Doping in C-grade ?

[Alex Simmons/RST]

for those interested:
http://wustl.academia.edu/AndrewRCoggan/CurriculumVitae" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

By the way, I just want to check something Winstonw.

Do you know what "e.g." means, as in the "e.g." that appears before the terms "Cat 3", and after the term "Good" in the power profiling tables?

[twizzle]

You have to start wondering about people here who have too much spare time.

[Alex Simmons/RST]

Brad McGee raced in B grade last Tuesday.

[The_Eggman]

No, you didn't say that exactly. However, you did say this:

[JustJames]

In other news:

Angels dancing on the head of a pin - how do they all fit?

[twizzle]

Brad McGee raced in B grade last Tuesday.

I bet I could have taken him, he's only a weekend warrior these days.


NOT.

[twizzle]

You know.... if I lose another 8Kg (given I've lost 15Kg this year), I become a Cat5/Cat4 sprinter, and drop solidly into the Cat1 range for 5 minute and FTP. Not shabby for a 43 yr old.

Damn, why didn't I take up real cycling when I was in my early 20's instead of my late 30's when I'd whacked on 43Kg of fat! (Currently I'm 33Kg lighter than I was in 2006).

[winstonw]

By the way, I just want to check something Winstonw.

Do you know what "e.g." means, as in the "e.g." that appears before the terms "Cat 3", and after the term "Good" in the power profiling tables?

Get off it Alex. Coggan never said his tables were "a waste of time" for predicting race category. Only you said that.
Give me your spin on what he means by 'success' in what I quoted above.

If Andy, as a cool headed scientist, thought the tables really were a waste of time, he wouldn't have created them. No credible scientist would genuinely set out to cloud and confound the truth, or produce something that was wrong more often than it was right....He obviously thought the tables with category overlays have value as "a guide", which is different to your take that they are a waste of time.

[Alex Simmons/RST]

By the way, I just want to check something Winstonw.

Do you know what "e.g." means, as in the "e.g." that appears before the terms "Cat 3", and after the term "Good" in the power profiling tables?

Get off it Alex. Coggan never said his tables were "a waste of time" for predicting race category. Only you said that.
Give me your spin on what he means by 'success' in what I quoted above.

If Andy, as a cool headed scientist, thought the tables really were a waste of time, he wouldn't have created them. No credible scientist would genuinely set out to cloud and confound the truth, or produce something that was wrong more often than it was right....He obviously thought the tables with category overlays have value as "a guide", which is different to your take that they are a waste of time.

Once again you introduce a strawman argument and misrepresent what others say. I'm not sure if it's a comprehension problem you have, or you just can't help yourself.

I never said the Power Profiling tables were a waste of time. They are a very helpful and useful guide to understanding one's individual power profile, which is precisely why they were created.

What I did say however was:

So once again, use of these tables to predict race category is a waste of time. Go race to find out what grade you are.

and I stand by that statement.

[Alex Simmons/RST]

Here is a direct quote from Dr Coggan from this post he made at Wattage forum on 6 January 2006, when he updated the tables from an earlier version.

Note that the link listed in the quote below has been superseded by that provided earlier in this thread.

The category guidelines associated with the power profiling tables, that is...version 4 is now posted at:

http://www.cyclingpeakssoftware.com/profile.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

(The examples still need to be updated, but hopefully that will be taken care of soon.)

BTW, note that in addition to resurrecting the bracketed terms, the women's functional threshold power column has changed. Also, allow me to remind everyone that the primary purpose of these tables is to help people assess their own personal relative strengths and weaknesses, not to determine what category they should or should not be (which is why the category terms are preceeded by "e.g." and why the brackets overlap). If you really want to know how you stack up against others, go race your bike and find out!!

This is the link to the post:
https://groups.google.com/d/topic/watta ... discussion" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

but you will need to be a wattage forum member to view it.

[toolonglegs]

Pretty much becoming as yawnful as the MHL one.

[ZepinAtor]

Pretty much becoming as yawnful as the MHL one.

Only 191 pages to catch up or yawn to the power of 4 million trillion.

Any more of this dribble & we'll have a ban on power data or the BPL thread (ban power laws)

[AndrewBurns]

Just to add some info, rode Heffron tonight in C-grade, hanging off the back being destroyed by the rubber band and was basically dropped at the end (finished about 50m back from the bunch). Average speed 39.8 kph.

[twizzle]

I rode Vets A grade tonight in Canb., 40.9kph average... word is that last week was 44.2kphr. I'm having to learn the corners all over again, the speed through collar-bone is insane. No power data... only have one working docking station, and it's at work.

[twizzle]

Pretty much becoming as yawnful as the MHL one.

Only 191 pages to catch up or yawn to the power of 4 million trillion.

Any more of this dribble & we'll have a ban on power data or the BPL thread (ban power laws)

Foe button...

[winstonw]

OK, BNA consensus is, using Andy's tables as a guide to race category is a waste of time, even though Andy never said this, and agreed to create the table as a category guide.

[toolonglegs]

Actually my consensus is I will take the word of someone who knows Coogan personally and professionally and has a pretty solid reputation for knowing his stuff inside and out.

[winstonw]

Actually my consensus is I will take the word of someone who knows Coogan personally and professionally and has a pretty solid reputation for knowing his stuff inside and out.

Personally, I avoid the cult of personality worship.... And believe Andy didn't intend to waste anyone's time.

[Marty Moose]

Interesting thread but you guys are feeding a Troll and his appetite is growing .......... Is there doping in C grade maybe there is Nice links to the dopers I enjoyed reading that.

MM

[winstonw]

Interesting thread but you guys are feeding a Troll and his appetite is growing
MM

Yes, that must be it. A nice simple explanation for nice simple minds.

[twizzle]

Interesting thread but you guys are feeding a Troll and his appetite is growing
MM

Yes, that must be it. A nice simple explanation for nice simple minds.

As opposed to over-analysing everything?


Sent from my iThingy...

[ft_critical]

Yes, that must be it. A nice simple explanation for nice simple minds.

Pop your reports in the Race Report thread and let us know how your theory evolves, won't you.

[ZepinAtor]

Pretty much becoming as yawnful as the MHL one.

Only 191 pages to catch up or yawn to the power of 4 million trillion.

Any more of this dribble & we'll have a ban on power data or the BPL thread (ban power laws)

Foe button...

Ouch !!

[toolonglegs]

Actually my consensus is I will take the word of someone who knows Coogan personally and professionally and has a pretty solid reputation for knowing his stuff inside and out.

Personally, I avoid the cult of personality worship.... And believe Andy didn't intend to waste anyone's time.

Why don't you just ask in him in the forums he is regularly on, or just email him and get him to comment on this thread... pretty sure he probably would.
Then we can see where an Australian C grade Vets for example fits on a chart that relates to US Cats... from what I understand Cat1 on that Chart would be roughly equal to a National Open level in Oz. Cat 3 would be equal to an average Australian A - B club grade somewhere there abouts. C grade club would be somewhere in the Cat 4 - 5 area... but depends where you race, who & how many turns up, if it is flat or hilly etc etc.Yes I can see how comparing more power numbers to that chart can tell me so much about who I will be racing and how I will do.
Bollocks.

[Alex Simmons/RST]

OK, BNA consensus is, using Andy's tables as a guide to race category is a waste of time, even though Andy never said this, and agreed to create the table as a category guide.

Andy never intended/agreed to create the table as a category guide. But you do so love your strawmen. Is this the only logical fallacy in your armoury, or do you have some others?