Thinking about a bent/trike

Recumbents and all feet forward machines

Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby Joeblake » Tue Dec 06, 2011 8:56 pm

Merry Christmas ...

Hohohohoho

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:mrgreen: :mrgreen:

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by BNA » Sun Dec 18, 2011 9:50 pm

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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby Baalzamon » Sun Dec 18, 2011 9:50 pm

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Well there it is. Front wheel will be changed to a dynamo setup tho so gotta acquire spokes n hub for that, I have the rim already :)
Took it down for a spin in a car park after the shops had closed for the day. Found cornering much much easier than I thought, starting is going to take heaps of practice tho :) After about 1.5km my right foot started to BURN :evil: The ball of my big toe was where it was concentrated. Yes I was clipped in using spd and shoes that I had fitted for my Thorn Raven Nomad. I am suspecting a cleat change may be required...
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby CommuRider » Sun Dec 18, 2011 10:55 pm

I saw what looked like a Huffy trike/bent at Costco. Flag included.

Looked like this

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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby Joeblake » Mon Dec 19, 2011 12:11 pm

Baalzamon wrote: After about 1.5km my right foot started to BURN :evil: The ball of my big toe was where it was concentrated. Yes I was clipped in using spd and shoes that I had fitted for my Thorn Raven Nomad. I am suspecting a cleat change may be required...


Even after a couple of decades of "benting" I still get burning on the sole. I've got clips and straps so I just slip my foot out and rest it on the bottom of the pedal for a short while, as I coast along.

Nice looking machine.

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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby }SkOrPn--7 » Mon Dec 19, 2011 12:36 pm

BZ you just gotta admire the Bacchetta there a simple and sleek looking bike so congrats on it's arrival. Is that an Alloy frame or Chrome molly?

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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby Baalzamon » Mon Dec 19, 2011 12:59 pm

It's an alloy.
Putting it on my Tacx Fortius tonight, going to be shooting for 95-100 cadence and doing laps on a virtual velodrome to see if grinding is causing the foot pain. Each night I'll be on the trainer a bit doing a few km's to see if I've figured it out, or if I have get my legs used to it as I'm still commuting on my regular bike.
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby Phil » Mon Dec 19, 2011 1:00 pm

Awesome stuff.

Looks very nice indeed.
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby Baalzamon » Tue Dec 20, 2011 12:04 am

Got it up on my trainer now.
Moved seat a lil closer, had cadence 88+. Still could feel my foot in the same position. Going to play it by ear over the next few days, may move seat in a lil closer but I'm inclined to change my cranks. They are 175mm and might drop them to 165mm to increase cadence.
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby John Lewis » Tue Dec 20, 2011 12:16 am

Baalzamon wrote:Got it up on my trainer now.
Moved seat a lil closer, had cadence 88+. Still could feel my foot in the same position. Going to play it by ear over the next few days, may move seat in a lil closer but I'm inclined to change my cranks. They are 175mm and might drop them to 165mm to increase cadence.


Congrats on getting the Baccheta all together Baalzamon. It looks very nice.

Couple of thoughts on the hot foot problem.
1) Tightness of shoe straps. perhaps try loosening them a bit.
2) More of a problem to do but I have heard reports that moving the cleat back quite a bit further can help. If you do that you'll need to readjust the seat position.
I know Stan down hear took to his shoes with a Dremel to get the cleats back where he wanted them.

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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby Baalzamon » Tue Dec 20, 2011 12:21 am

John Lewis wrote:
Baalzamon wrote:Got it up on my trainer now.
Moved seat a lil closer, had cadence 88+. Still could feel my foot in the same position. Going to play it by ear over the next few days, may move seat in a lil closer but I'm inclined to change my cranks. They are 175mm and might drop them to 165mm to increase cadence.


Congrats on getting the Baccheta all together Baalzamon. It looks very nice.

2) More of a problem to do but I have heard reports that moving the cleat back quite a bit further can help. If you do that you'll need to readjust the seat position.
I know Stan down hear took to his shoes with a Dremel to get the cleats back where he wanted them.

