29er to be or not to be?
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby bardynt » Mon Nov 21, 2011 7:29 pm
yes i would sell the other brakes that came with the bike
they have offer of buying shimano xt ice brakes for 300 they reckon they normally cost 600 but not sure if that is true
i did find the trek 6000 felt more like xtc
i did find the xtc 26 was a small bike even with large frame that would have to seat moved backwards cause i have long upper body
then found 29er fitted me better but only problem to get the same components on 29er you have spend a lot more money
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby silentbutdeadly » Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:29 am
The Shimano Ice-tech brakes are on a factory special deal at the moment - check out the Shimano AU website
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby bardynt » Tue Nov 22, 2011 12:00 pm
was trying to figure out what is best for the money
i have looked at merida 29er but wasn't sure if it was better than giant 29
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby Mugglechops » Tue Nov 22, 2011 6:47 pm
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby bardynt » Tue Nov 22, 2011 10:30 pm
then getting the upgraded the xt brakes but not sure yet
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby OrangeJuiceMan » Wed Nov 23, 2011 12:02 am
Well took it up to the trails yesterday and was fantastic, the mtbing skills just need to be worked on nowYair, c'mon, hurry up, pics or it didn't happen
Of course got to include a pic of it a lil' dirty
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29er to be or not to be?
Postby Max » Wed Nov 23, 2011 6:52 am
Max
Cycling is sometimes like bobbing for apples in a bucket full of dicks. - SydGuy
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby Mulger bill » Wed Nov 23, 2011 10:19 pm
Shaun
London Boy 29/12/2011
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby bardynt » Wed Nov 23, 2011 10:55 pm
i was wondering cause i rode one it was ok but was on cheap end like 800 and felt like it too is that the next model up from it ?
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby silentbutdeadly » Thu Nov 24, 2011 10:09 am
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=46029#p709485bardynt wrote:well how much was that gt
i was wondering cause i rode one it was ok but was on cheap end like 800 and felt like it too is that the next model up from it ?
Well done on the GT, OJM. They do look good on the first impressions.....and a great deal of potential there for both bike and rider.
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby bardynt » Thu Nov 24, 2011 3:22 pm
yer 1200 i have to check it out more have a look at the gt again
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby sblack » Fri Nov 25, 2011 1:52 am
As $899 the Cell is obviously not going to be at the level of other bikes mentioned in the thread but for the price the component level seams quite reasonable with the big question mark being about the frame itself. I can't find much info on it other than it's a Chinese made 4130 Cr-Mo frame. While the idea of a steel frame 29er has some appeal to me my concern is over whether this one is actually up to the task or not. Speaking to Cell they said the bike weighs around 12kg, which lines up with the Chinese exporter's listed weight of 12.5kg. Considering similarly specced Aluminium bikes weigh more I can't help but think that's a sign that it's not as strong but really I have no idea on just what abuse it could take. Searching the web for reviews, comments etc on the bike hasn't been very helpful. Have not found one comment from someone that's actually ridden one.
The Apollo is at one of my LBS with a ticket price of $1199 meaning it's still quite cheap for this thread but with 3x10 SRAM X5/X7 components it appears quite well specced for the price and I haven't talking them down at all yet either. Again I've had no luck finding any reviews or comments on it.
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby Mugglechops » Fri Nov 25, 2011 7:13 am
That Cell 29er looks to be a lot better than the previous one they sold. A lot of guys on rotorburn are talking about the chinese 29er frames but I have not seen any mention of a steel one.
The Apollo looks to be pretty good for the price seems to be about the same spec as the Merida 29er at that price point. If it was me I would get the Apollo and see what they can do on price for you.
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby silentbutdeadly » Fri Nov 25, 2011 8:54 am
As for the steel Cell frame...I would imagine that it'd be up for quite a bit. After all, the cheaper Voodoo 29er frames are also steel (as are of course Salsa, Surly, Singular et al) although quite what grade of tube we are talking about is open to question.
