Help choosing between Scott Foil 40 and Giant TCR Advanced 2

Questions about purchasing bicycles and parts

Help choosing between Scott Foil 40 and Giant TCR Advanced 2

Postby Dr.G » Sun Jan 27, 2013 10:15 pm

Hi, I'm new to the forum and have been an avid moutain bike rider for some time, now wanting a decent road bike to stay fit on and enjoy the odd day tour here and there.
I have decided I want a full carbon bike, with budget around the 2k mark.

I've narrowed down my choices and desires to the two bikes mentioned, but cannot seem to make a final conclusion - Ii'm not sure I can get on a bike and have an extended ride.

Anyway, the rational choice for me would seem to be the Giant - as I feel it has a better wheelset (Giant PSL1), Ride Sense (although I'm not sure I'll really use it), and the LBS that stocks them seems more likely to have stock of other things I need such as pedals and shoes, and possibly new helmet too. Overall this seems to be the more "tidy" purchase option.
But I'm not hugely excited about the overall look of the bike - although the black and blue colour scheme is nice.

The Scott on the other hand - has more of the "wow" factor - I like the style of the bike more (Ii'm not sure if there are any real differences in the frames or ride qualities between the two), it looks sleeker, BUT I believe it has a really crappy wheelset in the Shimano R501, and I'm not sure about the saddle too.
I'm also not sure how much more of a deal I can get on the oter items i need with the Scott LBS.

I really don't want to upgrade the wheelset on either bike right away.

Overall, the Scott is the bike that excites me, but the Giant is the bike and purchase package that seems to be the more rational.

I think the Scott weight is 7.9kg in 54cm, and I have seen that the Giant is 8.0kg, with a set of 105 pedals, and Garmin in the ML size - which actually surprised me how light it was.

Both bikes are the same price.

The main concern on the Scott is the wheelset - as I can work deals on the pedals etc seperately.

Any tips or ideas on this - and how about the Shimano R501 wheelset versus Giants PSL1 (which are apparently a DT swiss combo - and also weigh about 300gm less).

Cheers....!
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by BNA » Mon Jan 28, 2013 2:17 pm

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Re: Help choosing between Scott Foil 40 and Giant TCR Advanc

Postby merlin6014 » Mon Jan 28, 2013 2:17 pm

I just went through EXACTLY the same thing.

In the end bought the Scott Foil 40 for three reasons.

1) The Giant looked plain to me/ I didn't like the colour scheme (both personal reasons)
2) The Scott is on sale for $2100 at the moment vs $3000 normally so I put that saving into wheels.
3) The Scott has an aero frame and I do a lot of solo riding.

I wouldn't worry about the wheels, the stock ones both kind of suck anyway better off upgrading them later with a set you can keep for a while (currently what I am shopping for now.)

Anyway back to the Scott took it out for the first time the other day - wow is all I can say, its quick - hit 65km/h on a slight downhill that my previous best was 50km/h on (old bike was an Avanti Giro 3 for comparison). Think I broke 25 PR's on Strava without even breaking a sweat (and that was with the "crap" shimano 501 wheels) - in short it shat all over my old bike which was only 3 months old mind you. Very happy camper here.
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Re: Help choosing between Scott Foil 40 and Giant TCR Advanc

Postby biker jk » Mon Jan 28, 2013 2:49 pm

Just note that Giant provides a lifetime warranty on the frame and 10-years on the fork. In comparison, Scott provides 5-years for the frame if you get it serviced annually and 3-years otherwise (2-years on the fork). Strange since I believe that Giant make Scott frames.
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Re: Help choosing between Scott Foil 40 and Giant TCR Advanc

Postby kunalraiker » Mon Jan 28, 2013 3:24 pm

merlin6014 wrote:
Anyway back to the Scott took it out for the first time the other day - wow is all I can say, its quick - hit 65km/h on a slight downhill that my previous best was 50km/h on (old bike was an Avanti Giro 3 for comparison). Think I broke 25 PR's on Strava without even breaking a sweat (and that was with the "crap" shimano 501 wheels) - in short it shat all over my old bike which was only 3 months old mind you. Very happy camper here.



