Touring weight

All about touring, whether you are a local or visiting from overseas.

Re: Touring weight

Postby }SkOrPn--7 » Mon Apr 15, 2013 11:05 am

I don't worry about locks BB I have a private security firm that always looks over my rig. It's called the public way too many folks intrigued with the bike so thief's don't get a look in. In all serious I have never had an issue and I leave all my electronics in plain view.

Ricky

PS on the weight subject including bike probably 120+ kilos
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by BNA » Mon Apr 15, 2013 4:02 pm

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Re: Touring weight

Postby GJ_Coop » Mon Apr 15, 2013 4:02 pm

I've always been worried about answering the question how much does it all weigh but I found out when I strained the baggage limits when I flew to NZ.

65kg.

That includes the bike, about 15kg, I s'pose.

That's the base weight of luggage, 50kg before I added the consumables.

I think the heaviest was when I went from Exmouth to Meekatharra, across the Gascoyne, 860km without a single shop so I had 20 days food aboard, 20 odd litres of water at one stage and 2 litres of fuel, probably another 40kg.

Did I worry?

Not a bit although I could hardly keep the bike upright when I started out.

What's with that 50kg of base load: panniers, trailer, tent, sleeping bag and mat, computer, diary, notebook, 3 cameras, two spare tyres, 6 spare tubes, bulk spokes, and tools for everything, Whisperlite, one pot for cooking, my kettle, man I couldn't cope with coffee that tasted like spaghetti, toiletries, minimal clothes, but a raincoat and things to keep warm when it mattered, thongs for showers, etc. It all adds up.

The one thing I lugged that I had my doubts about was my plumbers tap fitting, for getting water out of places where there was no fitting I finally used in Albury of all places where I just couldn't find a public water point and used it on a tap outside a supermarket. That was my least used thing I lugged.

I just can't see the sense in not taking a knife to save weight, particularly when you are lugging 26kg of water as I did at one stage.

When I did my big push-a-thon from the Geehi River up to the top of Grey Mare Mountain (~1870m) I did start to wonder about the sense in carrying it all, at one stage when I was trying to get up a heavily grassed track, lush beyond belief, I had to carry stuff up the hill in three trips. I talked about it here http://www.cycletrailsaustralia.com/7b-blog/grey-mare-hut but it was actually about the day before which has a better photo. You do these things.

You can skimp if you tootle through closely settled parts for a few weeks. On a longer, or more remote, trip you just have to take it because not having a spare tyre on the Birdsville, for instance, is a trip breaker.

There's no right answer about this, it's individual choice, but avoiding becoming obsessed about weight helps keep you sane.

And in the end, it doesn't really matter much.
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Re: Touring weight

Postby }SkOrPn--7 » Mon Apr 15, 2013 5:19 pm

Good post GJC weight is a very personal thing and can never be transferred to another rider touring. We all have different needs and equipment that we have to carry which in turns effects weight and if you obsess over it your tour will end up being miserable in many instances. I never worry about weight either I just ride....

Ricky
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Re: Touring weight

Postby bumblebea » Tue Apr 16, 2013 7:09 am

Generally I've not found much need for a lock in tour

I don't worry about locks BB I have a private security firm that always looks over my rig


wow, that's very good news. thank goodness for the nosey public.

thank you!
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Re: Touring weight

Postby }SkOrPn--7 » Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:04 am

bumblebea wrote:
Generally I've not found much need for a lock in tour

I don't worry about locks BB I have a private security firm that always looks over my rig


wow, that's very good news. thank goodness for the nosey public.

thank you!


Just don't be complaisant I still keep an eye on things when I can but going into supermarkets to restock is the hard part but I like to think that for the most people are all good in nature and not thief's.

It's funny to over hear little Mary or Jonny telling there younger baby sister or brother off for touching things that are not there's. It's nice to know that the kids are being brought up right with manners and respect.

Ricky
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Re: Touring weight

Postby RonK » Tue Apr 16, 2013 3:55 pm

}SkOrPn--7 wrote:We all have different needs and equipment that we have to carry which in turns effects weight and if you obsess over it your tour will end up being miserable in many instances.

Your tour can just as easily end up being miserable if you are undisciplined about what you carry.
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Re: Touring weight

Postby Baalzamon » Tue Apr 16, 2013 4:25 pm

bumblebea wrote:
Generally I've not found much need for a lock in tour

I don't worry about locks BB I have a private security firm that always looks over my rig


wow, that's very good news. thank goodness for the nosey public.

thank you!


