Titanium Road Bikes

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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby cavebear2 » Fri Feb 03, 2012 7:09 pm

My recently built Burls Ti road bike weighs in at 8.3kg. (includes computer and bidon holders, double handlebar tape & gel inserts) Ultegra 6700 groupo, TWE clincher wheels 1350gms, Pedals Time RXS, Saddle Brooks Swift Ti, Forks Easton EC90SL. The frame was specified oversize by me to give a long head tube (19cm) longer chain stay (415mm) and longer seat stay to increase the wheelbase length to 1002mm for comfort on long rides.

The cost? All new, parts & components only (I built it) Includes GST and import duties on frame, fork and headset: $5,800

Ride quality is superb and definitely cannot be compared to my compact 2007 Giant TCR-C1. (wheelbase 980mm) The 1st ride on familiar surfaces close to home was a real eye opener! :D

The frame was manufactured in Russia by people who have long term experience in Ti welding in the Aerospace industry. I believe they produce Colnago's Ti frames.

Oh and all parts are current and fitted perfectly........... :lol:
Last edited by cavebear2 on Sat Feb 04, 2012 7:31 am, edited 5 times in total.
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by BNA » Fri Feb 03, 2012 9:33 pm

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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby Le Velo » Fri Feb 03, 2012 9:33 pm

cavebear2 wrote:My recently built Burls Ti road bike weighs in at 8.3kg. (includes computer and bidon holders, double handlebar tape & gel inserts) Ultegra 6700 groupo, TWE clincher wheels 1350gms, Pedals Time RXS, Saddle Brooks Swift Ti, Forks Easton EC90SL. The frame was specified oversize by me to give a long head tube (19cm) longer chain stay (415mm) and longer seat stay to increase the wheelbase length to 1020mm for comfort on long rides.

Ride quality is superb and definitely cannot be compared to my compact 2007 Giant TCR-C1. (wheelbase 980mm) The 1st ride on familiar surfaces close to home was a real eye opener! :D

The frame was manufactured in Russia by people who have long term experience in Ti welding in the Aerospace industry. I believe they produce Colnago's Ti frames.

Oh and all parts are current and fitted perfectly........... :lol:


Cavebar, what difference is noticeable from carbon to TI? Mine is being built at the moment and am yet to find out and very excited at the same time .....
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Titanium Road Bikes

Postby gabrielle260 » Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:11 pm

OK Chewsta, at risk of starting a long debate with others in the forum, let me answer your 2 questions in reverse order;
Why Ti?
1. I've always lusted for a Ti bike.
2. I wanted custom built and the options for carbon fibre custom built frames were poor and are now still only a little better.
3. Around the time I was looking to buy, I rode with a state level rider who reached down to the top tube of his sponsored CF frame and pushed it in with his thumb. He then told me this wasn't unusual after 20,000+ kms of hard racing and training.
4. Soon after getting the Baum, I was riding with the bunch at Ocean Grove and Cadel joined us. He told the 2 of us riding Ti bikes that he really liked them and that was enough validation of my decision!!!

OK - to answer your first question, I first saw Baum frames at a bike expo in Melbourne and was really impressed with the weld quality. They had been getting rave reviews in every magazine and web review site I could find. I had not heard of any dissatisfied customers. Steve Hogg recommends them. I can go on but I'm sure you get the idea.
One other thing - my Baum is the 4th or 5th custom frame I've had. The others have been Cro-moly and aluminum but I have learned more each time.
Oh, yes, in case you were wondering - I've been riding seriously for 24 years - racing road and MTB, riding Audax and ultra distance here and in the US, coaching and being coached - so I've been around! (some might call me an old fart!)
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby Le Velo » Sat Feb 04, 2012 10:30 am

And Phil Ligget himself rides a BAum too :D
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Postby RonK » Sat Feb 04, 2012 11:30 am

Le Velo wrote:And Phil Ligget himself rides a BAum too :D

So does Cadel - he disliked the Lotto team bike and had a Baum disguised as a Canyon.
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby MichaelB » Sat Feb 04, 2012 11:53 am

RonK wrote:
Le Velo wrote:And Phil Ligget himself rides a BAum too :D

So does Cadel - he disliked the Lotto team bike and had a Baum disguised as a Canyon.


