Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thread)

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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby simonn » Wed Feb 06, 2013 8:22 am

twizzle wrote:A mate a work suggests you go and live in Singapore for a while. Look into why they are a nanny state. Ask why it is necessary to have sensors in lifts in office buildings to catch people urinating.


In all fairness, that is not a nanny state example. The state is being a nanny when laws/regulations are enacted to protect you from yourself, not protect you from others. Enforcing helmet use on bicycles is the former. Stopping people urinating in lifts is the latter.
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by BNA » Wed Feb 06, 2013 8:54 am

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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby outnabike » Wed Feb 06, 2013 8:54 am

il padrone wrote:[

I took a fall on the weekend. Hit my head. Was unconscious for 1-2 minutes. The brand new helmet is busted :(

Yes it saved me from possibly more severe injuries. I have a broken collar-bone and possible cracked ribs. Still do not support MHL. I choose to wear a helmet. I am a high mileage rider (10-12k per year) and the fall happened while descending a gravel road out of the bush into Apollo Bay - not your garden variety 'ride to the shops'. I guess it can be seen as greater risk-taking, descending a gravel road at 30kmh. I accept that risk and deal with it. Abolishing the MHL will not change that.
snipped

That is a bad fall and will take some getting over. Getting over some cracked ribs myself from a tangle foot fall at home in the back yard.( Bloody thongs) The hardest part is to only sleep on my back. Finding I have to get up and sleep upright in the lounge chair.
Hope you recover well. How do they treat a broken collar bone, does it require a ss pin put in during an opp?
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby il padrone » Wed Feb 06, 2013 8:55 am

wilddemon wrote:
human909 wrote:Also following the argument that we need laws to protect us from ourselves most higher risk sports wouldn't exist or be so crazily regulated that it would be insane.

You mean like base jumping?
http://y-community-number-84.blogspot.c ... ld-be.html
Train surfing?
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/teen- ... 1yyol.html
Bull fighting?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... z2K3jOShbp

No, reasonable sports and recreational pursuits like rock-climbing, back-country skiing, sailing, white-water canoeing, even bushwalking.

You hear it in the media from shock-jocks and their diarist lackiys "How is it that people can be allowed to do this sort of thing?" Eg. commentary after the recent rescue of the French yachtsmen whose yacht capsized and had to be abandoned in storm and was rescued by a cruise ship.
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby human909 » Wed Feb 06, 2013 8:58 am

wilddemon wrote:
human909 wrote:Also following the argument that we need laws to protect us from ourselves most higher risk sports wouldn't exist or be so crazily regulated that it would be insane.

You mean like base jumping?
http://y-community-number-84.blogspot.c ... ld-be.html
Train surfing?
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/teen- ... 1yyol.html
Bull fighting?
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... z2K3jOShbp


Are you serious? :lol:

Bull fighting and train surfing are not legal due to reasons other than being hazardous sports. Base jumping is one of the VERY few sports that are banned in Australia solely for the risk to the individual participants.

There are hundreds of unregulated sports that are significantly greater risk than cycling. Many of them participants are at high risk of head injuries. But individual choices work very well in keeping people largely safe!
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby il padrone » Wed Feb 06, 2013 9:02 am

human909 wrote:Many of them participants are at high risk of head injuries. But individual choices work very well in keeping people largely safe!

Yes, like AFL, Thugby, boxing. Where are the MHLs for these sports? :?


BTW, I am not suggesting I want a law applied on them.
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby wilddemon » Wed Feb 06, 2013 9:07 am

human909 wrote:Also following the argument that we need laws to protect us from ourselves most higher risk sports wouldn't exist or be so crazily regulated that it would be insane.

You mean like base jumping?
http://y-community-number-84.blogspot.c ... ld-be.html

human909 wrote:Base jumping is one of the VERY few sports that are banned in Australia solely for the risk to the individual participants.


So you agree with me. Great :lol:

Therefore, it is insane.
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby il padrone » Wed Feb 06, 2013 9:19 am

wilddemon wrote:
human909 wrote:Base jumping is one of the VERY few sports that are banned in Australia solely for the risk to the individual participants.


So you agree with me. Great :lol:

Therefore, it is insane.

So some sports that you don't agree with, or think are more dangerous than you would tolerate, get lebelled as 'insane'?

Great. You fit in well with the 2UE/3yAWn talkback clientele :roll:
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby human909 » Wed Feb 06, 2013 9:47 am

wilddemon wrote:
human909 wrote:Base jumping is one of the VERY few sports that are banned in Australia solely for the risk to the individual participants.


So you agree with me. Great :lol:

Therefore, it is insane.

:?: :?

I wasn't agreeing with you! I don't believe base jumping should be banned. Personally I think it is a reckless sport and I have no desire to participate in it. But I don't believe that it is the government's job to tell us how to live our lives. How is a life of education, work, beach holidays, kids and retirement "better" than one of adventure possibly cut short but an accident?

Personally I do serious outdoor rockclimbing. The government, authorities and the general public think this is dangerous. But what do they know?
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby twizzle » Wed Feb 06, 2013 10:29 am

simonn wrote:
twizzle wrote:A mate a work suggests you go and live in Singapore for a while. Look into why they are a nanny state. Ask why it is necessary to have sensors in lifts in office buildings to catch people urinating.


In all fairness, that is not a nanny state example. The state is being a nanny when laws/regulations are enacted to protect you from yourself, not protect you from others. Enforcing helmet use on bicycles is the former. Stopping people urinating in lifts is the latter.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nanny_state
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby wilddemon » Wed Feb 06, 2013 12:06 pm

wilddemon wrote:
human909 wrote:Also following the argument that we need laws to protect us from ourselves most higher risk sports wouldn't exist or be so crazily regulated that it would be insane.

