Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
- jet-ski
- Posts: 1404
- Joined: Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:51 pm
- Location: Perth WA
- Contact:
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby jet-ski » Mon Jan 31, 2011 12:23 pm
-
- Posts: 9810
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:48 am
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby human909 » Mon Jan 31, 2011 1:36 pm
Cheapies are far better than nothing. Generally they are bright enough for the first 0.5-1hrs of use but they deteriorate quickly to a much dimmer light after that.jet-ski wrote:Not so sure those cheapies are adequate. I saw a few lights on Australia day that resembled those, but I initially thought that their dull red glow may have been reflectors catching the light of my Ayups.... but they weren't they were dodgy cheap lights I suppose I did see them 200m away. :/
- gorilla monsoon
- Posts: 3553
- Joined: Tue Aug 26, 2008 10:45 am
- Location: Lake Macquarie
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby gorilla monsoon » Mon Jan 31, 2011 3:58 pm
So you have been not so much part of the solution but part of the problem then?human909 wrote: Riding in inner Melbourne back streets I have no big issue with going short distances without lights. The longer commutes I have sometime resorted to going via a bike track. . No way would I ride Heidelberg road at night without lights.
-
- Posts: 5470
- Joined: Mon Mar 12, 2007 2:23 pm
- Location: Yangebup
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby Baalzamon » Mon Jan 31, 2011 4:21 pm
-
- Posts: 599
- Joined: Sat Nov 27, 2010 4:45 pm
- Location: Brisbane
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby TheShadow » Mon Jan 31, 2011 8:07 pm
However I would like to congratulate the small but growing number of pedestrians and joggers on the bikeway using LED flashers >> they get it, and I give them wave or a "Thanks!" more often than not.
- elStado
- Posts: 2363
- Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2010 12:27 am
- Location: Syd, NSW
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby elStado » Mon Jan 31, 2011 11:20 pm
The $4.80 single LED DX lights are good. I have been using them for 6+ months and they are still as bright as they were new. Not ideal as a total solution, but as a secondary/backup light they are fantastic.human909 wrote:Cheapies are far better than nothing. Generally they are bright enough for the first 0.5-1hrs of use but they deteriorate quickly to a much dimmer light after that.jet-ski wrote:Not so sure those cheapies are adequate. I saw a few lights on Australia day that resembled those, but I initially thought that their dull red glow may have been reflectors catching the light of my Ayups.... but they weren't they were dodgy cheap lights I suppose I did see them 200m away. :/
-
- Posts: 9810
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:48 am
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby human909 » Mon Jan 31, 2011 11:41 pm
Depends what you see as the problem? I would suggest that most seasoned, multipurpose, bike commuters would have experienced riding without lights at some point. I would be shocked if any dutchman who had ridden from 20+ years not to have ever ridden without lights. Is riding on an empty street at 15kph while being aware of your surroundings a problem? I wouldn't think so. I've been riding bikes long before lights were compulsory. I've been riding at night since I was ten years old.gorilla monsoon wrote:So you have been not so much part of the solution but part of the problem then?human909 wrote: Riding in inner Melbourne back streets I have no big issue with going short distances without lights. The longer commutes I have sometime resorted to going via a bike track. . No way would I ride Heidelberg road at night without lights.
As I have said the inner Melbourne back streets are safe. They are low speed, well lit and if you ride deferentially then there is little risk. I think you'll find the statistics would agree. There are more bikes on these streets than cars after 12, its like Amsterdam and its safe.
-
- Posts: 3
- Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2011 7:57 pm
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby Breba10 » Tue Feb 01, 2011 10:34 am
The fact is that actions have consequences – sometimes minor, sometimes deadly. It is a person’s choice not to mitigate that risk to themselves but it is unacceptable to involve other people in your gamble that serious consequences won’t occur because of your actions. Lights are essential, potentially life-saving equipment on a bike and riding without them deserves censure.
So make comment to the numpties. If it means one person puts lights on their bike then it is one less person who is likely to cause an accident that may involve me.
Pedal like you stole it
-
- Posts: 9810
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:48 am
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby human909 » Tue Feb 01, 2011 12:56 pm
An equally apt comparison for low speeds in quiet back streets is how far would you walk without lights in the dark?Breba10 wrote:Ask yourself one question – how far am I prepared to drive a car without lights in the dark? 5 km? 1km? 500m? (For those playing at home, the correct answer is “â€I’m notâ€.)
The fact is that actions have consequences – sometimes minor, sometimes deadly. It is a person’s choice not to mitigate that risk to themselves but it is unacceptable to involve other people in your gamble that serious consequences won’t occur because of your actions. Lights are essential, potentially life-saving equipment on a bike and riding without them deserves censure.