And how do you think you managed to do this ?
The reason I ask is becuase I've got a GIRO2 and seems fairly happy with it, although I must admit I haven't tried any other bike :)
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Re: Help choosing between Scott Foil 40 and Giant TCR Advanc

Postby merlin6014 » Mon Jan 28, 2013 3:26 pm

kunalraiker wrote:
merlin6014 wrote:
Anyway back to the Scott took it out for the first time the other day - wow is all I can say, its quick - hit 65km/h on a slight downhill that my previous best was 50km/h on (old bike was an Avanti Giro 3 for comparison). Think I broke 25 PR's on Strava without even breaking a sweat (and that was with the "crap" shimano 501 wheels) - in short it shat all over my old bike which was only 3 months old mind you. Very happy camper here.



And how do you think you managed to do this ?
The reason I ask is becuase I've got a GIRO2 and seems fairly happy with it, although I must admit I haven't tried any other bike :)


Better aero, less weight, pyschological? no idea but it did it easily (I wasn't even really trying) - confirmed on the GPS and my ride partners GPS so no dodgy figures. By the way I have nothing bad to say about the Giro it was a great bike, the Scotts just a lot better (as to be expected give the price)
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Re: Help choosing between Scott Foil 40 and Giant TCR Advanc

Postby Snagdog » Mon Jan 28, 2013 3:31 pm

For what it's worth everyone seems to usually bag giants for being too common. Last time I was at Mooloolaba coffee shops every second bike there was a foil. Look that could just mean there red hot bikes.

Same old story, test ride both and one should feel/ fit better. Fits more important than brand, colour or look
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Re: Help choosing between Scott Foil 40 and Giant TCR Advanc

Postby biker jk » Mon Jan 28, 2013 3:47 pm

merlin6014 wrote:I just went through EXACTLY the same thing.

In the end bought the Scott Foil 40 for three reasons.

1) The Giant looked plain to me/ I didn't like the colour scheme (both personal reasons)
2) The Scott is on sale for $2100 at the moment vs $3000 normally so I put that saving into wheels.
3) The Scott has an aero frame and I do a lot of solo riding.

I wouldn't worry about the wheels, the stock ones both kind of suck anyway better off upgrading them later with a set you can keep for a while (currently what I am shopping for now.)

Anyway back to the Scott took it out for the first time the other day - wow is all I can say, its quick - hit 65km/h on a slight downhill that my previous best was 50km/h on (old bike was an Avanti Giro 3 for comparison). Think I broke 25 PR's on Strava without even breaking a sweat (and that was with the "crap" shimano 501 wheels) - in short it shat all over my old bike which was only 3 months old mind you. Very happy camper here.


Wind speed and direction likely accounted for most of that difference in speed. I ride the M7 regularly and wind speed and direction is the greatest determinant of speed (and Strava PRs).
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Re: Help choosing between Scott Foil 40 and Giant TCR Advanc

Postby merlin6014 » Mon Jan 28, 2013 4:38 pm

biker jk wrote:
Wind speed and direction likely accounted for most of that difference in speed. I ride the M7 regularly and wind speed and direction is the greatest determinant of speed (and Strava PRs).


Is it just me or does it always feel like your riding into a headwind heading towards Bella Vista?
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Re: Help choosing between Scott Foil 40 and Giant TCR Advanc

Postby Dr.G » Mon Jan 28, 2013 7:03 pm

merlin6014 wrote:I just went through EXACTLY the same thing.

In the end bought the Scott Foil 40 for three reasons.

1) The Giant looked plain to me/ I didn't like the colour scheme (both personal reasons)
2) The Scott is on sale for $2100 at the moment vs $3000 normally so I put that saving into wheels.
3) The Scott has an aero frame and I do a lot of solo riding.

