My Helmet saved me the other day

Equipment and On Road Behaviour, Laws and Rules. Cycling Promotion and Advocacy

Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby human909 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 7:52 pm

cyclotaur wrote:Well ... I wasn't talking about what you think .... like I said, each to his own. 8)


No, it isn't each to his own! And that is the problem. Mandatory helmet laws removes the choice, that is the objection.


What I do find incredible is the attitude difference towards helmets in this forum compared to the Bicycle Victoria forums. Funny, who would have thought that the more people utility cycle the more accepting they are of sensible attitudes towards helmets. :wink:
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by BNA » Wed Jun 27, 2012 7:55 pm

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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby Oxford » Wed Jun 27, 2012 7:55 pm

I don't visit the MHL thread, but I did visit this thread and now regret it. So I will pose the curiosity question(s) I do have.

My questions are thus:

  • Do the anti MHL proponents drive cars without wearing seat belts or ask for them to be removed?
  • Do the anti MHL proponents ask for ABS on their motor vehicles to be disabled?
  • Do the anti MHL proponents ask for SRS (eg air bags) on their motor vehicles to be disabled?
Just curious, some are compulsory, some not, but all could save you, but more often than not just a waste of time, money, effort, etc if you are really really careful.
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby human909 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:04 pm

Oxford wrote:I don't visit the MHL thread, but I did visit this thread and now regret it. So I will pose the curiosity question(s) I do have.

  • Do the anti MHL proponents drive cars without wearing seat belts or ask for them to be removed? [I don't find it an inconvenience.]
  • Do the anti MHL proponents ask for ABS on their motor vehicles to be disabled? [Why? It's not an inconvenience except on gravel.]
  • Do the anti MHL proponents ask for SRS (eg air bags) on their motor vehicles to be disabled? [I don't have any air bags]
Just curious, some are compulsory, some not, but all could save you, but more often than not just a waste of time, money, effort, etc if you are really really careful.


You seem not to get it. Just because something can 'save' you doesn't mean that it should be used. Do you wear a helmet driving a car? Do you wear a helmet skiing? Do you wear a helmet walking down the street. You haven't put forward a coherent case for wearing helmets. Strangely enough most European cyclists get by just fine without wearing helmets. Also strangely enough cycling hasn't died off like it has here post MHLs.

Also when I drive I routinely make assumptions about the behaviour of other road users that I don't when I ride. For example if I'm driving along a main road I assume that car ahead facing a STOP sign is going to give way. My only big accident was when a car in such a circumstance didn't give way. When I ride I don't make such assumptions as helmet or no helmet I am going to get hurt if a car hits me.
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby cyclotaur » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:13 pm

human909 wrote:
cyclotaur wrote:Well ... I wasn't talking about what you think .... like I said, each to his own. 8)


No, it isn't each to his own! And that is the problem. Mandatory helmet laws removes the choice, that is the objection.

This thread wasn't about MHLs. Anyway you can choose to ignore the law if you feel so strongly about it. Plenty do. No-one's twisting your arm .... If you're not prepared to take that risk, that may be paranoia.... :?

I don't agree with MHLs either but I would still wear one - personal choice, which I'm sure you can appreciate. :wink:
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby Mulger bill » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:17 pm

Aaaannnnnd guess where this is going...
...whatever the road rules, self-preservation is the absolute priority for a cyclist when mixing it with motorised traffic.
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby wombatK » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:17 pm

human909 wrote:Are you kidding me? Our bodies and reactions are designed to protect the head from falls.

So just who is this grand designer ? Do you have any scientific evidence to support
your design claim ?

Did cave men have this ability ? Or was it a recently acquired design feature ?

Homo sapiens has evolved over nearly 200,000 years - and we've been riding bicycles for not even
100 years. So I'd really like to know just how and why our bodies were "designed" to react and fall
safely from 25 km/hr.

human909 wrote:My body performed admirably when I had my 25kph low side spill onto brickwork.
The fact that my head didn't hit the ground (despite my hips and shoulders) is
testament to this protection.

It's wonderful that you are so perfect. But there's lots of people out there who
are much less perfect than you, including drivers and other cyclists who can
collide with you at such speed that it is physiologically impossible for any part of your
body to respond to the threat.

I am very glad that Perry's helmet has protected him. Perry doesn't know why he
came down, and nobody else has an evidence of how it happened either.
So it is ludicrous, if not offensive, to suggest it was something you or anybody
else could have avoided.

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My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby Parrott » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:20 pm

Glad you are alright Cavebear

My helmet has saved me from injury also.