But in saying that }SkOrPn--7 has a non standard bike. Ricky rides a recumbent trike so ofc people are going to look and want to touch sometimes. I know from experience riding a recumbent trike for a while

Last tour I did, I had to go to the chemist on the way out of town. Was inside for a few minutes. When I came out first thing I noticed was my rear brake cable had been unattached from the rear brake. Think someone tried to take off with it, but when the bike wouldn't move they must have thought the rear brake was locked on and removed the cable. Instead I was running an Abus Amparo 4850 which locked the rear wheel and prevented being wheeled/ridden away
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Re: Touring weight

Postby }SkOrPn--7 » Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:09 pm

RonK wrote:
}SkOrPn--7 wrote:We all have different needs and equipment that we have to carry which in turns effects weight and if you obsess over it your tour will end up being miserable in many instances.

Your tour can just as easily end up being miserable if you are undisciplined about what you carry.


Very true Ron I still only take what I need but I do live in comfort only thing is I don't skimp on spare parts or tools to strip and build a bike. I don't live in snack bars, roadhouses or cafe's etc so I'm hauling food to cover 4 weeks at a time or living of the land so that adds up. I must say though that when I tour I rely on no one except in an absolute extreme situation that I need help so I guess my touring reflects the weight.

@BZ I should have made that clear I tend to forget it is a bigger draw card but then most touring folks with there bikes are draw cards just ours seems to be bigger.
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Re: Touring weight

Postby }SkOrPn--7 » Tue Apr 16, 2013 6:17 pm

That lock BZ is pretty nifty stops them wheeling your machine off. I do have a button I push on mine that locks the disks which I use as a park brake which also I guess acts as a anti wheeling the trike off. It's not part of the brake lever I made it using a mountain bike front fork suspension lockout button.

Ricky
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Re: Touring weight

Postby WarrenH » Tue May 21, 2013 2:31 pm

A touring weight, what's that?

Is that like when I go touring on the Great Divide with my mobile kitchen? ... am I meant to weigh all this stuff?

Image


Heavens forbid, weighing this? This is mostly carbs, the energy food of the Gods ... well, there is 40 days and 40 nights worth of supplies here. Weighing this stuff could bring on a bad omen you know. Like exciting the next big flood or even worse by losing this food in that flood and then to survive, gagging on badly cooked pasty muffins in truck stops. I'd prefer to drown.

Warren.

PS, I'll dump the cardboard packaging. That should save me a bit. I just hope that doesn't offend the Gods of the Divide.
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Re: Touring weight

Postby Tim » Tue May 21, 2013 4:24 pm

Nice looking load of tucker there Warren.
I'm always on the lookout for new camp food ideas.
Do you think you could reveal what's in all, or even some of those packages?
The only stuff I can identify is dried apricots ( I prefer dates :) ).
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Re: Touring weight

Postby }SkOrPn--7 » Tue May 21, 2013 5:31 pm

WarrenH wrote:A touring weight, what's that?

Is that like when I go touring on the Great Divide with my mobile kitchen? ... am I meant to weigh all this stuff?

Image


Heavens forbid, weighing this? This is mostly carbs, the energy food of the Gods ... well, there is 40 days and 40 nights worth of supplies here. Weighing this stuff could bring on a bad omen you know. Like exciting the next big flood or even worse by losing this food in that flood and then to survive, gagging on badly cooked pasty muffins in truck stops. I'd prefer to drown.

Warren.

PS, I'll dump the cardboard packaging. That should save me a bit. I just hope that doesn't offend the Gods of the Divide.


Warren's a man after my own heart I think we haul about the same amount although your carrying a little more than I normally do I have 30 days on board at any given time.

Ricky
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Re: Touring weight

Postby WarrenH » Wed May 22, 2013 2:23 pm

My water carrier with lighter weight road bike cages fitted. This is my somewhat dodgy attempt at becoming a weight weenie.

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A hint of smoke in the ranges one afternoon ...

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... settled in the valleys the next.

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Warren.
Last edited by WarrenH on Wed May 22, 2013 5:40 pm, edited 4 times in total.
"But on steep descending...Larson TT have bad effect on the mind of a rider" - MadRider from Suji, Korea 2001.

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Re: Touring weight

Postby WarrenH » Wed May 22, 2013 2:23 pm

Rif, G'day. I thought that you would've spotted the watermelon? ... following a recent thread about dehydrating food on MTBR.

