Events explained please? :?:

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Events explained please? :?:

Postby TrackPete » Sun Feb 27, 2011 5:32 pm

http://www.cyclingmasters.com/riders/timetable.html

Can someone give me a brief blurb on what each event is?

Pursuit -

Sprint -

Scratch -

Points/Course -
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by BNA » Sun Feb 27, 2011 5:34 pm

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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby alchemist » Sun Feb 27, 2011 5:34 pm

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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby TrackPete » Sun Feb 27, 2011 6:20 pm

So what's s sprint then?

What distance are most scratch races at club level or masters level?
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby brawlo » Tue Mar 01, 2011 12:23 pm

Not sure if there's a standard. In my limited 6mths of experience, our typical club nights have 5 & 20 lap scratch races. The local track carnival had 5 & 10 lap scratch races. We race on a 397m track.
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby toppity » Tue Mar 01, 2011 2:48 pm

no such thing as a standard I don't think.

We had a 20 lap (333m) scratch race at the recent Gippsland Champs. This was a MAS1,2,3 event. 30 laps for the elite riders.
I ride several bicycles, but not at once.
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby brentono » Thu Mar 03, 2011 3:13 pm

TrackPete wrote:So what's s sprint then?


1000 metres, timed over the last 200m, usually between 2 opponents. Roughly 50/50 speed/tactics.
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby ironhanglider » Thu Mar 03, 2011 8:44 pm

brentono wrote:
TrackPete wrote:So what's s sprint then?


1000 metres, timed over the last 200m, usually between 2 opponents. Roughly 50/50 speed/tactics.
:mrgreen:


The sprint as an event is not often held on a normal club track night since it is very time consuming with only two riders on the track at a time.

Colloquially a sprint is also used to describe any rush to the line eg. a points race will have several sprints spaced by a given number of laps (placings in each sprint will earn points), a scratch race will only have the final sprint at the end.

Also different riders approach a sprint differently according to their own strengths, some will try to establish a lead with a sudden spurt with more than a lap to go and simply try to stay ahead, others will prefer to come with a late rush inside the last 50m however most successful sprinters will use the slipstream of another rider and only work their way into clear air in the last 150m or so, the art form is to be in the right place at the right time with legs in a condition to make the most of it.

Cheers,

Cameron
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby brentono » Fri Mar 04, 2011 11:41 am

Sprint as an event, here's the UCI take.
Sprint: (men & women)

The sprint is one of the oldest cycling events making its first appearance at World Championships in Chicago in 1893.

It is a classic short distance event in which two or more riders cover three laps. Only the final 200 metres is timed. The special requirements in the sprint are strength and speed. The key is tactics. Sudden and dramatic changes in speed, standstill attempts, and feints are typical ways to surprise an opponent. Riders obtain a seeding through the qualifying 200 metre flying time trial and from then on race head to head. From quarter finals stage onwards the riders contest best of three races.


Here's a photo of me at the World Championships competing against Giordano Turrini in the Sprint.
(with Bill Long holding me up)
Image
:mrgreen:
Trackpete: Scratch race at Masters is 20Km (I think)... brief blurb on Pursuit- Boring.
PS: Cameron, I gave a brief blurb on the Sprint as an event,
at the Master's Championships which was the OP. 8)
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby toppity » Sat Mar 05, 2011 7:53 am

great photo.

When was that? Late sixties, early 70's? He was an olympic medallist, so I expect that it was a hard race.
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby brentono » Sat Mar 05, 2011 9:25 am

toppity wrote:great photo.

When was that? Late sixties, early 70's? He was an olympic medallist, so I expect that it was a hard race.


Pro W.C. after mid-70's.
Gave him 3-4 lengths at the 200m, just didn't get there. Would have put me in the last 8.
Here's the finish. I was flying to the line, just missed out. :(

Image

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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby toppity » Sat Mar 05, 2011 8:21 pm

great stuff. You should share more of the photos. I think heaps would be interested in them, and your exploits. I know I would :D
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby foo on patrol » Sun Mar 06, 2011 7:44 am

What would you have done different Brenton?
I don't suffer fools easily and so long as you have done your best,you should have no regrets.
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby bigfriendlyvegan » Sun Mar 06, 2011 12:54 pm

toppity wrote:great stuff. You should share more of the photos. I think heaps would be interested in them, and your exploits. I know I would :D


+infinity to this. Share the experience, mentor "young" trackies or simply brag: whatever your motivation, I want to see and hear more.

