QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Equipment and On Road Behaviour, Laws and Rules. Cycling Promotion and Advocacy

Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby Ken Ho » Tue May 21, 2013 8:19 am

Not sure if you are looking for feedback on the design draft there, but I see it as too busy, and the "1.5m" font is too small as a result.
From what I've read, a "Dark Side of the Moon" design gives the best protection.
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by BNA » Tue May 21, 2013 8:59 am

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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby The 2nd Womble » Tue May 21, 2013 8:59 am

Ken Ho wrote:Not sure if you are looking for feedback on the design draft there, but I see it as too busy, and the "1.5m" font is too small as a result.
From what I've read, a "Dark Side of the Moon" design gives the best protection.

I have been looking at options for the sizing of the back. ATM my preference is to remove the car altogether and use the additional space to effectively double the size of the cyclist and 1.5 chevron.
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby diggler » Wed May 22, 2013 12:15 pm

Even if it becomes law, do you really believe cops would enforce it? At the very least, you need a video camera before a cop gets off his arse. Even with video I think most cops couldn't be bothered.

If you really want a metre (or a metre and a half) you need a horizontal safety flag.
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby human909 » Wed May 22, 2013 2:21 pm

diggler wrote:If you really want a metre (or a metre and a half) you need a horizontal safety flag.


Or a comprehensive government backed safety campaign emphasising the need for motorists to drive safely around cyclist and backed up by appropriate enforcement!
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby g-boaf » Wed May 22, 2013 2:43 pm

diggler wrote:Even if it becomes law, do you really believe cops would enforce it? At the very least, you need a video camera before a cop gets off his arse. Even with video I think most cops couldn't be bothered.

If you really want a metre (or a metre and a half) you need a horizontal safety flag.


What about an umbrella held out at right angles? The Jane Caro solution.
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby ozzymac » Wed May 22, 2013 5:19 pm

How about a shirt that says YOU ARE UNDER VIDEO SURVEILLANCE....


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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby Ken Ho » Wed May 22, 2013 5:49 pm

diggler wrote:Even if it becomes law, do you really believe cops would enforce it? At the very least, you need a video camera before a cop gets off his arse. Even with video I think most cops couldn't be bothered.

If you really want a metre (or a metre and a half) you need a horizontal safety flag.


Nice thought, but fther they hit the flag, you are going to crash. Maybe I it was on a very flexible wip, but even then, I honk it would actually increase the risk. Hologram, maybe ??
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby KonaCommuter » Wed May 22, 2013 6:35 pm

ozzymac wrote:How about a shirt that says YOU ARE UNDER VIDEO SURVEILLANCE....


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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby The 2nd Womble » Wed May 22, 2013 6:39 pm

You could be onto something.
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby ozzymac » Wed May 22, 2013 6:39 pm

KonaCommuter wrote:
ozzymac wrote:How about a shirt that says YOU ARE UNDER VIDEO SURVEILLANCE....


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That's the American version.

Cheers


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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby The 2nd Womble » Thu May 23, 2013 8:01 pm

Another interview in tomorrow's Cairns Post on the petition while Cairns starts it cycling road safety campaign, and some huge stuff on the way including links to the petition in an international press release from one of the world's most well known corporations.
Also, there has been movement in the parliament today by Bruce Flegg. This from an insider earlier this arvo:

"Thought you might like to know Bruce gave an excellent speech in Parliament today in the Private Members Statements (approx 3.45pm) about cycling safety and the petition. He also mentioned you and Safe Cycling Australia. If I can get a transcript I will send it on to you to read."
And:
"No you can post it as its a fabulous boost for the petition, you and SCA! You might want to do a brief update post tonite and then when Hansard produce the full transcript of the day you can get the full details from it. You may not be able to access until toomorrow morning. If Bruce emails me the transcript tonite I will get it to you before then. Parliament has been sitting until after 11.30pm so you might get it before we do!"

Bruce used his time today to draw the Transport Minister in, showing his years of political experience:

http://www.parliament.qld.gov.au/docume ... 523_NP.pdf ... there's a question on notice: DR FLEGG ASKED THE MINISTER FOR TRANSPORT AND MAIN ROADS (MR EMERSON)—
Will the Minister advise the number of accidents involving cyclists, indicating number involving injuries and number involving fatalities, within the electorate of Moggill and also throughout Queensland over the past five years?"

Of course I found this as well while I was scrolling through. So funny:

"Mr McARDLE: I withdraw the word ‘liar’ and say ‘untruthful individual rodent’."
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby The 2nd Womble » Thu May 23, 2013 8:58 pm

Just received:

