in the moment on a quiet country road, it does matter.

Unlikely, since the subject is touring bikes. My 9-speed setup using STI is silent, all I can hear is the tyres on the road and the wind in the spokes - hence the name of my touring blog.

My other (Rohloff-equipped) tourer OTOH makes an ungodly racket in most gears but is particularly embarrassing in 7th gear (You paid how much? And have to put up with that rowl?). Rohloff aficionados won't tell you about that though...
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby australiantourer » Fri Mar 14, 2014 5:49 pm

I love the name of your blog, and am very pleased to hear about a totally silent 9 speed. But I'd have to say that out of my two classy 9 speeds (one sti, one bar ends), a less classy sti 9 speed, a classy 10 speed flat bar, and two mid-range 7 speed twist grips, the sevens are the only ones that whisper. Apart from which, I reckon 21 gears is more than enough (even given that you should only be using roughly half of them). But I'm glad there is a diverse market out there to allow us to experiment and find what works best for each of us.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby octagonalman » Fri Mar 14, 2014 8:26 pm

singlespeedscott wrote:All you would need to do is change your rear cassette to an 8speed. The chainrings and the derailleurs currently on your bike are backwards compatible all the way to 7 speed. Be aware though that chain rub on the front derailleur is always inevitable when on the edges of the cassette and all that it requires is a minor trimming of the derailleur. Not a big issue.


Say if I've trimmed it to the point of the crank arm striking the derailleur cage and am still not rid of chain rub on big-small? I guess I can get a similar effect by not using the 9th gear at the back and having 12t instead of 11t as my 'fastest'.

australiantourer wrote:Hello octagonal man. As it happens, the 9 speed transmission was only half worn out, so I have stored it in the boxes that the 8 speed stuff came in, and can provide the numbers. The chain and cassette are just standard shimano -- CN-HG70 and CS-HG41-8, respectively. Not expensive. I have bar end shifters (and love them) -- if you are running sti's, this experiment might be prohibitively expensive. The 8 speed shimano selectors are the same series as the ones they replaced -- SL-RS50-8. They were marked at $140, but Abbotsford Cycles gave me a terrific discount provided they could keep a couple of bits I apparently didn't need. I'm not sure that they are still in production.


I've got MTB shifter on a trekking bar model. On a recent tour my riding buddy was reminded about how useful it can be to have gear shifters in a convenient place while holding onto dear life on a lengthy corrugated downhill! Thanks for the info though. It's nice to know that not only are there people who aren't satisfied with particular aspects of their VWR, but also have solutions. :)
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby australiantourer » Fri Mar 14, 2014 10:02 pm

singlespeedscott wrote:All you would need to do is change your rear cassette to an 8speed. The chainrings and the derailleurs currently on your bike are backwards compatible all the way to 7 speed. Be aware though that chain rub on the front derailleur is always inevitable when on the edges of the cassette and all that it requires is a minor trimming of the derailleur. Not a big issue.


Actually, I don't believe it's that simple. Unless you are running friction shifters, you'll have to get the right indexed shifter (i.e. 8, not 9). And then the wider 6/7/8 speed chain. And if you go back to a 7 speed, you'll need to add a spacer. Basically, I was advised not to retrofit back to a 7 -- only to an 8 speed. And this advice was in the context of me arguing the virtues of 7 speed.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby singlespeedscott » Sat Mar 15, 2014 7:04 am

australiantourer wrote:
singlespeedscott wrote:All you would need to do is change your rear cassette to an 8speed. The chainrings and the derailleurs currently on your bike are backwards compatible all the way to 7 speed. Be aware though that chain rub on the front derailleur is always inevitable when on the edges of the cassette and all that it requires is a minor trimming of the derailleur. Not a big issue.


Actually, I don't believe it's that simple. Unless you are running friction shifters, you'll have to get the right indexed shifter (i.e. 8, not 9). And then the wider 6/7/8 speed chain. And if you go back to a 7 speed, you'll need to add a spacer. Basically, I was advised not to retrofit back to a 7 -- only to an 8 speed. And this advice was in the context of me arguing the virtues of 7 speed.

