Spamday Herald Sun

[il padrone]

The usual set-piece from the Feral Hun today. They set up their own speed camera specifically to target an area with a ridiculous 'recommended speed'. By the way Ms Harris and Mr Nash, that means it is not a limit at all, and solely at the discretion of the rider

But this was what I fond to be the most disturbing comment:

Bicycle Network Victoria spokesman Garry Brennan said Southbank promenade had a well-known "design failure'' because there was no alternative through route or defined path for bikes.

But he said cyclists should only go as fast as runners on shared paths.

Damn fool comment. So we should all stick to 10kmh?? On all shared paths??

Guess what Gary, today I rode a few shared paths. Apalling signage by the way - I knew these paths but still took a couple of wrong turns; anyone strange to the area would have misssed at least a dozen turns at unsigned and obscure junctions. At some sections I was doing four times the recommended speed!! Yes, four times. Recommended speed was 5kmh and yet, in the wet it was OK to do 20kmh (no pedestrians about).

Melbourne might lay claim to being a world class cycling city, but many of our shared paths are an insult to cyclists.

[find_bruce]

You are misunderstanding what he said - "as fast as runners" Marathon pace is ~20km/h, Usain Bolt is 36 km/h. Somewhere in there ought to cover it

[Mulger bill]

Which reminds me...
Time to clean the budgies cage.

Did you read the letters page?

[iaintas]

But i did learn a new peice of legislation that could be used to charge car drivers next time you get buzzed or T-boned.

http://www.australiancriminallawyers.co ... ering_life" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[g-boaf]

Damn fool comment. So we should all stick to 10kmh?? On all shared paths??

Guess what Gary, today I rode a few shared paths. Apalling signage by the way - I knew these paths but still took a couple of wrong turns; anyone strange to the area would have misssed at least a dozen turns at unsigned and obscure junctions. At some sections I was doing four times the recommended speed!! Yes, four times. Recommended speed was 5kmh and yet, in the wet it was OK to do 20kmh (no pedestrians about).

Melbourne might lay claim to being a world class cycling city, but many of our shared paths are an insult to cyclists.

I've suggested this numerous times - but it's pointless. All you get is the argument that you have to "share" the paths, which means pedestrians have right of way, blah blah blah, hoon cyclists, etc, TDF wannabes...

I just give up. People need to exercise common sense and caution. That means going at appropriate speeds. So in a clear area with nothing around, why not do 45km/h? I do. Sometimes even 50km/h, even 70km/h on a wide downhill stretch. And it was fine. But when it is narrow and there are pedestrians, 15-20km/h is okay. If it's very crowded, 10km/h or less is what I do.

And guess what, I do okay with most pedestrians. None of them complain. I give them plenty of warning I'm going to pass them on the right side and it all seems to work fine. If they look unsure, I slow down in plenty of time.

This makes the Herald-Sun's trashy melodramatic piece utterly worthless and pointless.

I also want to know how you do 5km/h on a bicycle? Mine is extremely twitchy at such low speeds. No design fault, that's the way it is. It's designed for high speeds, not going extremely slow.

[Xplora]

Pedestrians should hurry up and go as fast as my bicycle. Equally ridiculous. Does a runner have precedence over a slow moving convoy of prams or schoolkids? Do they automatically have no right to use the path faster than anyone else, because we must appeal to the lowest common denominator?

When I see absolute, unequivocal respect from drivers for my unalienable rights to use the road with my vehicle at a speed that respects me the SAME, I expect I'd feel somewhat more compelled to slow down. Simple fact is that some people are unwilling to share with anyone, and bikes currently have less legal protection than any other group.

[London Boy]

Melbourne might lay claim to being a world class cycling city, but many of our shared paths are an insult to cyclists.

I'm not aware that Melbourne is a world-class anything much.

It's a wannabe European city that can't cut it, but otherwise has nothing much to offer. You could compare it to Brisbane if you like, or Adelaide (oversized country towns) or to Perth (dormitory for the Pilbara). More sophisticated than those, but that doesn't exactly get you very far. They, at least, know where they fit in the world...

And Melbourne has a definite cringe, justifiably so, when compared with Sydney. Sydney is, of course, a world class city.