I'm just playing devils advocate here. I'm not saying people SHOULD ride without lights, I just recognising that it occurs and it isn't a terrible sin when it occurs if done sensibly. Same thing with drinking alcohol to great excess. I don't think people should do that, but it certainly does occur and as long as you don't fight, drive etc then I don't see a big problem about it.
Just saying...
But I will continue to use my lights at all times when its dark. But as a regular utility cyclists I will be very surprised if I don't get caught out for whatever reason at some point in the next decade.
-
- Posts: 261
- Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2010 12:53 am
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby goodlookingcyclist » Tue Feb 01, 2011 5:24 pm
How is it relevant what the dutcht do ??human909 wrote: I would be shocked if any dutchman who had ridden from 20+ years not to have ever ridden without lights.
Sure they ride without lights, or very weak ones, but most of the time they are also protected from traffic because they ride on seperate bicycle paths for 90% of the trip.
And if they don't , the streets are so wel lit , it is almost daylight, AND cars can't use the smidsy excuse...
Al these factors contribute to create a completely different situation.
-
- Posts: 9810
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:48 am
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby human909 » Tue Feb 01, 2011 6:40 pm
Its not completely relevent. But it is a window into what healthy, vibrant and widespread utility cycling entails.goodlookingcyclist wrote:How is it relevant what the dutcht do ??human909 wrote:I would be shocked if any dutchman who had ridden from 20+ years not to have ever ridden without lights.
human909 wrote:Sure they ride without lights, or very weak ones, but most of the time they are also protected from traffic because they ride on seperate bicycle paths for 90% of the trip. And if they don't , the streets are so wel lit , it is almost daylight, AND cars can't use the smidsy excuse...
Al these factors contribute to create a completely different situation.
Have you been to or lived in Holland? Separated bike paths only exist for major thoroughfares. Most of my commuting was on roads. As far as lighting goes I would say the street lighting is comparable to inner Melbourne. That is, it is only moderately lit.
- Matt72
- Posts: 87
- Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2010 8:31 pm
- Location: Niddrie, Vic
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby Matt72 » Thu Feb 10, 2011 1:18 pm
You owe me $2 for the food I spat out when I read this sentence.human909 wrote:Depends what you see as the problem? I would suggest that most seasoned, multipurpose, bike commuters would have experienced riding without lights at some point. I would be shocked if any dutchman who had ridden from 20+ years not to have ever ridden without lights. Is riding on an empty street at 15kph while being aware of your surroundings a problem? I wouldn't think so. I've been riding bikes long before lights were compulsory. I've been riding at night since I was ten years old.gorilla monsoon wrote:So you have been not so much part of the solution but part of the problem then?human909 wrote: Riding in inner Melbourne back streets I have no big issue with going short distances without lights. The longer commutes I have sometime resorted to going via a bike track. . No way would I ride Heidelberg road at night without lights.
As I have said the inner Melbourne back streets are safe. They are low speed, well lit and if you ride deferentially then there is little risk. I think you'll find the statistics would agree. There are more bikes on these streets than cars after 12, its like Amsterdam and its safe.
-
- Posts: 9810
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:48 am
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby human909 » Thu Feb 10, 2011 3:43 pm
Its true though in the back streets of inner Melbourne. (Niddrie isn't inner Melbourne.)Matt72 wrote:You owe me $2 for the food I spat out when I read this sentence.
- Matt72
- Posts: 87
- Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2010 8:31 pm
- Location: Niddrie, Vic
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby Matt72 » Thu Feb 10, 2011 3:47 pm
And you have no facts to support your claim.
- m@
- Posts: 5112
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 12:20 pm
- Location: Wurundjeri Country
- Contact:
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby m@ » Thu Feb 10, 2011 4:14 pm
Personally I'd want good lights even more if I expected the roads to be very quiet, as that's when you're more likely to encounter hoons or inattentive drivers just wanting to get home and not on the lookout for cyclists IME. Of the near misses and abuse from drivers I've had in the past 12 months, all have been late at night riding home after a late shift or from a mate's place between 10:30-11 PM.
I also feel that by riding without lights I might be setting a bad example to others who will then take less calculated risks, and adding to the perception that cyclists don't follow road rules or look out for our own safety.
By the by, when did lights become mandatory in Vic? Different states have different laws etc of course, but IIRC from 'bike week' in my primary school days they were required then in Tassie, though the wording is different now. That was a depressingly long time ago...
-
- Posts: 9810
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:48 am
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby human909 » Thu Feb 10, 2011 6:41 pm
What the fruitcake!? Are you serious with this line of comment?Matt72 wrote:And you have no facts to support your claim.