The only real issue with moving back to a 7 speed drivetrain would be finding a 7 speed STi rear lever and a 7 speed shimano triple front derailleur. Both of these are easily sourced of ebay after searching for a few days. Shimano RSX 7 speed STi levers work fine and there are plenty of Shimano deore LX, DX and XT 7 speed mtb, triple, front derailleurs to be found for very little money. The added benefit of the mtb derailleurs is that they are designed for smaller front chainrings that are favoured by tourists. The rear cassette spacer is no issue at all and only costs a few bucks.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby australiantourer » Sat Mar 15, 2014 12:50 pm

would you need to change the front derailleur? I didn't need to when changing from 9 to 8 speed cassette, but I don't know about 9 to 7.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby singlespeedscott » Sat Mar 15, 2014 1:17 pm

With Shimano Sti you will as the shifters do not allow trimming like Campagnolo. You really should have a front derailleur that matches your drive train width. If you use barend shifters it would not be an issue.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby thamete » Tue Mar 18, 2014 5:34 pm

I had chain rub on 48/11 on my 2013 STI VWR which I noticed when I was lubing the chain after about 400 Km of use. I simply adjusted the outer limit screw on the front derailleur by a quarter turn and it seems to have solved the problem. I will be mentioning it to my LBS when I put it in for the next free service to see whether a further adjustment is required.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby Tim » Tue Mar 18, 2014 7:25 pm

octagonalman wrote: I ended up buying a wider bottom bracket (122.5mm up from 113mm) to try move the chainline out so I wouldn't get rubbing at both ends of the gear spectrum. Now I have noticed that the combination of the Sugino crank shape and chainline mean that noise in 3x9 is pretty much unavoidable. I've even painted the outside of the derailleur cage to see whether it is struck by the crankarm. I think my 46t chainring is also showing noticeable wear!


octagonalman wrote:Say if I've trimmed it to the point of the crank arm striking the derailleur cage and am still not rid of chain rub on big-small? I guess I can get a similar effect by not using the 9th gear at the back and having 12t instead of 11t as my 'fastest'.


I really don't understand the problems (nor the solutions) you guys are encountering with driveline noise, chainlines and chain rub.
Why fit a wider bottom bracket? Why step backwards to 7 or 8 speeds?
Provided my VWR chain is oiled and derailleurs are correctly adjusted it runs just as quietly as my 25 year old, Shimano 105 equipped 7 speed steel framed Gemini roadie. No chain rub, no noise, no problems.
The front derailleur is seriously out of adjustment if it risks hitting the crank arm. I suspect the non standard BB and a poorly adjusted/fitted FD has something to do with it.
If I were you I'd be refitting the recommended 113mm bottom bracket and returning the bike to a competent mechanic. A bicycle driveline is a very simple mechanism, easily tuned in skilled and experienced hands.
Alternately contact Noel and ask him. From my experience he has been very approachable, knowledgeable, helpful and quick to reply.
The VWR is a solid and reliable bike. These problems are the result of poor setup and adjustment, nothing more.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby octagonalman » Tue Mar 18, 2014 11:44 pm

http://ocau.com/pix/vmuuy
Image
http://ocau.com/pix/m2tuw
Image

Hopefully the pictures can describe it better. My VWR came out of the factory a bit weird and my bike shop had a fair bit of trouble getting the correct parts and even responses from Noel. I have been back to that shop far too many times for a bike that should have come out of the factory at a much higher standard. The mechanic said that cage rub on 9 speed is unavoidable.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby singlespeedscott » Wed Mar 19, 2014 4:28 am

Just from the photos, as they appear on my phone, the derailleur looks to be sitting to high and is not aligned with the large chainring.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby Tim » Wed Mar 19, 2014 7:36 am

singlespeedscott wrote:...the derailleur looks to be sitting to high and is not aligned with the large chainring.


I agree. The lower edge of the outer plate of the FD should only be sitting 2-3mm above the large ring.

octagonalman wrote:The mechanic said that cage rub on 9 speed is unavoidable.


Rubbish!!!
Is that a Shimano Tiagra branded FD for triple rings? It looks quite different to mine. I get no chain cage rub.
Also, were those the pedals supplied with the bike? The Vivente site specs Shimano 505 pedals, much different to those in the photo.
Who put the bike together?
I think you are the victim of incompetence and a load of BS from the shop. I suspect the manufacturer specced parts may have been substituted or else never supplied in the first place. I think you have the wrong FD fitted.
Stand your ground and insist on a proper fix ie. a working bike with the parts as specified by the manufacturer.
If that fails, find a good, HONEST bike shop and mechanic.
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Re: Vivente Randonneur

Postby octagonalman » Wed Mar 19, 2014 7:56 am

I think the problem would be worse if the derailleur was any lower on the tube, due to the shape of the crank arm. But maybe that is something more to do with the derailleur model like Tim says.

My one is: http://www.viventebikes.com/main/page_p ... _bars.html

The pedals in the box were the M505s but the shop offered me the correct A530s for this trekking bar model. Front derailleur is a Deore LX.
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