DRAFTING
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby Baalzamon » Tue Jun 05, 2012 1:20 pm
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby Xplora » Tue Jun 05, 2012 4:38 pm
Weekend warriors are OK, they know what you're doing, and they know how to react. I have no idea if some noob is about to rearend me etc.
Also, there is virtually no benefit from drafting until you're doing 35kmh and right on their hammer IME, and that's well beyond the "normal" riding pace and space for most commuters, making the process more pointless.
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby wexford » Wed Jun 13, 2012 12:21 am
Only ever had the one acknowledgement, commuting northbound along Perth's Kwinana Freeway PSP. I picked him up around Canning Bridge and, given that conditions were good, I put the hammer down all the way into Perth and set a PR along the way and quickest ever commute by three minutes (to this day). Brutal pace by my standards - having him there really made me work hard. Anyway, as I peeled off at the CBD I had a look. He had a big grin and said "thanks mate, that was awesome!". Made my day
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby Gerry.M » Wed Jun 13, 2012 10:58 am
I don't see it as pointless, for me I might be struggling along at 25km/h and someone will pass me doing closer to 30.Xplora wrote: Also, there is virtually no benefit from drafting until you're doing 35kmh and right on their hammer IME, and that's well beyond the "normal" riding pace and space for most commuters, making the process more pointless.
Having them within sight allows me to push on at 30km/h without a huge increase in effort as you have a target to work to.
Not necessarily drafting, more following closely behind (i.e. at least a full bike length)
Generally I only do this on a bike path mind you.
For those that do let the lead rider know you are drafting, how do you let them know?
i.e. When I pass someone I'll often call out "Passing", so do you call out "Drafting"
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DRAFTING
Postby RonK » Wed Jun 13, 2012 1:01 pm
You extend the courtesy of asking first.Lebowski wrote:For those that do let the lead rider know you are drafting, how do you let them know?
i.e. When I pass someone I'll often call out "Passing", so do you call out "Drafting"
The four words required are: "May I sit on"
Or
"Mind if I sit".
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby trailgumby » Wed Jun 13, 2012 1:24 pm
I think he appreciated it when I said "thanks for the tow " after we crested the climb
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby elantra » Wed Jun 13, 2012 2:35 pm
On my way to work the other day a Roadie overtook me going so fast that i felt compelled to see how fast he was really going.trailgumby wrote:Haven't done it too often, but one mornng was doing hill repeats and had a guy pass me on a roadie so I bridged the gap and sat on his wheel.
I think he appreciated it when I said "thanks for the tow " after we crested the climb
To my amazement i managed to catch him with the assistance of a traffic light.
A kilometre later i let him "go" but soon after that he had to stop for a Ped crossing and he was a bit "slow" getting going again.
i felt embarrassed to have to pass him
then we went our separate ways.....
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby Xplora » Wed Jun 13, 2012 8:24 pm
You are describing "chasing" and not drafting. I chase EVERYONE on my commutes. Nothing wrong with chasing. Drafting in practice is sitting VERY close to their backwheel, and essentially becoming "one" in the slipstream. You can't do this safely with strangers on many commute routes, because there are often turns and obstacles to navigate etc and you need a prior understanding and a good road to draft safely - aka no sudden stops, expectation of signalling, etc. You might find the guy in front doesn't understand how important it is to yell out "slowing" or "rolling" or "all clear", there is an enormous amount of trust when you are following and it is IMO unreasonable to expect that from a stranger who may not have the experience in bunch riding.Lebowski wrote: For those that do let the lead rider know you are drafting, how do you let them know?
i.e. When I pass someone I'll often call out "Passing", so do you call out "Drafting"
Don't get me wrong. I have been having a fantastic time drafting on the commute east down the M4 near Parramatta with my riding pal, but we understand the speeds involved, and what to do when we get to the merging lanes etc. We also know each other and have been practicing I'm no bunch riding genius but my experience with commutes is that it's a bad bad idea to treat it the same as a casual ride on Saturday morning.
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby HLC » Sat Jun 30, 2012 8:54 pm
I never draft people either, unless it's my mates and we are on a group ride.
I rode one guy off my wheel yesterday arvo and he wasn't too happy, and I was less than impressed with the guy half-wheeling me later on that evening. Especially when slowing as I was (and usually am always) riding my brakeless track bike. Clowns.
