Living with a velomobile

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Baalzamon » Thu Dec 27, 2012 2:46 pm

But a trike is a bike would have been my argument as well. It is a HPV just as is a bike and a trike comes under legislation for bikes as well
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by BNA » Thu Dec 27, 2012 3:27 pm

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby mozart » Thu Dec 27, 2012 3:27 pm

Aushiker wrote:
mozart wrote:I just been talking to K & N , the reason that I have to pay duty because it is not a two wheels bicycle, velomobile goes under a three wheels tricycle there duty on velomobile :(


Interesting response. Do you by chance have the HS Commodity Code (required for determining the duty and for importation) or the duty code that they are using to determine what duty applies to a tricycle. They should supply this to justify the duty payable notice anyway.

The reason I ask is there does not appear to be a HS commodity code for tricycles, except for those for children aged up to three years old; well according to the Duty Code Calculator. I don't currently have Excel installed so cannot check the ABS code listing.

BTW if the Duty Calculator is correct, import duty of 5% is actually payable on bicycles so it may be a mute point anyway. It appears that the concession has expired.

Andrew


The person I spoke too at K & N, said they went to Sinners website check what was Mango tour was. NO I haven't got HS Commodity code I don't think that I go to win with them this some paper work that has sinner mango velomobile
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Aushiker » Thu Dec 27, 2012 4:50 pm

mozart wrote:The person I spoke too at K & N, said they went to Sinners website check what was Mango tour was. NO I haven't got HS Commodity code I don't think that I go to win with them this some paper work that has sinner mango velomobile


Looking at the document they have used

8712.00.00 BICYCLES AND OTHER CYCLES (INCLUDING DELIVERY TRICYCLES), NOT MOTORISED 5%
52 No Wheel diameter 508 mm or less and frame seat tube length 335 mm or less
53 No Other

or more specially 8712.00.00 53. The question is then is 8712.00.00 53 subject to a concession. According to http://www.customs.gov.au/webdata/resou ... _90_00.pdf there is or was a concession for that tariff code, well for 8712.00.00 at least. The relevant reference is TC 0104891

8712.00.00 BICYCLES
Op. 18.06.2001 Dec. 31.08.2001 - TC 0104891

However it seems from http://www.customs.gov.au/webdata/resou ... 030423.pdf that the concession was revoked on April 23, 2003 so unless it has been restated it looks like paying the 5% is correct. I haven't bothered searching further.

Anyway you could apply for a refund of the duty. Documents/instructions at http://www.customs.gov.au/site/page5939.asp . Nothing to lose other than the time spent filling out the form. Might get a win. Have heard of others doing so.

Looks like time to apply for a new concession. Can be done by anyone at http://www.customs.gov.au/tariff/gazette.asp by the looks. Trisled is the only manufacturer in Australia of velomobiles; is that correct?

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Roinik » Thu Dec 27, 2012 9:58 pm

Trisled are the only Australian manufacturer of velos. Greenspeed did try to make the Glyde, however it was more expensive than they'd expected and they didn't persist with bringing down the cost. It's a pity as it could have been an Australian success with the full suspension and sleek design. It's only downside is that it could have done with a few less kg. I'd have to check, however if I recall correctly the Glyde still retained a frame rather than going monocoque. I don't know whether Trisled are selling very many RVs in Australia. Maybe Pete has more of a handle on the number of sales. I'm not sure whether a: the majority of Australia is ready for the velomobile or b: whether the RV is being promoted enough. The main issue I see is that there aren't enough places to ride them if you're in a capital city like 95% of the population. The other 5% are in an area that is suitable except that their affordability is questionable. I may be wrong, but marketing is a big thing in Australian business and it is the vehicle crowd that has the money and the influence. Why else would Perth, Sydney, Adelaide and Brisbane get rid of their tram network (ok Perth, Brisbane and Sydney don't have the road space and this is off topic). Heck, we don't even have a recumbent bicycle shop in each Australian capital city!

Most Australia states have signed up to the Federal Government's target to double the number of regular cyclists by 2020. I don't see that enough is being done to give people the safety and freedom to meet this target. I'm one of the few companies where 20% (yes, you've read correctly) of head office ride to work during summer. This slides to 15% during winter due to the fair weather riders dropping out. Our bike park in the main building is often overflowing at 120 bicycles in summer. We now have access to an extra bicycle park with 65 spaces in another 11 story building (3 stories tennanted atm). The best thing is that this other building has space for 1. bents and 2. a couple of velos!!!! A mate of mine makes use of the space for his cargo.

