Tyre size 23 v 25

[Fletch]

I have always ridden 700x23 tyres and was after some opinions on 700x25.

The roads in my area are mostly a rough aggregate surface and i'm currently running specialized turbo elites as recommended by LBS, I did look at the 25 roubaix but was talked out of them.

[Nobody]

http://www.bicycles.net.au/forums/viewt ... =9&t=66556" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.bicycles.net.au/forums/viewt ... =9&t=56857" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[hudnut]

25s. Do it. Seriously.

[jacks1071]

Wide tyres roll better on a rough road than a narrow tyre.

I'm using a set of Pro-Lite Merano A25W wheels at the moment (24mm wide rim) with 23mm tyres.

The 23mm tyres on these rims are wider than a 25mm tyre on a standard width rim. I'm still playing with tyre pressures but generally am running 90psi front, 100psi rear which is 10psi less than I would use with a 23mm tyre on a narrow rim.

Loving it on our chip-seal roads. On nice hot-mix I feel that the narrow rims and 23mm tyres are probably a little faster but on the rough stuff the wider tyres/rims feel like a very good performance increase.

[Fletch]

Thanks Nobody, interesting threads. Not really concerned about any aero advantages, more comfort on the crap road surfaces in my area. Will give 25's a go.

[macca33]

I tried 25s and felt that they were a tad nicer a the start, but have recetly changed back to 23s and didn't notice a whole lot of diference the other way. Admittedly, I reckon you'd need a 6" wide tyre to absorb the shite roads that I ride on in West Gippy...lol.

cheers

[jacks1071]

I tried 25s and felt that they were a tad nicer a the start, but have recetly changed back to 23s and didn't notice a whole lot of diference the other way. Admittedly, I reckon you'd need a 6" wide tyre to absorb the shite roads that I ride on in West Gippy...lol.

cheers

Did you reduce your tyre pressures when you went to the 25's? General rule of thumb, reduce by 10psi when running 25's.

[macca33]

I did by 10psi mate f & r so who knows?

sent from a MacGalaxy far, far away. ..

[KL.]

Wide tyres roll better on a rough road than a narrow tyre.

I'm using a set of Pro-Lite Merano A25W wheels at the moment (24mm wide rim) with 23mm tyres.

The 23mm tyres on these rims are wider than a 25mm tyre on a standard width rim. I'm still playing with tyre pressures but generally am running 90psi front, 100psi rear which is 10psi less than I would use with a 23mm tyre on a narrow rim.

Loving it on our chip-seal roads. On nice hot-mix I feel that the narrow rims and 23mm tyres are probably a little faster but on the rough stuff the wider tyres/rims feel like a very good performance increase.

Hi jacks1071, your previous stance was that wide rims (23/24mm wide) were a whole lot of whoa, and rubbish, and that 25mm tyres on 20mm wide rims did that same, if not better, job.

Just, a few months ago you were quite adamant about this, so, that stance seems to have changed. Could you further clarify your current stance/opinion...

thanks KL :=)

[Nobody]

Hi jacks1071, your previous stance was that wide rims (23/24mm wide) were a whole lot of whoa, and rubbish, and that 25mm tyres on 20mm wide rims did that same, if not better, job.

Just, a few months ago you were quite adamant about this, so, that stance seems to have changed. Could you further clarify your current stance/opinion...

thanks KL :=)

We all continue to learn through our varied experiences in life. Over the years I've seen people on here at opposite poles on various subjects slowly move to agreement over some things, myself included.

I run wide 23/24.5mm rims (17/19 inner) with 23 tyres. This makes the tyres measure 24.5 on the front and 26 on the back. I've also tried the same tyres and bike on 21mm outer (15.7mm inner) rims. I changed the pressures until they felt about the same. I ride mainly on paths in Sydney and found I could feel the difference, but only just. The wider rims felt a bit more comfortable and the thinner rims a bit faster. In the end I stayed with the wider rims, but could understand those who have the opinion that it doesn't make any difference.

[warthog1]

We all continue to learn through our varied experiences in life. Over the years I've seen people on here at opposite poles on various subjects slowly move to agreement over some things, myself included.

I run wide 23/24.5mm rims (17/19 inner) with 23 tyres. This makes the tyres measure 24.5 on the front and 26 on the back. I've also tried the same tyres and bike on 21mm outer (15.7mm inner) rims. I changed the pressures until they felt about the same. I ride mainly on paths in Sydney and found I could feel the difference, but only just. The wider rims felt a bit more comfortable and the thinner rims a bit faster. In the end I stayed with the wider rims, but could understand those who have the opinion that it doesn't make any difference.