John


Looking at my shoes, the cleats can be moved quite a bit back. I'll give that a try tomorrow as the pain appears to be forward of where my cleat is. But I'm going to grab the liquid paper and tracing my cleat position first!
I'm going to be heading into Perth probably on Sat and head to that Milligan st shop and try out their footbed to see if it thinks my current specialized blue insole is enough support or does it want green, or inserts put in.. Might even invest in an e-sole as I do wear orthotics in my regular shoes.
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby Kalgrm » Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:31 am

Ooh! Very nice! I didn't realise they had a new colour on the current ones. I like it.

I strongly recommend going to much shorter cranks that the 165s you're considering. You will not even notice a difference with 165s. I got my 145s from these guys, but they are out of stock at the moment. For less than $70 delivered, they are great value.

Cheers,
Graeme
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby Baalzamon » Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:49 am

Last time I was on the trainer, on the way to work my left leg was playing up. During work it felt like my leg had been extended too much. Got home looked and swore that the seat had moved backwards.
Using the quick release clamp couldn't get enough tension so I removed seat so I could get to the other allen bolts. Not noticing any extra resistance and BANG. Seat clamp has snapped. I'm going to see if flyingfurniture can pop one in express post today..
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby Kalgrm » Thu Dec 22, 2011 9:55 am

In the dim and dark distant past, when I first got mine, I also had a problem with the seat moving backwards once. Unfortuantely, I can't remember the solution. :oops: I think it had something to do with the order in which the upper and lower bolts had to be tightened. Check the manual or the Bacchetta forum - it might be in there.

I've never had a problem since.

cheers,
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby Baalzamon » Thu Dec 22, 2011 10:01 am

Kalgrm wrote:In the dim and dark distant past, when I first got mine, I also had a problem with the seat moving backwards once. Unfortuantely, I can't remember the solution. :oops: I think it had something to do with the order in which the upper and lower bolts had to be tightened. Check the manual or the Bacchetta forum - it might be in there.

I've never had a problem since.

cheers,
Graeme


Yeah I found out afterwards a bit too late... QR clamp = extremely loose and tighten up upper bolts until plastic meets then use QR to tighten.
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby bradwoodbr » Thu Dec 22, 2011 1:12 pm

Kalgrm wrote:
I strongly recommend going to much shorter cranks that the 165s you're considering. You will not even notice a difference with 165s. I got my 145s from these guys.

Cheers,
Graeme


+1 I use 145mm cranks too.
It does sound very much like and adjustment issue as numbness is in one foot not both.

You are on the right track with seat fore and aft and also seat back angle. Also try different seat pad thickness.
When I got mine perfect I had no more numb foot issue. One or two mm can make a big difference. Record all current measurements and adjust one at a time, recording and testing by spinning it up for 10 or 15 minutes. You have the luxury of rollers so makes your bike fit easier to do. I used to make a seat/boom adjustment then go riding the next day and so on.
Cleat - also check position of your cleat compared to the left right centre of your shoe.
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby Baalzamon » Thu Dec 22, 2011 1:20 pm

Kalgrm wrote:Ooh! Very nice! I didn't realise they had a new colour on the current ones. I like it.

I strongly recommend going to much shorter cranks that the 165s you're considering. You will not even notice a difference with 165s. I got my 145s from these guys, but they are out of stock at the moment. For less than $70 delivered, they are great value.

Cheers,
Graeme


They are a sight cheaper than this mob Most likely because they are just the cranks and bikesmithdesigns have full cranksets.
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby exadios » Thu Dec 22, 2011 6:59 pm

Kalgrm wrote:Ooh! Very nice! I didn't realise they had a new colour on the current ones. I like it.

I strongly recommend going to much shorter cranks that the 165s you're considering. You will not even notice a difference with 165s. I got my 145s from these guys, but they are out of stock at the moment. For less than $70 delivered, they are great value.

Cheers,
Graeme


+1.

