Question about double lane roundabouts

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Question about double lane roundabouts

Postby nuttzo32 » Fri Dec 28, 2012 9:49 pm

Is it legal for a cyclist to change lanes in a double lane roundabout? When i was commuting home from work today there is a double lane roundabout i turn right into and as i turn right it is into a double lane street, i indicate left while entering into the roundabout and change lanes so i can get over to the left quickly rather than be stuck out on in the right lane which merges into one lane straight after the roundabout. I was wondering if this was illegal or dangerous in any way?
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by BNA » Fri Dec 28, 2012 10:28 pm

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Re: Question about double lane roundabouts

Postby Mulger bill » Fri Dec 28, 2012 10:28 pm

Would you have a G Map link to the place?

IIRC, in Vic at least a bike can turn right from the left lane in a roundabout but if doing so MUST give way to all other vehicles.
...whatever the road rules, self-preservation is the absolute priority for a cyclist when mixing it with motorised traffic.
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Re: Question about double lane roundabouts

Postby nuttzo32 » Fri Dec 28, 2012 10:43 pm

http://maps.google.com.au/maps?saddr=Gnangara+Rd&hl=en&sll=-31.796026,115.858383&sspn=0.007742,0.016512&geocode=FXbQGv4dtdXnBg&oq=gnangara&mra=mr&t=m&z=17

I'm travelling east on gnangara road and turning right at the roundabout to head south on mirrabooka ave. Mirrabooka ave is a double lane road going through the roundabout and there is a one lane merge point just south of the roundabout.
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Re: Question about double lane roundabouts

Postby ball bearing » Fri Dec 28, 2012 10:54 pm

Multi lane roundabouts are daft, in my opinion.

"Turning right
• Approach in either lane.
• If choosing to use the
right lane, cyclists must
behave in the same
manner as any other
vehicle (see diagram 4).
They must signal right on
approach, continue this
signal until near the
required exit and then
signal left to exit.
• If choosing to use the
left lane, cyclists must
give way to any vehicle
exiting the roundabout
(see diagram 5)."

http://www.transport.wa.gov.au/mediaFil ... he_law.pdf
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Re: Question about double lane roundabouts

Postby nuttzo32 » Fri Dec 28, 2012 11:00 pm

Thanks for that ball bearing, although none of the diagrams are the same as the roundabout i am talking about, it seems like i have to stay in the right lane until i exit the roundabout and then merge like i would in a car.
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Re: Question about double lane roundabouts

Postby il padrone » Sat Dec 29, 2012 9:09 am

That is correct as a general rule. Making any sort of left indication while going through the roundabout may be confusing to other vehicles (and dangerous) as you may be mistakenly thought to be exitting at an earlier exit.

Ride the roundabout as if you were driving. Claim the right lane, then merge left if needed as you exit. However if the road merges to a single lane shortly after, this left merge may not be needed. You should just hold your line and flow into the lane merge. Chances are pretty good that you'll be riding almost as fast as any motor vehicle leaving the roundabout and they will be unlikely to be able to pass you before the lanes merge.
Riding bikes in traffic - what seems dangerous is usually safe; what seems safe is often more dangerous.
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Re: Question about double lane roundabouts

Postby queequeg » Sat Dec 29, 2012 9:18 am

nuttzo32 wrote:Is it legal for a cyclist to change lanes in a double lane roundabout? When i was commuting home from work today there is a double lane roundabout i turn right into and as i turn right it is into a double lane street, i indicate left while entering into the roundabout and change lanes so i can get over to the left quickly rather than be stuck out on in the right lane which merges into one lane straight after the roundabout. I was wondering if this was illegal or dangerous in any way?


I have a large double roundabout near my house that I must navigate every day on the way home. I need to turn right about 300m after the roundabout, and if I am not already in the right hand lane before the roundabout, cars will not let me in. So, about 100m before the roundabout I move into the right lane (which is a downhill run), and I hold the lane through the roundabout and out the other side, then all the way downhill to the right hand turn bay. As it is a downhill run I am doing 45 to 50km/h and I think that most drivers are used to seeing me because I am there around the same time every day. I rarely have issues doing this as most drivers understand that I am going to turn right well before the two lanes merge into one (which is the most common reason drivers try to race ahead of me).

