Questions about purchasing bicycles and parts
I love Vittoria Rubino's, in 25 and 28mm. Lots of km's and pretty reliable.
Of late I've been looking at getting some race tyres and can't decide between some GP4000s, Pro 4 SC or Veloflex Corsa/Master. I'm going to run Michelin latex tubes and I'm attracted to Veloflex tyres for their tubular like construction. I know the Conti's have a lot of fans and few haters. I want to hear from anybody who has first hand experience with all of these tyres?
I'll go on a tangent to your initial tyre selections and suggest the sweetest clincher ride I had was with Michelin Latex tubes matched to 25mm Schwalbe Ultremo ZX tyres - felt like floating over the road and the seat of the pants feeling was faster than butyl tubes inside the same tyres.
"Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana" - Groucho Marx
I'm in training.........for middle age.........
I like where OR is coming from.
I have ZX's on my race bike and they are just soooo nice to ride on.
The only tyre I have tried that is better to ride/race on is the Vittoria Evo Corsa CX, beautiful tyres, grip, they roll amazingly but they cut so easily and are puncture prone.
GP4000S are great tyres but the Ultremo ZX and the Evo Corsa are MUCH better race tyres. Out of all the tyre mentioned on this thread the only ones I have not tried are the Michelin Pro 4's. The local lbs owner and I ride regularly and he loves Michelin and I love the Schwalbe Ultremo's and both refuse to cross to the dark side and try the other....
IMO GP4000S are the best of the alrounders but there are better training tyres and there are better race tyres. It really depends on what you are looking for.
Oops sorry not tried the veloflex
I've had the GP4000s and now I'm using the Ultremo ZX in 23 and 25mm. For me they are more comfortable. The GP4000s 23mm at the same pressure felt a bit dead? compared to the Ultremo 23mm. I now use Schwalbe on all my bikes
I have thought about the schwalbes, but I have heard they cut up easily.
have not used, WILL NOT use Michelin tyres on my bikes, sorry.
GP4000s are about the best all round road tyre in terms of price, weight, wear, grip etc, not in any order. They're just an excellent tyre.
I use a bunch of Veloflex Pave, Master, Corsa, have not yet bought the 23c. I would use them as a race tyre above all other, their road handling is superb, puncture protection is pretty good, but they're light and responsive, and wear quite well. They can be had for about $50 per tyre if you look around.
Any particular reason?
I'm running Michelin Pro 3 Race Service Course presently and they seem pretty good.
2012 Jim Bundy
1995 Bosevski - Athena
Not tried the Veloflex but the Michelin PR3s ride and handle better than the GP4000s. However I use the GP4000S because the PR3s are too fragile for everyday riding on sketchy roads - too many flats. Not mention they wear out fast.
The GP4000S are not the best tyre, but they're the best balance of ride and handling with durability and reasonable puncture resistance.
I'm looking at the 23mm tyres. They can be had from Ribble for $41 plus shipping, free shipping if you buy enough stuff.
How do you find them on course chip bitumen? That's what I'll be riding along to get to the crits. Do they cut up easily?
One very good reason. They cut to ribbons in an unacceptably short time, even on what seem to be perfect roads. That's PR, PR2 and PR3. Never again. I thought once they came out of the box pre-slashed with some clever disguise so I didn't notice until I got 1km down the road. Now I'm certain that if the next door neighbour is slicing cheese the tyres will miraculously suffer. They're diabolical.
SSC - I really like the feel of Veloflex, they are the most supple tyres I've ever used. Not soft or smooth.... Michelin PR3 are smooth for as long as they retain air, but the Veloflex have a really wonderfully supple casing which makes roadfeedback excellent IMO. Even the 22c made chip seal no particular problem. As to longevity, I seem to have remarkable luck with them and commonly would expect a rear tyre to last >4000km, small nicks not a problem, I've even ridden them on gravel roads, but it is fair to say they're not the best in puncture protection - they're too light a carcass, but IIRC they claim a kevlar belt to help with protection. Their grip is also assured and certain, even in rain.
For harder wearing 'training tyres' it's hard to go past Vittoria Rubino Pro's, which just keep on keeping on. A word of caution, Rubino's can be lethal in the rain, they seem to reach a point at which they just come unstuck from the road really badly. Bad results. I've never had that with Veloflex.
I think that is somewhat dependant on the rider weight and the pressure you run. I'm 68kg and have had no problem with Ultremo's - but a guy in my club is about 85kg and he had heaps of cuts/punctures on them.
If you run the tyres too hard they'll cut and puncture a lot more easily since there is less give in the tyre. If you run enough pressure that you arn't getting pinch flats you should find a happy medium.
