Diet Thread

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Nobody
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Re: Diet Thread

Postby Nobody » Fri May 18, 2018 4:46 pm

mikesbytes wrote:One of the suggestions I make when people probe me for nutritional info is to avoid manufactured foods, as much as possible make the food yourself from base ingredients.

I would add to that calorie density, chase the fibre and no liquid calories. If calorie density is too high, then the body won't meter well. The fibre is for gut health and help with satiation. Liquid calories are also metered poorly. But I suppose that is a lot to remember when you're trying to keep it simple. Calorie density would be my number 1 because it addresses much of the processed foods.

CKinnard wrote:IMHO, low carbers are many generations away from adequately demonstrating their doctrine trumps the Blue Zone longevity advantage.

You mean never.

CKinnard wrote:Nobody, the more diet clients I see, the more I am convinced insulin resistance is the plaid dressed elephant in the room re dysregulated appetite. I give the LCHF devotee Ivor Cummins kudos for reviving Joseph Kraft's 5 hour glucose challenge for insulin sensitivity.


Thanks for the video. I found it interesting. I should ask the guy at work who has had a heart attack whether he's been checked for diabetes. The other guy who's had a heart attack has diabetes. The video gives me some confidence that I don't need to get a CAC and expose myself to that level of radiation. I believe my insulin sensitivity for my age is good. At least my fasting BG is 4.3. BG may not a good indicator, but it's the only one I have so far. If I was willing to get a BG tester and prick myself 6 times in 5 hours, I'd probably know more.

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CKinnard
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Re: Diet Thread

Postby CKinnard » Fri May 18, 2018 7:04 pm

Baalzamon wrote:And Ivor Cummins is an Engineer!!!! Engineers are breaking down the dietary stories we have been fed with an engineers approach which is the correct way to do it!

You should see his cholesterol hypothesis.


Yep, I made a study of it and have taken it on board. I don't buy it as the entire truth, but appreciate it has found holes in the explanations of WFPB authorities.

I've emailed back and forth with Ivor in the past. I was trying to organize a debate between top LCHF and WHPB authorities. All of the latter I approached declined. But I feel a debate would sharpen interpretation of the literature by both sides. Both read the literature with bias. Ivor incidentally is a good man with a GSOH. We were able to engage at length and stay very civil and good natured.

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CKinnard
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Re: Diet Thread

Postby CKinnard » Fri May 18, 2018 7:11 pm

Nobody wrote:Thanks for the video. I found it interesting. I should ask the guy at work who has had a heart attack whether he's been checked for diabetes. The other guy who's had a heart attack has diabetes. The video gives me some confidence that I don't need to get a CAC and expose myself to that level of radiation. I believe my insulin sensitivity for my age is good. At least my fasting BG is 4.3. BG may not a good indicator, but it's the only one I have so far. If I was willing to get a BG tester and prick myself 6 times in 5 hours, I'd probably know more.


CAC imaging has improved, and the radiation dose is less than breast screening.

Nevertheless, the whole purpose of these tests is to convince one to improve their diet, and there's not much more you could do to improve yours Nobody.

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Re: Diet Thread

Postby Nobody » Fri May 18, 2018 9:30 pm

CKinnard wrote:Nevertheless, the whole purpose of these tests is to convince one to improve their diet, and there's not much more you could do to improve yours Nobody.

Well I think most people who get the test done don't get that link, or have it explained to them well enough. GPs may want their patients to improve (or maybe not depending on how cynical you are) but give them no clear guide on how to get there. The combination of a lack of a guide, societal norms and addictive thought patterns in regard to food ensures that most are unlikely to change enough to make a difference.

For those reading that might want a dietary guide to reduce their arterial risk:
https://share.kaiserpermanente.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/The-Plant-Based-Diet-booklet.pdf
https://www.drmcdougall.com/health/education/free-mcdougall-program/
http://www.pcrm.org/health/diets/vsk
http://www.onegreenplanet.org/vegan-food/step-by-step-guide-how-to-transition-to-vegan-diet/

We have a good old chat on here most of the time. But I should give some consideration to those visiting readers who may be trying to glean something useful from this thread, or the PBDT.
Last edited by Nobody on Sun May 20, 2018 10:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

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CKinnard
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Re: Diet Thread

Postby CKinnard » Sun May 20, 2018 8:58 am

I had a patient chronically obese, sick, stressed, and with suicidal ideation this week who broke down over and over about multiple pains, poor body image, and self esteem. I raised TNH as a great option, at around $8000 all up cost inc airfares - understanding her body and hunger better, weight loss, education, great company, etc.
She responded we just paid for a $60,000 swimming pool.

