Latest Reviews and Articles
Will your next bike be Intelligent? ABS and Smart Bike Tech
Vitus Vitesse EVO Disc Review – Speed Machine indeed!
titanium v carbon.
-
- Posts: 26
- Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 9:13 pm
titanium v carbon.
Postby ajgool » Tue Jan 15, 2013 8:51 pm
-
- Posts: 414
- Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2010 10:30 pm
- Location: East Sydney
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby whitey » Tue Jan 15, 2013 8:59 pm
Edit: the search function is your friend viewtopic.php?f=11&t=48956&hilit=titanium
-
- Posts: 9585
- Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2011 3:40 pm
- Location: Brisbane
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby jasonc » Tue Jan 15, 2013 9:33 pm
whitey wrote:Can someone pass the popcorn....If money is no issue buy both and tell us the results
Edit: the search function is your friend viewtopic.php?f=11&t=48956&hilit=titanium
buy me both, and i'll report back

- London Boy
- Posts: 725
- Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2010 3:43 pm
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby London Boy » Tue Jan 15, 2013 9:45 pm
whitey wrote:Can someone pass the popcorn....If money is no issue buy both and tell us the results
I can't say money is no issue, but on the basis of n+1... I now have a couple of old steels, an ally, a carbon and a Ti.
Ti is Van Nicholas Zephyr, built for long cruisey rides. I like it. I'd buy it again. Unlike my old carbon, the frame is pretty much bullet proof (had a cracked frame, not good, but replaced under warranty) and it is comfortable. Not comfortable like a feather mattress, that would be an exaggeration, but has a little more damping than the carbon. It's my Sunday best and I expect to be riding it in another 20 years, if I'm still compos.
- drubie
- Posts: 4714
- Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:12 am
- Location: New England
- Contact:
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby drubie » Tue Jan 15, 2013 9:57 pm

but really, that's rubbish. We get none of it because the choices are illusory.
-
- Posts: 8464
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:48 am
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby human909 » Tue Jan 15, 2013 10:17 pm
drubie wrote:At 52 a good quality, lugged steel frame will outlast you and two work hardened Ti frames. The jury is still out on the UV damage a carbon frame can sustain, but steel bikes 100 years old are still rideable. Ti is for showing off, not forever
Why do you say Ti is not forever? Personally I love lugged steel but I do see a good Ti bike as the next step up for those not fiscally constrained.

At the moment I ride lugged aluminium!

- sogood
- Posts: 17164
- Joined: Thu Aug 31, 2006 7:31 am
- Location: Sydney AU
- Contact:
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby sogood » Tue Jan 15, 2013 10:37 pm