Any proof to that ?
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby sumgy » Sat Feb 04, 2012 12:22 pm

MichaelB wrote:
RonK wrote:
Le Velo wrote:And Phil Ligget himself rides a BAum too :D

So does Cadel - he disliked the Lotto team bike and had a Baum disguised as a Canyon.


Any proof to that ?


I think it is in his book. :?:
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Postby gabrielle260 » Sat Feb 04, 2012 12:40 pm

Really? He said that in his book? Wow! When riding in the bunch I referred to, Cadel was quite disparaging about the longevity of CF bikes. From memory, Phil's Baum is plain black and clear of any speedo or anything on the bars.
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby Comedian » Sat Feb 04, 2012 12:44 pm

Interestingly I weighed a TCR Advanced SL (Durace, ISP, and Giant carbon dish wheels) this morning and it was 6.8 bare. That makes the Baums that are leaving the shop at 7.3kg with pedals look pretty good. There is not a lot in it on weight... at least with Baum.
Once you can climb hills on a bike it's all downhill. :mrgreen:

Hopefully I'll know what that's like..... one day. :shock: :lol:

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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby Le Velo » Sat Feb 04, 2012 1:28 pm

Comedian wrote:Interestingly I weighed a TCR Advanced SL (Durace, ISP, and Giant carbon dish wheels) this morning and it was 6.8 bare. That makes the Baums that are leaving the shop at 7.3kg with pedals look pretty good. There is not a lot in it on weight... at least with Baum.


Comedian you can get the Baum to be lighter than that ...... check this one out http://www.cyclingtips.com.au/2011/11/bikes-of-the-bunch-baum-corretto/ , 6.6kg and with the pedals !
I think the majority of people think that a titanium bike will be as heavy as steel for some reason
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby RonK » Sat Feb 04, 2012 1:44 pm

MichaelB wrote:
RonK wrote:
Le Velo wrote:And Phil Ligget himself rides a BAum too :D

So does Cadel - he disliked the Lotto team bike and had a Baum disguised as a Canyon.


Any proof to that ?

Cadel Evans: Close to Flying p.p 246-247.
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby chewsta » Sat Feb 04, 2012 9:41 pm

Le Velo wrote:
Comedian wrote:Interestingly I weighed a TCR Advanced SL (Durace, ISP, and Giant carbon dish wheels) this morning and it was 6.8 bare. That makes the Baums that are leaving the shop at 7.3kg with pedals look pretty good. There is not a lot in it on weight... at least with Baum.


Comedian you can get the Baum to be lighter than that ...... check this one out http://www.cyclingtips.com.au/2011/11/bikes-of-the-bunch-baum-corretto/ , 6.6kg and with the pedals !
I think the majority of people think that a titanium bike will be as heavy as steel for some reason


That's a bike to lust for.. Those lightweights bring the weight down considerably though
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby cavebear2 » Sat Feb 04, 2012 9:51 pm

If the engine is good enough and the ride is efficient 1kg just isn't going to matter......and you can save 000's by not buying a Baum. :P

Of course my Ti frame would undoubtedly be larger than an equivalent sized Baum based on seat tube size. Also I chose Ultegra 6700 not Campag as I didn't want to buy a new set of tools or spend mega $$'s. Weight wise I don't race and place more importance on comfort which means customised geometry & a larger frame. The weld quality of the Burls & the ride quality speak for themselves and for $5800 I'm :D 8)

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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby bosvit » Sat Feb 04, 2012 10:09 pm

MichaelB wrote:
RonK wrote:
Le Velo wrote:And Phil Ligget himself rides a BAum too :D

So does Cadel - he disliked the Lotto team bike and had a Baum disguised as a Canyon.


