Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
- Comedian
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby Comedian » Sat Dec 15, 2012 12:06 pm
I'm going to re-fit the front tyre with rim tape, and I'm going to leave both of them for another week or so. If they are still on the rim I'll bite the bullet and fit them on the bike and take them for a little roll.
The problem with this insidious issue is that it's going to take some time to get the confidence back in the whole thing.
- bosvit
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby bosvit » Sat Dec 15, 2012 1:11 pm
Absolutely!Comedian wrote: The problem with this insidious issue is that it's going to take some time to get the confidence back in the whole thing.
Just send them to me and you wont have to stress about it ever again!
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby jasonc » Sat Dec 15, 2012 1:12 pm
I've got first dibs I believebosvit wrote:Just send them to me and you wont have to stress about it ever again!
- winstonw
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby winstonw » Sat Dec 15, 2012 1:56 pm
This was the final sprint, so those towards the back were out of contention. I included the pic because everyone heard the "bang", and thought wt.toolonglegs wrote:Lot of people looking backwards in that photo ... If it doesn't bring me down I prefer to keep my eyes looking forward when I am two inches off someones else's wheel!.
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby winstonw » Sat Dec 15, 2012 3:50 pm
At least it's been consistent.....getting death wobble, even once, is enough to steal confidence long term in your frame, wheels, self.Comedian wrote:The problem with this insidious issue is that it's going to take some time to get the confidence back in the whole thing.
By changing the tape and tire type, that's two things changed simultaneously. Wouldn't it be more revealing to change one thing at a time....so tape and same tires as before?
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby Comedian » Sat Dec 15, 2012 5:25 pm
We did. We put the contis on the wheel with the old tape and it blew off! That was the oh no moment. So, we replaced the tape with the same tyre and it's still on.winstonw wrote:At least it's been consistent.....getting death wobble, even once, is enough to steal confidence long term in your frame, wheels, self.Comedian wrote:The problem with this insidious issue is that it's going to take some time to get the confidence back in the whole thing.
By changing the tape and tire type, that's two things changed simultaneously. Wouldn't it be more revealing to change one thing at a time....so tape and same tires as before?
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby bosvit » Sat Dec 15, 2012 8:52 pm
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby eeksll » Sun Dec 16, 2012 12:55 am
in terms of stretch, i eventually got them on by installing them on a R500 (which has a deeper center, hence easier to fit), pumping them up to 120, wait an hour or so, let them down and install on the dtswiss wheels, definite stretch in a very short period.
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby LM324 » Sun Dec 16, 2012 10:14 pm
In my very limited knowledge, I'd think this was the cause as well.jacks1071 wrote: The more I think about this issue, the more I am confident that the OP is stretching the tyres by over inflating them.
lets see how the new tires go.
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby ijpnic » Sun Dec 16, 2012 10:40 pm
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby Comedian » Thu Dec 27, 2012 10:25 am
However my c24 ultremo DD was down to the canvas so I had to do something. I took the Dd off, removed the blue factory rim tape, and replaced it with cloth.
I then grabbed one of the near new ultremo ZX that had blown off the c50. I fitted it using the usual procedure and pumped it to 140. It's still on the rim this morning. That's a good sign... but not conclusive. I may max it out and leave it for a few more hours. If its still up this afternoon ill drop it to 110 or so and ride it. Cross fingers.
If you don't hear from me again.. you'll know what happened.
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby Nobody » Thu Dec 27, 2012 11:17 am
Leave a message with one of your friends to post if you don't make it. That way we'll know for sure.Comedian wrote:If you don't hear from me again.. you'll know what happened.
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby antipodean » Thu Dec 27, 2012 2:27 pm
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby Comedian » Thu Dec 27, 2012 9:00 pm
It's kind of a check pressure test. The manufacturers of both the tyre and the rims specify a max pressure of 10 bar. I figure they have both got substantial margins in those figures. As you've seen above, the tyre manufacturers state that they are good for up to 290psi!antipodean wrote:Why do you insist on pumping it to 140 psi? Like others have mentioned this is more than likely the cause of your problem.
