Weight loss through cycling

[winstonw]

Winstonw are you saying you lost 3kg in one month?

Weight loss is relatively easy for those who do a lot of exercise. All it takes is good food knowledge and the ability to apply that knowledge to one self.

Acquiring and implementing that knowledge is the challenge and there are people here who are happy to share their experiences

no I am saying the diff between my high volume (May) and low volume (June) months will equal around 3kg of body fat.
Based on previous experience, I think I will lose more weight reducing my exercise/general activity, and focusing on calming stuff like meditation and yoga.

Yes, you could retort that I am n=1 so my experience doesn't apply to all, but in my clinical experience, many overweight people do not manage psychoemotional stress well, and it is these that dysregulate various physiological systems that impact appetite.

Anyway, I am just saying more exercise is not the simple solution for weight loss some think. When stress spills over to distress, homeostasis is lost.

[Marty Moose]

Still think you can read studies and read studies! Food pyramid plus 1200 to 1500 cals per day for an average male you will loose weight(no more than a kg per week) and get an education in the correct way to eat that is sustainable. Plenty on here comment on how to loose weight but then in other threads "I need to loose weight" its not hard its easy. Loosing weight takes commitment(breaking of bad habits often emotional) scales and a diary that's all, no extremes no paleo, no high protein just a balance. If its unsustainable then its another fad diet not a healthy eating plan. Why does this have to be this hard ? Go here http://www.calorieking.com.au/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; buy the counter $10 and a diary for $5 done! Read it adapt to yourself and you will loose weight its not rocket science. We can play games and one up man ship all day but in the end its pretty simple.

MM

[casual_cyclist]

I rode 6190km in Jan. I put on 3kg. Hydration, blood volume, muscle and glycogen levels can all be enhanced and weight goes up.

The skinny cyclist diet is caffeine free. Low in added salt (the more salt you eat, the more water retention you hold as your body needs to dilute the excess sodium to keep electrolytes in balance).

Water
fruit
sugar
steamed starches like rice, potato, yam etc

UNLIMITED calories

I eat infinity calories too... but no matter how many infinity calories I eat I never seem to reach my goal of cycling infinity kilometres in a month. Every time I seem like I get close, I just miss out.

[casual_cyclist]

I rode 6190km in Jan. I put on 3kg. Hydration, blood volume, muscle and glycogen levels can all be enhanced and weight goes up.

So you claim. You also wrote in another post...

#6000km in a month?! lol! Not even pro's ride that much during the TDF!

viewtopic.php?f=49&t=61166&p=926725#p926725

[twizzle]

Still think you can read studies and read studies! Food pyramid plus 1200 to 1500 cals per day for an average male you will loose weight(no more than a kg per week) and get an education in the correct way to eat that is sustainable. Plenty on here comment on how to loose weight but then in other threads "I need to loose weight" its not hard its easy. Loosing weight takes commitment(breaking of bad habits often emotional) scales and a diary that's all, no extremes no paleo, no high protein just a balance. If its unsustainable then its another fad diet not a healthy eating plan. Why does this have to be this hard ? Go here http://www.calorieking.com.au/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; buy the counter $10 and a diary for $5 done! Read it adapt to yourself and you will loose weight its not rocket science. We can play games and one up man ship all day but in the end its pretty simple.

MM

So those studies with thousands of participants that show that most people cannot lose significant weight and keep it off via calorie restriction are all lying?

[warthog1]

I lost 7 kg recently,FIIKH really. I upped the miles a bit and cut back on carbs. Seems to be staying off.
I read something about protein satisfying the hunger better than carbs. I've been eating those little flavoured tuna tins for snacks.

[singlespeedscott]

I've been eating those little flavoured tuna tins for snacks.

The novelty of them will wear off quick . I went through a period of eating them for lunch. I cant stomach the smell any more.