David
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby brentono » Sun Mar 06, 2011 3:42 pm

toppity wrote:great stuff. You should share more of the photos. I think heaps would be interested in them, and your exploits. I know I would :D


Déjà vu... check an earlier post (below)
viewtopic.php?f=39&t=22307

And have snippets of exploits through many posts
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=18444
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=21458
There's a lot of stories, maybe you might have a question?
Apologies the the OP, though we might cover most track events (I did over my career)
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby brentono » Sun Mar 06, 2011 3:54 pm

foo on patrol wrote:What would you have done different Brenton?


Not much to be done... (as I explained in a post way back)
My memories, were of approaching the quarter finals of a W.C. and being
in a three up, with two Italians (one their favourite, and we're in Italy)
(complained to Bill Long, to protest, but he explained, no point, home-rules)
so it's engineered to back me, off the favourite, it's rough and tumble,
gave him about 5 lengths at the 200m, and he got it by just half a wheel.
(have the photo, that put me out of the competiton)
He went on to get the silver. Bitterly disappointed me,
but just another experience, a cycling moment (it happens to everyone,
in cycling-with officials, judges, referees etc, and there are many).
Turrini was his name.


There's sometimes, in competition, your trained up to the max, your tactics are on track,
and a split second can change everything in a race. I know you know, it just happens,
and you just can't take it back :|
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby brentono » Sun Mar 06, 2011 4:15 pm

bigfriendlyvegan wrote:
toppity wrote:great stuff. You should share more of the photos. I think heaps would be interested in them, and your exploits. I know I would :D


+infinity to this. Share the experience, mentor "young" trackies or simply brag: whatever your motivation, I want to see and hear more.

David


David,
As for bragging and being a mentor, I have covered both, and basically told by some here, I'm FOS.
My cycling career, isn't bragging, it's just what I did, at a stage, it WAS my Life!
(could even say... from birth :shock: )
Did my best, as a mentor, though it would seem that my methods, and thoughts/experiences,
today, by some here, are not relevant. 8)
(covered cadence=rhythm, gears, crank length, training etc. already :?: )
I lost a lot of motivation when being ridiculed, though fair to say, a few here have been great. :?
(and I have never spoke of myself or "bragged" on the forum, about details,
that I could not substantiate)
Nevermind. If you have a question, I would be happy to answer, if I can. :?:
:mrgreen:
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby foo on patrol » Sun Mar 06, 2011 5:43 pm

It is the same in sprint/match races that have the same team members, at club level. :wink:

My club ( Ipswich ) was well known for doing this really well at the senior level. :mrgreen:

I am of the firm belief, that at the International level in these races, it should not be allowed! :idea:
I don't suffer fools easily and so long as you have done your best,you should have no regrets.
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby bigfriendlyvegan » Sun Mar 06, 2011 7:08 pm

brentono wrote:
bigfriendlyvegan wrote:
toppity wrote:great stuff. You should share more of the photos. I think heaps would be interested in them, and your exploits. I know I would :D


+infinity to this. Share the experience, mentor "young" trackies or simply brag: whatever your motivation, I want to see and hear more.

David


David,
As for bragging and being a mentor, I have covered both, and basically told by some here, I'm FOS.
My cycling career, isn't bragging, it's just what I did, at a stage, it WAS my Life!
(could even say... from birth :shock: )
Did my best, as a mentor, though it would seem that my methods, and thoughts/experiences,
today, by some here, are not relevant. 8)
(covered cadence=rhythm, gears, crank length, training etc. already :?: )
I lost a lot of motivation when being ridiculed, though fair to say, a few here have been great. :?
(and I have never spoke of myself or "bragged" on the forum, about details,
that I could not substantiate)
Nevermind. If you have a question, I would be happy to answer, if I can. :?:
:mrgreen:


Thanks Brentono. If I think of a question or seven, I'll PM you. I've just started on the track and am a sponge for info at the moment. Being in D grade, I've raced against some of the older guys in the club and while they've only got a good half lap in them (according to them, at least), they know exactly when to use it. Having a chat after racing someone who has forty years experience on the track is wonderful.

Cheers,
David
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby scotto » Mon Mar 07, 2011 8:29 am

bigfriendlyvegan wrote:Thanks Brentono. If I think of a question or seven, I'll PM you. I've just started on the track and am a sponge for info at the moment. Being in D grade, I've raced against some of the older guys in the club and while they've only got a good half lap in them (according to them, at least), they know exactly when to use it. Having a chat after racing someone who has forty years experience on the track is wonderful.