I know that I've been looking (nee brushing over) at a job relocation to a rural area just so I can have an excuse to get myself a velo and ride further to work. I just can't bring myself to be one of those DF riders that feel like they must dress up in their tight clothing and go into the hills to prove that they can do it. The boss won't give up her life hear unless we move somewhere else. Anyone got a use for an experienced Chemical Engineer?
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Baalzamon » Fri Dec 28, 2012 11:55 am

And here we have
KonaCommuter trying to overtake 2 mango's
[/quote]
Now care to guess which 2 brisbane mango's these are. One has Da Hood so narrows it down quite a bit.
Is there opposing video footage :)
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Phil » Fri Dec 28, 2012 12:28 pm

Haha nice find.

Gotta say you Qlders are spoilt. Thats better that any PSP in Perth by far.

Not sure how comfortable a velo would be in 42 degrees - lolz my best commute last summer was 45 degrees on the path.
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Aushiker » Fri Dec 28, 2012 12:41 pm

Baalzamon wrote:Now care to guess which 2 brisbane mango's these are. One has Da Hood so narrows it down quite a bit.
Is there opposing video footage :)


Pretty sure that was Paul in the red cap.

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Aushiker » Fri Dec 28, 2012 12:49 pm

Phil wrote:Not sure how comfortable a velo would be in 42 degrees - lolz my best commute last summer was 45 degrees on the path.

Averaged 35 C on this mornings ride. Peaked at 46 C on the bike. I wonder if the velo might actually be a bit cooler as there is less exposure to reflective heat.

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Rhubarb » Fri Dec 28, 2012 3:08 pm

Baalzamon wrote:Now care to guess which 2 brisbane mango's these are. One has Da Hood so narrows it down quite a bit.


Unless the single hoodless velomobile owner in Brisbane is currently loaning a hood for a trial ....
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Baalzamon » Fri Dec 28, 2012 3:20 pm

Well the way it took off after cruising does point fingers to well developed recumbent legs
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Rhubarb » Fri Dec 28, 2012 4:01 pm

Aushiker wrote:
Phil wrote:Not sure how comfortable a velo would be in 42 degrees - lolz my best commute last summer was 45 degrees on the path.

Averaged 35 C on this mornings ride. Peaked at 46 C on the bike. I wonder if the velo might actually be a bit cooler as there is less exposure to reflective heat.

Andrew


It's a good question ..... with a complicated answer - It very much depends on the situation. In my experience (3000kms (mostly commuting) in Brisbane from July to Dec) I don't find the velo any hotter than riding a normal bike. That said, some times it is steamier, but sometimes it is also much cooler.

I do find I heat up on the steep slow climbs, although without the hood, this is not an issue. It is very steamy inside the hood when there is virtually no airflow. I find you need to be doing about 12km/hr in still air before the hood is sufficiently vented. Over that - no problems. This assumes a high humidity environment though which is the norm for Brisbane. On the return journey of the Brisbane to Gold Coast ride it got to 37 deg Celsius but it was a dry heat and quite a windy day. The sun was absolutely baking that day. In the velomobile with the hood on, I was surprisingly really cool. The shell and hood protected me from the sun and maybe radiant road heat, and even when I wasn't moving, the outside wind would find its way up the footholes and create sufficient ventilation to vent the heat out the hood. It was actually amazingly cool, particularly as you passed DF bike riders who were simply frying in the heat of the sun.

The vizer of the hood allows you to control airflow through the hood. In the winter it also enables you to close the viser shut and keep warm.

So when moving at a reasonable pace (>12 km/hr) there is no issue with hood. Without the hood, I don't really think there is any issue with heat although you may find you get sweatier. In many other situations, the sun protection and aerodynamic advantage will mean you are much cooler in the velo.
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Aushiker » Fri Dec 28, 2012 5:21 pm

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby il padrone » Fri Dec 28, 2012 5:33 pm

Baalzamon wrote:And here we have
KonaCommuter trying to overtake 2 mango's

PWND indeed !!

:twisted:
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Aushiker » Fri Dec 28, 2012 5:57 pm

Thanks Ruburb. Great information.

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby John Lewis » Fri Dec 28, 2012 10:32 pm

Rhubarb wrote:
Baalzamon wrote:Now care to guess which 2 brisbane mango's these are. One has Da Hood so narrows it down quite a bit.


Unless the single hoodless velomobile owner in Brisbane is currently loaning a hood for a trial ....


You'll never get it back. :mrgreen:

Methinks Terry has it. Of course I have inside information. I think he was getting a bit steamy.

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Riggsbie » Sat Dec 29, 2012 7:51 pm

Another Mango ride today (part of the Strava Festive 500).....it was really windy 30 - 40 kph southerlies......the race hood was trying to take off a couple of times.....

Anyone with a race hood - check the visor lock nuts....one came loose today, maybe it's just the roads being too smooth in Victoria ;-)

Good speed even with strong winds......got another KOM today :-)

The Mango is brilliant in strong winds, the head winds only knock off a couple of kph, on my DF I slow down by around 10 kph in a strong headwind.....