[Marty Moose]

Still think you can read studies and read studies! Food pyramid plus 1200 to 1500 cals per day for an average male you will loose weight(no more than a kg per week) and get an education in the correct way to eat that is sustainable. Plenty on here comment on how to loose weight but then in other threads "I need to loose weight" its not hard its easy. Loosing weight takes commitment(breaking of bad habits often emotional) scales and a diary that's all, no extremes no paleo, no high protein just a balance. If its unsustainable then its another fad diet not a healthy eating plan. Why does this have to be this hard ? Go here http://www.calorieking.com.au/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; buy the counter $10 and a diary for $5 done! Read it adapt to yourself and you will loose weight its not rocket science. We can play games and one up man ship all day but in the end its pretty simple.

MM

So those studies with thousands of participants that show that most people cannot lose significant weight and keep it off via calorie restriction are all lying?

Nope not at all Twiz. For the most part any low calorie diet that doesn't encourage a sustainable way of eating is doomed to fail which is why most low calorie diets do fail. I watch people all the time yo yo from one fad low cal diet to the next and most of them (all) are still fat, In the mean time I chow down rice, potatoes, lean meat, gluten free pasta,nuts, heaps of fruit and guess what I'm not fat. Then I get "your lucky its your genetics" rubbish. At the end of the day if you don't consume less calories than you need you will not loose weight, what that figure is or needs to be you need to work out yourself with a diary and scales. Once you reach your goal weight keep eating the same way just more food its not a diet so to speak but a way of life.

The irony is Twiz with the greatest of respect (its the internet no non verbals) have you reached your goal (lean) weight yet after reading all the studies?

MM

[Apple]

Still think you can read studies and read studies! Food pyramid plus 1200 to 1500 cals per day for an average male you will loose weight(no more than a kg per week) and get an education in the correct way to eat that is sustainable. Plenty on here comment on how to loose weight but then in other threads "I need to loose weight" its not hard its easy. Loosing weight takes commitment(breaking of bad habits often emotional) scales and a diary that's all, no extremes no paleo, no high protein just a balance. If its unsustainable then its another fad diet not a healthy eating plan. Why does this have to be this hard ? Go here http://www.calorieking.com.au/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; buy the counter $10 and a diary for $5 done! Read it adapt to yourself and you will loose weight its not rocket science. We can play games and one up man ship all day but in the end its pretty simple.

MM

Yes, right answer. But isn't it amazing how every Tom Dick and Harry can write a new fad and people will fall for it every time.
I am with you. All you need is the correct calories in and calories burned out. A Pen and paper to write what you eat during the day and the scales. Be patient. weight will come off when intake is reduced on calorie input.

I myself do not observe these rules as I love food. So I will just blame it on age, being a woman, hormonal imbalance and not sure yet what else but I will find something.

[winstonw]

Marty, I agree with your general view. 1200 for women and 1500 for men applies to a majority of overweight people.
However, that's because for most those intakes create a deficit somewhere between 250 and 1000 Cals per day, which many over a week or so, become comfortable with.

But for many, a deficit over 500 Cals is very very difficult to stick to.
And if you get someone who is doing a lot of moderate to high intensity exercise, they are going to consume blood glucose and glycogen stores, more so than fat reserves.
And if you get someone insulin resistant, they are going to crave simple sugars more regularly than others.
And those with buggered thyroids, or pituitarys, are likely to have cravings normals cannot understand.
And those with stretched and dysfunctional stomachs, and dysregulated ghrelin/leptin, are going to find a Calorie deficit of 250+ Cals extremely difficult.

Anyway, at the end of the day, it is math....but the success of the math is determined by how comfortable a dieter "feels" on the deficit.
And out of left field, I wouldn't be surprised if we find one day a viral or bacterial infection explains a significant portion of this obesity epidemic (in that satiety is dysregulated somewhere by bugs).

[matagi]

And out of left field, I wouldn't be surprised if we find one day a viral or bacterial infection explains a significant portion of this obesity epidemic (in that satiety is dysregulated somewhere by bugs).

