PED's for older cyclists

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warthog1
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PED's for older cyclists

Postby warthog1 » Mon Nov 12, 2012 10:23 pm

Found this study recently, and thought it worth a read. Pretty extravagant results, though it was only a small trial. Based around improving blood supply to the muscles was my uneducated take on it.

Human exercise capacity declines with advancing age. These changes often result in loss of physical fitness and more rapid senescence. Nitric oxide (NO) has been implicated in improvement of exercise capacity through vascular smooth muscle relaxation in both coronary and skeletal muscle arteries, as well as via independent mechanisms. Antioxidants may prevent nitric oxide inactivation by oxygen free radicals. The purpose of this study was to investigate the effects of an L-arginine and antioxidant supplement on exercise performance in elderly male cyclists.

There was no difference between baseline exercise parameters. In the supplemented group, anaerobic threshold increased by 16.7% :o (2.38 ± 0.18 L/min, p < 0.01) at week 1, and the effect was sustained by week 3 with a 14.2% (2.33 ± 0.44 L/min, p < 0.01). In the control group, there was no change in anaerobic threshold at weeks 1 and 3 compared to baseline (1.88 ± 0.20 L/min at week 1, and 1.86 ± 0.21 L/min at week 3). The anaerobic threshold for the supplement groups was significantly higher than that of placebo group at week 1 and week 3.

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twizzle
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Re: PED's for older cyclists

Postby twizzle » Wed Nov 14, 2012 3:42 pm

Baked Beetroot. "Viiiiiiiagra".
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Re: PED's for older cyclists

Postby flow.rider » Wed Nov 14, 2012 6:51 pm

twizzle wrote:Baked Beetroot. "Viiiiiiiagra".

Seriously? I only opened this thread to make that joke..

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Re: PED's for older cyclists

Postby twizzle » Wed Nov 14, 2012 6:54 pm

flow.rider wrote:
twizzle wrote:Baked Beetroot. "Viiiiiiiagra".

Seriously? I only opened this thread to make that joke..

Very much so.


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Re: PED's for older cyclists

Postby Nobody » Wed Nov 14, 2012 7:45 pm

If I really want to dope up for the CCR, then it's coffee, dark chocolate and some beetroot. At Warthog's (and my) age, you need all the help you can get. :oops: :lol:

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warthog1
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Re: PED's for older cyclists

Postby warthog1 » Wed Nov 14, 2012 8:45 pm

I read it in a bicycle mag that was lying about at work. The article is a couple of years old.
I thought it interesting, in that is it doping, or is it not, my thoughts are that if it gives you an artificial edge over the competition then yes it is.
Wondering what others think?

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Re: PED's for older cyclists

Postby Nobody » Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:02 pm

So do sports drinks, but they are allowed in various forms of competition.
I believe you also need di hydrogen monoxide if you want to be at your best. :wink:
If it's not illegal in racing and it's not harmful to your health, then it's not doping. But it's easy to take the other side too. If you are concerned about having an unfair advantage, stop racing on the the S5. :P

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Re: PED's for older cyclists

Postby warthog1 » Wed Nov 14, 2012 9:43 pm

Bugger it, I'm going to snort a couple lines of it before the next race then. :)

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Re: PED's for older cyclists

Postby wombatK » Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:48 pm

Worth a counter-balance The Dubious Promotion of Herbalife's Niteworks. While this predates the latest "study", it's very revealing about the ethics, or lack thereof, of the principals promoting the product.

The study is very small scale - just 16 subjects are recruited and studied for a paltry 3 weeks. That's not a number you could draw any serious statistically valid conclusions - at best it might warrant a larger trial being undertaken, at worst it could all be fudged or purely due to chance.

To the extent that drugs are products intended for cure, mitigation, treatment, or prevention of disease that have been put through proper drug approval processes, Niteworks doesn't cut the mustard.

But hey, if you've got the money and really want to give it a crack, it'll only cost you $US90 a month.

As protection against a placebo effect, send me the $US90 a month, and some months I'll send you sugar-pills and others I'll send you the real mc-coy (chosen at random). You keep a journal of your performances (maybe on strava, but hidden from me). Maybe after we've done this for 6 to 12 months, an third (independent) person can get the results and my selections, and tell you if it made any difference.

Suspect it's dirt cheap compared to EPO, but if it really was that good, why wasn't Lance and his mates on it too?



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Alex Simmons/RST
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Re: PED's for older cyclists

Postby Alex Simmons/RST » Thu Nov 15, 2012 8:27 am

warthog1 wrote:I read it in a bicycle mag that was lying about at work. The article is a couple of years old.
I thought it interesting, in that is it doping, or is it not, my thoughts are that if it gives you an artificial edge over the competition then yes it is.
Wondering what others think?

In the context of the sport of cycling, doping is defined for us by WADA. If you start to apply your own definition, then the discussion becomes quite tricky.

Performance enhancing and doping are not the same thing. Here's a simplistic way of thinking about it:

Image

There are other considerations, such as whether a substance or method is illegal, or ethical to administer, but these are not factors considered with respect to whether something is considered doping. They are separate considerations.

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Alex Simmons/RST
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Re: PED's for older cyclists

Postby Alex Simmons/RST » Thu Nov 15, 2012 8:30 am

As for nitrates, there is sufficient indications for it to be considered worthwhile for additional study as an aid to performance (be it for the elderly or in cycling).

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Re: PED's for older cyclists

Postby Alex Simmons/RST » Thu Nov 15, 2012 8:34 am

wombatK wrote:Worth a counter-balance The Dubious Promotion of Herbalife's Niteworks. While this predates the latest "study", it's very revealing about the ethics, or lack thereof, of the principals promoting the product.

Note the policy of the AIS with regard to network marketing companies and supplements:
http://www.ausport.gov.au/__data/assets ... panies.pdf

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warthog1
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Re: PED's for older cyclists

Postby warthog1 » Thu Nov 15, 2012 10:21 am

wombatK wrote:
The study is very small scale - just 16 subjects are recruited and studied for a paltry 3 weeks. That's not a number you could draw any serious statistically valid conclusions - at best it might warrant a larger trial being undertaken, at worst it could all be fudged or purely due to chance.




Cheers


Aware of that yes, which is why I said the results were extravagant.
The herbalife product naming made it a bit suss also.
There is at least some defined mechanism by which it could work and maybe a bigger study is warranted. Don't know who is going to be interested in funding that without a financial incentive to be gained by a positive result though.

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warthog1
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Re: PED's for older cyclists

Postby warthog1 » Thu Nov 15, 2012 10:40 am

Alex Simmons/RST wrote:As for nitrates, there is sufficient indications for it to be considered worthwhile for additional study as an aid to performance (be it for the elderly or in cycling).


The mechanism via which beetroot is supposed to work also

Alex Simmons/RST wrote:Note the policy of the AIS with regard to network marketing companies and supplements:


Maybe I'll just stick to a vege garden full of beetroot then :)
or train a bit more :lol:

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twizzle
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Re: PED's for older cyclists

Postby twizzle » Thu Nov 15, 2012 11:54 am

From memory, the beetroot studies showed about a 10% increase in threshold. Bugger to prepare though, needs to be roasted not boiled otherwise the nitrates escape, or juiced.

No - I don't eat it for performance benefits, I just like beetroot.
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