East Parade PSP - Carpark Crossing

East Parade PSP - Carpark Crossing

Postby Aushiker » Tue Aug 21, 2007 12:57 am

G'day

From the BTA:

The car park entry across this heavily used PSP is hazardous and MRWA have upgraded the signage as you can see in the images - The new signage and marking look great and leave no doubt about who has right of way through this section and it also gives plenty of warning to both cyclists and motorists to be especially vigilant of each other in this area. A great job and our thanks to Main Roads.

Don’t forget that you have until 31 August to have your say about the maintenance of Main Roads Shared Paths. To check out the survey, click here or go to http://www.mainroads.wa.gov.au/ and follow the cycling links


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Andrew
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by BNA » Tue Aug 21, 2007 1:30 am

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Postby Kalgrm » Tue Aug 21, 2007 1:30 am

BTA wrote:.... leave no doubt about who has right of way ....

Gotta call BS on this statement. I see nothing to indicate who has right of way - just a sign saying watch for bikes. That does not tell drivers to give way to cyclists, nor does it tell cyclists they have right of way on this path.

I also see a big white sign which will block the view of drivers leaving the carpark. They won't see riders approaching the camera's position until they are blocking the path when preparing to enter the traffic.

I hate un-derserved self-congratulation .....

Graeme
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Postby tallywhacker » Tue Aug 21, 2007 2:30 am

I ride this daily and it has absolutely no effect on motorists. A complete waste of money
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Postby mikesbytes » Tue Aug 21, 2007 8:04 am

It doesn't take a phd to see that every second car that comes out of the carpark will be blocking the cycle path. AND you going to need eyes in the back of your head for left hand turners
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Postby rambler1au » Tue Aug 21, 2007 8:44 am

What a bunch of wingers, all this bleating about cars etc and someone does something and all you do is winge winge winge. you should be grateful for every thing done for bikes even if its small.

Go ride on most of Perth to se what little is considered for cyclists.
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Postby sogood » Tue Aug 21, 2007 9:03 am

Winge is a style of existence. I read that even Predictor-Lotto's mechanics complained of Cadel Evans whinges on bike weight, this and that (whinge on whinge). And then the whinge that no teammate was helping him on stages of TdF. Oh well... It keeps one's sanity.
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Postby tallywhacker » Tue Aug 21, 2007 9:50 am

rambler1au wrote:What a bunch of wingers, all this bleating about cars etc and someone does something and all you do is winge winge winge. you should be grateful for every thing done for bikes even if its small.

Go ride on most of Perth to se what little is considered for cyclists.

very happy to give bouquets when what is done is done well but in this case it isn't. You may reward half assed cludges, I don't. (btw its whinge)
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Postby Aushiker » Tue Aug 21, 2007 10:14 am

G'day

I did miss one photo but I suspect it does not address the concerns. I am not sure what would but? Maybe some suggestions could be made to the City of Perth or MRWA?

I would be interested to know what feedback members of this forum put into the consultation process as well. I am of course assuming there a consultation process. It would be interesting to see what notice is taken of input, if any.

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Postby Aushiker » Tue Aug 21, 2007 10:15 am

mikesbytes wrote:It doesn't take a phd to see that every second car that comes out of the carpark will be blocking the cycle path.

The cars are meant to keep the path clear and it does say "Keep Clear" on the ground :D . Short of having someone there policing it, what do you suggest is done?

Edit: Answering my own question. Could the path have gone behind the carpark Tallywhacker? Graeme?

Regards
Andrew
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Postby europa » Tue Aug 21, 2007 10:18 am

Landmines :twisted:

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Postby Aushiker » Tue Aug 21, 2007 10:31 am

europa wrote:Landmines :twisted:

Can their sensitivity be adjusted to pick up fixies? :twisted:

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Postby europa » Tue Aug 21, 2007 10:34 am

Aushiker wrote:
europa wrote:Landmines :twisted:

Can their sensitivity be adjusted to pick up fixies? :twisted:

Andrew


Dunno. Mine are all set to 'derailleur' :shock:

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Postby Aushiker » Tue Aug 21, 2007 10:38 am

BTW the BTA can be given feedback via their blog at http://bta-bulletin.blogspot.com/ Your comments Graeme might be worth sharing with them.

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Postby tallywhacker » Tue Aug 21, 2007 11:27 am

Aushiker wrote:Edit: Answering my own question. Could the path have gone behind the carpark Tallywhacker? Graeme?

would have been the logical thing to do when the path/car park was originally built. People in cars do not read anything painted on the road. All they have succeeded in doing is wasting money and make a dangerous skid patch when it rains and you have to stop suddenly when a driver doesnt read the sign.
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Postby mikesbytes » Tue Aug 21, 2007 11:35 am

Aushiker wrote:
mikesbytes wrote:It doesn't take a phd to see that every second car that comes out of the carpark will be blocking the cycle path.

The cars are meant to keep the path clear and it does say "Keep Clear" on the ground :D . Short of having someone there policing it, what do you suggest is done?

Edit: Answering my own question. Could the path have gone behind the carpark Tallywhacker? Graeme?

Regards
Andrew


No solution is going to make it idiot proof.

Replace the give way with a stop sign and paint double lines
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Postby Kalgrm » Tue Aug 21, 2007 1:47 pm

Aushiker wrote:The cars are meant to keep the path clear and it does say "Keep Clear" on the ground :D . Short of having someone there policing it, what do you suggest is done?

I haven't been to this location, so I can't answer with anything useful. Any suggestions MUST be made with all points taken into consideration.

However, my preference for this style of hazard is to remove the grassed median strip and make the (wide) cycle path part of the full road surface. It looks like it's too late for that now, so I'd change the road markings and put a real bike lane in. Again, probably too expensive.

Moving the path behind the carpark is likely to solve the problem, but I won't hold my breath waiting for that to happen. (It will introduce other problems though - bikes hitting pedestrians walking from the their cars to their destinations.)

Next best thing is to put sharp-edged speed bumps on the entry and exit sides of the car access. Nothing they can roll over without a conscious effort - these need to be apparent even to 4WD owners!

Really, if they think a sign from main roads is the answer to making drivers aware of cyclists, they may as well wait for a sign from the Lord. If a driver doesn't notice a moving rider, he/she is not likely to notice a sign perched 2.2m above the road.

Cheers,
Graeme (AKA The whigin' minge)
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Postby Aushiker » Tue Aug 21, 2007 2:02 pm

mikesbytes wrote:No solution is going to make it idiot proof. Replace the give way with a stop sign and paint double lines

True about idiots. Like your idea of a stop sign. Riding to Joondalup this morning I thought of boom gates triggered by cyclists but maybe that is a bit extremene :shock:

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Postby moosterbounce » Tue Aug 21, 2007 11:01 pm

Hmmm...painting Keep Clear on the road works really well at train crossings doesn't it :shock: Cars certainly don't win in that exchange, yet people keep doing it. For the 10% of drivers who will take notice - great.

I wish there was a definitive answer, I really do.
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Postby Kalgrm » Tue Aug 21, 2007 11:55 pm

After I calmed down this afternoon, I thought more about this supposed upgrade to a potentially hazardous location.

In the end, what-ever Main Roads do here, I'll be adopting my normal mindset when riding: I'll still pretend I'm invisible to all other traffic, regardless of the work of Main Roads (good or otherwise).

Given that I'll be wrong 99.9% of the time, no harm will be done. It's the "0.1% event" in which my assumption will save my arse on this crossing.

Cheers,
Graeme

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