Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby sunho » Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:17 am

BRLVR.v2 wrote:Remove the seat post and see what size it has stamped on it.


What is the significance of knowing the seatpost size?
just something that was on my mind tonight :D
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by BNA » Tue Oct 09, 2012 6:03 am

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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby find_bruce » Tue Oct 09, 2012 6:03 am

sunho wrote:What is the significance of knowing the seatpost size?
just something that was on my mind tonight :D

Steel tubes came in standard external diameters so they would fit standard lugs, so a basic rule of thumb is that the lighter the tube set, the thinner the tube walls & the bigger diameter the seat post.
Sheldon Brown wrote:Most steel bicycle frames have tubing of standard outside diameter. Frames made to British or Italian standards will typically have 1 1/8" (28.6 mm) seat tubes. Older French bicycles used 28 mm. Old American style, commonly used on BMX bicycles and other bicycles that use one-piece-cranks, uses a 1" seat tube. Standard outside diameter accommodates standard lugs and clamp-on parts such as front derailers, pulleys and other cable guides, pump pegs, etc.

High-performance bicycles are made of thinner-walled tubing, so the hole will be larger if the outside diameter is kept the same.

As a result, a larger seatpost size is often a sign of a higher-quality bicycle. This has resulted in a de facto standard of 27.2mm for high-quality bicycles that have 1 1/8" O.D. seat tubes. Since high-quality seatposts are widely available in 27.2, most high-end aluminum and carbon fiber road bicycles also use 27.2.
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby sunho » Tue Oct 09, 2012 7:44 am

Thanks for that. Interesting. Sheldon is amazing too.

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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby grantw » Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:53 am

Is that cable slot on the TT just a hole, or is it reinforced? Normally you see some form of reinforcement around penetrations into the tubing. It prevents the tube from cracking around the hole.
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby sunho » Tue Oct 09, 2012 10:32 am

grantw wrote:Is that cable slot on the TT just a hole, or is it reinforced? Normally you see some form of reinforcement around penetrations into the tubing. It prevents the tube from cracking around the hole.


i believe it is reinforced but i would need to double check.
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby sunho » Wed Oct 10, 2012 11:38 am

Reinforced.
Now going to get it blasted and powder coated. 160 is the cheapest quote I got...

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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby munga » Wed Oct 10, 2012 6:40 pm

get more quotes.
pitty43 wrote:Thanks all for your help. Better change my Gumtree add now.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/retroclassiccycling/
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby sunho » Wed Oct 10, 2012 9:18 pm

100 for "b + k" at Brookvale.

I tried sanding it with some wood and pain t sand paper and the paint is coming off really easily. I think the grit of the sandpaper is slightly rough but still works a treat. I wouldn't be damaging the frame by doing it too much would I?



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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby sunho » Thu Oct 11, 2012 12:00 am

I'm looking for a groupset and atm I can see the Veloce is well priced on bike24.
Unfortunate it isnt a compact gearing, i might just take on the 39/53 but im not sure about the FD, RD options and also what to do with my boss end downtube shifter..
I prefer the modern set up, easier in traffic..

So i need:
A groupset $400-$600 (Cranks 175mm, BB1.37x24, FD width not sure, Rear deraileur not sure - Rear Dropout width is 135mm so I will fit a 10speed easy right?
A Stem 12cm to fit (11cm one nice but a little shorter) $??
Dropbars to fit (44cm) $??

Any help is greatly appreciated.
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby Dan » Thu Oct 11, 2012 8:23 am

sunho wrote:I'm looking for a groupset and atm I can see the Veloce is well priced on bike24.
Unfortunate it isnt a compact gearing


David,

bike24 have the Veloce compact black in stock, as well as the regular black, in all configs bar 172.5mm regular. I have the compact black in 175mm - but would prefer regular. PM if you want to discuss a straight chainring swap. Mine have 390 km on them - so, about 389.5 on the 50, and 0.5 on the 34... :)

RE: downtube bosses - pick up some adjusters when you order the groupset.

Dan

EDIT: More OSX typos...
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby sunho » Thu Oct 11, 2012 10:19 am

Thanks Dan.

Also called up a few more Sandblasters+Powdercoaters:
All Sydney..

Peak Powdercoating - $100
StripCo - $154
MrClean - $95
StarEnamellers - $230-260 (note:these guys paint not powdercoat - 7 week delay and extra for silver/transluscent finish)
GlassImpact - $160 (claude)
B+K - $100

I think I will go with Mr Clean at this stage... Pretty popular in this forum and car forums.
2 week turnaround seems good.
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby munga » Thu Oct 11, 2012 5:37 pm

i would get a second downtube shifter boss brazed on before you repaint it. it's gunna be difficult to run a front derailleur without it.
i think star enamellers can do that sort of work.

someone local care to chime in? who can braze on a shifter boss for him?
pitty43 wrote:Thanks all for your help. Better change my Gumtree add now.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/retroclassiccycling/
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby sunho » Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:19 pm

I'm supposing i will need something like this brazed on?


ebaylink
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby BRLVR.v2 » Thu Oct 11, 2012 6:45 pm

sunho wrote:I'm supposing i will need something like this brazed on?


ebaylink

nah, like this.