I wouldn't worry about the wheels, the stock ones both kind of suck anyway better off upgrading them later with a set you can keep for a while (currently what I am shopping for now.)

Anyway back to the Scott took it out for the first time the other day - wow is all I can say, its quick - hit 65km/h on a slight downhill that my previous best was 50km/h on (old bike was an Avanti Giro 3 for comparison). Think I broke 25 PR's on Strava without even breaking a sweat (and that was with the "crap" shimano 501 wheels) - in short it shat all over my old bike which was only 3 months old mind you. Very happy camper here.


Wow, thanks for your input on this - It's good to hear your thoughts, and I was kinda thinking that about the wheels - how do you find the comfort on it, and is the saddle OK?
Do you have it set up with spacers under the stem or...?

And if I wanted to set up something like the ride-sense thing they have on the Giant, what would my options be?

And finally, did you ride a Giant, and how would you describe the ride in comparison?

Cheers!
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Re: Help choosing between Scott Foil 40 and Giant TCR Advanc

Postby merlin6014 » Mon Jan 28, 2013 8:36 pm

Dr.G wrote:
merlin6014 wrote:I just went through EXACTLY the same thing.

In the end bought the Scott Foil 40 for three reasons.

1) The Giant looked plain to me/ I didn't like the colour scheme (both personal reasons)
2) The Scott is on sale for $2100 at the moment vs $3000 normally so I put that saving into wheels.
3) The Scott has an aero frame and I do a lot of solo riding.

I wouldn't worry about the wheels, the stock ones both kind of suck anyway better off upgrading them later with a set you can keep for a while (currently what I am shopping for now.)

Anyway back to the Scott took it out for the first time the other day - wow is all I can say, its quick - hit 65km/h on a slight downhill that my previous best was 50km/h on (old bike was an Avanti Giro 3 for comparison). Think I broke 25 PR's on Strava without even breaking a sweat (and that was with the "crap" shimano 501 wheels) - in short it shat all over my old bike which was only 3 months old mind you. Very happy camper here.


Wow, thanks for your input on this - It's good to hear your thoughts, and I was kinda thinking that about the wheels - how do you find the comfort on it, and is the saddle OK?
Do you have it set up with spacers under the stem or...?

And if I wanted to set up something like the ride-sense thing they have on the Giant, what would my options be?

And finally, did you ride a Giant, and how would you describe the ride in comparison?

Cheers!


Comfort has been fine so far no worse than the much more relaxed giro. Though i will admit the stock saddle is a piece if crap. Ive replaced it already with a selle italia slr pro carbinio which was on sale for $100 at chain reaction. Saved 140grams too...

I've removed the spacers and dropped the bars right down, probably a tad too aggressive so I may put one spacer back in but Im probably just being soft. Ive added some aero bars too but havnt had a chance to use them yet.

I have a garmin edge 500 hooked up with the standard garmin cadence and speed sensors cable tied to the frame as normal (its a little tricky though due to the aero frame). Ridesense is a lot tidier and is a great idea from giant though more of a luxury than a deal breaker.

I rode the giant briefly nothing wrong with it you cant go wrong with either bike just pick on the best deal/which one you think looks the best aesthetically
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Re: Help choosing between Scott Foil 40 and Giant TCR Advanc

Postby donkuok » Tue Jan 29, 2013 12:21 am

I was torn in between too but at the end i went for Scott Foil 40. Simply because it looks sleeker, excellent paint works, faster and lighter. This is my first carbon road bike, I used to ride Avanti blade 4 cross bike. Avanti Blade 4 is a fast cross bike..I ever hit 65km/h on the flat road with slipstream. But this Scott Foil 40 even faster, especially at the cornering. The Aerodynamic design really does the job.
I tested ride Giant TCR before but found that it's not as stiffness and responsive as Scott Foil frame. The only good thing with Giant is the Ridesense. Buy hey..you can get the Garmin Edge 510 bundle for Speed sensor and HRM.
I was also tempted with the downunder tour offer for the Scott. My LBS only sells it at 1999 only down from 2999.
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Re: Help choosing between Scott Foil 40 and Giant TCR Advanc

Postby Dr.G » Fri Feb 01, 2013 12:11 pm

Well, I pulled the trigger and bought a 2013 TCR advanced 2 in the medium size.