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In my case, I'm currently trying a new tire each time I replace them as I was fed up with the cuts particularly in the sidewall of Continental GP4000s.
Another contender is Vredestien Fortezza Tricomp which I found to be a good performing tire but also subject to cuts.
Vittoria Rubino Pro are waiting for the next change over, as are Scwalbe Durano.
2012 Jim Bundy
1995 Bosevski - Athena
My experience is that the Ultremo ZX & R.1 is that the rubber dries up quickly the way i use them. Maybe last me 6months before cracking appears.
I race on them mainly in the summer (crits and indorr+outdoor track) so the bike+tyres are left in direct sunlight on the 40 degree days while i prepare for the race.
That said they offer excellent!! cornering feel and grip with the Michelin latex tubes i ran with them.
Lots of people make the mistake of thinking that matters. Sure, they do get lots of little cuts but that in no way affects the performance or flat resistance. You just have to ignore the cuts.
Having said that, I'm the first to admit they are a bit fragile for a multi-purpose tyre and they do wear out quickly. They have "Race" in the name for a reason! Every six months or so I get sick of my GP4000S and put the PR3 's back on - puts a smile on my face. A few weeks and a few punctures later and the GP4000S set go back on again.
I've commuted a few times and ridden a few long club rides on my Schwalbe Ultremo ZX's (23 front and 25 rear). I'm 65kg and run them both around 95psi, I don't get any pinch flats and so far I haven't had any punctures or cuts. I'm a bit surprised because I expected them to be fragile but they appear to be holding up quite well to less than ideal surfaces and they feel quite nice to ride on.
I am reading the forums and still looking for the tyre/tire of choice...
Had GP4000s for a long time, worked well,
but a huge gash on the back tyre after only 2000km of use, meant that there is something wrong.
I was considering:
- Michelin PR3 or PR4
- Diamante Pro
- Rubino Pro 3s
and of course replacing those with GP's
I see everywhere on the forums a hige support for GP's and it makes sense,
those were good tyres for me, just one puncture in the front after about 1000,
but am always looking for better,
(all rounders, some crit racing, climbing, mostly good roads with some bad tarmac, but no dirt)
I am still with the 4000s, even though it failed me (the side-wall gash was reported several times)
but what better can I expect?
I tried Rubino Pro's and had some bad luck.. 2 punctures in 2 weeks but have had better luck with another set.
GP's are arriving this week so I will put them on my training/race set and see how they go, should avg around 150-190km a week on them
I have been using Veloflex Master 23 for a few months and they seem great. No punctures as yet. Road feel is great, and i like the look of the gumwall sides. Too early to comment on wear rates.
I'm am just wondering how many people age their tyres? I have noticed that I seem to get fewer punctures on tyres that have been lightly used and sat around for 6-12 months. I read somewhere that aging tyres used to be the go in the dim dark past but does it apply to modern tyres with their modern compounds.
I think aging matters with tubulars if they have a latex tube
I have ridden with Rubino Pro 3 and they lasted me 6000km, It is a very rigid/hard compound tyre so chunks of rubber do come off and leave holes. I have also had bad experiences with the tyre in wet weather.
I've had no issues with the Rubino Pro in the wet, the problems I find are they are very puncture resistant until they wear down to a certain level, about the 3000km mark at the back, 5000km at the front, then it becomes a puncture fest, I've had 10 punctures in the last month. I'm about to order some Durano's, meant to have the Raceguard protection belt to help prevent punctures, using them for training only though.
I'm currently riding on Schwalbe Durano S tyres. I'm 85kg and they have been brilliant for my non race riding. 120psi front and back.
So far they seem the best all rounder but not sure how they race? Anyone race with these?
Alright, the Michelin Pro Service 3 turned south pretty quickly after my last post.
They were cut up pretty bad and punctures came thick and fast.
Next up was Vittoria Rubino Pro which gave the impression of being impervious to my puncture magnetism
Until the sidewall failed on the front and it went off like a rifle shot as I coasted into the lights.
Currently trying Schwalbe Durano Plus which I'm liking a lot, however we're still in the grace period when you shouldn't be getting punctures anyway - we'll see in a 1000km or so. Very smooth ride quality.
Also trying out Veloflex Master 23's on the other bike. They're mainly for show and I'm not confident in their abilities as they're the lightest tyre I've ever used. Beautiful ride on these.
2012 Jim Bundy
1995 Bosevski - Athena
I admit Peter, I had a nasty gash on the side wall of the GP4000s after about 4k of riding and the changes one to new wheels,
I wanted something different, I tried Michelin Pro 3, but it did no good with a relatively quick flat.
After some more research went back to GP4000s... just a matter of habit I guess...
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