I can say that as someone who grew up understanding what non-Australians think of Australia and its cities, as well as being a naturalised Australian who understands how Australians see themselves.

[il padrone]

I can see this kicking off now

[iaintas]

So melbourne is to Australia as London is to Europe?

Besides i totally disagree on Sydney being a world Class city, its overpopulated expensive yuppie infested sprawling city with an ugly building on the water. And as someone who has lived in both Melbourne and Sydney but does not originate from either im pretty impartial too.

[human909]

Melbourne might lay claim to being a world class cycling city, but many of our shared paths are an insult to cyclists.

I'm not aware that Melbourne is a world-class anything much.

It's a wannabe European city that can't cut it, but otherwise has nothing much to offer. You could compare it to Brisbane if you like, or Adelaide (oversized country towns) or to Perth (dormitory for the Pilbara). More sophisticated than those, but that doesn't exactly get you very far. They, at least, know where they fit in the world...

And Melbourne has a definite cringe, justifiably so, when compared with Sydney. Sydney is, of course, a world class city.

I can say that as someone who grew up understanding what non-Australians think of Australia and its cities, as well as being a naturalised Australian who understands how Australians see themselves.

I don't know where to start with this. So I think I won't. It sounds like you've 'naturalised' with some tinted glasses.

[simonn]

Melbourne might lay claim to being a world class cycling city, but many of our shared paths are an insult to cyclists.

I'm not aware that Melbourne is a world-class anything much.

It's a wannabe European city that can't cut it, but otherwise has nothing much to offer. You could compare it to Brisbane if you like, or Adelaide (oversized country towns) or to Perth (dormitory for the Pilbara). More sophisticated than those, but that doesn't exactly get you very far. They, at least, know where they fit in the world...

And Melbourne has a definite cringe, justifiably so, when compared with Sydney. Sydney is, of course, a world class city.

I can say that as someone who grew up understanding what non-Australians think of Australia and its cities, as well as being a naturalised Australian who understands how Australians see themselves.

I don't know where to start with this. So I think I won't. It sounds like you've 'naturalised' with some tinted glasses.

You can start here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_citys" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[simonn]

Besides i totally disagree on Sydney being a world Class city, its overpopulated expensive yuppie infested sprawling city with an ugly building on the water. And as someone who has lived in both Melbourne and Sydney but does not originate from either im pretty impartial too.

World class cities are, pretty much by definition, overpopulated yuppie infested cities.

[iaintas]

I guess it depends on your definition of world class?

[kb]

I also want to know how you do 5km/h on a bicycle?

Compact crankset?

Mine is extremely twitchy at such low speeds.

Ah... I always thought it was the cyclist who was twitchy at low speeds

[skull]

I would walk faster tgan 5km/h

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 4

[warthog1]

Melbourne might lay claim to being a world class cycling city, but many of our shared paths are an insult to cyclists.

I'm not aware that Melbourne is a world-class anything much.

It's a wannabe European city that can't cut it, but otherwise has nothing much to offer. You could compare it to Brisbane if you like, or Adelaide (oversized country towns) or to Perth (dormitory for the Pilbara). More sophisticated than those, but that doesn't exactly get you very far. They, at least, know where they fit in the world...

And Melbourne has a definite cringe, justifiably so, when compared with Sydney. Sydney is, of course, a world class city.

I can say that as someone who grew up understanding what non-Australians think of Australia and its cities, as well as being a naturalised Australian who understands how Australians see themselves.

Disagree that Sydney is anything special either.
Apart from that as someone who grew up in Melb I mostly agree.
IMO cities full stop aren't the best place to live. If you must the smaller the better. Less crowding and congestion.
For that reason I'll take Adelaide and Perth over the east coast slums. Darwin is a good size but too hot.

[simonn]

Melbourne might lay claim to being a world class cycling city, but many of our shared paths are an insult to cyclists.

I'm not aware that Melbourne is a world-class anything much.

It's a wannabe European city that can't cut it, but otherwise has nothing much to offer. You could compare it to Brisbane if you like, or Adelaide (oversized country towns) or to Perth (dormitory for the Pilbara). More sophisticated than those, but that doesn't exactly get you very far. They, at least, know where they fit in the world...