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby sblack » Fri Nov 25, 2011 10:30 am
Was very tempted to do just that while I was in the shop but really don't need to rush so I'd like to at least check out the Cell first. I'm also contemplating paying the ticket price and getting it on interest free, which may also mean I could consider the Xpert 291 which steps up to the Recon fork and a tapered head tube. Not sure how the SLX dynasys compares to X5/X7 drivetrain and whether I can justify the extra $500.Mugglechops wrote:The Apollo looks to be pretty good for the price seems to be about the same spec as the Merida 29er at that price point. If it was me I would get the Apollo and see what they can do on price for you.
Not too concerned about visuals and if the unless the construction difference makes a noticable difference to ride or durabilty then I'm not really concerned about that either. Really, if I can get a few years out of this frame by which time I'll no longer be towing my son around and I'll know if a 29er is really my thing, then I'll be happy and likely to be ready to upgrade anyway.silentbutdeadly wrote:One of the local MTB mags did a review of the Apollo earlier this year (from memory). They were impressed by the component/price combination but less thrilled about the frame - much of that seemed to rotate around the visuals and the relatively unsophisticated construction compared to the GiantMeridaSpecialized kind of frame rather than the actual performance of the frame.
Yeah, I'm confident that a 4130 steel frame is capable of taking a fair amount of punishment. My concern was that if the weight is correct at 12.5kg then this would appear the frame is lighter than the other brands you've mentioned as people building up those frames go single speed to get down to that kind of weight. This makes me wonder if the tubing is thinner and as such may not be up to the same kind of abuse. I'm still keen to give it a ride if I can get to Stanmore and see how it feels. As I said before I'm really only after this bike lasting a few years so my concerns may be a non issue in that kind of time. Of course it may not be durability that is the issue with the lower weight, it may be stiffness that suffers but that I'll be able to work out with a bit of a test ride, I may even like it having a little more flex.silentbutdeadly wrote:As for the steel Cell frame...I would imagine that it'd be up for quite a bit. After all, the cheaper Voodoo 29er frames are also steel (as are of course Salsa, Surly, Singular et al) although quite what grade of tube we are talking about is open to question.
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby silentbutdeadly » Fri Nov 25, 2011 12:46 pm
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby sblack » Fri Nov 25, 2011 6:14 pm
I have to say I am thinking the same way. All the less obvious upgrades like you mention, and add better tyres to that list, are making the Apollo appear as the better value bike. Another one to add is it looks like the Cell doesn't have a replaceable derailleur hanger which has the potential for a very different repair cost should something cause damage in that area.silentbutdeadly wrote:While the Xpert290 is not $300 better than the Cell X-29 based simply on the gear attached to the frame....I'd still pay the extra for the 10spd driveline, much better BB, crankset, headset, wheels and cockpit components. If you can shave some dollars off the Apollo it'll be in your favour. SLX and a tapered headtube don't add much that you'll be able to account for in the ride unless your trail skills run high - not for the extra $500 spend.
The other big plus is the Apollo is from an LBS with two stores within a half hour drive or 1 hour ride from home and service that I've always been happy with. That in itself makes it very hard for any other bike to compete (and is the reason a Giant or Merida hasn't been on my consideration list). The only reason I would chose to go elsewhere is for a serious saving or for something they don't have. The second bit is where the Cell comes in because there doesn't appear to be another steel 29er option with this sort of value and the one thing that gives the Cell some appeal against the Apollo is my curiosity as to how a steel frame would ride, having not ridden one since I was a teenager.
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby Mugglechops » Fri Nov 25, 2011 6:26 pm
I was talking to my LBS guy today and he said he has about 6 different makes he can get in 29ers for about $1100.