Go have a look at the helmet thread in cycling safety. Trying to convince some on the forum that helmets protect your head is an exercise in futility.
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby human909 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:21 pm

cyclotaur wrote:This thread wasn't about MHLs.

It was a thread promoting paranoia and fear that it heavily present in Australia's cycling community thanks to our MHL. I object to the promotion of fear that is present here.

cyclotaur wrote:Anyway you can choose to ignore the law if you feel so strongly about it. Plenty do. No-one's twisting your arm .... If you're not prepared to take that risk, that may be paranoia.... :?

Well actually the government is 'twisting my arm', I will get fined if I don't wear a helmet. In fact I have had cops challenge me when I was STOPPED on my bike with my helmet hanging on my handlebars. :roll:

cyclotaur wrote:I don't agree with MHLs either but I would still wear one - personal choice, which I'm sure you can appreciate. :wink:

So will I.
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby damhooligan » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:22 pm

cyclotaur wrote:Well ... I wasn't talking about what you think .... like I said, each to his own. 8)



ow, im sorry..
I got confused by you quoting me, and responding to my post....
Nevermind, wont happen again...
The dutch have one word to describe the aussie MHL, this word is ;
SCHIJNVEILIGHEID !!
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby damhooligan » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:23 pm

Mulger bill wrote:Aaaannnnnd guess where this is going...



Do we get point for guessing it correctly ?? :mrgreen:
The dutch have one word to describe the aussie MHL, this word is ;
SCHIJNVEILIGHEID !!
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby damhooligan » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:28 pm

Oxford wrote:I don't visit the MHL thread, but I did visit this thread and now regret it. So I will pose the curiosity question(s) I do have.

My questions are thus:

  • Do the anti MHL proponents drive cars without wearing seat belts or ask for them to be removed?
  • Do the anti MHL proponents ask for ABS on their motor vehicles to be disabled?
  • Do the anti MHL proponents ask for SRS (eg air bags) on their motor vehicles to be disabled?
Just curious, some are compulsory, some not, but all could save you, but more often than not just a waste of time, money, effort, etc if you are really really careful.


Im glad you dont visit the mhl thread often then..

are you really going to compare safety measures that apply to bikes to safety measures that apply to cars ?
The dutch have one word to describe the aussie MHL, this word is ;
SCHIJNVEILIGHEID !!
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby human909 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:29 pm

Parrott wrote:Go have a look at the helmet thread in cycling safety. Trying to convince some on the forum that helmets protect your head is an exercise in futility.

You miss the point. I'm not arguing that helmets don't protect the head.

wombatK wrote:Homo sapiens has evolved over nearly 200,000 years - and we've been riding bicycles for not even
100 years. So I'd really like to know just how and why our bodies were "designed" to react and fall
safely from 25 km/hr.


I said that our bodies were designed to protect our head in falls. So now you change my statement and then challenge me on that changed version? Poor form dude. Either way do you think that homosapiens in their 200,000 years of evolution never tripped and fell? Never ran and tripped?

It is quite clear that our bodies ability to protect their head from falls works quite well at speeds normally encountered on a bicycle. It also works quite well at 50kph on skis too. After all its more about the height above the ground than the speed you are going.
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby Mulger bill » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:33 pm

damhooligan wrote:
Mulger bill wrote:Aaaannnnnd guess where this is going...



Do we get point for guessing it correctly ?? :mrgreen:


Not a thing Hooli. :P
As soon as I saw the title I had to go get a bourbon. :roll:

This thread is about one pointless post away from having the merge button pushed. Sensible responses along the lines of "Glad you're OK CB, maybe don't try sprinting on heavy transport routes next time" are few and far between...
...whatever the road rules, self-preservation is the absolute priority for a cyclist when mixing it with motorised traffic.
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby RonK » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:35 pm

Mulger bill wrote:This thread is about one pointless post away from having the merge button pushed. Sensible responses along the lines of "Glad you're OK CB, maybe don't try sprinting on heavy transport routes next time" are few and far between...

Do it!
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby cyclotaur » Wed Jun 27, 2012 8:39 pm

damhooligan wrote:
cyclotaur wrote:Well ... I wasn't talking about what you think .... like I said, each to his own. 8)

ow, im sorry..
I got confused by you quoting me, and responding to my post....
Nevermind, wont happen again...

I accept your apology because you are confused - I first quoted you with respect to your notion of paranoia, not personal definitions of 'reasonable', 'minor' and 'precautions' - which is what you asked of me. And I replied as above ... each to his own.