Mine are 150s. Makes a big difference to cadence and hot foot issues.
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby Baalzamon » Fri Dec 23, 2011 12:35 am

http://www.calhouncycle.com/ Has 145 stock coming in for soon for Origin, so I'm going to get them and my new seat clamp. Looking at it I might be able to fix it up but I wouldn't trust it outside. Only on my trainer.
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby Rhubarb » Fri Dec 23, 2011 7:36 am

Excuse my ignorance of recumbents, but is it "normal" for bents to use shorter cranks than DF bikes ?

I ride 175mm cranks on my DF bike which seem fine but I've never tried anything else. What would suit me on a bent? 175 or something else? Does it depend on the bike design?
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby bradwoodbr » Fri Dec 23, 2011 11:07 am

Rhubarb wrote:Excuse my ignorance of recumbents, but is it "normal" for bents to use shorter cranks than DF bikes ?

I ride 175mm cranks on my DF bike which seem fine but I've never tried anything else. What would suit me on a bent? 175 or something else? Does it depend on the bike design?


On Short Wheel Base recumbents, the cranks are shortened to reduce foot/front wheel in terference, to improve cadence and gearing, and to be more comfortable.
This article will start you off into the black art.
http://sheldonbrown.com/cranks.html

Here is another article with a calculator. If you are medium height then somewhere between 165 and 175mm cranks would suit you on your DF.
http://www.recumbents.com/wisil/misc/crank_angle.asp
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby exadios » Fri Dec 23, 2011 11:09 am

Rhubarb wrote:Excuse my ignorance of recumbents, but is it "normal" for bents to use shorter cranks than DF bikes ?

I ride 175mm cranks on my DF bike which seem fine but I've never tried anything else. What would suit me on a bent? 175 or something else? Does it depend on the bike design?


Fairly normal.

But it turns out that many people could benefit from shorter cranks on diamond frame bikes as well. The only reason that diamond frame bike riders don't use shorter cranks is that they are not offered the option.
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby Baalzamon » Fri Dec 23, 2011 11:15 am

I'm running 172.5mm cranks on both my Thorn Raven Nomad and my Masi Speciale CX. The Bacchetta has came with 175mm cranks and I didn't get the option to change them. Looking at the calculator seems to agree 145mm for me since I have a high BB

edit
I do have heel strike issue on my front wheel and this should sort that out as well.
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby exadios » Fri Dec 23, 2011 12:36 pm

Baalzamon wrote:I'm running 172.5mm cranks on both my Thorn Raven Nomad and my Masi Speciale CX. The Bacchetta has came with 175mm cranks and I didn't get the option to change them. Looking at the calculator seems to agree 145mm for me since I have a high BB

edit
I do have heel strike issue on my front wheel and this should sort that out as well.


Sorry. When I said that diamond frame riders don't get the choice I didn't mean to imply that recumbent manufacturers offer a choice. In fact the recumbent manufacturers and retailers I've spoken to are either completely ignorant about this issue or they (metaphorically) roll their eyes. What I should have said is that a recumbent rider, having made the decision to ride a "non standard bike", is open to the suggestion that other parameters may need review and change as well.

One of the manufacturers that does understand the importance of crank length is Cruz Bike.
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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby John Lewis » Fri Dec 23, 2011 2:33 pm

Baalzamon wrote:I do have heel strike issue on my front wheel and this should sort that out as well.


I have heel strike issues with my SWB. So long as its not going to be a hard strike as on the pedal or crank it quickly becomes a non issue. I no longer even think about it.

I would like to try short cranks though. I think Greenspeed will make short cranks up fromyour existing ones if they are suitable.

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Re: Thinking about a bent/trike

Postby Baalzamon » Fri Dec 23, 2011 3:19 pm

John Lewis wrote:
Baalzamon wrote:I do have heel strike issue on my front wheel and this should sort that out as well.


I have heel strike issues with my SWB. So long as its not going to be a hard strike as on the pedal or crank it quickly becomes a non issue. I no longer even think about it.

I would like to try short cranks though. I think Greenspeed will make short cranks up fromyour existing ones if they are suitable.

John


Hey John

Feel free to try mine when I get eventually get down there.
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