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby bardynt » Fri Nov 25, 2011 7:28 pm
i have narrowed down the list to this can people let me know who own these bike or have exp with them what would be worth buying
im looking at xtc29er 2 for $1500
the xtc $1500 26 wheel
the talon 1 $800 26
talon 0 $1099 26
merida 500d 2011 $899 on special 26
nine nine merida tfs 500d $1,400 29
Rockhopper expert 29 $1499
Matt tfs 300d 2011 $949 26
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby sblack » Fri Nov 25, 2011 7:50 pm
I looked at Kona but their steel 29ers come as a singlespeed and a 1x9 only and I really want a wider range of gearing, especially since this bike will be full filling several duties, as the towing bike for pulling my son around, the cruising bike for riding along with my daughter, a commuter with the option of taking more varied and interesting routes home and to be able to have some fun on some trails and the local bmx track. So that would mean going to the Aluminium framed Kahuna range and spending more to get comparable components to the Apollo.Mugglechops wrote:Have you looked at the Kona Unit? They are supposed to be pretty good. Around $1100 dollars I think.
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby trailgumby » Sat Nov 26, 2011 2:05 pm
Nice! You'll have a lot of funOrangeJuiceMan wrote:Well took it up to the trails yesterday and was fantastic, the mtbing skills just need to be worked on nowYair, c'mon, hurry up, pics or it didn't happen
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby Cinder » Sat Nov 26, 2011 5:09 pm
At any rate, they're a great bike, I'm sure you'll love it, I love mine, it's just not suitable for what I'm doing right now (and don't have space for multiple bikes sadly).
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby OrangeJuiceMan » Sat Nov 26, 2011 9:40 pm
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby sblack » Fri Dec 02, 2011 10:59 am
Took for a short ride that afternoon with my daughter. First impression.. it's certainly a lot harder work than the roadie but to be expected with the extra weight and big offroad tyres and fine cruising along at her speed. The brakes are much better than when I tried some mechanical discs in their early days and have good modulation instead of just being on or off like they where back then. They really pull the wheel to the side though. Don't know if it's in the fork, wheel or combination of the two and I don't notice it in the ride but it's visable and with much wider tyres or under really hard braking I think the tyre would come into contact with the fork.
Once on the dirt the bike rolls along nicely and is well beyond my novice skills and lack of confidence. Perhaps with some experience I'll be able to see a difference in different frames but for my initial requirements this appears to suit as well as I can expect any bike to. One thing I did notice was that the standard pedals really aren't very good, I can't understand how people ride off road without SPDs or similar as the lack of sure footing really destroys the confidence and I ensured the SPDs where on it for the next ride. Now I just need to get some experience up and build my confidence so I can make use of more of it's capabilities. It's been fun commuting on it and taking some alternate routes home. Oh, I'll get a pic of it to put up as soon as I can.
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Re: 29er to be or not to be?
Postby silentbutdeadly » Fri Dec 02, 2011 11:20 am
Well scored, sir.sblack wrote:Took for a short ride that afternoon with my daughter. First impression.. it's certainly a lot harder work than the roadie but to be expected with the extra weight and big offroad tyres and fine cruising along at her speed. The brakes are much better than when I tried some mechanical discs in their early days and have good modulation instead of just being on or off like they where back then. They really pull the wheel to the side though. Don't know if it's in the fork, wheel or combination of the two and I don't notice it in the ride but it's visable and with much wider tyres or under really hard braking I think the tyre would come into contact with the fork.
I'll wager that the front brake issue is a combination of the fork and wheel. They probably aren't quite stiff enough to counteract the braking force delivered by the disc. It's unlikely that the wheel will torque enough to contact the fork but anything is possible I suppose.
This issue is why you often see QR15 front axles & hubs on the more high spec bikes. Instead of a 10 mm threaded tube and a traditional QR, the axle and QR are combined in a 15 mm tube that goes through the fork leg and wheel bearings and screws into a nut in the fork leg on the other side. Tighten up the QR cam on this axle and you have a very stiff front end that is very resistant to twisting forces from the brake and rough ground....
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