Not left field at all, but I reckon it will turn out to be something common to processed food, which would explain why countries where the population adopt a Western diet over their traditional diet end up with the same obesity issues.

[warthog1]

I've been eating those little flavoured tuna tins for snacks.

The novelty of them will wear off quick . I went through a period of eating them for lunch. I cant stomach the smell any more.

They are only a snack for when I weaken between meals. It's working so far, I'll eat them if I'm hungry enough, I still like the chilli varieties.
I'm sure the gloss will wear off, I'm hopeful I'll just eat less of them and not substitute them for some fat storing rubbish. Maybe some nuts or the like will help too, I've been munching on a nut/seed mix at work.

[Apple]

I've been eating those little flavoured tuna tins for snacks.

The novelty of them will wear off quick . I went through a period of eating them for lunch. I cant stomach the smell any more.

I eat them as well, I now put bacon in the microwave and crisp it. The problem is when I drink a glass of red, I always want the cheese and biscuits to come out, once that is consumed I take out the Swiss chocolate Sooooooooooooo good

[singlespeedscott]

I love how everybody blames the traditional western diet for the problems of obesity in modern society. In my mind the traditional western diet was meat and 3 veg. Pretty much standard diet for most of us growing up in the 50's, 60's and 70's. It is the invasion of cheap fast food franchises from the US aka Macca's and KFC in the 70's that brought about a problem with the bulge. Have a look at images of Aussies from the 70's back. The traditional western diet didn't appear to be so bad for people's waste lines.

[Alien27]

Modern western diet then, coupled with modern western lifestyle.

[twizzle]

So those studies with thousands of participants that show that most people cannot lose significant weight and keep it off via calorie restriction are all lying?

Nope not at all Twiz. For the most part any low calorie diet that doesn't encourage a sustainable way of eating is doomed to fail which is why most low calorie diets do fail. I watch people all the time yo yo from one fad low cal diet to the next and most of them (all) are still fat, In the mean time I chow down rice, potatoes, lean meat, gluten free pasta,nuts, heaps of fruit and guess what I'm not fat. Then I get "your lucky its your genetics" rubbish. At the end of the day if you don't consume less calories than you need you will not loose weight, what that figure is or needs to be you need to work out yourself with a diary and scales. Once you reach your goal weight keep eating the same way just more food its not a diet so to speak but a way of life.

The irony is Twiz with the greatest of respect (its the internet no non verbals) have you reached your goal (lean) weight yet after reading all the studies?

MM

So you agree that the studies don't lie, but it's because it's an "unsustainable" calorie reduction? What's "sustainable" then? Were you ever fat?

Sent from my iThingy...

[Marty Moose]

So those studies with thousands of participants that show that most people cannot lose significant weight and keep it off via calorie restriction are all lying?

Nope not at all Twiz. For the most part any low calorie diet that doesn't encourage a sustainable way of eating is doomed to fail which is why most low calorie diets do fail. I watch people all the time yo yo from one fad low cal diet to the next and most of them (all) are still fat, In the mean time I chow down rice, potatoes, lean meat, gluten free pasta,nuts, heaps of fruit and guess what I'm not fat. Then I get "your lucky its your genetics" rubbish. At the end of the day if you don't consume less calories than you need you will not loose weight, what that figure is or needs to be you need to work out yourself with a diary and scales. Once you reach your goal weight keep eating the same way just more food its not a diet so to speak but a way of life.

The irony is Twiz with the greatest of respect (its the internet no non verbals) have you reached your goal (lean) weight yet after reading all the studies?

MM

So you agree that the studies don't lie, but it's because it's an "unsustainable" calorie reduction? What's "sustainable" then? Were you ever fat?

Sent from my iThingy...

I think studies are useful yes! However I think more than often they are very narrow in focus and are a good guide and thats all, they also make it very easy to get bogged down in the science not the day to day application of their data. I guess what I'm saying is eat the meat and spit out the bones or if you are a vego eat the tato not the skin (I don't want to hear the skin is healthy ) As in the nature of science it changes and should be looked at in a grey light not black and white.

