Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Scott_C
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Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby Scott_C » Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:16 pm

https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonrei ... b239b96f6c

Cyclists who drive are better behind the steering wheel than motorists, a new analysis has found. The link between cycling and safer motoring was revealed by a UK insurance firm which offers specialist motor insurance policies for cyclists. This analysis correlates with an earlier study which found that cyclist-drivers tend to have faster reaction times than non-cyclists.

Nick Day of Chris Knott Insurance said an analysis of his firm's crash data showed that cyclists make less than half the number of insurance claims as non-cyclists.

13% of the firm’s insured drivers make at least one claim per year, found Day, but this fell to 6% for cyclists who were insured on the firm’s cyclist-driver policy.

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby human909 » Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:22 pm

There is probably a alot of truth there. But you always need to be careful how a study is done and how it is reported.

In other news... Unlicensed drivers make better drivers! A survey of unlicensed drivers found that they made car insurance claims at a rate of 0% per year.

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby AdelaidePeter » Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:34 pm

Scott_C wrote:https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2018/10/09/cyclists-are-better-drivers-than-motorists-finds-study/#41b239b96f6c

Cyclists who drive are better behind the steering wheel than motorists, a new analysis has found. The link between cycling and safer motoring was revealed by a UK insurance firm which offers specialist motor insurance policies for cyclists. This analysis correlates with an earlier study which found that cyclist-drivers tend to have faster reaction times than non-cyclists.

Nick Day of Chris Knott Insurance said an analysis of his firm's crash data showed that cyclists make less than half the number of insurance claims as non-cyclists.

13% of the firm’s insured drivers make at least one claim per year, found Day, but this fell to 6% for cyclists who were insured on the firm’s cyclist-driver policy.


It's hard to be sure without other information. Did the cyclists also drive less, on average? Were cyclists more likely to fit into a specific age group? Or income or education group? Do all physically fit people, even non-cyclists, make better drivers?

I'd be surprised if being a cyclist didn't make one a better driver. But I'd also be surprised if solely being a cyclist reduced ones probability of crashing by over 50%.

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby Comedian » Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:46 pm

Personally - I think I'm a better driver since cycling. :o

The thing that concerns me about this is I only drive a couple of thousand k's a year. So do I have less accidents because I'm a better driver or because I've got less exposure? :idea:

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby outnabike » Wed Oct 10, 2018 1:58 pm

human909 wrote:There is probably a alot of truth there. But you always need to be careful how a study is done and how it is reported.

In other news... Unlicensed drivers make better drivers! A survey of unlicensed drivers found that they made car insurance claims at a rate of 0% per year.


Hi Human909,
The stats didn't show what percentage of those unlicensed driver had a steadying drink or two did it?
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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby ColinOldnCranky » Wed Oct 10, 2018 2:11 pm

human909 wrote:There is probably a alot of truth there. But you always need to be careful how a study is done and how it is reported.

In other news... Unlicensed drivers make better drivers! A survey of unlicensed drivers found that they made car insurance claims at a rate of 0% per year.

Good point. Sometimes a proxy for something is a bad proxy.

I did note however something about better response times which I can't easily see being something revealed by insurance company data. I'll have to see where that came from.
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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby AdelaidePeter » Wed Oct 10, 2018 2:24 pm

ColinOldnCranky wrote:
human909 wrote:There is probably a alot of truth there. But you always need to be careful how a study is done and how it is reported.

In other news... Unlicensed drivers make better drivers! A survey of unlicensed drivers found that they made car insurance claims at a rate of 0% per year.

Good point. Sometimes a proxy for something is a bad proxy.

I did note however something about better response times which I can't easily see being something revealed by insurance company data. I'll have to see where that came from.


That was from this study https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/a ... 751730249X . But again I'd urge caution; were the better reactions times due to other factors, e.g. physical fitness? And even if reaction times are better, is reaction time a significant factor in what makes a safe driver?

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby LateStarter » Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:00 pm

My bicycle certainly does more kms per year than my car and car often only gets out to take bike to some country destination for a weekend of riding.

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby uart » Wed Oct 10, 2018 3:11 pm

AdelaidePeter wrote: And even if reaction times are better, is reaction time a significant factor in what makes a safe driver?


I'd suspect reaction times (even if true) would only be a very small part of it.

I personally believe that as a cyclist I am probably more aware of the risks to vulnerable road users of behaviors like distracted driving, impatient or high speed lane weaving, and many other poor driving practices. I think that I'm more aware of these things because of my first hand experience of seeing motorists who indulge in these driving behaviors putting my life at risk.

