Sore legs...... again !

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Nitram
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Sore legs...... again !

Postby Nitram » Wed Jul 25, 2018 2:05 pm

OK, I guess this chestnut has been a bit done to death.....:-) But maybe this is different.....

I've got sore legs-it's the thighs I'm talking about. Sore when riding-definately, but what I really mean is sore to touch or poke. They hurt as if they're bruised (no. I havn't had a crash....:-) ) I ride a fair bit: at least five or six rides a week- generally for two hrs plus., including a fair bit of climbing: maybe 1000m each ride, and I make an effort. Racing club crits and some road racing as well: B or C grade depending on the track. Also, I'm pretty old: past 50..... and I've been riding all my life, but only racing as above for the past 10 years or so.

Anyway, sore legs !! BAN ME NOW FOR SWEARING !! me. It hasn't always been that way, but I've been putting up with it for probably the last couple of years at least. But a few things have happened lately that make me think I should look into it:
1. I spoke to some (younger) riding mates who said that they either don't get sore legs, or if they do it's gone by the next day afer a solid ride.
2. I went on holidays for two months with no bike :-( and came back with fresh legs :-) FRESH LEGS !! I hadn't felt that way for years ! I could actually push hard without pain ! It was great ! Fantastic !
3. Now, three weeks after being away on holidays, and three weeks back on the bike and...... sore legs again..... :-( Sore to touch (like bruising) and sore when riding. No more fresh legs......

The first thing I think of is: over-training. Sure, but FFS firstly I'm not doing masses of riding, and secondly I can stay off the bike for three days and they're still flippin' sore ! What am I supposed to do to get fresh legs again ? Have a two month rest every three weeks ??? I think the soreness to touch (or poke) is a strong indicator of lack of fresh legs- in fact I'm sure of it.

So here's my question: I guess when we get older recovery takes longer. I'm cool with that, and apart from something like the Tour of Bright, I'm not racing back-to-back days anyway. But I'd like to be able to ride often and recover like a normal person after a day or two off the bike. So:
1. What is it about the aging process that makes recovery slow ?
2. Is there something I can do to get recovery happening in a less drawn out manner ?

Any thoughts on this subject will be greatly appreciated.

Cheers,

Nitram

Nitram
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Re: Sore legs...... again !

Postby Nitram » Wed Jul 25, 2018 2:09 pm

P.S. My diet is pretty standard and healthy, but I don't much get into protein supplements like WPI etc because I've never really found it makes much difference.
Also my general health is fine.
Ta
Nitram

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andrewjcw
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Re: Sore legs...... again !

Postby andrewjcw » Wed Jul 25, 2018 2:22 pm

This is one those topics in cycling that brings out a butt load of different opinions. These are the most common ones.


    Need to stretch after or before the ride
    Need to massage/foam roll after the ride
    Cold shower/ hot epson salt bath after ride
    Eat more Vitamin A/B/C/E/D/iron/magnesium/spirulina/quinoa/red meat
    Drink more water
    Sleep more
    Use smaller gear
    Use bigger gear
    Stop being so old

Hope that helps...

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ValleyForge
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Re: Sore legs...... again !

Postby ValleyForge » Wed Jul 25, 2018 2:52 pm

I get sore legs when I leave the hair-removal cream on too long.
Ha ha ha! Cookies on dowels.

Nitram
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Re: Sore legs...... again !

Postby Nitram » Wed Jul 25, 2018 3:15 pm

Yeah, I guess so. There’s probably some truth in all of the standard replies,(except for VF’s over-creamed Legs) But I was kind of interested in the science. Do old blokes muscle fibre tears take longer to repair ? Why ? How to fix ?
Nitram

NASHIE
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Re: Sore legs...... again !

Postby NASHIE » Wed Jul 25, 2018 3:17 pm

Nitram wrote:P.S. My diet is pretty standard and healthy, but I don't much get into protein supplements like WPI etc because I've never really found it makes much difference.
Also my general health is fine.
Ta
Nitram


Interested in what others have to say on this as i had a case of very sore legs about month ago. Similar programme to you Nitram but late 40s.
Did a medium effort 80k Sunday ride and suffered very sore thighs, tender to touch for about 4-5 days after (did not ride in this period) Raced the following weekend and felt ok. I have put it down to maybe a virus etc or that i got straight of the bike and into building (up down ladders) without any cool down relax ?.
No issues since, but most training is mostly later in the day so cool down relax after rides has been done. So maybe a look at your post ride routine as mentioned above.

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10speedsemiracer
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Re: Sore legs...... again !

Postby 10speedsemiracer » Wed Jul 25, 2018 3:23 pm

Nitram wrote:OK, I guess this chestnut has been a bit done to death.....
So:
1. What is it about the aging process that makes recovery slow ?
2. Is there something I can do to get recovery happening in a less drawn out manner ?

Any thoughts on this subject will be greatly appreciated.

Cheers,

Nitram


How is your flexibility generally?
I'm wondering if this is a symptom of tissue friction across and around the bony mass of the pelvis/hips...which may create a repetitive microtrauma effect in the area or nearby, and also possible tendinosis. The thigh pain may be an indicator of an issue elsewhere.
If your bike fit reflects your physical state 10 years ago (or even just some time ago) it may be time for a fresh bike fit...I know that I can't ride in the same position as I did just 10 years ago.
Also, and this was my concern reading your post and noting the delayed recovery, it may be worth seeing your GP and getting some testing done (blood work etc) just to rule stuff out. Actually, I would recommend seeing the GP anyway, just for safety's sake.

