Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
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Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby Nobody » Tue May 01, 2012 8:57 am
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby Nobody » Fri Aug 17, 2012 9:04 pm
http://www.roadbikeaction.com/Most-Popu ... kdown.htmlShimano USA’s vice president, Wayne Stetina, has a different take on things: “The BB30 is an optimized design for an aluminum spindle, and 24mm diameter is the optimized size for a steel spindle. But, after five to 10 years, an aluminum spindle will eventually fail. Neither of the designs are the ultimate.”
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby rkelsen » Fri Aug 17, 2012 10:29 pm
Which is why they should go back to the square taper. It is a design which proved itself for decades.Nobody wrote:"Neither of the designs are the ultimate."
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby Bentnose » Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:05 am
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby ldrcycles » Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:15 am
+1, i love square taper. Especially with a seperate axle BB, very easy to service.rkelsen wrote:Which is why they should go back to the square taper. It is a design which proved itself for decades.Nobody wrote:"Neither of the designs are the ultimate."
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby __PG__ » Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:50 am
Having said that I doubt Shimano's claim that 'all aluminum 30 mm spindles will fail in five years'.
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby Nobody » Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:59 am
He said, "But, after five to 10 years, an aluminum spindle will eventually fail."__PG__ wrote:Having said that I doubt Shimano's claim that 'all aluminum 30 mm spindles will fail in five years'.
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby jasonc » Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:01 am
and how many of us would use a spindle for that long anyway?Nobody wrote:He said, "But, after five to 10 years, an aluminum spindle will eventually fail."__PG__ wrote:Having said that I doubt Shimano's claim that 'all aluminum 30 mm spindles will fail in five years'.
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby Nobody » Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:07 am
I have. However, on average, the kind of person to buy a 30mm spindle is unlikely to keep their bike that long. The secondhand buyer just needs to be aware that Al crank spindles have a fatigue life.jasonc wrote:and how many of us would use a spindle for that long anyway?
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby il padrone » Sat Aug 18, 2012 10:35 am
Never mind the spindle - the entire square-taper cartridge bearing set has been in my son's bike since 1995. Originally my bike, it's done plenty of kilometres too.jasonc wrote:and how many of us would use a spindle for that long anyway?
"An unjustified and unethical imposition on a healthy activity."
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby ozdavo » Sat Aug 18, 2012 10:43 am
Have shimano (or anyone?) ever produced a production alloy 24mm BB spindle? I thought 24mm has always been steel?Nobody wrote:I found it interesting that while some of the Shimano road cranksets have Al spindles,
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby Nobody » Sat Aug 18, 2012 10:55 am
As per original post, my 5650 105 (2010?) cranks were alloy spindle. Also the Tiagra 4500 pictured below.ozdavo wrote:Have shimano (or anyone?) ever produced a production alloy 24mm BB spindle? I thought 24mm has always been steel?Nobody wrote:I found it interesting that while some of the Shimano road cranksets have Al spindles,
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby __PG__ » Sat Aug 18, 2012 4:17 pm
I can't see how SRAM, FSA, Cannondale etc would send critical components off to market with a five year fatigue design life. In any case, it's the mileage that matters. Maybe a BB30 spindle will fail after 100,000 km or so.
But if BB30 spindles were as fragile as the Shimano rep suggested you'd have epidemics of amateur racers with broken cranksets.
I think the Shimano rep is just using a scare tactic to talk down the opposition.
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby warthog1 » Sat Aug 18, 2012 4:58 pm
Seems unlikely to fail to me especially with the limited power I am able to generate
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby Nobody » Sat Aug 18, 2012 6:58 pm
Probably right about being about Kms and not time.__PG__ wrote:I can't see how SRAM, FSA, Cannondale etc would send critical components off to market with a five year fatigue design life. In any case, it's the mileage that matters. Maybe a BB30 spindle will fail after 100,000 km or so.
Even steel can break if the bearing seizes.__PG__ wrote:But if BB30 spindles were as fragile as the Shimano rep suggested you'd have epidemics of amateur racers with broken cranksets.
http://www.bicycles.net.au/forums/viewt ... 34&t=40469
Have BB30 been popular for 10 years yet?