So yeah, I think it's entirely plausible that drivers who are also regular road cyclists could have safer attitudes to driving, and in general a greater awareness of the dangers that they pose if they don't maintain a good attitude to safety.

And BTW. While I think that skill is important, I actual think that attitude trumps skill when it come to risk of motor vehicle accidents, particularly those which injure people.

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby duncanm » Wed Oct 10, 2018 4:24 pm

Nick Day of Chris Knott Insurance said an analysis of his firm's crash data showed that cyclists people who use their car less make less than half the number of insurance claims as non-cyclists. fewer claims


FIFY, Nick.

Stats, stats, and bull*.

That being said, I think I am a much more aware driver due to being a cyclist. That, and watching lots of aus dash cam youtube.

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby uart » Wed Oct 10, 2018 4:32 pm

duncanm wrote:
Nick Day of Chris Knott Insurance said an analysis of his firm's crash data showed that cyclists people who use their car less make less than half the number of insurance claims as non-cyclists. fewer claims

FIFY, Nick. Stats, stats, and bull*.



What he actually said:
13% of the firm’s insured drivers make at least one claim per year, found Day, but this fell to 6% for cyclists who were insured on the firm’s cyclist-driver policy.


Personally I think that it would be wrong to assume that drivers who insure under a "cyclist-driver" policy drive less than half (6/13) as much as the average driver. You would have to show me that statistics on that before I would call it credible. Anecdotally though, I know many driver-cyclists who drive much the same km/year as any regular driver.

There may be a small difference in the average number of km/yr driven, but I highly doubt that it's a 54% reduction on average.

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby opik_bidin » Wed Oct 10, 2018 4:48 pm

AdelaidePeter wrote:
Scott_C wrote:https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2018/10/09/cyclists-are-better-drivers-than-motorists-finds-study/#41b239b96f6c

Cyclists who drive are better behind the steering wheel than motorists, a new analysis has found. The link between cycling and safer motoring was revealed by a UK insurance firm which offers specialist motor insurance policies for cyclists. This analysis correlates with an earlier study which found that cyclist-drivers tend to have faster reaction times than non-cyclists.


Did the cyclists also drive less, on average?


That could be a reason and it is important. There are insurance companies that like drivers that drives less (not always driving, take public transport, walk and cycle) as it lowers the risk and loss

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby Arbuckle23 » Wed Oct 10, 2018 4:50 pm

I like to think I have calmed down a lot behind the wheel and am more considerate since I started cycling.
But it could be just getting older as well :wink:

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby AdelaidePeter » Wed Oct 10, 2018 4:54 pm

uart wrote:
duncanm wrote:
Nick Day of Chris Knott Insurance said an analysis of his firm's crash data showed that cyclists people who use their car less make less than half the number of insurance claims as non-cyclists. fewer claims

FIFY, Nick. Stats, stats, and bull*.



What he actually said:
13% of the firm’s insured drivers make at least one claim per year, found Day, but this fell to 6% for cyclists who were insured on the firm’s cyclist-driver policy.


Personally I think that it would be wrong to assume that drivers who insure under a "cyclist-driver" policy drive less than half (6/13) as much as the average driver. You would have to show me that statistics on that before I would call it credible. Anecdotally though, I know many driver-cyclists who drive much the same km/year as any regular driver.

There may be a small difference in the average number of km/yr driven, but I highly doubt that it's a 54% reduction on average.


The paper cited within the Forbes article https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/a ... 751730249X (the driver attentiveness study) said, in their sample, the cyclists on average drove 179 km/week and non-cyclists on average drove 302 km/week. But that might have been biased by how they recruited test subjects.

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby Thoglette » Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:13 pm

AdelaidePeter wrote:The paper cited within the Forbes article https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/a ... 751730249X

Complete citation
Beanland, V. and Hansen, L.J., 2017. Do cyclists make better drivers? Associations between cycling experience and change detection in road scenes. Accident Analysis & Prevention, 106, pp.420-427.

