human909 wrote:
1. Registration and accountability has nothing to do with buying access to the use of roads.
2. I'll let you in on another secret. Pedestrians crossing against the red man can't be identified either!
3. Recourse for what? Going against a red light? Road users don't have "recourse" on this anyway!
4. How? Who are these bad eggs? How reducing the number of cyclists going through empty intersection with red light affect cyclist being killed due to motorist inattention and lack of care?
5. Why do you have a desire to see cyclists charge with traffic offences? Do you somehow think this is going to make things safer?
perhaps because I'm new to cycling i'm not so entrenched in this "all cyclists are completely pure and obey road rules" mindset - I know that they don't.
1. you'll note that I said nothing about "buying" access to the road. so it's a poor start to a post when you didn't comprehend the central point of my proposal.
2. who are pedestrians hurting when they cross the road on a red light? they're the bottom of the road user food chain. we might be smaller than a car, but we can still hurt a pedestrian if we run into them. what you're essentially saying is that, while we moan about inconsiderate drivers, and expect them to be hit with the full force of the law if they interfere with us in our space - a cyclist who does the same thing to a pedestrian shouldn't be identified, fined, or punished. do you not see how hypocritical that makes you?
3. recourse for breaking road rules! if a driver goes through a red light they'll eventually get caught by a camera. for other things they're
identifiable (which is the whole point of the suggestion) by number plate. if i'm riding on a pedestrian footpath when there's a bike lane on the other side of the nature strip and i hit someone before riding off, why shouldn't a witness be able to identify me? unfortunately for my victim, "giant guy on a Giant bike" describes about 5000 riders in Canberra.
4. you're focussing on one example of rule breaking behaviour. do you really believe that there aren't cyclists out there who give the rest of us a bad name? of course they do! i'll give you one this morning - main road in canberra, bike lane on the side of the road that the bus has to pull into. the rule, as it was explained to me by the guy at the bike shop a couple of weeks ago, is to wait behind the bus. instead, many riders, including one this morning, will swing out from behind the bus onto the road, without looking, causing cars to have to swerve around them into another lane without having time to check if there's anything in that lane. i see this nearly every day.
can't you understand that this makes the rest of us look bad?
5. if a driver breaks the law, I expect them to be fined. it should be no different for other road users. but in any case, i didn't say anything about wanting to see people fined - once again, if you'd bothered to read my post, I want cyclists to be identifiable - for safety reasons as much as anything else.
and i fully expect that if drivers can see a rego plate with possible recourse to report law-breaking behaviour, perhaps instead of screaming abuse or practicing road rage, they'll stop to consider how serious it was, whether they should be getting plate details. perhaps it will educate some of the pinheads who think we're doing the wrong thing by riding two-abreast when they ring the police and are told "that's perfectly legal." (to the person posting pictures - as I said, I don't have all the answers. i don't know how you would put it on on the back of a bike)
anyway, perhaps i will put my head down and back out of this forum altogether. i'm clearly only ever going to be a bike rider. from what I've experienced so far on the roads and on this forum, i don't ever want to be a "cyclist" - too many of them are hypocritical, arrogant douchebags.
my first weekend riding after getting my bike, i was riding along, minding my own business, and having a friggen ball. was absolutely loving it. i must've looked ridiculous riding along with this stupid big grin on my face. (and my friends would tell you that I'm a particularly bubbly personality) what i didn't look like was a cyclist - i was wearing cheap lightweight "athletic shorts", an American football jersey, an old pair of sneakers and a pair of service station sunglasses.
a couple of cyclists, with proper road bikes (i ride a hybrid) and lycra and a lot more speed and experience than me came up behind me. instead of going around me, they started following me (I promise you I wasn't going fast enough for anyone to be slipstreaming off me)
they didn't go around me, so i was expecting that they were going to say hello. (perhaps I was being naive because of the insane amount of fun that i was having)
but they didn't say hello. they started ragging on me for being slow ("hurry up porky" is so mature) and then continued to rag on me as they over took me ("how the f did YOU get a bike to hold you?!"). for someone who had owned his bike for 3 days, it was about the most horrible experience that I could've imagined at that particular point in time. i'd had my bike 3 days, it took me another 3 days to want to go and ride on the road again. and it hasn't been as fun as it was in the first 3 days.
it's upsetting to even recount it. it upset me because they maliciously took my fun for no reason. it upset me because i spent a lot of money that i didn't really have for that fun. and it particularly upset me because i spent all that money hoping that this was a community that i might be able to get involved in, and my first experience with that community was awful.
but i hoped that these guys were the arrogant ones who are probably the 'bad eggs' that i refer to on the road. i had hoped that not all 'cyclists' were like that - which is why i joined this forum. i wanted to meet the friendly cycling community.
but from the responses I've received so far for daring to offer an opinion and ask a question, most of you are the same hypocritical, arrogant douchebags that wrecked my first week in my new hobby.
you aren't better than me just because you can ride fast. your world might revolve around your bike, but mine doesn't. to me it's just fun. or at least it was for the first 3 days.
"cycling" really is a culture isn't it?
but it's not a culture i want to be a part of if it means having to be a prick to new riders and become so closed minded that I forget how some cyclists behave. i never want to become one of you who thinks that cyclists can't ever do anything wrong, and who thinks that all vitriol directed at riders in unwarranted. like drivers, cyclists sometimes do stupid things. i don't ever want to become so arrogant that i forget that.
in my experience over the last 2 weeks, you people (cyclists, both on the road and on this forum) are a very unwelcoming people. you espouse the virtues of cycling as though it makes you better than drivers, you say that everyone should be doing it - but you don't want them doing it. they're cutting in on your niche. they're cutting in your culture. you don't want your sport becoming mainstream at all because then it would be less obvious that you're a "cyclist" when you're wearing your matching lycra at the coffee shop.
anyway, that's the end of my rant/sook. thanks for confirming that too many cyclists are
exactly like those pricks, and if riding a bike is to be fun, it will be in spite of you.
i'll check in again in a couple of days though - just cos i'm hoping that if anyone is aware of an online community of friendly, non-patronising, welcoming
bike riders (as opposed to 'cyclists'), please let me know.
fwiw, thanks to you for sharing kb. you're the first rider i've ever known to get a fine!