Queensland Parliament Hansard Green
DATE: 23/05/2013
FILE: 23052013_000127_LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY_GREEN CHAMBER.DOCX SUBJECT: Road Safety, Cyclists
MEMBER: Dr FLEGG
Road Safety, Cyclists
Dr FLEGG (Moggill—LNP) (3.46 pm): The roads of our cities are for the use of all of our citizens. A recent court decision throws into serious doubt the view held in some parts of the community that existing road laws are adequate to protect cyclists on our roads. Last year, on a notoriously congested, narrow, inadequate and dangerous stretch of Moggill Road, between the Kenmore roundabout and Chapel Hill, a wonderful young life was lost when Richard Pollett, a gifted young musician, was fatally injured by an overtaking truck. The truck was 2.5 metres wide. The lane where Richard’s body was found is 3.1 metres wide and is only 3.4 metres wide at its widest point.
What more stark illustration could there be that a metre matters? Under the law in Queensland, a bicycle is a vehicle which has the same right to use the road as every other road vehicle and is therefore obliged to abide by the same rules as every other road vehicle. Richard was doing the right thing by traffic on that road by keeping to the left to make it easy for small vehicles to pass him. He could have legally ridden in the middle of the lane of traffic. The court’s decision to dismiss the charges against the truck driver would appear to be through a loophole in the Criminal Code, which states that a vehicle, including a truck, can overtake a cyclist without allowing any particular margin providing the driver of the vehicle has a reasonable belief that it is safe to do so. There is now no question that existing laws do not adequately protect cyclists.
When I was asked to sponsor a petition by Mr David Sharp from Safe Cycling Australia, I did not hesitate to do so. I have always believed that legislation which prescribes a minimum distance when overtaking should be introduced to protect cyclists. A distance of 1.5 metres is good practice and good courtesy. One metre should be the barest minimum allowed by law. It is not safe to overtake if there is not a distance of at least one metre. Over 4,000 people have already signed this online petition, and I urge members and the community to get on board and sign it at the parliamentary website.
Whilst you can get an idiot on a bike, just as you can get an idiot in a car, I cannot stress strongly enough that the vast majority of car drivers and truck drivers are safe and responsible, as are the vast majority of bike riders, who try to minimise the inconvenience caused to traffic.
Whilst the road toll has dropped in the last decade, bicycle deaths in Queensland have not. There are around 6,000 cyclist emergency department presentations per annum in Queensland, most of them children. This is a large human toll. The economic cost to the state is $450 million annually. If we want to save lives and save the huge human toll of very serious injury, the government and the community need to act. We do need better bicycle infrastructure, particularly in the western suburbs, and I note that the push to legislate is strongly supported by the Amy Gillett Foundation, which is also doing wonderful work for bicycle safety.
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby InTheWoods » Thu May 23, 2013 9:01 pm

Wow! :D
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby Philipthelam » Thu May 23, 2013 9:12 pm

:D :) :o :P :!:

Good job Dr Flegg
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby The 2nd Womble » Thu May 23, 2013 9:21 pm

Bruce be da shizzle!

Maybe SCA should start down the road of memberships with cyclist insurance. You'd have peace if mind AND advocacy then.
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby InTheWoods » Thu May 23, 2013 9:43 pm

The 2nd Womble wrote:Maybe SCA should start down the road of memberships with cyclist insurance. You'd have peace if mind AND advocacy then.


I'd switch :)

I'm a BQ member (for the insurance, really) and am very disappointed by the lack of effort from them on the advocacy front.
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby ldrcycles » Thu May 23, 2013 9:54 pm

Having insurance through my Cycling Australia membership helps me to justify the expense (and of course the matter of no licence no race).
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby The 2nd Womble » Thu May 23, 2013 10:56 pm

ldrcycles wrote:Having insurance through my Cycling Australia membership helps me to justify the expense (and of course the matter of no licence no race).

CA? Yup, all good.
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby ozzymac » Fri May 24, 2013 8:19 am

The 2nd Womble wrote:I simply don't care to comment any further on anything regarding the AGF. As for why some are still pushing for less than 1.5, ask them.


Hi,
I sent off an email to them a few days back asking them and so far I haven't heard back... Maybe they don't know or the question was to difficult.


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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby The 2nd Womble » Fri May 24, 2013 8:41 am

Erm, mmm mmm mm m mmmmmm mmm mmm.
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby Summernight » Fri May 24, 2013 11:16 am

Now that is what the parliaments are for! Well done Bruce Flegg!
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby Ken Ho » Fri May 24, 2013 11:48 am

Have to add my humble thanks to David for having the guts and determination to do this. I live with the elbow shave threat and don't like it one little bit.
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby The 2nd Womble » Fri May 24, 2013 12:42 pm

FCS... 1.5 metres. 1 metre is NEVER enough for Qld cyclists! http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/polls/q ... .html#poll
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby Mulger bill » Fri May 24, 2013 3:10 pm

The 2nd Womble wrote:FCS... 1.5 metres. 1 metre is NEVER enough for Qld cyclists! http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/polls/q ... .html#poll

Amazing how when a body pushes for 1.5 that another body, which, less than a month ago would have spluttered indignantly about even a metre seems to be supportive of the AGF stance. Would it be OTT to assume that they have felt the grounswell of support for rider safety and safe passing and decided to champion what they would see as the lesser evil?[/cynic]
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Re: QLD Minimum Safe Passing Distance e-petition

Postby The 2nd Womble » Fri May 24, 2013 3:21 pm

Glad you noticed it. I was threatened with a law suit (have the Lawyer's emails) so I had to bite my tongue.
Last edited by The 2nd Womble on Fri May 24, 2013 3:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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