I'm a calorie counter. Not to avoid the calories, but to get enough in. Each vacuum bag has been weighed to give a specific number of calories. Riding at 25 kph on a 2-3º slope I'll burn between 97-102 calories in 6 kilometres. Hauling a touring weight on the flat over the 6 kilometres at about 15 kph I'll burn about 135-150 calories. With light exercise our bodies burn about 1.3 calories per minute even when standing still. I don't want to loose more than 10 kilograms on my next tour, which is a deficit of about 73-75,000 calories over the 40 days. I'll probably loose about 12-15 kilograms over the 40 days, I always do. I need 2,000 calories a day with only light exercise to maintain my body weight. It isn't possible to take all the food that I need. I allocate 700 calories for breakfast, 650 calories for lunch, 1200+ calories for dinner and snacks to 250 calories twice a day.

This is what I have, full cream powdered milk to make 38 litres.
Assorted cereals for 40 days. Lots of Wheatbix. There are 60 calories in one Wheatbix without the milk. Several Wheatbix with lots of milk and diced dried fruit and it is rocket fuel.
Swiss protein bars for 40 days (@x1.5 bars per day). GU gels (more than in the photo) for 14 days. One GU gel is energy for 6 kilometres on the bike or 1.25 kilometres if walking.
Dried fruits and nuts for 40 days (@x2 a day), apricots, sultanas, mixed nuts, prunes, watermelon, and dates.
For 20 days, Pasta mixes. Peas, carrots, tomatoes (many tomatoes, tomatoes are good for breaking down lactic acid), onions, green olives.
Beef jerky (Peri Peri flavour) for 40 days, on 20 of the days the beef jerky will be part of the main meal with Deb mash.
40 cups of soup, for lunch.
Coffee for 40 days and cocoa with 2 sugars for 40 days.
Only one Lemon Lime powdered Gatorade, to make 8 litres. Normally I'd take two Gatorades to help avoid cramps, but I'm actually fit for once.
7 meals of Tasty Bites Indian curries. 7 servings of rice. 7 whole meal flour Poori flat bread mixes, pre mixed.
Large French Onion soup mixes (x4). I put 1 pack of each of the vegs in the soup (not the potato) and shred a pack of jerky into the soup.
0.5 litre of Extra Virgin Olive Oil.
I packet of Jelly Belly jelly beans.
A few of the best easy deserts going, Rafferty's Garden Premium Baby Food ...Grandma's Favourite Old Fashioned Chocolate Custard. This custard is not suitable for off-riders under 6 months of age. The calorie count in this stuff would turn babies into Sumo wrestlers by the time that they reached their first birthday.
... and spices to enhance the main meals.
If I run across farm gate produce that's for sale, I'll buy fruit and vegs. Hopefully I will be able to.

I had originally booked to take the train to Armidale, I was looking forward to a train ride but Country Link couldn't guarantee that the train ticket wouldn't be diverted into a coach ticket somewhere near Maitland, Singleton or Muswellbrook. Nor would they allow some items on the train, like any type of cooking fuel. It is a criminal offence to carry even metho on a train, let alone Hexamine or High-Performance ISO-Butane/Propane. So I'm riding to New England when it stops raining. Country Link do not make it easy to travel with the gear, unless the gear is basic or a folding bike. Nor would Country Link allow any other items in the bike box ... only the bike. They wouldn't let me put the Extrawheel trailer in the bike box, even though the weight of box, bike and trailer, met the limit. Country Link have a 20 kg limit for manual handling.

About 6 weeks ago Hexamine fuel tablets were banned for sale in the ACT ... Country Link baggage staff probably put the amateur Canberra polies up to it.

Warren.
Last edited by WarrenH on Wed May 22, 2013 7:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"But on steep descending...Larson TT have bad effect on the mind of a rider" - MadRider from Suji, Korea 2001.

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Re: Touring weight

Postby rifraf » Wed May 22, 2013 4:41 pm

WarrenH wrote:Rif, G'day. I thought that you would've spotted the watermelon? ... following a recent thread about dehydrating food on MTBR.
Warren.