You want to draft me? Ask. And be prepared to take a turn too. Just like we do at the track. Sick of hero super-commuters who want to shave seconds off their strava segments but wheel sucking... Mate, if you are getting passed by a guy on a Fixed Gear bike running a huge gear into a block headwind (all it ever seems to be over here) then saving seconds is the least of your worries.
The worst is heading against the 'traffic' in this instance. On the rare rare occasion that I'll be copping a sweet sweet tailwind there is a fair chance that I'll have the hammer down. Instead of having to worry about drafters and half-wheeling jerks, I get to contend with them coming at me in stupidly long trains awkwardly trying to pass slower riders so not to drop off the ack and lose their draft. Makes for some smooth moves and heart-in-mouth moments. If you are riding everyday, you should know better than that.
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby diggler » Sun Jul 01, 2012 11:29 pm
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DRAFTING
Postby 98octane » Mon Jul 02, 2012 12:20 am
I commute daily along the Main Yarra Trail, which I've been doing for a year (to the day!). I try to always stay above 35kph. So I need to pass lots of cyclists on the way. Only a few go close to that pace, so I'm not tempted to draft often.
However, if the cyclist in front is doing within 1-2kph of the speed I want to go, overtaking can be difficult in the narrow parts of the trail. So I tend to follow behind by a metre or so for a few hundred metres until I can pass.
Until reading this thread I was unaware that that sort of drafting really irritates some cyclists. That said, a man who I can only conclude had had a bad day did once shout at me "Get off my f@#cking arse you f@#cking c@nt!" as I approached him riding up a hill (I passed immediately, so wasn't actually drafting). I find that reaction odd given there's actually a benefit to the lead cyclist, and I'm more than happy to return the favour when I pass.
In future, if I want to draft relatively closely (but no closer than a wheel), I'll be sure to ask the lead cyclist first.
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby hamwedges » Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:48 pm
I reguarly chase and draft people when crossing the Sydney Harbour Bridge - straight stretch, no unexpected obsticles (generally). If you keep a good look out and find a good rider it definitely increases your speed. I try to ask first but am sometimes too puffed.
Im always happy for people to draft me, i just make sure if give them heaps of warning when braking (hand signal, etc)...
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby Sweeper59 » Tue Jul 03, 2012 4:13 pm
Nobody looks back on their life....and remembers the nights they got plenty of sleep !!
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby Kenzo » Tue Jul 03, 2012 4:57 pm
I think the snot rocket is a perfect example of incredibly disgusting behaviour when there is a rider behind you.Sweeper59 wrote:I find that occasionally clearing your nose ('cocky's blow') tends to make unwanted wheel suckers drop off a little.
I was several metres off the back wheel of a rider and still copped the spray off this inconsiderate moron. (Not saying it was you Sweeper59).
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby Crawf » Wed Jul 04, 2012 1:13 pm
Sheesh calm down.HLC wrote:I hate Kent's drafting me. Unless it's my mates and we are on a group ride.
I never draft people either, unless it's my mates and we are on a group ride.
I rode one guy off my wheel yesterday arvo and he wasn't too happy, and I was less than impressed with the guy half-wheeling me later on that evening. Especially when slowing as I was (and usually am always) riding my brakeless track bike. Clowns.
You want to draft me? Ask. And be prepared to take a turn too. Just like we do at the track. Sick of hero super-commuters who want to shave seconds off their strava segments but wheel sucking... Mate, if you are getting passed by a guy on a Fixed Gear bike running a huge gear into a block headwind (all it ever seems to be over here) then saving seconds is the least of your worries.
The worst is heading against the 'traffic' in this instance. On the rare rare occasion that I'll be copping a sweet sweet tailwind there is a fair chance that I'll have the hammer down. Instead of having to worry about drafters and half-wheeling jerks, I get to contend with them coming at me in stupidly long trains awkwardly trying to pass slower riders so not to drop off the ack and lose their draft. Makes for some smooth moves and heart-in-mouth moments. If you are riding everyday, you should know better than that.
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby Xplora » Thu Jul 05, 2012 4:57 pm
Screw conveying confidence. Be confident, take your time and feel out the situation. Just remember that there is no guarantee that they aren't a pack of noobs, and you are not the most skilled rider.argon_18 wrote:So what's the etiquette when joining a group/shop ride for the first time and no-one knows you yet?
My assumption is to hang back until I can convey some confidence that I know what I'm doing?