Any proof to that ?

The bike they refer to is the one on the cover.

He didn't race it. He just used it for training when in Australia because Canyon were not available here, which is why it was white and had no stickers on it.
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby ausrandoman » Sun Feb 05, 2012 9:07 pm

cavebear2 wrote: ... you can save 000's by not buying a Baum. ...


Last year, I discussed prices with Baum. For what they would charge, I bought a van Nicholas (mostly Ultegra) and a custom-made Ti bike (mostly a mixture of Dura-Ace and Ultegra) and had enough money left over that I could have flown to England to pick up my custom-made bike from the shop, if I had wanted to.

I'm not going to tell anyone where they should be on the price/performance curve. Baum makes bikes for people who want a Patek Philippe even though a Rolex would be good enough.
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby cavebear2 » Mon Feb 06, 2012 12:30 am

cavebear2 wrote:If the engine is good enough and the ride is efficient 1kg just isn't going to matter.

Edit: with all accessories stripped off, the bike only weighs 8.0kg (with Ultegra 6700 groupo) so it's only 700gms or the equivalent of 1 bidon of water. 200gm of that is probably my slightly larger frame - the result of specifying custom geometry and wheelbase. (when compared to a Ti compact road frame from Burls) So in reality we're down to 0.5kg and you could save 200g by having Dura Ace so then it would be 0.3kg, then I could remove the second layer of bar tape and the gel pads underneath.....not that I'm obsessively rationalising or anything.... :lol:

I'm just extremely happy with the value, look and performance of my Burls Ti bike. :D

The TWE wheels probably put it ahead of the Fulcrum wheels shown in the Baum photos 8)
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby MichaelB » Mon Feb 06, 2012 8:32 am

RonK wrote:
MichaelB wrote:
RonK wrote:So does Cadel - he disliked the Lotto team bike and had a Baum disguised as a Canyon.


Any proof to that ?

Cadel Evans: Close to Flying p.p 246-247.


Thanks, but in reading that, it talks about Team Canyons not being available yet, so when in Aus, go local builders to help him out.

Nothing was said that matched your first quote fully.
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby twizzle » Mon Feb 06, 2012 9:08 am

MichaelB wrote:
RonK wrote:
MichaelB wrote:Any proof to that ?

Cadel Evans: Close to Flying p.p 246-247.


Thanks, but in reading that, it talks about Team Canyons not being available yet, so when in Aus, go local builders to help him out.

Nothing was said that matched your first quote fully.


My understanding was that when he received his first Canyon, they couldn't get the bars low enough to suit his riding position. What gets me was that Baum dropped everything and built him a bike straight away... not that I would have expected anything else (in fact, I would have been disappointed if they hadn't done it!), it just makes me jealous that I'm not famous enough to be a queue-jumper. :roll:
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby RonK » Mon Feb 06, 2012 10:40 am

MichaelB wrote:Thanks, but in reading that, it talks about Team Canyons not being available yet, so when in Aus, go local builders to help him out.

Nothing was said that matched your first quote fully.


Perhaps you need to read more carefully. :roll:

My original statement: "So does Cadel - he disliked the Lotto team bike and had a Baum disguised as a Canyon."

On page 246
But He was already plagued with a problem that was distracting him.

"I can't get low enough at the front" he said about his position on the bike.


The next paragraph explains that the Canyon head tube was higher than Cadel wanted, and that new (Canyon) bikes had to
be made, but they were not available before he resumed training in Australia, so Tescher and Baum were recruited to build training bikes for him.

The last sentence on page 246, continued on page 247, says:
And Darren Baum crafted a titanium frame and painted it Canyon white to ensure the sponsorship investment wasn't put in jeopardy.
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby notwal » Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:04 am

Le Velo wrote:
Comedian wrote:Interestingly I weighed a TCR Advanced SL (Durace, ISP, and Giant carbon dish wheels) this morning and it was 6.8 bare. That makes the Baums that are leaving the shop at 7.3kg with pedals look pretty good. There is not a lot in it on weight... at least with Baum.