Gee it'd be nice to have the money to just change rim widths willy nilly like that. Rim brakes, disc brakes, narrow rims, wide rims? Hmmm what will I ride today?

[Nobody]

Gee it'd be nice to have the money to just change rim widths willy nilly like that. Rim brakes, disc brakes, narrow rims, wide rims? Hmmm what will I ride today?

Yes, well, being a family man like you, sometimes I have some money and most times I don't. Just going through a long don't phase now. Hope to have some money again in April.

[warthog1]

[Yes, well, being a family man like you, sometimes I have some money and most times I don't. Just going through a long don't phase now. Hope to have some money again in April.

The don't phases seem to be getting longer here too. Secondary school next year.
Must be getting really old now also

[KL.]

Wide tyres roll better on a rough road than a narrow tyre.

I'm using a set of Pro-Lite Merano A25W wheels at the moment (24mm wide rim) with 23mm tyres.

The 23mm tyres on these rims are wider than a 25mm tyre on a standard width rim. I'm still playing with tyre pressures but generally am running 90psi front, 100psi rear which is 10psi less than I would use with a 23mm tyre on a narrow rim.

Loving it on our chip-seal roads. On nice hot-mix I feel that the narrow rims and 23mm tyres are probably a little faster but on the rough stuff the wider tyres/rims feel like a very good performance increase.

Hi jacks1071, your previous stance was that wide rims (23/24mm wide) were a whole lot of whoa, and rubbish, and that 25mm tyres on 20mm wide rims did that same, if not better, job.

Just, a few months ago you were quite adamant about this, so, that stance seems to have changed. Could you further clarify your current stance/opinion...

thanks KL :=)

We all continue to learn through our varied experiences in life. Over the years I've seen people on here at opposite poles on various subjects slowly move to agreement over some things, myself included.

I run wide 23/24.5mm rims (17/19 inner) with 23 tyres. This makes the tyres measure 24.5 on the front and 26 on the back. I've also tried the same tyres and bike on 21mm outer (15.7mm inner) rims. I changed the pressures until they felt about the same. I ride mainly on paths in Sydney and found I could feel the difference, but only just. The wider rims felt a bit more comfortable and the thinner rims a bit faster. In the end I stayed with the wider rims, but could understand those who have the opinion that it doesn't make any difference.

Gee it'd be nice to have the money to just change rim widths willy nilly like that. Rim brakes, disc brakes, narrow rims, wide rims? Hmmm what will I ride today?

So, it seems

Another approach to consider is 23/24/25 wide rear rim and 20/21/22 wide front rim

thanks KL

[jacks1071]

KL. I will always tell you what I believe to be true at the time. Nobody said it best, everyone gains experience as time goes on. Wide rims are relatively new to me, I'm still fiddling with pressures.

Here is the basic run-down as I see it at this point in time:

Chip-seal roads, run wide tyres OR a wide rim. I havn't tried a tyre wider than 23mm on the Merano A25W but I feel it'd be pointless to go any wider as its quite fat. This rim is 24mm wide.

To achieve a similar width on a narrow rim a 28mm tyre would be required or if you'd like to go half-way then a 25mm will suffice.

A 25mm tyre on a 19.2mm rim is not as wide as a 23mm tyre on a 24mm rim.

If you ride where the roads are mostly hotmix stick with the lighter, narrow rims and tyres.

If the roads are rubbish or you are seeking comfort, go fat - either fat tyres or fat rims. You can achieve a similar contact patch either way.

If you do go fat, reduce the tyre pressure accordingly, the ability to run lower pressure is where the benefit is.

Other considerations. Wider tyres are heavier than narrower ones. Wider rims are heavier than narrower ones. Some people believe that wider rims are stronger than narrow rims, the jury is out on this - at this point in time I don't believe that to be true but time will tell and in 1 or 2 years I should be able to give you a more accurate opinion.

[gabrielle260]

[Yes, well, being a family man like you, sometimes I have some money and most times I don't. Just going through a long don't phase now. Hope to have some money again in April.

The don't phases seem to be getting longer here too. Secondary school next year.
Must be getting really old now also

I'm feeling your pain Warthog!
Paying one set of private school fees now and will have two lots in 12 months time. Plans for a new bike are now dependent on winning tattslotto.... Only one problem - I need to buy a ticket!
Andrew

[gabrielle260]

And back on topic - I am a huge fan of the GP 4000S 25mm tyres. I have them on both road bikes and won't go back.

[thearthurdog]

What about 24 mm? Vittoria Open Pave CG is the best tyre in the universe !

[KL.]

... Chip-seal roads, run wide tyres OR a wide rim. I haven't tried a tyre wider than 23mm but I feel it'd be pointless to go any wider as it is quite fat. This rim is 24mm wide ...