Hi Warren,
I suspect you may be answering Tims question - his avatar and mine are similar and my lawyers will be in touch with his legal team shortly. :wink:
I might have to knock the rider off his bike in his one........
Whoops too late, someones beaten me to it. :lol: :lol:
I however watch your posts with keen interest anyway being keen to improve my knowledge about many of the aspects you comment about.
Love the above pics and need to get out my own camera and learn to properly use the damn thing.
Its bulk, weight and financial investment tend to inhibit me where it was supposed to do the opposite and motivate me to get out more. :o
Currently observing dehydrators on gumtree and have seen a few bargains.
Not so sure how static my accommodation is and wont be splashing out till I know more.
Seen other posts hailing your watermelon so keen to try for myself :lol: :lol:
Any plans to try the BBB XL Fuel Tanks on your forks? They can carry 1.5 liter bottles so you'd only maybe need one per leg and still be hauling more water than your current setup (perhaps :?: ).
Or is that 4 one liter bottles your set up for there?
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Re: Touring weight

Postby Tim » Wed May 22, 2013 7:34 pm

rifraf wrote:....and my lawyers will be in touch with his legal team shortly.


But, but, I didn't do it.
Anyway, my legal team is bigger than yours.
I survived a divorce, and still own a bicycle.
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Re: Touring weight

Postby }SkOrPn--7 » Wed May 22, 2013 10:23 pm

Tim wrote:
rifraf wrote:....and my lawyers will be in touch with his legal team shortly.


But, but, I didn't do it.
Anyway, my legal team is bigger than yours.
I survived a divorce, and still own a bicycle.


I'm an A-Hole I just got in contact with her and she now knows the bike exists are your legs in working order now? :twisted: :mrgreen:

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Re: Touring weight

Postby il padrone » Thu May 23, 2013 6:30 am

WarrenH wrote:I'm a calorie counter. Not to avoid the calories, but to get enough in.

Warren you are certainly one heck of a lot more pedantic than I with your food volumes and calorific values. I just eat till I'm full and plan to take enough food to do this (or get suitable local supplies). If I lost more than 5 kgs on a tour it woukd be a crisis - I don't have that much extra to loose. Currently in Italy I think I may be putting weight on while on tour.... for the first time ever :o

WarrenH wrote:It is a criminal offence to carry even metho on a train, let alone Hexamine or High-Performance ISO-Butane/Propane. So I'm riding to New England when it stops raining. Country Link do not make it easy to travel with the gear, unless the gear is basic or a folding bike.

You're right there - Countrylink and their rules are crap. But whatever is in my bike panniers is no business of theirs. Or do they do customs baggage searches now :roll:
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Re: Touring weight

Postby elStado » Sun May 26, 2013 1:36 pm

bumblebea wrote:changing the subject from cooking but still on weight - what kind of locks do people use for touring? i've noticed on websites that the weight of locks is rarely listed. are there any good secure locks that are fairly light or do you just have to find some happy medium and balance out whether you prefer light weight or security?

appreciate any advice!

thanks, b


I took a Kryptonite Evolution Mini 7 Lock and 4 Foot KryptoFlex Cable with me... very secure, which is reassuring when you park your bike somewhere in town in France (a country known for high levels of petty crime and theft). However it was a bit too bulky and heavy for my liking and I would look into lighter alternatives next time I go on a long distance tour. The lock and cable was around 1.3kg all up :shock: , considering how much money I spent on ultralight tents and sleeping gear it seems a bit pointless to then carry such a heavy lock around (however I was glad to have it in France).

You can get pretty solid flexible chains from Kryptonite and ABUS which weigh less than 1kg.. still too heavy for solo touring but if you are touring with another person you can both use the same lock so you don't have to both carry one each. One person carries the fuel and extra water, the other carries a lock.

The other solution is to only go touring in quiet rural areas with low crime, then you would only need a basic cable lock especially if you bike is fully loaded and looks pretty dirty. Not many crooks would bother trying to steal the bike, however they might rummage through the pannier bags for any valuables (unlikely in a quiet town especially if the bike is in full public view).
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Re: Touring weight

Postby flippant » Sun Jun 02, 2013 11:26 am

elStado wrote:
bumblebea wrote:changing the subject from cooking but still on weight - what kind of locks do people use for touring? i've noticed on websites that the weight of locks is rarely listed. are there any good secure locks that are fairly light or do you just have to find some happy medium and balance out whether you prefer light weight or security?

appreciate any advice!

thanks, b


I use a TiGr lock, a titanium bow. A 3cm wide, 61cm long bow comes in at $US200. While a little bit expensive, this lock has three things going for it: 1) novelty—not many bike thieves would know what to do with it; 2) flexibility—can't be jacked open nor easily be cut; 3) weight—at ~750g for the bow and lock, it's not that heavy.