RK wrote:And that is Wikipedia - I can write my own definition.
- RonK
- Posts: 10025
- Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 2:08 pm
- Location: Brisbane, Queensland
- Contact:
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby RonK » Tue Jan 15, 2013 10:43 pm
They are all good.
I think the attribution of ride characteristics to materials is overstated. It's the construction, not the materials that determine a frame's ride qualities.
And I would never buy a bike on the basis that it's going to be my bike "for the rest of my life". How bloody boring!
-
- Posts: 587
- Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2011 8:37 pm
- Location: Adelaide
- Contact:
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby TDC » Tue Jan 15, 2013 10:46 pm
-
- Posts: 8664
- Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:10 pm
- Location: Sydney
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby Nobody » Tue Jan 15, 2013 10:48 pm
Ride On wrote:Road racer Ben Douglas told Ride On the common understanding among competitive riders is that after two years averaging 20-25,000km per annum racing and training, a carbon fibre bike will lose some of its stiffness due to the epoxy resin softening. It makes the bike less suitable for high-end racing, but still more than adequate as a road bike.
http://rideons.wordpress.com/2012/04/19 ... nd-repair/
-
- Posts: 8664
- Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:10 pm
- Location: Sydney
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby Nobody » Tue Jan 15, 2013 10:56 pm
From what I've read, metals with a fatigue limit like Ti and steel need to have the repeated stresses less than half the yield strength to last indefinitely. To me that means these frames will only last a lifetime if the frame is built strong enough and you are light enough. Many these days have the opposite combination.TDC wrote:Why do you think that it will last a life time? Any frame will fatigue and break in various ways if you ride them long and hard enough.
-
- Posts: 8464
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:48 am
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby human909 » Tue Jan 15, 2013 10:59 pm
TDC wrote:Why do you think that it will last a life time? Any frame will fatigue and break in various ways if you ride them long and hard enough.
Many materials including steel and titanium don't exhibit fatigue behaviour under normal loading. A steel bike frame should last a lifetime unless you break in a crash or other extreme event.
Nobody wrote:From what I've read, metals with a fatigue limit like Ti and steel need to have the repeated stresses less than half the yield strength to last indefinitely. To me that means these frames will only last a lifetime if the frame is built strong enough and you are light enough. Many these days have the opposite combination.
EDIT: My confidence in steel fatigue is probably misplaced judging by the comments below.
I doubt this is the case except in extreme cases. Cyclical loading on bicycle frames would be well less than 10% of yield strength. (I've happily loaded up my bicycles with 3 adults before. Bicycles frames are EXTREMELY strong!)
- twizzle
- Posts: 6386
- Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2008 11:45 am
- Location: Taking a break.
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby twizzle » Tue Jan 15, 2013 11:05 pm
Sent from my iThingy...
...real cyclists don't have squeaky chains...
-
- Posts: 587
- Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2011 8:37 pm
- Location: Adelaide
- Contact:
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby TDC » Tue Jan 15, 2013 11:05 pm
-
- Posts: 8664
- Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 12:10 pm
- Location: Sydney
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby Nobody » Tue Jan 15, 2013 11:15 pm
Well there are a few on here like TLL and Twizzle who will proudly tell you they have cracked steel frames. It's no surprise to many here that I have a bias toward steel, but I still can't deny the reality. The steel frame has to be build strong enough for the person it is going to carry to last. Many lighter frames aren't IMO. Either that, or they are poorly built.human909 wrote:I doubt this is the case except in extreme cases. Cyclical loading on bicycle frames would be well less than 10% of yield strength.
(I've happily loaded up my bicycles with 3 adults before. Bicycles frames are EXTREMELY strong!)
viewtopic.php?f=34&t=51878
Edit: Wow, you have to quick around here.

- sogood
- Posts: 17164
- Joined: Thu Aug 31, 2006 7:31 am
- Location: Sydney AU
- Contact:
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby sogood » Tue Jan 15, 2013 11:35 pm
human909 wrote:I doubt this is the case except in extreme cases. Cyclical loading on bicycle frames would be well less than 10% of yield strength. (I've happily loaded up my bicycles with 3 adults before. Bicycles frames are EXTREMELY strong!)
This pseudo-science justification is akin to one Ti bike company that advertised their bike strength by running a few Ti tubes with a 4WD, all forgetting that the tubes still needed to be welded together and other manufacturing steps. The resulting frame will fail at the weakest point or a point of stress concentration. Fact is, all frames fail.

RK wrote:And that is Wikipedia - I can write my own definition.
- ZepinAtor
- Posts: 1558
- Joined: Fri Nov 26, 2010 7:46 pm
- Location: Brizzzzbane Everton Hillzzzz
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby ZepinAtor » Tue Jan 15, 2013 11:39 pm
To date the Blacksheep is the only bike I've ever owned that has cracked (vertical head tube crack under top headset cup) It also suffered a cable lug failure which cracked off. Not good for a $5000 custom frame.
I'm now riding a carbon fibre Parlee Z4 which has a life time warranty & to date is the best bike I've ever owned/ridden. So far it's withstood a good 10 thousand km's over 12 months & is looking as good as the day I purchased it. All going well I will replace my Cannondale Super Six with another Parlee in the next 2-3 years.
-
- Posts: 1687
- Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2010 6:25 pm
- drubie
- Posts: 4714
- Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:12 am
- Location: New England
- Contact:
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby drubie » Wed Jan 16, 2013 12:08 am
but really, that's rubbish. We get none of it because the choices are illusory.
- AUbicycles
- Site Admin
- Posts: 12866
- Joined: Tue Aug 23, 2005 2:14 am
- Location: Sydney & Frankfurt
- Contact:
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby AUbicycles » Wed Jan 16, 2013 12:14 am
I agree on the lifespans - technically Carbon Fibre has the longest lifespan however is still an unknown factor, depends on construction (faults or flaws), riding, impacts and material degradation over time, as suggest UV is a potential factor.
The bike that won't fail is the bike that isn't ridden, otherwise it could perform well for a long time or there could be something that affects it such as an imperfection which facilitates failure or fatigue.
--
In making a decision, a titanium custom bike will be special bike, you will (should) have tailored geometry to suit. It may not necessarily be a bike for life however is more timeless than carbon fibre - Carbon fibre is still evolving realatively fast and is improving in technology, design and layup.
Darren of Baum Cycles in Geelong is very well regarded for custom titanium bikes and is also local.
-
- Posts: 26
- Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 9:13 pm
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby ajgool » Wed Jan 16, 2013 7:05 am
-
- Posts: 8464
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:48 am
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby human909 » Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:49 am
sogood wrote:This pseudo-science justification is akin to one Ti bike company that advertised their bike strength by running a few Ti tubes with a 4WD, all forgetting that the tubes still needed to be welded together and other manufacturing steps. The resulting frame will fail at the weakest point or a point of stress concentration. Fact is, all frames fail.
Pseudo science? Hardly.
The notion that all frames fail is plainly false. Design a frame with sufficient strength and it wont fail. But I would now seem to agree with Mr "Nobody" that many times manufacturers are pushing the limits and thus the resulting fatigue failures even of many steel bikes. (Until reading this thread I didn't realise BB failures were some common in steel bikes.)
AUbicycles wrote:I agree on the lifespans - technically Carbon Fibre has the longest lifespan however is still an unknown factor, depends on construction (faults or flaws), riding, impacts and material degradation over time, as suggest UV is a potential factor.
Steel has shown itself to last centuries as long as it is adequately protected from rust. Short of materials with no miniumum fatigue limit, you cant really say one material out lasts the other.
Also it is quite common for Dutch bikes to last 50 years of riding everyday. My sister is rides her Oma Fiets everyday and that bike is 35 years old!
And then there is this:


