2012 Tour de France

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DavidS
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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby DavidS » Sun Jul 22, 2012 1:56 pm

Bit of a boring tour but congrats to Wiggins and Sky. They looked at the course, worked out how to win and had the talent to pull it off. Can't do much better than that.

One of the most reveling quotes I think came from Wiggins' press conference last night, he said:
"When we were riding on the front at 450 watts (of power) or whatever, someone would attack and Mick Rogers would say 'just leave him, he can't sustain it'," Wiggins said.
"Someone is going to have to sustain 500 watts over 20 minutes of a climb to stay away, which is not possible anymore unless you've got a couple of extra litres of blood. That's the reality of it. It really is.
Maybe if we are in an age of less drugs then, with a more level playing field, dominant teams will come to the fore. I suppose you could also argue the same when Indurain was winning (I've heard this win compared to the way he won) but back then the playing field would have been level as a result of everyone being on drugs. I hope Wiggins is right about drugs being less prevalent.

It is now up to the rest of the teams to catch up to Sky, although Voeckler shed some useful light on that when he said:
France's Thomas Voeckler, who is set to finish fourth overall riding with Europcar team, said: "They designed their team around the demands of the race route. "They've got a really big annual budget which is more than triple ours," said Voeckler, who this year won two stages and looks likely to take the King of the Mountains polka dot jersey.
"Some people might say their victory was without style and panache but you can't argue with the fact they've finished first and second. Hats off to them."
Maybe we do need look at how the race can become more unpredictable. In effect that means isolating team leaders which by extension means no super teams like Sky. But this also begs the question what BMC were spending money on. After all, they were touted as building a super team last year when they signed Gilbert, Hushovd et al to add to their reigning tour champion.

DS
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norbs
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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby norbs » Sun Jul 22, 2012 2:06 pm

Philipthelam wrote:
norbs wrote:Even now I am still cranky about last night.


http://norbs.tk/9c


Be warned, some sweary bits.
Norbs is that your blog? I took a quick look at the posts and really enjoyed it. I will follow it :)

Yes it is. The ramblings of a fat bloke. :D

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sogood
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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby sogood » Sun Jul 22, 2012 2:21 pm

vander wrote:Everyone saying about Cadels age being against him, I dont think it is, granted he has had a bad year (not just tour) but I still think he has a few good years in him. Look at Chris Horner this year at 40 probably up there with his best ever tour. Dont count Cadel out yet, he will be back stronger (or as strong) than ever.
I think Cadel is a great diesel engine that lacked peak power of those elite climbers. He'll be up there but tough to get back to the #1 spot given his deteriorating ITT results of recent. Last year was a lucky set of circumstances for Cadel.
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rpmspinman
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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby rpmspinman » Sun Jul 22, 2012 2:30 pm

Well done wiggo, froome & team sky. They dominated the whole tour. A bit boring but they have shown their strength and raised the bar in this event alone.
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Peacewise
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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby Peacewise » Sun Jul 22, 2012 2:33 pm

Gotta hand it to those two poms, they sure can ride.

Boring tour? I don't think so, just not the aussie winning outcome I was hoping for.
Plenty of interesting stages, though I think ultimately during stage 17, when froome and wiggins rode away from every other GC rider, they proved they are the best riders of 2012 tdf.
Capping that off with a 1 and 2 on the final time trial only further cements the pommy dominance.

Anyone for cricket?
oh wait.

the London games?
hope the poms are overtrained...
Keep flexing, spinning, rolling, coasting, pushing, pulling, drafting, sprinting, time trialling, touring, climbing, descending, hot dogging, crit-ing, racing, weaving, dodging, dropping, tanking, chasing... but most of all - just keep f'ing riding!

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rpmspinman
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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby rpmspinman » Sun Jul 22, 2012 4:03 pm

Peacewise wrote:Gotta hand it to those two poms, they sure can ride.

Boring tour? I don't think so, just not the aussie winning outcome I was hoping for.
Plenty of interesting stages, though I think ultimately during stage 17, when froome and wiggins rode away from every other GC rider, they proved they are the best riders of 2012 tdf.
Capping that off with a 1 and 2 on the final time trial only further cements the pommy dominance.