As mentioned, my heart was with the Scott, however when I went to be fitted for it, it seemed i was kinda between the two sizes - 54 and 52.

I just couldn't seem to gel with either one - and didn't really feel like going through the fiddling that would be required to get a perfect fit - such as stem adjustments, saddle change (the stock saddle is like a board), and the wheelset etc.

I decided to mull it over and while doing so, went to check out a new shipment of TCRs that had come in.

I jumped on the medium, and it just felt right. There seems to be more adjustment for the stock saddle, which is also more comfortable, and I got some 105 pedals, and shoes, bottle cage and cooler bottle as part of the overall deal - not all free, but at a good discount.

I am very happy with the bike, and in this case the rational choice (on paper) turned out the be the right one.

The bike seems very efficient with regards to power transfer, but I am not expert with frames which may be more rigid - and even better, the bike seems to be very compliant over reasonable imperfections in the road - particularly in the rear end, and with plenty of feedback through the front.

Over bumpy stuff, it is still harsh, but that would be the case on most bikes, I'd imagine. Overall it is a smooth ride, and I really enjoy riding it, and look for excuses to jump on it.

The longest ride so far is about 30km, and I feel fresh with no pain at all over that distance.

I could possibly use a shorter stem, but it's good enough for now.

Anyway, thanks for the inputs on the process, and what this experience confirms with me is the importance of a test ride wherever possible.

Cheers....!
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Re: Help choosing between Scott Foil 40 and Giant TCR Advanc

Postby Cmm » Thu Feb 14, 2013 3:31 pm

any updates on how the TCR rides on longer rides?
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Re: Help choosing between Scott Foil 40 and Giant TCR Advanc

Postby Blackened160 » Mon Feb 18, 2013 2:24 pm

Registered just to reply to this thread.

Basically, test ride everything you can. Hopefully, the LBS will let you take them out for a more extended ride. Most of the ones I went to around Melbourne let me out for 20min or so. Find the one that is the most comfortable for the purpose you're using it. This will be the biggest factor in enjoying your cycling experience.

That said, I ended up with the Foil 40. I tried the TCR, and it was a pretty decent bike with better kit for the same price, but it didn't wow me. It fit about the same as the Foil, but the Foil was quicker and handled much better with lesser specs (105s vs Ultegra, and 501s vs whatever). It was the quickest bike I tried barring the Felt AR2 (man, that's a fast bike) and the best handling. That was with the 501s. I occasionally ride with my Fulcrum 3s, and turn entry is so much quicker. I've ridden about 4000k on the Foil since I bought it in October, and have done everything from 7 hour Dandenong runs to the 220k flat ride. The Foil is also quite smooth for a race bike. Performs close to endurance style bikes for ride quality, except for larger bumps. which is surprising, considering how stiff it is. It excels at anything fast, so slow grinds up hills aren't my favourite. Short or small grade climbs are fine as long as you power them and keep the speed up, making use of the Foil's strength. Other than the uphill performance, the only other downside is the "twitchyness" of the steering. You have to pay attention to it, especially with lighter wheels.

After riding it for the last few months, I'd recommend the Foil to anyone with road cycling experience (due to the twitchy front end), but would advise going Ultegra and lighter wheelset. If you're on a budget, the 105s and 501s are fine, but there is a noticeable performance increase with the wheels and Ultegra shifting is so much smoother.

Pros: Handling, quick, stiffness
Cons: Twitchy, slow grind performance was the same as other bikes
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