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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby rkelsen » Thu Oct 11, 2012 8:11 pm

Of course, if you really want two downtube shifter bosses, there is a much easier way:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/HURET-31-8mm-One-Sided-Split-Band-Downtube-Shifters-Clamp-On-Bosses-Adapter-/130773294839

Personally, I'd just run a single chainring and avoid the hassle.
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby sunho » Thu Oct 11, 2012 8:46 pm

Yeah, I like the Huret.

My problem is I have this unquenchable bikelust at the moment. Is it just me?
Everytime I get my hands on something, I want the next NOS style bike.
Unbelieveable.
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby rkelsen » Thu Oct 11, 2012 9:06 pm

sunho wrote:Yeah, I like the Huret.

Certain frame manufacturers used to only braze on a r/h downtube boss on some models. These clips were designed to allow a 5 speed bike to be easily converted to 10 speed.
sunho wrote:My problem is I have this unquenchable bikelust at the moment. Is it just me?

Nope. :lol:
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby sunho » Fri Oct 12, 2012 12:02 am

rkelsen wrote:Personally, I'd just run a single chainring and avoid the hassle.


I'm still deliberating and weighing up the pros and cons of doing:

1. 2x10 speed crankset - nice veloce
Pros:
* can trade up frames and swap groupset onto it.

Cons:
* Have to braze on boss end or buy that clamp but I will need to check the width of the downtube.
* More time involved

2. Single Chain Ring
Pro:
* Easier to do

Con:
* What to source (groupset and config chainring, cassette size etc)
* What budget

Obviously a lot more that I need to think about...
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby grantw » Fri Oct 12, 2012 5:45 am

You haven't mentioned colour yet either :P
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby rkelsen » Fri Oct 12, 2012 10:34 am

You can easily convert any double chainring crank to a single, either using some of these or some of these or (irreversibly) with one of these.

So don't let that change your mind if you have your heart set on a particular crank.

Are you thinking of buying a Campagnolo Veloce group set? If you do, and you choose the 11-25 cassette and 53/39 crank, then you can remove the 53 tooth chainring and have a gear range of 41 to 93 inches (or 3.3 to 7.4m). Personally, I find a range like this to be fun and very usable. If you're not racing it, then you probably won't really need taller gearing than that. It's more than enough to get you into trouble, anyhow... Ask me... :(
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby elantra » Fri Oct 12, 2012 11:52 am

sunho wrote:
rkelsen wrote:Personally, I'd just run a single chainring and avoid the hassle.


I'm still deliberating and weighing up the pros and cons of doing:

1. 2x10 speed crankset - nice veloce
Pros:
* can trade up frames and swap groupset onto it.

Cons:
* Have to braze on boss end or buy that clamp but I will need to check the width of the downtube.
* More time involved

2. Single Chain Ring
Pro:
* Easier to do

Con:
* What to source (groupset and config chainring, cassette size etc)
* What budget

Obviously a lot more that I need to think about...

Go the single chainring !

Ultimately it can be done with less expenditure than double chainring.
Debatable but it also looks better.
Source stuff for sale from these and other forums.
More fun than just ordering a complete new ensemble from internet.

Just remember that with a single front chainring it should be between 39 to 44 teeth.
Not more or less.
And on the back anything will do, as long as the range is not less than 13 tooth to 25 tooth cogs, then 7 or 8 or 9 or 10 speeds should be workable.
A 12 tooth smallest cog would be best, and i prefer 7-speed or 9-speed.
"Technology gives us much more information but Education is never be able to give us the skill to evaluate it"
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby sunho » Fri Oct 12, 2012 11:29 pm

So yep, I've decided.
Single chain ring it is. As for down tube shifting.... Maybe maybe not. But 10 speed max should do the trick!


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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby munga » Sat Oct 13, 2012 6:53 am

..for all the effort you're going through, a braze-on will be worthwhile i reckon, especially if you decide to sell it.
why would anyone buy a nicely built, freshly painted bike that can only run a single chainring? you might find a buyer, but it's going to be a small demographic that isn't turned off by it.
pitty43 wrote:Thanks all for your help. Better change my Gumtree add now.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/retroclassiccycling/
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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby sunho » Sat Oct 13, 2012 3:24 pm

munga wrote:..for all the effort you're going through, a braze-on will be worthwhile i reckon, especially if you decide to sell it.
why would anyone buy a nicely built, freshly painted bike that can only run a single chainring? you might find a buyer, but it's going to be a small demographic that isn't turned off by it.


Yeah I know definitely could. But maybe that one sided boss clamp adapter may be alright. Brazing onto a frame, can I go to any brazer/welder for that?

I don't mind not selling the bike :-) first project, deserves a place on the wall!

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Re: Need advice/help/expert opinion on steel frame

Postby Crowz » Sat Oct 13, 2012 4:41 pm

sunho wrote:I don't mind not selling the bike :-) first project, deserves a place on the wall!


You may not be saying that when it's time for the bigger and better project #2!
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