The fact they changed from Al to steel for spindles says a lot in itself.__PG__ wrote:I think the Shimano rep is just using a scare tactic to talk down the opposition.
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby Nobody » Sat Aug 18, 2012 7:02 pm
warthog1 wrote:There looks to be a fair thickness of metal on that tiagra crankset.
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby __PG__ » Sat Aug 18, 2012 7:22 pm
But that was for 24 mm diameter spindles, not 30 mm.Nobody wrote:The fact they changed from Al to steel for spindles says a lot in itself.
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby Nobody » Sat Aug 18, 2012 7:41 pm
True. Like most things, the truth will come out eventually.__PG__ wrote:But that was for 24 mm diameter spindles, not 30 mm.
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby trailgumby » Sat Aug 18, 2012 7:58 pm
If we're lucky, the change might even bring an improvement occasionally.
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby warthog1 » Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:09 pm
I'll go with that too, b@stardstrailgumby wrote:Bikes are like R/C cars. They change things and make them incompatible with old things to keep the market turning over.
If we're lucky, the change might even bring an improvement occasionally.
The amount of different bb designs is starting to get/has gotten a bit over the top now
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby warthog1 » Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:12 pm
That would have to be pretty hard to break with the power the average punter puts out wouldn't it?Nobody wrote:warthog1 wrote:There looks to be a fair thickness of metal on that tiagra crankset.
Wear on the surface where the bearings contact would be more likely to see it out IMHO.
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby Nobody » Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:36 pm
Since some on these forums have broken crank arms, nothing surprises me. Shimano must have had a reason to change. If I remember correctly doubles came with steel and compacts came with the alloy spindle. Maybe they thought compact users were soft and won't use their cranksets as much. Maybe they were proven wrong...warthog1 wrote:That would have to be pretty hard to break with the power the average punter puts out wouldn't it?
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby Nobody » Sun Aug 19, 2012 10:41 pm
Agree. Some of the changes I've appreciated over the last 20 years or so (in no particular order):trailgumby wrote:Bikes are like R/C cars. They change things and make them incompatible with old things to keep the market turning over.
If we're lucky, the change might even bring an improvement occasionally.
1 1/8" Aheadset (threadless).
Stems face-plates that unbolt so you can remove the handlebar easily.
Double walled rims.
Disc brakes.
Two bolt seatpost saddle rail clamps.
Seatpost clamps that are not part of the frame.
Dual clamp seatpost clamps (different size for frame and post).
STI/Ergo (although I still don't have them).
Wider range road cassettes and more gears (although I think 9 is plenty).
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby twizzle » Mon Aug 20, 2012 8:09 am
Things that come instantly to mind...
Alloy freehubs. Just sooooo durable, but I guess "The Market" replaces the wheels before they need to get that cassette off.
"Unique" spokes. Because it's always fun to wait weeks to get a replacement for that spoke you broke, isn't it?
Every bottom bracket system since square drive. Although, I really do like the Shimano two-piece setup, it is engineering elegance.
Shimano's chain rings for the last few years. Cheaper to buy a new crankset than buy replacement chain rings - if you could even find them.
11 speed - because it has to be better than ten speed. Right? Or because it wears out quicker and you spend more on servicing.
Gary Fisher's wider front hubs. "Stiffer"? Riiight.
Carbon rims with alloy braking surfaces - awesome, a heavy rim that wears out just like ones you can buy for 25% of the price, and all you get is a .2kph speed advantage once over 40kph!
Everything claiming that a 15 gram saving in weight was worth the doubling in price.
Garmin - making you pay twice the price to get a feature that was implemented in the software and could have been made available to all of the older models.
...real cyclists don't have squeaky chains...
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Re: Shimano rethinks road crank spindles on 105
Postby ldrcycles » Mon Aug 20, 2012 2:59 pm
YES!Nobody wrote: Some of the changes I've appreciated over the last 20 years or so (in no particular order):
1 1/8" Aheadset (threadless).
Stems face-plates that unbolt so you can remove the handlebar easily.
MEH. other than for crazy muddy races (conditions where the race should probably be called off anyway) i reckon Vs or cantis are just fine. As for discs on road bikes .Nobody wrote: Disc brakes.
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