Anyone for cricket?
oh wait.

the London games?
hope the poms are overtrained...
Don't get me wrong. I enjoyed Voeckler's attacks for KOM, Sagan's stage wins, the spills, break aways and even the scenery, and just watching how everything else unfolded. But Team Sky pretty much dominated so much that they just shut everyone down who made moves on their GC campaign. I guess I would have liked to seen someone really match Sky's ability in the mountains for the GC lead, even if it was Nibali. Sure he made some good attempts but he just could not sustain it. Not taking anything away from Team Sky, they deserve the win, but I was expecting someone to match them and make it more competitive for the GC. It just felt like it was basically over by end of week 2 to some extent.
Cheers
Shav

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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby Peacewise » Sun Jul 22, 2012 4:33 pm

Look at the stats, truly the tdf was over after Wiggins put 10 seconds over cadel on the very first day! From then on Sky and Wiggins just increased the lead or defended it.

Everything else was us aussies (well me at least) trying to not believe reality. :oops:
Keep flexing, spinning, rolling, coasting, pushing, pulling, drafting, sprinting, time trialling, touring, climbing, descending, hot dogging, crit-ing, racing, weaving, dodging, dropping, tanking, chasing... but most of all - just keep f'ing riding!

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norbs
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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby norbs » Sun Jul 22, 2012 6:52 pm

My highs and lows of the Tour are up on the blog. See blog link in my sig if you're interested.

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Chuck
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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby Chuck » Sun Jul 22, 2012 7:09 pm

sogood wrote:Last year was a lucky set of circumstances for Cadel.
FFS :roll:
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TimW
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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby TimW » Sun Jul 22, 2012 7:32 pm

sogood wrote: Last year was a lucky set of circumstances for Cadel.
I typed a reply but deleted it, as i would have got into trouble yet again with the Mods :roll: :roll: :roll:
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bosvit
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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby bosvit » Sun Jul 22, 2012 8:55 pm

I think the tour organisers are to blame for the lack lustre tour more than Sky

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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby greyhoundtom » Sun Jul 22, 2012 9:11 pm

bosvit wrote:I think the tour organisers are to blame for the lack lustre tour more than Sky
I will stick to blaming the Sky team thanks ..........a bit like watching synchronized swimming :lol: :wink:

The_Eggman
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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby The_Eggman » Sun Jul 22, 2012 10:42 pm

My 2 cents on a bunch of matters tour:

GC
Wiggins has earned his victory. Yeah, Froome looked the stronger climber at times and was held back by the team, but Wiggins owned the ITT and was proven the one of the top 5 climbers (probably top 2 to be honest). He's earned his win.

But was it entertaining?
No it wasn't. Was a bit like watching a golfer win by a massive margin - impressive though somehow dull. The thrill of the GC contest took a massive dent in the ITT (stage 9) and was gone by the end of Stage 11. Again, credit to Wiggins and Sky for their dominance, but it didn't make great viewing (especially given the theater of 2011).

Must say the tour organisers should be belted with baguettes for the routing. Two ITTs of that length plus the prologue? Only 3 mountain top finishes? Rubbish. Stage 12 was a perfect example of a crappy route - two cat 1 climbs, both in first 80km of stage - 120km of flat to follow. Zero incentive to attack and two great climbs wasted.

Cadel
His whole season has been a little down on last season. I was hoping he was foxing somewhat, but he just didn't seem to have the legs this year. I personally doubt he'll win another yellow. Guys like Voigt and Horner have proven you can still be a factor for years to come, but winning GC at the TdF? Just can't see it.

Rather than despair though, I'd rather rejoice in the fact he won the bloody thing last year. Even if he never wins another race or stage, it's a truely phenomenal career he's put togther.

Rather than another tour, I'd probably like to see him set himself for the Giro (where the terrain should suit him better) or maybe even a big classics season next year.

Orica Green Edge
Disappointing. Hopefully they can pinch the win tonite and turn their tour around, but odds are they will come away empty handed. I know it's their first TdF, but they are a team of seasoned pros not new kids, and unlike Liquigas, Lotto and Sky they had no GC man to protect. Their leadout train ranged between fair and ineffectual, and Goss proved a notch down on Greipel, Cav and Sagan. And come the mountains and rolling stages they barely fired a shot.

Even on reflection their one stage win at the Giro was kinda lucky. Probably the best leadout I've seen from them, but when Cav goes downs in the sprint you'd have to say it's somewhat fortunate.....

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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby AUbicycles » Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:05 am

My complaint is that I couldn't watch in the Euro timezone this year, the late nights really knock you around.
Cycling is in my BNA

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norbs
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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby norbs » Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:34 am

Cav is a beast!

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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby bigfriendlyvegan » Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:39 am

norbs wrote:Cav is a beast!
Yep, looking good for gold next week.

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snark
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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby snark » Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:53 am

Holy moly, bring back Tina Arena...
Phil Liggett, TdF 2011, Alpe-d'Huez: "I reckon tonight in hindsight he may have won the Tour de France tomorrow."