Considerations: TiGr are about to start selling a 30" (76cm) long version of the bow soon, that will allow you to lock both wheels (the 61cm version can do that on road bikes). However, with wider touring wheels and mudguards, it might still be too big an ask. Besides, the 61cm version can be creatively positioned on the bike.

I wrapped mine in an old bicycle tube to keep it from damaging the paint on my bike, and keep it like this when I commute.

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The TiGr people want $50 to ship it, but these guys will ship for free.
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Re: Touring weight

Postby RonK » Sun Jun 02, 2013 11:51 am

RonK wrote:
bumblebea wrote:changing the subject from cooking but still on weight - what kind of locks do people use for touring?

Generally I've not found much need for a lock in tour. I have a lightweight cable lock I can use while I make a quick dash into a shop, but rarely feel the need to use it.
Ultimately, if you want to avoid theft then always keep your bike and gear in sight.

This is the lock I carry, rarely use. It's an ABUS Combiloop 205, bought originally to secure my backpack.

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Why this lock? Because I can loop it through the bike frame, both wheels and all four Ortlieb security cables on my panniers.

Image

None of this would secure the bike for very long, but certainly for a few minutes while I shop. And since there have been only a few occasions when I have felt the need to use it, I'm pleased that I haven't been carrying a kilogram of u-lock or frame lock, which don't secure the panniers anyway.

If I need to leave the bike and gear unattended for longer periods then I find a secure place to park it, inside, off the street.
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Re: Touring weight

Postby il padrone » Wed Jun 26, 2013 7:09 am

For locking, secure parking is the best solution, but not always possible (like tonight in Volterra). So we have our bikes locked with their Abus Amparo frame locks through the rear wheels and a secured cable through the wheel and frame and fastened in the same Abus lock.

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Re: Touring weight

Postby snafuspyramid » Mon Oct 28, 2013 8:13 pm

RonK wrote:20 kgs max, including 4 season clothing and equipment - no exceptions.


Does this include food and water?

I have been weighing and measuring everything for air travel and the total weight of everything (except the bicycle itself and the cycle clothing I'd be wearing) is slightly over 18kg.

This is much heavier than I imagine RonK would be touring with, since it includes full rain gear, fleece and baselayers, spare shoes, camp clothing, an enormous two-man tent, the new Downmat I'm so proud of, a water filter, solar panel, clothes washing bag, sink, full Trangia with kettle, plenty of fuel...

I was actually really surprised by the weight of the bags themselves, all five panniers weigh about 4kg.
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Re: Touring weight

Postby il padrone » Mon Oct 28, 2013 9:43 pm

Handlebar bag (I do so love the convenience of the handlebar bag) weighs 2kgs.

My very basic gear that we took to Europe this year, including tent and other camping gear but no stove or mess kit, weighed 20kgs. Generally my standard kit for tours, without food or water, weighs between 22-24kgs. Add in the food for 4-5 days and that will be up to around 30kgs. If I need to carry water for a day or two as well, this might bring the load up to 36kgs. In the outback with food for 7-8 days and all water for 3 days I reckon we were carrying >50kgs .
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Re: Touring weight

Postby RonK » Mon Oct 28, 2013 10:10 pm

snafuspyramid wrote:
RonK wrote:20 kgs max, including 4 season clothing and equipment - no exceptions.


Does this include food and water?

I have been weighing and measuring everything for air travel and the total weight of everything (except the bicycle itself and the cycle clothing I'd be wearing) is slightly over 18kg.

This is much heavier than I imagine RonK would be touring with, since it includes full rain gear, fleece and baselayers, spare shoes, camp clothing, an enormous two-man tent, the new Downmat I'm so proud of, a water filter, solar panel, clothes washing bag, sink, full Trangia with kettle, plenty of fuel...

I was actually really surprised by the weight of the bags themselves, all five panniers weigh about 4kg.

20kg is base load - it includes the water I carry on the bike frame and food for breakfasts and an overnight stop.

Are you are not taking a sleeping bag? Toiletries? Spares? Tools? Camera? Computer? Phone? Chargers? Batteries? If so I think you may have a problem with your scales. :lol:

I didn't pay too much attention to weight last trip - baggage allowances have changed and I was able to buy an extra allowance just to make packing a bit easier. The previous trip I packed very carefully, even made sure my cabin luggage was up to the maximum 7kg but still ended up being 2kg over my 28kg checked baggage allowance and was charged $20 for the excess. My wheeled bike bag however weighs 7kg, so really it was 30kg for bike and all luggage, with only 2.5 litres of water to be added before getting on the road.

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