Sustainable is starting out eating 1200-1500 cals positive a day and see how you go, if its not possible increase to a level you can handle its not easy though. If you don't eat less than you need you will not loose and you WILL feel hungry at first.

Have I ever been fat?? What is fat! Depends on your view, in western eyes no I have not. I have a size 32" waist and weight about 82-83kg and am reasonably lean or so I'm told, had a NRS rider ask me what I've been doing last Saturday as my legs looked ripped I laughed and said "resting I've been sick":) . If I get fat in my eyes I push a 34" waist and feel really bad.I raced A grade at around 78-80kg in my 20's but am happy where I am now. I love icecream If I cut it out I guess I'd drop more but don't want too I like it

My wife is the mover here she was 92kg and 5"4 now she is 54-56kg still 5"4 (size 6-8 for the ladies reading) and has been that way for 15yrs this year. She knows more about eating and the emotional side of being fat than most as she had an eating disorder for a long time. I lived this with her so have opinions on the subject and have seen her and others have great results with what I'm talking about. I know WInstow brought up medical issues I don't know enough to comment but the principal are the same its simple math.

Remember the 1200-1500 positive is based on the food pyramid not paleo or any other what I see as wacky way of eating. Its not a diet but a way of life.

MM

ps I like hot chips sometimes to with salt .....................

[mikesbytes]

I love how everybody blames the traditional western diet for the problems of obesity in modern society. In my mind the traditional western diet was meat and 3 veg. Pretty much standard diet for most of us growing up in the 50's, 60's and 70's. It is the invasion of cheap fast food franchises from the US aka Macca's and KFC in the 70's that brought about a problem with the bulge. Have a look at images of Aussies from the 70's back. The traditional western diet didn't appear to be so bad for people's waste lines.

Yes, in the 50's the average person knew bugger all about nutrition and yet they were so much thinner than today. What did the eat - meat and 3 veg. What did they snack on - nothing.

To add to the list of problems above;

• Heavily marketed cheap carbohydrates (soft drinks, sugar laden breakfast products, etc)
• A considerable reduction in incidental exercise
• Portion size
• Adders to dinners such as sauces etc etc etc etc
• Snacking

It wouldn't surprise me if booze consumption is up since the 50's too

And it goes on from there, the marketing machine sells us products marked as diet or healthy. This is based on it being different to its equivalent product.

If your looking to loose weight, start a food log, be honest with it and review/reflect

And if you don't know what's good for you, use the closer to the farm principal, most manufactured foods are of lower quality than stuff straight from the farm. Hard to beat vegetables for quality

[casual_cyclist]

I love how everybody blames the traditional western diet for the problems of obesity in modern society. In my mind the traditional western diet was meat and 3 veg. Pretty much standard diet for most of us growing up in the 50's, 60's and 70's. It is the invasion of cheap fast food franchises from the US aka Macca's and KFC in the 70's that brought about a problem with the bulge. Have a look at images of Aussies from the 70's back. The traditional western diet didn't appear to be so bad for people's waste lines.

Yes, in the 50's the average person knew bugger all about nutrition and yet they were so much thinner than today. What did the eat - meat and 3 veg. What did they snack on - nothing.

To add to the list of problems above;

• Heavily marketed cheap carbohydrates (soft drinks, sugar laden breakfast products, etc)
• A considerable reduction in incidental exercise
• Portion size
• Adders to dinners such as sauces etc etc etc etc
• Snacking

Yes, yes and yes. Add to the list potato crisps and the giant mega-muffins they sell you with your morning coffee.