A quick look at Beanland, V.'s publications on google scholar (or at least the abstracts) suggests that this is a researcher worth reading.

e.g. the safety in numbers effect
Beanland, V., Lenné, M.G. and Underwood, G., 2014. Safety in numbers: Target prevalence affects the detection of vehicles during simulated driving. Attention, Perception, & Psychophysics, 76(3), pp.805-813.

e.g. moron motorists
Beanland, V., Sellbom, M. and Johnson, A.K., 2014. Personality domains and traits that predict self-reported aberrant driving behaviours in a southeastern US university sample. Accident Analysis & Prevention, 72, pp.184-192.

e.g. speed kills
Stephens, A.N., Beanland, V., Candappa, N., Mitsopoulos-Rubens, E., Corben, B. and Lenné, M.G., 2017. A driving simulator evaluation of potential speed reductions using two innovative designs for signalised urban intersections. Accident Analysis & Prevention, 98, pp.25-36.
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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby AdelaidePeter » Wed Oct 10, 2018 5:24 pm

Thoglette wrote:
AdelaidePeter wrote:The paper cited within the Forbes article https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/a ... 751730249X

Complete citation
Beanland, V. and Hansen, L.J., 2017. Do cyclists make better drivers? Associations between cycling experience and change detection in road scenes. Accident Analysis & Prevention, 106, pp.420-427.

A quick look at Beanland, V.'s publications on google scholar (or at least the abstracts) suggests that this is a researcher worth reading.


She's also Australian, or at least Australia-based (as is Ms. Hansen).

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby DavidS » Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:56 pm

I think cycling teaches you to read traffic better too. I drove trams for 4 years and we were taught to read traffic (40 tonnes, no steering, you read traffic or hit things!) and it made me a much better driver.

Being able to anticipate likely actions of other road users is a huge advantage. I think it also teaches you to be predictable which helps to avoid trouble. Not infallible but reduces risk, always a good thing.

Planning also helps, it drives me nuts seeing drivers charge across a couple of lanes as they need to turn right but are in the left lane. You have to plan ahead as a cyclist to stay safe.

Many good skills come from cycling and I would expect cyclists make better drivers. But data to back this up would be useful.

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby fat and old » Thu Oct 11, 2018 3:20 pm

Comedian wrote:Personally - I think I'm a better driver since cycling. :o


I believe I'm better (than what I would have been) due to Motorcycling. I had a M/C license 5 years before I drove a car. Since taking up cycling yeah, the same again I reckon. Less tolerant of things I see cyclists do that don't meet my standards tho, so that's not so good.

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby find_bruce » Thu Oct 11, 2018 3:50 pm

what is it they say - 80% of people think they are above average drivers. :roll:

In terms of insurers, they don't really care if it is correlation or causation - if the risk is lower that affects premiums (& reinsurance costs) regardless of why.

If however you want to make a public policy decision, why becomes much more important

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby fat and old » Sun Oct 14, 2018 11:56 am

find_bruce wrote:what is it they say - 80% of people think they are above average drivers. :roll:



Define “average”

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby find_bruce » Sun Oct 14, 2018 1:07 pm

fat and old wrote:
find_bruce wrote:what is it they say - 80% of people think they are above average drivers. :roll:



Define “average”

If I wanted to be mathematically accurate it would be median, but I suspect you knew that

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby Tamiya » Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:00 pm

fat and old wrote:
Comedian wrote:Personally - I think I'm a better driver since cycling. :o


I believe I'm better (than what I would have been) due to Motorcycling. I had a M/C license 5 years before I drove a car. Since taking up cycling yeah, the same again I reckon. Less tolerant of things I see cyclists do that don't meet my standards tho, so that's not so good.


If I was Minister/Dictator in charge of Transport I'd mandate that every person wanting to drive first needs to spend 2-3yrs on a pushbike learning the Highway Code.

Once qualified they're allowed a licence for moped or LAMS m/c for minimum 12 mths.

Only then can they graduate to 4 wheels :mrgreen:

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby BJL » Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:59 pm

fat and old wrote:
find_bruce wrote:what is it they say - 80% of people think they are above average drivers. :roll:



Define “average”


Semi-comatose half wit.

The question that comes to my mind is why the 20% who think they're less than average drivers think they should be driving motor vehicles on the road. :?

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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby mikesbytes » Mon Oct 15, 2018 8:44 am

I have this image of cars pulling out of a side street resulting in a T-boning and I'm ready to react whenever a motor vehicle approaches from a side street. I'm sure this reflex wouldn't be there while driving if I weren't a cyclist
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Re: Drivers who cycle make half the insurance claims of non-cycling drivers and are better drivers

Postby Arbuckle23 » Mon Oct 15, 2018 9:45 am

mikesbytes wrote:I have this image of cars pulling out of a side street resulting in a T-boning and I'm ready to react whenever a motor vehicle approaches from a side street. I'm sure this reflex wouldn't be there while driving if I weren't a cyclist


I tend to watch them closely even when driving a car.
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