Cheers,
David


nah, just post em here so we can all read and benefit from them. nothing better than the wisdom of the elderly !
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby brentono » Mon Mar 07, 2011 11:02 am

foo on patrol wrote:It is the same in sprint/match races that have the same team members, at club level. :wink:

My club ( Ipswich ) was well known for doing this really well at the senior level. :mrgreen:

I am of the firm belief, that at the International level in these races, it should not be allowed! :idea:


Ah, yes, the club "scene" then the state "scene" with so many ideas and opinions, and prejudice. :)
(the gap, a wide as a mile, how things should be done, and reality.)

At International level, you are correct, Gary, but "national pride" played a big role in the seventies,
(and probably maybe today :wink: )
especially in Europe at that time. As for the Italians, that's a whole story in itself.
("Share the experience" that maybe a post topic, in itself, by itself)

As for my experience in the photo's, the first was when we were lined up in a two-up.
(as it should have been, at that stage of the draw)
Then things went pear shaped, there were "withdrawals"? and the next thing
I know, I am in a three-up, with the "national hero" and another Italian.
It seemed at that time, if the race was in your village, you made the rules. :shock:
And the finish result is shown in the second photo.
Now with the interference, was it 5/4/3 lengths, I gave away, at the 200m mark.
It's hard to recall now, and in the split seconds that passed, it seems like an eternity of distance.
Anyhoo, All history for me now.
:mrgreen:
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby brentono » Mon Mar 07, 2011 11:06 am

scotto wrote:
bigfriendlyvegan wrote:Thanks Brentono. If I think of a question or seven, I'll PM you. I've just started on the track and am a sponge for info at the moment. Being in D grade, I've raced against some of the older guys in the club and while they've only got a good half lap in them (according to them, at least), they know exactly when to use it. Having a chat after racing someone who has forty years experience on the track is wonderful.

Cheers,
David


nah, just post em here so we can all read and benefit from them. nothing better than the wisdom of the elderly !


... and nothing better, than the respect of the youth. :|

:mrgreen:
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby foo on patrol » Mon Mar 07, 2011 7:29 pm

X2 Plus they can learn from us and us from them. :wink:
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby brentono » Tue Mar 08, 2011 12:07 pm

Rounding it up for Trackpete.

The Match Sprint racing in the "blue ribbon event" of the Track.
Requires a lot more tactics than most, and experience is gained by doing it.
Acceleration, bike-handling, and the ability to muster a final burst are important.

Scratch racing is a bunch start, over a set distance (up to 20Km) or a number of laps.
Each rider takes a turn at the front, for a half lap or so, depending on the size of the track.
There is a final Sprint, with around 3-4 laps to go, you should be in the first third of the
bunch, on a good riders wheel. With 2-laps to go, you ideally be in the first half-dozen riders.
With one lap to go you could be 3 back, on a good wheel,
and then let loose down the back straight. With speed you could win. :D

As for Points Races, distance can be like a Scratch Race, up to 20Km or x-laps, with Sprints,
every 3 or 5 laps, you get points 3,2,1 for being in the first three places each Sprint, and
at the end the points are totalled. In the event of tied points,
the winner of last Sprint wins overall, usually. Madison is another form of this race.

Pursuit, is between 2000m-4000m, a match as in a Sprint, between 2 riders (either side of track)
Not a popular event, time consuming, and can be boring for rider and spectators.
It was mentioned that Track Sprint series are rare at Club meets,
well can't see Pursuit ever even getting a run.

During my Tour of Europe, each Major City has a Sprint "Grand Prix" it was the Event.
During my travels, a Pursuit Exhibition was very rare, and only for show,
and only usually for the current or ex World Champion.
You train by the clock, and it's a plodders event usually. IMO.

Hope that helps you out Pete, Good Luck.
Have raced in all of these types of events, myself.
A lot of HARD work ahead.
:mrgreen:
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby crazycanuck » Tue Mar 08, 2011 8:04 pm

Coming out of the woodwork...

I've just started doing track w the MDCC on wed's (with the kids :lol: ) and am loving it. My aim's to do the women's only nights starting in April.

Do you have any good links for track etiquette? Also, track specific core work exercises? (Swiss ball has become my friend)

Ta
C
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Re: Events explained please? :?:

Postby brentono » Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:40 am

C,
Did a quick search, came up with this link-
http://www.sa.cycling.org.au/?ID=41319
Hope that can help, AIS S.A. is the one for Track (so track etiquette should be aussie)
The AIS system came in well after my time, so don't know much about their methods.
FME Would think track specific core work exercises, involves light upper body gym work,
(use very light weights, many reps) don't bother with any weight work on the legs.
Track work will do that. 8)
Your club (not familiar, is that MBCC?) anyway, is that at the SpeedDome?
Hope it all goes well for you and the kids, a great interest for the family.
:mrgreen:
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