It's not just the food though, it's food availability. Food is ubiquitious. Almost everywhere I go now there is ready to eat food available at all hours of the day or night. And people are eating it. I walk around town and see people stuffing food into their faces at all times of the day and night. It's like they can't stand feeling even a little bit hungry. Go to the movies and in the quiet spots it sounds like a paddock in there. It's a little bit disgusting

There does seem to be something unique about a modern western lifestyle though:

...the French are gradually falling foul of "Anglo-Saxon" couch potato and fast food culture, increasingly grazing between meals or in front of computer screens...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... llion.html

According to the latest data from the World Health Organisation (WHO), Pacific island nations occupy the top seven places in the global obesity rankings. Diet is the main reason: people who once subsisted on fish, coconuts and root vegetables now eat imported processed foods that are high in sugar and fat.

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style ... 69418.html

[casual_cyclist]

Still think you can read studies and read studies! Food pyramid plus 1200 to 1500 cals per day for an average male you will loose weight(no more than a kg per week) and get an education in the correct way to eat that is sustainable. Plenty on here comment on how to loose weight but then in other threads "I need to loose weight" its not hard its easy. Loosing weight takes commitment(breaking of bad habits often emotional) scales and a diary that's all, no extremes no paleo, no high protein just a balance. If its unsustainable then its another fad diet not a healthy eating plan. Why does this have to be this hard ? Go here http://www.calorieking.com.au/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; buy the counter $10 and a diary for $5 done! Read it adapt to yourself and you will loose weight its not rocket science. We can play games and one up man ship all day but in the end its pretty simple.

MM

So those studies with thousands of participants that show that most people cannot lose significant weight and keep it off via calorie restriction are all lying?

Nope not at all Twiz. For the most part any low calorie diet that doesn't encourage a sustainable way of eating is doomed to fail which is why most low calorie diets do fail. I watch people all the time yo yo from one fad low cal diet to the next and most of them (all) are still fat, In the mean time I chow down rice, potatoes, lean meat, gluten free pasta,nuts, heaps of fruit and guess what I'm not fat. Then I get "your lucky its your genetics" rubbish. At the end of the day if you don't consume less calories than you need you will not loose weight, what that figure is or needs to be you need to work out yourself with a diary and scales. Once you reach your goal weight keep eating the same way just more food its not a diet so to speak but a way of life.

The irony is Twiz with the greatest of respect (its the internet no non verbals) have you reached your goal (lean) weight yet after reading all the studies?

MM

I can't speak for Twiz but I read the studies and have eaten myself from obese to goad (lean) weight in the last couple of years. The studies did help. I don't agree with calorie counting though. It doesn't work for me because I eat home cooked food that is cooked up in big batches and refrigerated or frozen. I refuse to take the time to calculate the number of calories in those meals or try to work out how many calories I need etc. I also didn't weigh myself much, I preferred to base my eating on hunger rather than bathroom scales.

My top tips to go from obese->normal weight based on my experience are:
* change your expectations, if it took 10 years to put the weight on, don't expect it to dissapear in a month
* reduce portion sizes
* eat more slowly and chew your food properly
* cut back on refined carbs (especially flour and sugar)
* more vegetables (I prefer sweet potato)
* adequate fat (I prefer coconut)
* no refined carb snacks (I prefer nuts, fruit, cheese, vegetables)
* get enough sleep
* limit snacking to one snack between meals and only if you need it
* fast occassionally, it won't kill you but it will remind you what proper hunger actually feels like
* restrict "treats" to one day and week and on that day, don't go nuts
* walk after dinner
* no snacking at all after dinner
* rice, pasta or legumes for dinner worked really well for me

My weight loss was painfully slow at a rate of 1kg to 1.5kg per month on most months. On the upside, it's a lifestyle not a diet, so it is sustainable. Sure it took a couple of years to get to a normal weight, but more than 6 months later my weight is stable. Last time I did a crash diet and lost the weight in a couple of months, I put it all back on with interest. My weight loss goals are now in the 5 to 10 year range, not the week or month range.

I don't agree with the concept that a calorie is a calorie. If I eat a 500 calorie meal (low fat, low protein, high in refined carbs) and I'm hungry an hour later that is no use to me. If I eat a 500 calorie meal (higer fat, higer protein, lower in refined carbs) and I'm not hungry 4 hours later, that's great. The quality of your calories if far more important than the quantity.