I'm not trying to present facts, I am presenting observation as someone who lived and still rides in inner Melbourne regularly. Take it or leave it I am not presenting a court case here. In Collingwood, Fitzroy & Carlton I genrerally encounter far more bikes using the back streets than cars late at night. I have not done a full statistical survey.
- Matt72
- Posts: 87
- Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2010 8:31 pm
- Location: Niddrie, Vic
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby Matt72 » Thu Feb 10, 2011 8:00 pm
That was patently obvious!human909 wrote:What the fruitcake!? Are you serious with this line of comment?Matt72 wrote:And you have no facts to support your claim.
I'm not trying to present facts, I am presenting observation as someone who lived and still rides in inner Melbourne regularly. Take it or leave it I am not presenting a court case here. In Collingwood, Fitzroy & Carlton I genrerally encounter far more bikes using the back streets than cars late at night. I have not done a full statistical survey.
- damhooligan
- Posts: 3409
- Joined: Mon Mar 09, 2009 5:16 pm
- Location: melbourne
- Contact:
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby damhooligan » Thu Feb 10, 2011 10:52 pm
Hi human909.human909 wrote:Its not completely relevent. But it is a window into what healthy, vibrant and widespread utility cycling entails.goodlookingcyclist wrote:How is it relevant what the dutcht do ??human909 wrote:I would be shocked if any dutchman who had ridden from 20+ years not to have ever ridden without lights.
human909 wrote:Sure they ride without lights, or very weak ones, but most of the time they are also protected from traffic because they ride on seperate bicycle paths for 90% of the trip. And if they don't , the streets are so wel lit , it is almost daylight, AND cars can't use the smidsy excuse...
Al these factors contribute to create a completely different situation.
Have you been to or lived in Holland? Separated bike paths only exist for major thoroughfares. Most of my commuting was on roads. As far as lighting goes I would say the street lighting is comparable to inner Melbourne. That is, it is only moderately lit.
To avoid confusion, i posted as goodlookingcyclist before, but wil answer as damhooligan. (sorry for the added confusion)
Yes , I have lived there for more then 28 years.
Mayby not in every corner, but from my point of vieuw where I lived the differences between there and here are massive.
Don't forget then 90% of the dutch wil only use those major thoroughfares
I would be interested to know for how long you have been there, and in wich part...
And i don't know if you travelled a bit further then the lenght of your nose while you where there,
But not the whole country is the same, from my experience, the difference between the two is too big to even look at this window.
No matter how you look at it, and no matter what they do in other country's, cycling without lights is stupid.
You can never have a good reason or excuses or or or , whatever to ride without lights.
SCHIJNVEILIGHEID !!
- elStado
- Posts: 2363
- Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2010 12:27 am
- Location: Syd, NSW
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby elStado » Thu Feb 10, 2011 11:57 pm
+1damhooligan wrote: No matter how you look at it, and no matter what they do in other country's, cycling without lights is stupid.
You can never have a good reason or excuses or or or , whatever to ride without lights.
Even having broken/stolen lights aren't really good excuses/reasons.
Would you drive your car home at night if it has broken lights? Of course not. Why? Because it damn dangerous for both yourself and other people. Same goes for the bike, except its more dangerous for yourself. Why anyone would put themselves at risk is beyond me. It's not hard to buy some cheap $5 lights online so you always have a spare pair. That's what I do.
- damhooligan
- Posts: 3409
- Joined: Mon Mar 09, 2009 5:16 pm
- Location: melbourne
- Contact:
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby damhooligan » Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:02 am
elStado wrote:+1damhooligan wrote: No matter how you look at it, and no matter what they do in other country's, cycling without lights is stupid.
You can never have a good reason or excuses or or or , whatever to ride without lights.
Even having broken/stolen lights aren't really good excuses/reasons.
Would you drive your car home at night if it has broken lights? Of course not. Why? Because it damn dangerous for both yourself and other people. Same goes for the bike, except its more dangerous for yourself. Why anyone would put themselves at risk is beyond me. It's not hard to buy some cheap $5 lights online so you always have a spare pair. That's what I do.
Ah yes, stolen lights, that has happend to me before... (from my pup bike... outside the pub...)
And in fairnes, makes the bike rider in that case a bit of a victim as well.
SCHIJNVEILIGHEID !!
- elStado
- Posts: 2363
- Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2010 12:27 am
- Location: Syd, NSW
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby elStado » Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:21 am
Takes exactly 20 seconds to remove your lights and stash them in your pocket/jacket. Not a valid reason.damhooligan wrote: Ah yes, stolen lights, that has happend to me before... (from my pup bike... outside the pub...)
And in fairnes, makes the bike rider in that case a bit of a victim as well.