And finished the festive 500 !!


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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby mozart » Sat Dec 29, 2012 9:03 pm

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby recumbenteer » Sat Dec 29, 2012 9:25 pm

mozart wrote:Rotovelo Carbon


http://youtu.be/oSqoKFytnw4




........Oh Yeh, baby!! mmmmmm :mrgreen:
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby John Lewis » Sat Dec 29, 2012 9:50 pm

Good one Paul.
Great to see you managed it without any drama.
Don't think I'll be trying it any time soon . Well done.
Does your hood have the rubber or the plastic washers? Mine are rubber and when you put the hood right down it springs open a bit when you let it go. I think Harry replaced them with nylon washers in a later version as I recall.
I only rode to the shop and back today. About 6km. My downhill speed was down. Checked when I got home and the deraileur wasn't going to the 11 tooth. Only time I get any speed is downhill. My rolling average today was I think 14 kmh.

Mmm! That Rotovelo looks nice. I wonder if its a one off and whether it has suspension.

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Riggsbie » Sat Dec 29, 2012 10:16 pm

Hey John....

My hood has the black rubber washers.....my visor is pretty stiff and I use a Velcro strap to keep it in the fully down position but to be honest I rarely have it in that position for long usually just when trying to go really fast ;-)

Back to the RV, not sure I see the point of it unless it comes with suspension.....I wonder what the weight saving is of carbon versus roto-molded plastic and what the extra cost is ?

Wonder if it is still a body on a frame or whether it's a full monocoque like a Mango ?

Hmmmm.......


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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Aushiker » Sat Dec 29, 2012 11:18 pm

Riggsbie wrote:Back to the RV, not sure I see the point of it unless it comes with suspension.....I wonder what the weight saving is of carbon versus roto-molded plastic and what the extra cost is ?


No mention of suspension. 13 kg lighter than the roto-moulded plastic version. Oh has a starting price of $9,995 putting it right up in Mango country.

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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Roinik » Sun Dec 30, 2012 1:27 am

13 kg lighter puts it at around 20kg. It still retains the crucifix frame with bolt on (now carbon/kevlar) body. I understand from earlier posts that suspension is not an option. Bit of a fizzer really. It's only when you place it up against the RAW or the Milan that it seems cheaper. Against the Quest or the Mango it is a no brainer for value. You might as well place a Holden/Ford up against a BMW M3 CSL or Merc AMG in that sort of analogy.

I don't expect to see high volumes of these being sold (hence 'limited release') unless the price can come down by a few $k through mass production techniques. As much as the boys at Trisled don't want to admit it, they may be forced to go to the welding machine and Quickstep machine to get the costs down. They could also make the RV out of fibreglass using the same process and leveraging off the CSIRO Quickstep machine. Utilising these technologies should be able to produce a RV at around the current normal sale price. That would be more revolutionary (and some sort of suspension rather than relying on Schwalbe Big Apple tyres).

The paint job looks good though.
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Rhubarb » Sun Dec 30, 2012 2:20 pm

Yeah - Interesting development. 19.5kgs is certainly an impressive weight. When you pay $10k though you probably expect suspension and a few of the other touches eg Lights, indicators, horn, USB power outlets etc like you get on a mango. That's before you start with enclosed drivetrain etc.

We shouldn't be too critical though. I actually think its great to see Rotovelo continuing to develop their product. I think weight was a bit of an issue for them (although not massively at a lower price point). They have already announced they are working on a suspension model, and now have proven they can get the weight down. It will be interesting to see what they put out over the next few years.

Personally, I am very happy with my mango and can't see me changing for many years, but I really wish Trisled all the best with their upcoming developments. I will no doubt be wanting to buy another velomobile at some stage down the track and would love for that to be a Trisled.
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Roinik » Mon Dec 31, 2012 7:56 pm

Aushiker wrote:Anyway you could apply for a refund of the duty. Documents/instructions at http://www.customs.gov.au/site/page5939.asp . Nothing to lose other than the time spent filling out the form. Might get a win. Have heard of others doing so.
Andrew


Does a 2nd hand import attract the duty and GST or does this only apply to new?
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Re: Living with a velomobile

Postby Rhubarb » Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:59 am

Here's a couple of videos you may find interesting.

These were taken from a large euro velomobile ride in The Netherlands where 157 velos took part. Here's the carpark walkaround: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... onm9M1Jjzo

Check out the duo quest (actually trio or maybe even quattro if you count the trailer), the shark, the lady bird, nemo (can you find it) etc.

And here's some ride footage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... GkULyzFKO0

This guy rides a quest but it is fitted with the Sinner Bikes hood, same as my mango. He uses a sunglasses camera so the vision is somewhat close to what you see riding with the hood. He also pulls a mean looking trailer behind him.
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