[matagi]

It's not just the food though, it's food availability. Food is ubiquitious. Almost everywhere I go now there is ready to eat food available at all hours of the day or night. And people are eating it. I walk around town and see people stuffing food into their faces at all times of the day and night. It's like they can't stand feeling even a little bit hungry. Go to the movies and in the quiet spots it sounds like a paddock in there. It's a little bit disgusting

I know what you mean.

I find it interesting that people can't seem to manage even a one hour aeroplane flight without eating.

[twizzle]

...
Have I ever been fat?? What is fat! Depends on your view, in western eyes no I have not.
...

Yeah, well... so you've never experienced the joys of mental fuzz, physical lethargy, shakes, inability to maintain body warmth at night (where is my beanie!?), sleep disruption (Oh crap, it's 3am again, I'm now going to be awake for an hour) etc. that accompanies prolonged weight loss every time you get the calorie balance wrong.

I found the first 15kg relatively easy, the next 5kg's pretty hard and the next 10kg's required a very significant change in my lifestyle avoiding pretty much everything "first world" (turns out my two hospital trips are atypical presentation of gall-stones. Yay me.). I've only been working on the "how we lose weight" question this last year because I was annoyed that I was able to easily lose 1kg/week back when I first started cycling and again when I went full "Paleo like", but after 6-12months (in both cases) the weight loss stops or reverses.

And, IMO the studies will never tell you what works... the studies help you avoid tactics that are unlikely to succeed.

BTW - I can't find the story again, (Dr Karl's book on digestion?) but years ago one of the research hospitals had a bunch of obese people they were experimenting on. There was one woman who was able to gain weight despite what they thought was a significant calorie deficit. Her BMR was extremely low, and her digestive flora were extremely efficient at extracting energy from the food.

Sent from my iThingy...

[warthog1]

I eat them as well, I now put bacon in the microwave and crisp it. The problem is when I drink a glass of red, I always want the cheese and biscuits to come out, once that is consumed I take out the Swiss chocolate Sooooooooooooo good

You are in deep trouble

[winstonw]

My top tips to go from obese->normal weight based on my experience are:
* change your expectations, if it took 10 years to put the weight on, don't expect it to dissapear in a month
* reduce portion sizes
* eat more slowly and chew your food properly
* cut back on refined carbs (especially flour and sugar)
* more vegetables (I prefer sweet potato)
* adequate fat (I prefer coconut)

The people I deal with are not happy with the above recommendations.
They want to lose weight at a medically safe rate, at a reasonable pace.
"reducing portions" could mean anything. reduce by how much? There's too much hit and miss and doubt in the dieter's mind. When a dieter starts to have strong hunger pangs, as they invariably do when starting off, they will question whether they reduced their portions too much. This is where a diet of a known number of Calories (1200/1500) with specific portion sizes instills confidence when hunger hits; especially when the person's energy expenditure has been estimated and a specific Calorie deficit established.

Statements like "cut back on refined carbs", "eat more veges", "eat adequate fat", are not actionable. They don't quantify what most dieters feel insecure about - the quantity of each food group.

One doesn't have to Calorie count if the counting has already been done in the form of a diet plan.
And for most, they want the weight off at a reasonable clip, 0.5-1.0kg/week.
Seeing the weight come off at a reasonable pace empowers dieters. They realize "wow, it is all about the math". If weight loss is slow, doubt creeps in re whether they are doing things right, or as good as they could.
Anyway, this is all in the literature. I have no interest in pushing what specifically worked/s for me.

BTW, as of tonight, I've ridden 1270km in the last 3 weeks....with no weight loss.
Next month, I'll be meditating, doing yoga, not touching coffee and alcohol, and not cycling more than 500km in total. As I have done this month, I'll be eating what I feel "comfortable" with.

[toolonglegs]

1 yoga class per week,...

yawn...