Yes, that is the objective of the wider rim ... that you can use a narrower tyre, such as a 23mm tyre (and even a 22mm tyre, for low rotating weight/mass) on a 23mm or 24mm wide rim, run lower air pressure (5 to 10 psi without incurring snake bites/tube pinch punctures) but achieve similar comfort and corner grip to that achieved by running a 25mm or 28mm tyre ( which have higher rotating weight) on a 20mm wide rim. It even reduces the need to run tubular

The other benefit is that the 23mm tyre can have increased puncture protection, with a small weight increase, and still having low rotating weight/mass

So, there should be no need to run a 25/28mm on a 23mm or 24mm wide rim, but you can, and be able to run even lower air pressure and achieve even more comfort

Note though, that the internal dimension is also important to achieving the good effect of the wide rim. If the internal dimension is the same as the 20mm wide rim, that you are changing from, then there is no real benefit (probably no benefit in this case, although perhaps some aero benefit, maybe!).
The following rim is a good example of a good wide/aero rim http://www.bikehubstore.com/category-s/167.htm

thanks KL

[jacks1071]

... Chip-seal roads, run wide tyres OR a wide rim. I haven't tried a tyre wider than 23mm but I feel it'd be pointless to go any wider as it is quite fat. This rim is 24mm wide ...

Yes, that is the objective of the wider rim ... that you can use a narrower tyre, such as a 23mm tyre (and even a 22mm tyre, for low rotating weight/mass) on a 23mm or 24mm wide rim, run lower air pressure (5 to 10 psi without incurring snake bites/tube pinch punctures) but achieve similar comfort and corner grip to that achieved by running a 25mm or 28mm tyre ( which have higher rotating weight) on a 20mm wide rim. It even reduces the need to run tubular

The other benefit is that the 23mm tyre can have increased puncture protection, with a small weight increase, and still having low rotating weight/mass

You're forgetting that a wide rim is heavier than a narrower rim all else being equal.

[KL.]

... Chip-seal roads, run wide tyres OR a wide rim. I haven't tried a tyre wider than 23mm but I feel it'd be pointless to go any wider as it is quite fat. This rim is 24mm wide ...

Yes, that is the objective of the wider rim ... that you can use a narrower tyre, such as a 23mm tyre (and even a 22mm tyre, for low rotating weight/mass) on a 23mm or 24mm wide rim, run lower air pressure (5 to 10 psi without incurring snake bites/tube pinch punctures) but achieve similar comfort and corner grip to that achieved by running a 25mm or 28mm tyre ( which have higher rotating weight) on a 20mm wide rim. It even reduces the need to run tubular

The other benefit is that the 23mm tyre can have increased puncture protection, with a small weight increase, and still having low rotating weight/mass

... wide rim is heavier than a narrower rim all else being equal.

Wide rim weights are coming down in weight, slowly but surely (this link is an example ... http://www.bikehubstore.com/category-s/167.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ), especially CF rims, although their internal dimension are not so wide because of their issues with heat dissipation (they are improving though, as are wide alloy rims)

The really nice aspect is that the outer most weight/mass of the rotating wheel, the tyre and tube remains low with hopefully only a small increase in rim weight, while achieving a more comfortable ride (lower tyre pressure) with better corner grip

thanks KL

[warthog1]

I'm feeling your pain Warthog!
Paying one set of private school fees now and will have two lots in 12 months time. Plans for a new bike are now dependent on winning tattslotto.... Only one problem - I need to buy a ticket!
Andrew

I ride with blokes who seem to buy new road bikes more often than I buy new clothes
Good thing I'm happy with my bike anyway
We went the catholic school route for primary but luckily the local state high has a very good reputation with a committed and passionate principal
Those private school fees must be hurting but its a great investment. Kids are more important than bikes any day
I need to remind myself of that more often sometimes

[KL.]

... wide rim is heavier than a narrower rim all else being equal.

There are wide 23mm clincher rims that weigh less than 400gms such as the Velocity A23, Stans A340, HED C2, etc, and these rims/wheelsets have been around for a while ...

thanks KL

[Wakatuki]

Science aside, loving my Conti 4000s 25's Run then har as nails on the fast days (120) or 110 rear/ 100 front for normall ride, love the grip too.
They do 'feel' faster they certainly corner better. IMO

Male 188cm, 96kg rider, Scott Foil 40 7.8kg... BW (before water)

[Rex]

Would love to try out 25's but something aint right with my bike as the tyre is always less than 1mm from the chainstay on all the wheels I run with 23's on one side.
Some even rub.

I want to get 24mm wide rims but afraid I'll have issues.