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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby meridaman » Mon Jul 23, 2012 2:21 am

Snark I agree what a Shocker!

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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby maryusdemetry » Mon Jul 23, 2012 6:58 am

Chuck wrote:
sogood wrote:Last year was a lucky set of circumstances for Cadel.
FFS :roll:

No question cadel isn't right. He's riding like he was that year when he crashed and rode two weeks with a broken arm/clavicle....

Is this the end of his road? A man of his age.. Hit the peak of his career, new child, is the hunger still there to suffer day in day out? He's never been the most talented... Except for suffering... Lol

I would not be surprised if he retired at the end of the year. The irony would be that bmc then would be in the game for Froome

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Chuck
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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby Chuck » Mon Jul 23, 2012 8:35 am

norbs wrote:Cav is a beast!
Most stage wins ever at the Tour by a sprinter and he's only 27. 3 stage wins at the Giro and another 3 at the Tour in the World Champions Jersey, hardly a "waste" :mrgreen:

His efforts at the Giro to get through the mountains and fight for the points classification and finish the race showed a lot of respect for the race and for the WC jersey, respect 8)

Congratulations to SKY and to Wiggins for a dominant performance.

In a race where they say it's an achievement just to finish Cadel now has six top ten finishes (including his win last year) an outstanding performance.
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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby PawPaw » Mon Jul 23, 2012 8:47 am

I was happy with Sky's TdF performance. It proved Australian sports physiology and coaching is world best.

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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby twizzle » Mon Jul 23, 2012 9:16 am

maryusdemetry wrote:Is this the end of his road? A man of his age..
At the most, he might have lost 1% VO2Max in the last year. The studies suggest that for athletes under 70, the rate is 6% per decade. "Age" cannot be blamed for his loss of form this year, although his age means he's giving a fair bit away to the younger riders... but he had a lot to start with given that he had the highest VO2Max ever measured at the AIS.

It will be interesting to see what W/kg numbers the anti-doping crowd come up with this year for Cadel, his performance has always been considered the benchmark for 'clean'.
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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby clackers » Mon Jul 23, 2012 11:09 am

twizzle wrote: At the most, he might have lost 1% VO2Max in the last year. The studies suggest that for athletes under 70, the rate is 6% per decade.
If that corresponded with a 1% drop in performance, he's giving away more than 30 seconds on a time trial.

That he was the oldest postwar winner may be revealing. Last year was unusual. Age finally counts against champions, no matter how good.

It may be that power drops off considerably, too.

Stuart O'Grady thought so when asked about his condition before this year's Paris-Roubaix compared to when he won it.
Last edited by clackers on Mon Jul 23, 2012 11:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby jules21 » Mon Jul 23, 2012 11:10 am

The_Eggman wrote:Cadel
His whole season has been a little down on last season. I was hoping he was foxing somewhat, but he just didn't seem to have the legs this year. I personally doubt he'll win another yellow. Guys like Voigt and Horner have proven you can still be a factor for years to come, but winning GC at the TdF? Just can't see it.

Rather than despair though, I'd rather rejoice in the fact he won the bloody thing last year. Even if he never wins another race or stage, it's a truely phenomenal career he's put togther.

Rather than another tour, I'd probably like to see him set himself for the Giro (where the terrain should suit him better) or maybe even a big classics season next year.
i'm more optimistic than that. cadel has had a rough season - i suspect his sinus infection may have had a bigger impact on his preparation than he let on. if you look at the last two Tour winners, they've had very clean preparations (i'm hesitant to go back further than that). there's no obvious reason why it can't all fall into place again next year.

although he will start losing some of the raw endurance capacity to younger opponents, you can't underestimate the value of experience in this race, nor his ability to stay out of trouble. it only takes one mistake and a heavy favorite can be knocked out of contention.

most people thought he could not win the 2011 race and he proved them all wrong. i'll be cheering him on next year.

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Re: 2012 Tour de France

Postby Peacewise » Mon Jul 23, 2012 12:22 pm

PawPaw wrote:I was happy with Sky's TdF performance. It proved Australian sports physiology and coaching is world best.
lol, hardy ha ha i say.

yep, PawPaw has a keen point. Aussies are the best coaches.
Keep flexing, spinning, rolling, coasting, pushing, pulling, drafting, sprinting, time trialling, touring, climbing, descending, hot dogging, crit-ing, racing, weaving, dodging, dropping, tanking, chasing... but most of all - just keep f'ing riding!

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