Comedian you can get the Baum to be lighter than that ...... check this one out http://www.cyclingtips.com.au/2011/11/bikes-of-the-bunch-baum-corretto/ , 6.6kg and with the pedals !
I think the majority of people think that a titanium bike will be as heavy as steel for some reason


Beautiful bike (Where's the drool emoticon). There's a LOOOOOOOOOTA money there. It could be somewhat lighter again of course if you wanted to get really weight weenie with it.

I'm afraid I'm in the AXCD sort of market. I don't think they use double butted bicycle tubing. I think it's more like aircraft hydraulic tube :lol: but I'm only guessing. I wouldn't be happy unless I was comfortable specifying it to the ^n th degree and I just don't know enough about it.
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby Le Velo » Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:14 am

notwal wrote:
Le Velo wrote:
Comedian wrote:Interestingly I weighed a TCR Advanced SL (Durace, ISP, and Giant carbon dish wheels) this morning and it was 6.8 bare. That makes the Baums that are leaving the shop at 7.3kg with pedals look pretty good. There is not a lot in it on weight... at least with Baum.


Comedian you can get the Baum to be lighter than that ...... check this one out http://www.cyclingtips.com.au/2011/11/bikes-of-the-bunch-baum-corretto/ , 6.6kg and with the pedals !
I think the majority of people think that a titanium bike will be as heavy as steel for some reason


Beautiful bike. There's a LOOOOOOOOOTA money there. It could be somewhat lighter again of course if you wanted to get really weight weenie with it.

I'm afraid I'm in the AXCD sort of market. I don't think they use double butted bicycle tubing. I think it's more like aircraft hydraulic tube :lol: but I'm only guessing. I wouldn't be happy unless I was comfortable specifying it to the ^n th degree and I just don't know enough about it.


Notwal, Baum does use butted tubes on their cubano and corretto models
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby Kenzo » Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:26 am

RonK wrote:The next paragraph explains that the Canyon head tube was higher than Cadel wanted, and that new (Canyon) bikes had to
be made, but they were not available before he resumed training in Australia, so Tescher and Baum were recruited to build training bikes for him.

The last sentence on page 246, continued on page 247, says:
And Darren Baum crafted a titanium frame and painted it Canyon white to ensure the sponsorship investment wasn't put in jeopardy.

I have not read the book, nor do I have any intention to read it, but how does any of this show Cadel 'preferred' Baum over Canyon.. or BMC for that matter?
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby notwal » Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:29 am

Le Velo wrote:Notwal, Baum does use butted tubes on their cubano and corretto models


Baum I would trust to get it right. For AXCD I would have to get the spec spot on.

That Corretto has given me a serious case of bike envy :mrgreen: . In principle I'm against painting Ti because it doesn't need it for any practical reason and any paint you put on it is just an unnecessary maintenance overhead but I guess if you are happy to pay the sort of money that that bike demands then the occasional factory repaint is just like changing your suit.
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby twizzle » Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:57 am

Kenzo wrote:
RonK wrote:The next paragraph explains that the Canyon head tube was higher than Cadel wanted, and that new (Canyon) bikes had to
be made, but they were not available before he resumed training in Australia, so Tescher and Baum were recruited to build training bikes for him.

The last sentence on page 246, continued on page 247, says:
And Darren Baum crafted a titanium frame and painted it Canyon white to ensure the sponsorship investment wasn't put in jeopardy.

I have not read the book, nor do I have any intention to read it, but how does any of this show Cadel 'preferred' Baum over Canyon.. or BMC for that matter?


No-one has said that in this thread.
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Re: Titanium Road Bikes

Postby Kenzo » Mon Feb 06, 2012 12:07 pm

twizzle wrote:No-one has said that in this thread.

You're right... it is the message I received though... and I believe it was the message intended. If not - then why post the info - and - assert it.
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