I think the big thing is to be aware of your limits - bunch riding on 6 hours sleep and a hard week isn't going to end well, so maybe it's time to jump onto the back. I can't help myself. I have to go forward
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby high_tea » Thu Jul 05, 2012 8:20 pm
Being at the back of a bunch is overrated. The further back you are, the more surging there is. So it's harder both physically and from a bike-handling point of view. The upside is that if you go off the back you will do so without inconveniencing other riders. It's the least intimidating place to ride with one thing and another, but I don't reckon it's the easiest.Xplora wrote:Screw conveying confidence. Be confident, take your time and feel out the situation. Just remember that there is no guarantee that they aren't a pack of noobs, and you are not the most skilled rider.argon_18 wrote:So what's the etiquette when joining a group/shop ride for the first time and no-one knows you yet?
My assumption is to hang back until I can convey some confidence that I know what I'm doing?
I think the big thing is to be aware of your limits - bunch riding on 6 hours sleep and a hard week isn't going to end well, so maybe it's time to jump onto the back. I can't help myself. I have to go forward
PS. Have to rant. What is it with people who not only follow too closely, in traffic but insist on hanging half a metre to my left while doing it? Whatever happened to not overtaking on the inside? Not that they're even overtaking, they're just aimlessly hanging there close enough to make me nervous and putting themselves in the doorzone to no useful purpose. This happened to me not once, but twice, on the ride home today. The second time this hubbard didn't overtake when I signalled him and slowed down(signalling being so much more polite than yelling GET OFF MY EVERLOVING WHEEL YOU SILLY WHEELSUCKING PERSON, or possibly some version with lots of cusswords), then said something about waiting for me. I may have said something that insinuated that he had missed the point of me slowing down.
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby g-boaf » Thu Aug 16, 2012 11:35 am
It does, and I don't like it much either. For one, I'm not going to make myself out as the finest cyclist there is, and two - I don't know who the person behind me is. I'll speed up to stop it if I can, or I'll slow down and let you go ahead and then I'll follow about 3 or so bike lengths back. I prefer to be careful.98octane wrote:Until reading this thread I was unaware that that sort of drafting really irritates some cyclists. That said, a man who I can only conclude had had a bad day did once shout at me "Get off my f@#cking arse you f@#cking c@nt!" as I approached him riding up a hill (I passed immediately, so wasn't actually drafting). I find that reaction odd given there's actually a benefit to the lead cyclist, and I'm more than happy to return the favour when I pass.
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby ZepinAtor » Thu Aug 16, 2012 12:10 pm
I'm also from the N-side of Brisbane & probably ride the same dedicated paths that you do, or similar.Whipy wrote:I failed to mention that the drafting I do is on a dedicated bike track.
I totally agree with all the non-drafting opinions on here & for good reason. I train with a power meter & constantly watch the cadence/power figures with certain efforts requiring me to slow to 10km/hr then surge hard for 30 seconds.
I have had commuters/roadies/SSers try to draft of me & I always just keep increasing the speed until they're gone. It's turned a nice endurance/tempo ride into a TT fest which can be really annoying, but fun to an extent.
I much prefer to have them pull up beside me for a chat. It gets lonely out there sometimes
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby wurtulla wabbit » Thu Aug 16, 2012 12:15 pm
You were doing what you were doing anyway ?
No change of plan so what are they getting off you for free that you could charge for or ask permission for ?
Cyclists and the politics are just silly at times.
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby grantw » Thu Aug 16, 2012 1:01 pm
Just this morning I had some dill half wheel me on the inside, I didn't know he was there so didn't indicate that I was changing my line to avoid some rough road surface. Very nearly put him in the ditch, only I glanced down and saw his wheel at the last moment.
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby bychosis » Thu Aug 16, 2012 1:19 pm
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby nescius » Thu Aug 16, 2012 1:24 pm
The problem is that you don't know how competent they are, all it takes is a touch of wheels and you could both be thrown into traffic. My girlfriend had a wheel sucker run up the back of her when she slowed for a pedestrian on a crossing, luckily there was no damage to her or the bike, but it could easily have ended badly for both of them.wurtulla wabbit wrote:Must be daft , I don't get why you would be set with someone getting an easier time by riding behind you.
You were doing what you were doing anyway ?
No change of plan so what are they getting off you for free that you could charge for or ask permission for ?
Cyclists and the politics are just silly at times.
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Re: DRAFTING
Postby wurtulla wabbit » Thu Aug 16, 2012 1:28 pm
Being too close is asking for bother if they don't know you're there.
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