-
- Posts: 1418
- Joined: Sun Jan 17, 2010 7:00 pm
- Location: W.A
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby Marty Moose » Wed Jan 16, 2013 11:30 am


MM
- Comedian
- Posts: 5425
- Joined: Mon Aug 09, 2010 7:35 pm
- Location: Brisbane
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby Comedian » Wed Jan 16, 2013 12:32 pm
whitey wrote:Can someone pass the popcorn....If money is no issue buy both and tell us the results
Edit: the search function is your friend viewtopic.php?f=11&t=48956&hilit=titanium
I'm going to do the experiment. Will report back in a few months.

-
- Posts: 479
- Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2008 8:33 am
- Location: Maribyrnong,Victoria
Re: titanium v carbon.
Postby william » Wed Jan 16, 2013 1:37 pm
Titanium has some brilliant qualities.
Return to “General Cycling Discussion”
- General Australian Cycling Topics
- Info / announcements
- Buying a bike / parts
- General Cycling Discussion
- The Bike Shed
- Cycling Health
- Cycling Safety and Advocacy
- Women's Cycling
- Bike & Gear Reviews
- Cycling Trade
- Stolen Bikes
- Bicycle FAQs
- Serious Biking
- Audax / Randonneuring
- Retro biking
- Commuting
- MTB
- Recumbents
- Fixed Gear/ Single Speed
- Track
- Electric Bicycles
- Cyclocross
- Dragsters / Lowriders / Cruisers
- Children's Bikes
- Road Racing
- Road Biking
- Training
- Time Trial
- Triathlon
- International and National Tours and Events
- Cycle Touring
- Touring Australia
- Touring Overseas
- Touring Bikes and Equipment
- Australia
- Western Australia
- New South Wales
- Queensland
- South Australia
- Victoria
- ACT
- Tasmania
- Northern Territory
- Country & Regional
- The Market Place
- Member to Member Bike and Gear Sales
- Want to Buy, Group Buy, Swap
- My Bikes or Gear Elsewhere
- Cycling Brands
- Azzurri
- Bianchi
- BMC
- Campagnolo
- Cannondale
- Cervélo
- Colnago
- Focus
- Fuji
- Garmin
- Giant
- Malvern Star
- Merida
- Scott
- Shimano
- Specialized
- SRAM
- Surly
- Trek
- Custom Builders
- Generic Carbon
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: 10speedsemiracer, Derny Driver, pj
- All times are UTC+10:00
- Top
- Delete all board cookies
About the Australian Cycling Forums
The largest cycling discussion forum in Australia for all things bike; from new riders to seasoned bike nuts, the Australian Cycling Forums are a welcoming community where you can ask questions and talk about the type of bikes and cycling topics you like.