(Source) - former athlete of similar age now experiencing numerous manifestations of prior injuries, specifically lower back, knees, ankles...and nose (Say What?).
Mmm, SunTour

Nitram
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Re: Sore legs...... again !

Postby Nitram » Thu Jul 26, 2018 8:02 am

Ah yes. Flexibility is definitely not my strong point, and I went through a phase of conscientiously stretching pre ride. That helped, I think, by avoiding the damage done by riding hard on cold legs, ‘though I wasn’t convinced that post ride stretching helped.
I went to the Dr about 12 mths ago looking for an explanation for my deteriorating race performance (occasionally/regularly getting dropped in B grade, which was new and depressing). The Dr was a no-hoper masquerading as a Sports Specialist who first got me to do a stress test at outrageous expense, didn’t bother to get back to me re the results, and when I hassled him he told me that ‘maybe your expectations exceed your potential’. I walked out and havn’t been back. Idiot !!!
So I saw another Dr who got me to take a blood test, again didn’t get back to me about the results (as he said he would), and when I hassled him he said my iron & testosterone levels were slightly low but nothing to worry about. He wasn’t too interested since I wasn’t actually sick.......
I guess it’d be interesting to see a Dr who knows something about the physiology of trying to race with an aging body. I suspect that they’re hard to find.
Thanks for the thoughts so far.
Cheers
Nitram

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ValleyForge
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Re: Sore legs...... again !

Postby ValleyForge » Thu Jul 26, 2018 8:26 am

Nitram wrote:I guess it’d be interesting to see a Dr who knows something about the physiology of trying to race with an aging body. I suspect that they’re hard to find.

You won't find one. Best option is a medico who is a keen cyclist - there are one or two about :wink: . Occasionally University departments ask for enrollments in their Exercise labs as bunnies for the students. You won't get any "diagnosis" but you may get a reasonable insight with some lactate testing et al and some respiratory parameters.

Being serious about the sore legs - there is a chance there is an organic process behind it. Ask your GP for a form for routine bloods (MBA/SMAC & FBC) and a muscle enzyme profile and get the blood taken straight after a solid and representative hit out . My bet is this will be normal. If you have ever been a smoker, then a Doppler ultrasound of you abdomen and pelvic blood vessels might be worth it.

Muscle pain associated with exercise has a few causes - most commonly it is attributed to excess lactate build up (and myocyte microtrauma) from anaerobic phase metabolism. You might have more joy quarantining some of your exercise to strength work in the gym (which will make you muscles sore) and switch to longer rides, no vigorous climbs or sprints, aiming to use the ketone body pathway. Some advocate riding after a fast but this is not evidence based. Likewise some recommend a low carb diet the night before a long ride to achieve the same - once again not evidence based but a bit of "Level 5" evidence (read folklore).

Pre-exercise NSAIDs definitely do work. As do post-ride calcium/magnesium supplements, chocolate milk and protein drinks. Evidence based.
Ha ha ha! Cookies on dowels.

uart
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Re: Sore legs...... again !

Postby uart » Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:20 pm

I find that I get a far fewer problems with sore legs if I mix up my ride intensities a bit. In particular I like to do a nice easy "spin" the day after any hard (or even moderately hard) ride. Here I ride a nice relatively flat course at a fairly relaxed rate - typically a distance of only 35 km or so.

I remember a couple of months ago I had done a really hard ride and then that night a week or more of absolutely foul weather set in, so I couldn't do my usual recovery ride. It really surprised me just how long my legs stayed sore. My legs were still pretty stiff and sore at about 4 or 5 days later.

BTW. I'm 58 yo and not overly fit, so this might not hold the same for everyone.

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foo on patrol
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Re: Sore legs...... again !

Postby foo on patrol » Sun Aug 05, 2018 6:26 am

Do you use a recovery drink after your rides or even a 500/600 chocolate milk? Every time that I have a hard ride I have one and my legs are much happier. :wink:

Foo
I don't suffer fools easily and so long as you have done your best,you should have no regrets.
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Cyclophiliac
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Re: Sore legs...... again !

Postby Cyclophiliac » Tue Aug 07, 2018 5:52 pm

I had the same problem several years ago: excessively sore legs, and tiredness after rides. But it was only when during a ride I suddenly lost my sense of balance and almost came off the bike that I did a bit of research, and decided that there was a good chance I was iron-deficient. Once I added more iron to my diet, the excessive leg soreness, tiredness and lack of balance vanished, and I've been fine ever since.

Jmuzz
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Re: Sore legs...... again !

Postby Jmuzz » Thu Aug 09, 2018 11:34 am

I've always had really sore DOMS in uppet legs after exercise if I don't exercise for a week or two.

Sticking with regular exercise is best way for me to prevent it. If I take a break then I have to be careful to ease back into it because 2 to 3 days later getting up stairs is like torture.

Magnesium supplements seem to help a lot with regular exercise soreness.

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Re: Sore legs...... again !

Postby User Name » Wed Aug 15, 2018 6:45 am

The following is probably more severe than what you're describing, but you might find some answers

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/viewtopic. ... 97f75012d7

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