You mean like base jumping?


human909 wrote:Base jumping is one of the VERY few sports that are banned in Australia solely for the risk to the individual participants.


il padrone wrote:So some sports that you don't agree with, or think are more dangerous than you would tolerate, get lebelled as 'insane'?

Great. You fit in well with the 2UE/3yAWn talkback clientele


human909 wrote:Personally I think it is a reckless sport and I have no desire to participate in it.


human909, do you listen to 2UE?
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby il padrone » Wed Feb 06, 2013 12:27 pm

human909 was not describing base-jumpers or the sport as 'insane'. You were the one who did that :roll:
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby jules21 » Wed Feb 06, 2013 12:28 pm

hope you're healing well pete.

i have further to add on helmets :)
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby wilddemon » Wed Feb 06, 2013 12:31 pm

il padrone wrote:human909 was not describing base-jumpers or the sport as 'insane'. You were the one who did that :roll:


maybe you should get that bump checked out.
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby il padrone » Wed Feb 06, 2013 12:32 pm

Broken collar-bone confirmed. Overlapping and fore-shortened 3 cms. I now have to get an appointment with the orthapedic surgeon. :(
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby il padrone » Wed Feb 06, 2013 12:34 pm

wilddemon wrote:
il padrone wrote:human909 was not describing base-jumpers or the sport as 'insane'. You were the one who did that :roll:


maybe you should get that bump checked out.

My head is just fine. Knocked out for 2 minutes and despite 4 hrs of observation I had no symptoms of concern.


Heal thyself, physician!
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby twizzle » Wed Feb 06, 2013 12:36 pm

il padrone wrote:
wilddemon wrote:
il padrone wrote:human909 was not describing base-jumpers or the sport as 'insane'. You were the one who did that :roll:


maybe you should get that bump checked out.

My head is just fine. Knocked out for 2 minutes and despite 4 hrs of observation I had no symptoms of concern.


Heal thyself, physician!


Yet research suggests that (long term), it's a significant injury.
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby human909 » Wed Feb 06, 2013 1:18 pm

wilddemon wrote:human909, do you listen to 2UE?

No. An please don't read into my comments more than they say.

I described base jumping as reckless. That is a personal opinion of mine and my attitude to risk. I recognise that other people are different, they have different desires and different appetites for risk.

As far as I am concerned base jumping is too much risk for ME to participate in. However as I said everyone appetite for risk differers, most males, particularly young males, hunger for risk. Personally I avoid most risks that I don't feel I can control. Hence skiing and mountain biking I am conservative in whereas in rock climbing I take significant calculated risks.
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby il padrone » Wed Feb 06, 2013 1:30 pm

twizzle wrote:
il padrone wrote:Heal thyself, physician!


Yet research suggests that (long term), it's a significant injury.

That was not a comment on my medical care nor recovery, but about wilddemon's inability to understand what he had posted (and his facetious implications about my 'bump'). Seems he has the "significant injury" ??
Last edited by il padrone on Wed Feb 06, 2013 1:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby wilddemon » Wed Feb 06, 2013 1:31 pm

il padrone wrote:Broken collar-bone confirmed. Overlapping and fore-shortened 3 cms. I now have to get an appointment with the orthapedic surgeon. :(


All "tongue in cheek" aside, I'm glad you are still here and I wish you a speedy recovery. Firstly and foremost, we are fellow human beings as well as cyclists so that puts us on the same ship, albeit on different decks (I'll take first class thanks).

Also, I'm glad that you were wearing a helmet. Many people don't have your "common sense". By the way, do you have private health insurance? Cycling insurance?

human909, don't worry, I expect your posts to be opinion. Significant calculated risks? So you free solo?
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby human909 » Wed Feb 06, 2013 1:51 pm

wilddemon wrote:Also, I'm glad that you were wearing a helmet. Many people don't have your "common sense".


I have never seen ANYBODY not wearing a helmet while mountain biking. In fact many mountain bikers go far and beyond mediocre bits of foam as protection. Many use full face helmets and body armour. Your assertion that many people don't have "common sense" [to wear a helmet] does not seem to be supported when it comes to mountain biking.
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby wilddemon » Wed Feb 06, 2013 2:59 pm

human909 wrote:
I have never seen ANYBODY not wearing a helmet while mountain biking. In fact many mountain bikers go far and beyond mediocre bits of foam as protection. Many use full face helmets and body armour. Your assertion that many people don't have "common sense" [to wear a helmet] does not seem to be supported when it comes to mountain biking.


Does not seem to be supported by what? Your opinion? I have seen mountain bikers not wearing helmets. I have lent a friend a helmet because I couldn't stand to watch him ride single trail without one. He's still got it. I hope he uses it.
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby Mulger bill » Wed Feb 06, 2013 5:34 pm

I'm disgusted that a law is needed ANYWHERE to stop people having a whizz in lifts :roll:

I'd call these people pigs but that's unfair to most pigs.
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby il padrone » Wed Feb 06, 2013 5:44 pm

elevator....? urinal....? elevator.... ? urinal.....? elevator!!


Some people just have trouble with their spolung :P :P :lol:
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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby Ross » Fri Feb 08, 2013 2:25 pm

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Re: Mandatory Helmet Laws & stuff (Was One & ONLY Helmet Thr

Postby Kenzo » Fri Feb 08, 2013 3:44 pm

Ross wrote:One for the anti-MHL people - http://grist.org/cities/bike-sharing-go ... t-problem/

Thanks Ross, interesting link at the end of that article too: http://grist.org/article/2010-10-11-the ... -cyclists/ regarding more cyclists equates to better safety.. and links to a 2003 academic paper on the topic.
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