I still say my helmet saved me - just agreeing with the OP. :roll:
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby Oxford » Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:10 pm

wow, aren't the militant anti MHL proponents a very touchy and sensitive group. hypocrisy is potentially another word that could be used but I guess that's just going to fire you all up even more.

anyway, I'm glad you're alright cavebear and I'm really sorry you just don't have that expert sense of total awareness of your total environment that would have avoided the mishap in the first place. you must be so ashamed that as a rider you do not meet the standard of some on the forums. go out the back and give yourself an uppercut.
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby damhooligan » Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:11 pm

Mulger bill wrote:
damhooligan wrote:
Mulger bill wrote:Aaaannnnnd guess where this is going...



Do we get point for guessing it correctly ?? :mrgreen:


Not a thing Hooli. :P
As soon as I saw the title I had to go get a bourbon. :roll:

This thread is about one pointless post away from having the merge button pushed. Sensible responses along the lines of "Glad you're OK CB, maybe don't try sprinting on heavy transport routes next time" are few and far between...


Ow, bourbon 8)
which one ??
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SCHIJNVEILIGHEID !!
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby Nobody » Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:12 pm

Glad you're OK CB, maybe don't try sprinting on heavy transport routes next time.

[Like that Shaun?]

Anyway CB, it probably won't make you feel much/any better, but I threw myself down the road about 3 weeks ago. Coming back from the shops on my utility bike in the wet. Went round a sharp turn in the road which I knew to be a bit more slippery than most. Thought I was going slow enough, running a trailing rear brake (it's at the bottom of a hill). Turned in OK but then the front wheel just disappeared! :shock: Didn't even have enough time to put a foot down (and I was on flat pedals). Ended up sliding along the road on my front. Not a good look, but when is crashing a good look?. When I got up I rubbed my foot on the road to find it was like wet metal, even though I couldn't see anything obvious. A few rocks around. I could have also hit one, but don't remember it. Can't blame the front tyre as it was a Big Apple with 22psi in the front (5 out of 5 for grip on Schwalbe's site).

Anyway, the usual injuries. Grazes, either cracked rib or damaged cartilage and a shoulder I'm only now starting to get significant movement back in, but still with pain. I might be able to lie on that side to sleep soon.

The only thing I've learnt from this crash is, if riding in the wet, it's only a matter of time before I go down from something unseen. I'll need to be over-cautious in the wet from now on. Maybe have the foot out already if I try that corner again in the wet.
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby Nobody » Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:17 pm

Oxford wrote:anyway, I'm glad you're alright cavebear and I'm really sorry you just don't have that expert sense of total awareness of your total environment that would have avoided the mishap in the first place. you must be so ashamed that as a rider you do not meet the standard of some on the forums.
Yeah, I obviously don't meet "the standard" either. Oh well, now I know my road riding skills are up there with my MTB skills. :mrgreen: :oops:
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby Mulger bill » Wed Jun 27, 2012 9:19 pm

damhooligan wrote:Ow, bourbon 8)
which one ??


Cougar I'm afraid.
For some unaccountable reason, my bottle of Basil Haydens has evaporated along with the Makers Mark :(
...whatever the road rules, self-preservation is the absolute priority for a cyclist when mixing it with motorised traffic.
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby damhooligan » Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:19 pm

Mulger bill wrote:
damhooligan wrote:Ow, bourbon 8)
which one ??


Cougar I'm afraid.
For some unaccountable reason, my bottle of Basil Haydens has evaporated along with the Makers Mark :(


I hate when that happens.... :lol:
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SCHIJNVEILIGHEID !!
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby hannos » Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:28 pm

Mulger bill wrote:
damhooligan wrote:Ow, bourbon 8)
which one ??


Cougar I'm afraid.
For some unaccountable reason, my bottle of Basil Haydens has evaporated along with the Makers Mark :(



Well here's your pointless post, posted by the mod himself. :twisted:

Cougar? What are you trying to do, degrease your insides?
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby Mulger bill » Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:34 pm

hannos wrote:Cougar? What are you trying to do, degrease your insides?

It's alright when adulterated with coke, definitely not a sippin' bourbon. Normally kept for visitors...
...whatever the road rules, self-preservation is the absolute priority for a cyclist when mixing it with motorised traffic.
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby cavebear2 » Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:47 pm

Hmmm....a lot's happened here in my 8 hour absence......thanks for alerting me Hooli!

:| :| :| :) :) :x :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :wink:
Last edited by cavebear2 on Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: My Helmet saved me the other day

Postby il padrone » Wed Jun 27, 2012 10:48 pm

cyclotaur wrote:Well ... I wasn't talking about what you think .... like I said, each to his own. 8)

And THAT really is the point so many are trying to get at........

But our guv'nmint won't let us have it that way :roll:
Riding bikes in traffic - what seems dangerous is usually safe; what seems safe is often more dangerous.
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