People are either committed to health supporting change, or to the apparent freedoms and pleasures that make them miserable. When you look deep into their eyes you can often see the resistance to getting on the straight and narrow path, in preference to worship of false Gods. As a clinician, you just have to respect their free will to experience more of the same.

Some say for most, 90% of decision making energy is in the emotions, not the mind.
When you look at the thought processes of many, I think there's a lot of truth in that.
- men : fast cars, contact sport, beer, ogling women's highly modified apocrine sweat glands and buttocks.
- women: jewelry, cosmetics, fashion, status signaling.
I spent a bit of time in the 80s with an Amish community in Pennsylvania. Their lifestyles were the most logically determined I've seen, integrating that we perish after 10 decades, give or take.

hence, to be effective in many endeavors involving people, appeal to emotions trumps appeal to mind.

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Re: Diet Thread

Postby Nobody » Sun May 20, 2018 10:27 am

CKinnard wrote:Some say for most, 90% of decision making energy is in the emotions, not the mind...hence, to be effective in many endeavors involving people, appeal to emotions trumps appeal to mind.

Good point. So informing people that they will feel and look better is going to be more effective than saying that they will be healthier, or perform better. An appeal to the subjective, rather than the objective. But the objective is easier to prove.

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CKinnard
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Re: Diet Thread

Postby CKinnard » Sun May 20, 2018 6:35 pm

Nobody wrote:
CKinnard wrote:Some say for most, 90% of decision making energy is in the emotions, not the mind...hence, to be effective in many endeavors involving people, appeal to emotions trumps appeal to mind.

Good point. So informing people that they will feel and look better is going to be more effective than saying that they will be healthier, or perform better. An appeal to the subjective, rather than the objective. But the objective is easier to prove.


Well I am always looking for the right angle to swing a person out of their hypnotized and erroneous beliefs re nutrition and wt mgt.
I like to give people the benefit of the doubt of being half intelligent, so I try the science angle first.
But this rarely seems to turn the lights on.
I think with women, bringing the kids into the picture is the best shot.....so something along the lines of eating healthier not for yourself, but for the sake of your kids. There's countless examples to build this.
What stuns me is the ignorance out there of how obesity in women trying to conceive or develop a healthy foetus is the norm.
I cannot believe how ignorant about these things young mothers are.

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Re: Diet Thread

Postby Nobody » Wed May 23, 2018 10:40 pm

CKinnard wrote:I cannot believe how ignorant about these things young mothers are.

Why wouldn't they be ignorant? We have had the food industries feeding us all the illusion of knowledge through marketing over generations. They already know, so nothing further is required to learn.
I'll try to remember some of my illusion of knowledge:
Protein is the most important element of diet.
Meat, eggs, fish and dairy are the only real protein sources.
Calcium is very important, mainly comes from dairy and dairy is good for you.
Iron is an important mineral that only comes from red meat.
Eggs are good for you, are an excellent source of protein and a complete food.
Omega-3 fats only comes from fatty fish, krill, or their oils.
Eating margarine with plant sterols is the way to lower one's cholesterol.
Olive oil is good for you.

______________________________________________________

https://www.9now.com.au/the-truth-about-obesity/2018/episode-1
You need to login or register to watch.

Ashwell (of WHtR fame) was on it. Although I thought her weight loss advice was too simplistic.
I thought the results of eating in the day versus night was interesting.
The taking of hormones to lose weight (at the end of episode) I believe is fraught with danger over the long term.

march83
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Re: Diet Thread

Postby march83 » Thu May 24, 2018 6:55 am

You forgot "complete protein". All those amino acids in your veggies? /They're useless because they're not complete.
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Re: Diet Thread

Postby mikesbytes » Thu May 24, 2018 2:56 pm

The mass retail chains are telling us not to prepare our own food, its telling us to purchase prepared food from them. Oh BTW apparently a meal is when you combine the selling product with hot chips and a soft drink
If the R-1 rule is broken, what happens to N+1?

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CKinnard
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Re: Diet Thread

Postby CKinnard » Thu May 24, 2018 8:47 pm

mikesbytes wrote:The mass retail chains are telling us not to prepare our own food, its telling us to purchase prepared food from them. Oh BTW apparently a meal is when you combine the selling product with hot chips and a soft drink


processed foods have longer shelf lives than fresh unprocessed produce, so net profits are higher for former.

but I still hold the view that the consumer has ultimate responsibility for what they consume.
I don't take my education from television advertising or what's on supermarket shelves.
I took it from my mother and health professionals.

IMHO, people who are patsies to advertising have no culture, no heritage, no collective wisdom passed down from generation to generation.
Sure one can retort the tech age has made much from previous generations redundant... but I am yet to see tech do a better job of expressing love, provide a moral compass, and give a finite life profound meaning.

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