Anyway, if you need to turn right at a double roundabout, I would get into the right lane well before the roundabout. Make your turn like any other vehicle, and once you have exited you can change into the left lane (if there is one!).
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Re: Question about double lane roundabouts

Postby Mulger bill » Sat Dec 29, 2012 10:25 am

Thanks for the link Nuttz, even tho' the GMaps satellite imagery shows a T junction. :roll: New happy snaps of the area please Google.

I'd be doing the full vehicular move there. Look back in plenty of time, indicate and move to the right lane for the turn. Hold your lane and flow into the traffic stream on Mirrabooka then reassess. You have to be assertive about the look and signal. Smokeboxers are like dogs, they can sense any uncertainty. 95ish% are fairly decent and will do the right thing but it's always wise to be thinking of escape routes if you hapen to encounter one of the remainder.

Shaun

EDIT: As usual, shoulda just +1'd Il Padrones post... :oops:
...whatever the road rules, self-preservation is the absolute priority for a cyclist when mixing it with motorised traffic.
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Re: Question about double lane roundabouts

Postby Xplora » Sat Dec 29, 2012 2:38 pm

Unusual traffic situations are pretty much the main reason why "ride big" and "take the lane" are common mantras for safe vehicular cycling. You have to send clear signals about what you are trying to do, and MB is right - of all the failures to pay attention etc, sensing "they are confused and uncertain about what they are doing" is something that a lot of drivers are very good at. If you are humble, then they won't chop you up, but a longterm solution is simply telegraph your intentions early.

I take the right lane on Victoria Road in Parramatta (Sydney) at one of the biggest, busiest intersections in the area, and I sprint my guts out while I hog that lane despite the possible dangers from obviously being "in the way". I have to turn right about 300m down the road, and there is no WAY I'm going to try and merge. It's just crazy that it's the safer option, but there you go.
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Re: Question about double lane roundabouts

Postby maestro » Mon Dec 31, 2012 12:44 pm

Mulger bill wrote:New happy snaps of the area please Google.


Image from NearMap below...

The southbound lanes merge just off the bottom of the picture. Personally, I'd stay in the RH lane the whole way around the roundabout and merge with the left as per the road rules as the lanes become one. One advantage is that you will be bloody obvious to cars when you are merging from the RH lane.

I have a couple of spots on my commute where roads merge and the lane layout causes me to end up in the RH lane, and even when I am about to turn right most motorists seem very reluctant to overtake to the left of a cyclist (when both bike and car are in separate marked lanes, so it is perfectly legal). They all seem to want to give way and let me change to the LH lane. You could take advantage of this easier merge (I certainly do).

Image
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Re: Question about double lane roundabouts

Postby nuttzo32 » Mon Dec 31, 2012 9:36 pm

maestro wrote:
Mulger bill wrote:New happy snaps of the area please Google.


Image from NearMap below...

The southbound lanes merge just off the bottom of the picture. Personally, I'd stay in the RH lane the whole way around the roundabout and merge with the left as per the road rules as the lanes become one. One advantage is that you will be bloody obvious to cars when you are merging from the RH lane.

I have a couple of spots on my commute where roads merge and the lane layout causes me to end up in the RH lane, and even when I am about to turn right most motorists seem very reluctant to overtake to the left of a cyclist (when both bike and car are in separate marked lanes, so it is perfectly legal). They all seem to want to give way and let me change to the LH lane. You could take advantage of this easier merge (I certainly do).

Image



Nice snap maestro, I will handle it the same way as i do in a car and stay in the right lane till it merges and then move over left, much easier now i have the look behind over both shoulders and signaling down pat and I have built up the peripheral vision to the point where i am confident with my surrounds.
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Re: Question about double lane roundabouts

Postby il padrone » Mon Dec 31, 2012 10:46 pm

Looking at that photo of the redesigned intersection, as it now is a three-entry roundabout the situation is much easier. Your entry road is single lane so you will need to claim the lane but will be quite OK moving into the left lane as you transit the roundabout. You would then of course need to merge when the road later reverts to single lane, but this should not present too much grief. It seems there is a bike lane or sealed shoulder from the merge point onwards anyway.
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