Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
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Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby Dan » Wed Sep 26, 2012 8:06 pm
Thanks
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby jacks1071 » Wed Sep 26, 2012 10:31 pm
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby Dan » Wed Sep 26, 2012 10:42 pm
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby DarrylH » Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:00 pm
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby Mugglechops » Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:04 pm
I read the same thing, so I run 35sDarrylH wrote:I've just read an article in an English magazine which says that 25s give better ride AND less rolling resistance to 23s at the same pressure - contrary to popular belief.
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby Dan » Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:08 pm
However, given I have next to no clearance for 23s on the new frame, discussion on the rolling resistance or otherwise of 25s seems largely irrelevant, don't you think?
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby DarrylH » Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:54 pm
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby Dan » Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:29 pm
I also asked specifically about the ride quality of 20C through 22C tyres - right there in the title.
Did the english article mention any of the smaller diameter tyres by any chance? Id be interested to read if so.
D
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby DarrylH » Thu Sep 27, 2012 6:59 pm
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby Nobody » Thu Sep 27, 2012 8:15 pm
See the "TYRE PRESSURE" section in the link below for a better explanation.
http://www.slowtwitch.com/Tech/What_s_i ... _1034.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby Dan » Thu Sep 27, 2012 8:49 pm
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby warthog1 » Fri Sep 28, 2012 12:08 am
Good article thanks.Nobody wrote:Bigger tyres roll faster (for the same pressure) but IMHO (all things being equal) they are slower. This is due to aero and power transfer losses (thicker casing, more bob at lower pressure). However this assumes a smooth surface. As the surface gets rougher, bigger tyres (at lower pressure) get faster due to the reduction of shock/bounce. Probably why you won't see too many CX tyres in XC MTB races (where there are no tyre restrictions to my knowledge).
See the "TYRE PRESSURE" section in the link below for a better explanation.
http://www.slowtwitch.com/Tech/What_s_i ... _1034.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
What you are saying about narrower being faster appears to be supported by what is being raced on. The larger 25c tyres only seem to be used where the road is rough eg Paris-Roubaix.
You don't see 25c used in tts to my knowledge, where every time gain possible is sought.
Can't fit a 25 in the rear of my S5, a 23 is already a close fit.
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby DarrylH » Fri Sep 28, 2012 2:12 pm
The wider tyre does not mean a thicker casing and the point is that at the same pressure "bob"will be less on a wider tyre as there is a bigger volume of air to support the weight. A narrow tyre has more deformation at the same pressure and therefore greater rolling resistance.
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby Nobody » Fri Sep 28, 2012 2:41 pm
What part of the logic is out of date?DarrylH wrote:That may be a bit out of date
I've been riding on wider touring rims for years. I use 23mm tyres but they measure 24.8mm when used with these rims.DarrylH wrote:in the Giro, my info is that Greenedge used 25mm Conti Competition, Rabobank 25mm Vittorias and Sky 24mm Veloflex which actually measure 24.9mm. Rims are also going wider - Zipps Firecrest 23.48mm up from 21mm, Hed and Bontrager going to 27mm, Mavic 24.2mm and Shimanos latest (used by Sky) are also up in size. A 23mm on these rims will be no more aero than a 25mm. All above courtesy of Cycling Plus.
True, but once over 28mm, it usually does as the target market is different.DarrylH wrote:The wider tyre does not mean a thicker casing...
True. Obviously tried to simplify too much. What I overlooked writing was for the ideal pressure for each tyre, a bigger tyre should have more bob. Of course at the same pressure the bigger tyre is going to be harder, but then either the bigger is over-inflated or the smaller is under-inflated.DarrylH wrote:and the point is that at the same pressure "bob"will be less on a wider tyre as there is a bigger volume of air to support the weight.
True, but I just can't get my 2.35" Big Apples to go faster than my 23mm Rubino Pros.DarrylH wrote:A narrow tyre has more deformation at the same pressure and therefore greater rolling resistance.
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby Dan » Fri Sep 28, 2012 2:45 pm
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby Nobody » Fri Sep 28, 2012 2:46 pm
Yeah, sure. What do you want to do with it now?diggerdantheman wrote:Can I have my thread back please?
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby Dan » Fri Sep 28, 2012 2:49 pm
you're right, its pretty well trashed now...Nobody wrote:Yeah, sure. What do you want to do with it now?diggerdantheman wrote:Can I have my thread back please?
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby Nobody » Fri Sep 28, 2012 7:30 pm
Well, since it's trashed anyway...diggerdantheman wrote: you're right, its pretty well trashed now...
Thanks for the reply. Not being able to fit a 25 into a new S5 says a lot. If Cervelo really thought 25s were actually faster for road racing, I'm sure they would allow the space. You would think that Schwalbe would know something about tyres. They think narrow tyres are faster too.warthog1 wrote:What you are saying about narrower being faster appears to be supported by what is being raced on. The larger 25c tyres only seem to be used where the road is rough eg Paris-Roubaix.
You don't see 25c used in tts to my knowledge, where every time gain possible is sought.
Can't fit a 25 in the rear of my S5, a 23 is already a close fit.
http://www.schwalbetires.com/tech_info/ ... nce#narrow" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
It's funny me arguing this point as it was only a couple of years ago that I'd be arguing the opposite. I've had more time to read, think and experiment since then.
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby toolonglegs » Fri Sep 28, 2012 7:41 pm
* Part of the advantage for bigger riders running 25's is they run lower pressures compared to what you run in 23's.
Personally I run 150 psi in front 19mm tubular, 160 psi in rear 22mm tubular on my tt bike ( much more weight over the front wheel on a tt bike ). 100-115 psi in my 23mm front clincher & 100 psi in the 25mm rear on the road bike ( 120 psi on the rear with a 23mm ). 28psi on the front 32mm & 32 psi rear on my cyclocross clinchers... would love to run much lower but need tubulars for that.
Horses for courses.
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby warthog1 » Sat Sep 29, 2012 12:54 am
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby warthog1 » Sat Sep 29, 2012 1:03 am
160-180 in my 22mm tubulars on my tt bike. No idea if that is faster than a lower pressure. I tend to wonder why they build such high pressure capability into the tyres if lower is faster though.toolonglegs wrote: Personally I run 150 psi in front 19mm tubular, 160 psi in rear 22mm tubular on my tt bike.
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby warthog1 » Sat Sep 29, 2012 1:12 am
Was that on the rougher stages, and is that the measured width or specified width of the tyre?DarrylH wrote:That may be a bit out of date - in the Giro, my info is that Greenedge used 25mm Conti Competition, Rabobank 25mm Vittorias and Sky 24mm Veloflex .
It's similar to the theory that clinchers are as fast as tubulars. Most of the photos of the bikes in the peleton that I see show tubulars.
I'll also reiterate my point about tt tyre widths. When I see them running 25 - 28 mm tyres on tt bikes I'll accept they are as fast.
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby Dan » Sat Sep 29, 2012 4:44 am
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby toolonglegs » Sat Sep 29, 2012 4:49 am
If you run a latex tube in them they are even better.
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Re: Ride Quality - 20C through 22C tyres
Postby Dan » Sat Sep 29, 2012 5:02 am
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