And Melbourne has a definite cringe, justifiably so, when compared with Sydney. Sydney is, of course, a world class city.

I can say that as someone who grew up understanding what non-Australians think of Australia and its cities, as well as being a naturalised Australian who understands how Australians see themselves.

Disagree that Sydney is anything special either.
Apart from that as someone who grew up in Melb I mostly agree.
IMO cities full stop aren't the best place to live. If you must the smaller the better. Less crowding and congestion.
For that reason I'll take Adelaide and Perth over the east coast slums. Darwin is a good size but too hot.

Don't get me wrong. World cities are based on metrics, not opinion (well... other than what the organization considers a valid metric).

Ideally I'd like to live in a small coastal town with a wide variety of people, a great set of restaurants, decent internet, which is great for cycling and I can get a decent job in my industry on a similar salary (and had my extended family around me) (and not Byron Bay<cartman/>). However, the decent job thing is the problem.

[rkelsen]

Melbourne might lay claim to being a world class cycling city, but many of our shared paths are an insult to cyclists.

I'm not aware that Melbourne is a world-class anything much.

*cough*

[rkelsen]

Bicycle Network Victoria spokesman Garry Brennan said Southbank promenade had a well-known "design failure'' because there was no alternative through route or defined path for bikes.

But he said cyclists should only go as fast as runners on shared paths.

Damn fool comment.

If he is talking about Southbank, then I agree. People ride too fast through there. Docklands too.

[Mulger bill]

I get regularly passed by joggers on Southbank

[iaintas]

Great way to secretly get rid of cyclist "lets build them a bike lane where they have to ride slower than walking pace, that will make them give up and just walk"

[Alistair]

I think the Hun's execution is poor (surprisingly...), but there is something in this. I ride down Southbank twice daily and it is extremely messy. I try to go fairly slowly and keep left of people and bikes, but many don't which makes us all look like arseholes.

There are hundreds of people using phones, tourists taking photos, kids running around etc, yet people still swerve around them at 25-30kph. The other fun issue is waves of traffic leaving the lights side-by-side at peak hour, and forming walls as much as four or five riders wide. This results in frequent incidents where people try to pass others doing the same thing in the opposite direction on the right... and things generally get chaotic and a bit lethal.

In practical terms Southbank isn't a 'shared path' as much as just a busy, shared space. It isn't productive to treat it like every other shared path in Melb. People need to just chill out and take it easy along there, as I see regular incidents along that short stretch that could easily be avoided.

[birdbrain]

warthog1 wrote:
Disagree that Sydney is anything special either.
Apart from that as someone who grew up in Melb I mostly agree.
IMO cities full stop aren't the best place to live. If you must the smaller the better. Less crowding and congestion.
For that reason I'll take Adelaide and Perth over the east coast slums. Darwin is a good size but too hot.

I hear Snowtown is the place to be.

[casual_cyclist]

Damn fool comment. So we should all stick to 10kmh?? On all shared paths??

I just give up. People need to exercise common sense and caution. That means going at appropriate speeds. So in a clear area with nothing around, why not do 45km/h? I do. Sometimes even 50km/h, even 70km/h on a wide downhill stretch. And it was fine. But when it is narrow and there are pedestrians, 15-20km/h is okay. If it's very crowded, 10km/h or less is what I do.

This is what I do too. No traffic - open speed, the more traffic the more I slow down.

I also want to know how you do 5km/h on a bicycle? Mine is extremely twitchy at such low speeds. No design fault, that's the way it is. It's designed for high speeds, not going extremely slow.

I commute on a touring bike with wide tyres so it is easy to me to do 5km/h. Sometimes the shared path in South Perth gets so congested that I need to. It doesn't bother me to ride at walking speed when necessary. appropriate speeds

[biker jk]

I have cycled along Southbank and many riders are way too fast through a congested area. There are accidents waiting to happen. Still, I believe the infrastructure needs to be fixed rather than setting a ridiculously low speed limit which kills the route for commuters.

On the world's best city, see below. Choose your criteria.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/la ... 6738045069