- damhooligan
- Posts: 3409
- Joined: Mon Mar 09, 2009 5:16 pm
- Location: melbourne
- Contact:
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby damhooligan » Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:43 am
Let's not get ultra nitpicky here...elStado wrote:Takes exactly 20 seconds to remove your lights and stash them in your pocket/jacket. Not a valid reason.damhooligan wrote: Ah yes, stolen lights, that has happend to me before... (from my pup bike... outside the pub...)
And in fairnes, makes the bike rider in that case a bit of a victim as well.
For everything in life there is always something you could have done to prevent it , in hindsight...
Being a victim of a crime is not a crime itself.
SCHIJNVEILIGHEID !!
- Matt72
- Posts: 87
- Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2010 8:31 pm
- Location: Niddrie, Vic
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby Matt72 » Fri Feb 11, 2011 7:16 am
Unless of course you use that as an excuse to commit a crimedamhooligan wrote:Let's not get ultra nitpicky here...elStado wrote:Takes exactly 20 seconds to remove your lights and stash them in your pocket/jacket. Not a valid reason.damhooligan wrote: Ah yes, stolen lights, that has happend to me before... (from my pup bike... outside the pub...)
And in fairnes, makes the bike rider in that case a bit of a victim as well.
For everything in life there is always something you could have done to prevent it , in hindsight...
Being a victim of a crime is not a crime itself.
-
- Posts: 9810
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:48 am
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby human909 » Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:12 am
Would you happily walk your bike home without lights? Yes? Well what about sitting on the saddle while going 5kph? Safe enough? What about 7kph? 12kph? Safety isn't black and white. If you ride slowly and stay away from other road users then you are pretty damn safe. If you are riding empty roads and pull over whenever another car approaches how is that dangerous.elStado wrote:Would you drive your car home at night if it has broken lights? Of course not. Why? Because it damn dangerous for both yourself and other people. Same goes for the bike, except its more dangerous for yourself. Why anyone would put themselves at risk is beyond me.
I do that too. And I ride with quite a few lights blinking. Including this on one of my bikes.elStado wrote:It's not hard to buy some cheap $5 lights online so you always have a spare pair. That's what I do.
However I don't see the world in black and white and I don't think it is a mortal sin to ride hope without lights if you are careful.
Well just as well riding without lights at night ISN'T a crime!Matt72 wrote:Unless of course you use that as an excuse to commit a crime
I might as well include this because it is funny.
http://vimeo.com/19138224
- Matt72
- Posts: 87
- Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2010 8:31 pm
- Location: Niddrie, Vic
Re: Riding a bike with no lights in poor visibility...
Postby Matt72 » Fri Feb 11, 2011 10:21 am
human909 wrote: However I don't see the world in black and white and I don't think it is a mortal sin to ride hope without lights if you are careful.
Well just as well riding without lights at night ISN'T a crime!Matt72 wrote:Unless of course you use that as an excuse to commit a crime
http://www.vicroads.vic.gov.au/Home/Saf ... cycles.htmRiding at night
Riding at night is illegal unless the bicycle or the rider has a white light (flashing or steady) on the front, a red light (flashing or steady) at the back and a red reflector at the back.
Obviously still not discussing facts I see!
You have a fair bit of this guy about you.
"It's just the vibe of the thing"
Return to “Cycling Safety and Advocacy”
- General Australian Cycling Topics
- Info / announcements
- Buying a bike / parts
- General Cycling Discussion
- The Bike Shed
- Cycling Health
- Cycling Safety and Advocacy
- Women's Cycling
- Bike & Gear Reviews
- Cycling Trade
- Stolen Bikes
- Bicycle FAQs
- The Market Place
- Member to Member Bike and Gear Sales
- Want to Buy, Group Buy, Swap
- My Bikes or Gear Elsewhere
- Serious Biking
- Audax / Randonneuring
- Retro biking
- Commuting
- MTB
- Recumbents
- Fixed Gear/ Single Speed
- Track
- Electric Bicycles
- Cyclocross and Gravel Grinding
- Dragsters / Lowriders / Cruisers
- Children's Bikes
- Cargo Bikes and Utility Cycling
- Road Racing
- Road Biking
- Training
- Time Trial
- Triathlon
- International and National Tours and Events
- Cycle Touring
- Touring Australia
- Touring Overseas
- Touring Bikes and Equipment
- Australia
- Western Australia
- New South Wales
- Queensland
- South Australia
- Victoria
- ACT
- Tasmania
- Northern Territory
- Country & Regional
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users
- All times are UTC+10:00
- Top
- Delete cookies
About the Australian Cycling Forums
The Australian Cycling Forums is a welcoming community where you can ask questions and talk about the type of bikes and cycling topics you like.
Bicycles Network Australia
Forum Information
Connect with BNA
This website uses affiliate links to retail platforms including ebay, amazon, proviz and ribble.