See... my theory is if it doesn't blow off at 145, then if I back it off to 120 ... it shouldn't blow off at that. If the past I've had them blow off at as little as 115.
As you can see by me typing this message, I survived my test ride at 120 today on a ZX (with about 150k). It was fitted to the DA C24 minus the factory blue rim tape (replaced with cloth). Cross fingers...
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby bosvit » Thu Dec 27, 2012 10:24 pm
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby Comedian » Thu Dec 27, 2012 11:03 pm
In a week or two ill feel more confident that we have a solution.bosvit wrote:Let's hope all your problems were caused by something as simple as rim tape.
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby Comedian » Fri Dec 28, 2012 5:11 pm
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby bosvit » Fri Dec 28, 2012 10:44 pm
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby Comedian » Fri Dec 28, 2012 10:50 pm
Thats just the way I roll.. Boom Boom... I mean.. oh never mind.bosvit wrote:Your a man on the edge Mr Amos
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby winstonw » Sat Dec 29, 2012 2:20 pm
I'd be interested to know if you have ever stored your wheels in your car or some other hot place that may have stretched the plastic type rim tape excessively.
Or maybe 140psi is unduly stretching the tape?!
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby biker jk » Sat Dec 29, 2012 2:26 pm
That's a good point since the Shimano rim tape is rated to 145psi. Each 10 deg celsius rise in temperature increases pressure by 1 psi. So if the temp rises 30 deg that's an extra 3 psi. From 140 psi you're getting close to the rim tape's limit.winstonw wrote:Comedian, weren't you having blow offs on all three wheelsets?
I'd be interested to know if you have ever stored your wheels in your car or some other hot place that may have stretched the plastic type rim tape excessively.
Or maybe 140psi is unduly stretching the tape?!
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby Comedian » Sat Dec 29, 2012 2:41 pm
There are three wheelsets in play here. The C24 and Mavic's have only had maybe one or two blow offs. The durace c50 I was just unable to keep the bloody tyres on!winstonw wrote:Comedian, weren't you having blow offs on all three wheelsets?
I'd be interested to know if you have ever stored your wheels in your car or some other hot place that may have stretched the plastic type rim tape excessively.
Or maybe 140psi is unduly stretching the tape?!
The bike may have been in a car occasionally but I can't think of a case where it has been. We have an external bike carrier and this is how I carry it although I ride everywhere so this is a very very occasional thing. So, being stored on the rack behind the car probably isn't greatly different to actually being ridden, or leant up against something at a cafe in the sun.
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby bosvit » Sat Dec 29, 2012 3:02 pm
I think you need a shirt with something on it like
"In my experience you are not experiencing what you think you are experiencing"
- Comedian
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby Comedian » Sun Dec 30, 2012 10:20 am
It's pretty funny - hey? You've got three very experienced riders who have never had a problem fitting tyres to wheels. Some new tyres from two reputable brands. Some top shelf wheels from a prominent Japanese manufacturer. And no one can make them work together.bosvit wrote:Hey Comedian
I think you need a shirt with something on it like
"In my experience you are not experiencing what you think you are experiencing"
So we've got people saying...
- You're fitting them wrong.
- You're pumping them up too much - even if it is below the max pressure.
- You're generally incompetent.
- You're using them to ride a bike on.
- You're leaving them in your car.
- The rims are cracked.
- The spokes are too tight.
- Your gauge is inaccurate.
- You're not using nitrogen.
- You're stretching them putting them on.
- You should stop using them as props in bondage roll play games.
Did I miss anything there? I'm sure there is a little bit of truth in all of those points. Many of them may be contributors. I'm not prepared to call it finally yet, but it's looking like it was actually just the rim tape!
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Re: Schwalbe Ultremo blowing off rim
Postby Nobody » Sun Dec 30, 2012 12:58 pm
Strange comment since the air is 78% nitrogen.Comedian wrote:- You're not using nitrogen.
Yes.Comedian wrote:Did I miss anything there?
- Rims not able to handle the pressure.
I'm sure I read that at least once.
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