Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

opik_bidin
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Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby opik_bidin » Fri Nov 09, 2018 5:01 pm

I've been thinking about these speeding problem and how cars nowadays can go fast.

Isn't it time to put speed limits in cars?

Here in Australia, I think most places would have an upper limit of 100 km/h (CMIIW), then every car, truck, bus etc that used public roads should be limited to 100 km/h only and cannot go beyond that. What is the point of having Ferrari's, McLarens, etc that can go 200 km/h or even higher when they can't be legally used? And don't we already have the tech? High speed should only be limited to race tracks


Another thing is speed limiter on the control board of the car, I'm thinking the position is at the dashboard or steering wheel, probably looking something like this (CMIIW or make a better one)
Image

here as the switch is pointing towards 40, the vehicle cannot go beyond 40 km/h. So there would be no problem for people who can't control their feet and erases the need to switch views between the speedometer at the dashboard and windscreen.

Could this be implemented in Australia so everybody is safer?

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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby ironhanglider » Fri Nov 09, 2018 5:42 pm

Many modern cars already have limiters.

My 2007 Citroen does and I find it very useful. I rarely drive in built up areas without the limiter on because it lets you focus on driving rather than on the speedometer. However the tradeoff with all the constantly changing limits around the place is that you have to divert your attention in order to reset the limiter.

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Mulger bill
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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby Mulger bill » Thu Nov 15, 2018 5:53 pm

The Waze app has an inbuilt speed alert when running, between that and cruise control I'm good
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Tamiya
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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby Tamiya » Thu Nov 15, 2018 9:13 pm

opik_bidin wrote:here as the switch is pointing towards 40, the vehicle cannot go beyond 40 km/h. So there would be no problem for people who can't control their feet and erases the need to switch views between the speedometer at the dashboard and windscreen.

Could this be implemented in Australia so everybody is safer?


If you're incapable of staying IN CONTROL of your vehicle at all times you shouldn't be licensed to drive.

Can't get any simpler than that.

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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby opik_bidin » Thu Nov 15, 2018 10:07 pm

Tamiya wrote:
opik_bidin wrote:here as the switch is pointing towards 40, the vehicle cannot go beyond 40 km/h. So there would be no problem for people who can't control their feet and erases the need to switch views between the speedometer at the dashboard and windscreen.

Could this be implemented in Australia so everybody is safer?


If you're incapable of staying IN CONTROL of your vehicle at all times you shouldn't be licensed to drive.

Can't get any simpler than that.


if.only.speeding and mobike phone use can make aomwone loae their licence, but.its not that simple right?

the idea is vision zero, where safety.is built to the deaign so even if there.is a wrong, the.system can tolerate so the reaukt isnt too dangerous.

there.is nothing such.as a perfect driver or cyclist. otw, we woukdnt have thise speed bumps as a licenced driver should be capable.of alowing.down

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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby Bunged Knee » Thu Nov 15, 2018 11:44 pm

Why not get all 3 wheeler cars and trucks on roads and they can`t speed as it will tip over????

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ID please? What ID? My seat tube ID is 27.2mm or 31.6mm depending on what bikes I ride today.thanks...

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Derny Driver
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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby Derny Driver » Fri Nov 16, 2018 12:17 am

You've been brainwashed by the 'Speed Kills" hogwash.
Speed doesnt kill.
Poorly skilled drivers kill.

Modern cars practically drive themselves. How people manage to crash them is beyond me. Any idiot is given a licence as if the right to drive is a human right. Its not. Nervous people, stupid people, mentally deranged people, people with alzheimers, dementia or other medical issues, people with anger management issues, people who cannot speak or read English .... can use public transport. In fact any person who cant pass an advanced driving test and demonstrate technical control of a car in a variety of emergency situations should be given an Opal card.
But that would require rigorous licence testing, retesting every 5 years. That would cost money, not generate money. Easier just to give everyone a licence and then fine them for not staring at their speedos.
I drive everywhere at 30kph over the limit, Im not embarrassed to say it, I am rarely caught speeding because there are so few highway patrol cars, Ive never crashed, never fallen asleep at the wheel, never made a 'mistake'. I learnt how to drive as a hoon in my 20s and those skills have stood me in good stead avoiding all the crap drivers Ive come across every day for the last 40 years.

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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby NASHIE » Fri Nov 16, 2018 12:52 am

Derny Driver wrote:You've been brainwashed by the 'Speed Kills" hogwash.
Speed doesnt kill.
Poorly skilled drivers kill.

Modern cars practically drive themselves. How people manage to crash them is beyond me. Any idiot is given a licence as if the right to drive is a human right. Its not. Nervous people, stupid people, mentally deranged people, people with alzheimers, dementia or other medical issues, people with anger management issues, people who cannot speak or read English .... can use public transport. In fact any person who cant pass an advanced driving test and demonstrate technical control of a car in a variety of emergency situations should be given an Opal card.
But that would require rigorous licence testing, retesting every 5 years. That would cost money, not generate money. Easier just to give everyone a licence and then fine them for not staring at their speedos.
I drive everywhere at 30kph over the limit, Im not embarrassed to say it, I am rarely caught speeding because there are so few highway patrol cars, Ive never crashed, never fallen asleep at the wheel, never made a 'mistake'. I learnt how to drive as a hoon in my 20s and those skills have stood me in good stead avoiding all the crap drivers Ive come across every day for the last 40 years.


Yep, a speeding driver is a concentrating driver. Yes floors in that statement, but driving modern cars at 100kph we are just zombies behind the wheel.

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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby opik_bidin » Fri Nov 16, 2018 4:30 am

I just wonder why so many demonstrate their poor driving skills here, can't see why we have traffic calming devices like narrowing the road and speed bumps, and then say speed doesnt kill, poorly skilled drivers do.

Overconfident poor drivers like these are reasons why roads are dangerous and the reason it's "safe" is because everybody else is blocked from using the roads in fear of being killed,

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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby g-boaf » Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:09 am

A fast car doesn't kill, it is the driver that does.

And how many Ferrari and Mclaren cars give you grief on the road? It's more the average Mazda, Toyota or ute.

I'd feel far safer on the road around a Ferrari or Mclaren than some clapped out old Toyota.

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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby fat and old » Fri Nov 16, 2018 8:09 am

g-boaf wrote:I'd feel far safer on the road around a Ferrari or Mclaren than some clapped out old Toyota.


Try living down here, near Sorrento and tell me about that theory. :lol:

The numbers are relative.

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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby MichaelB » Fri Nov 16, 2018 8:17 am

Tamiya wrote: ..
If you're incapable of staying IN CONTROL of your vehicle at all times you shouldn't be licensed to drive.

Can't get any simpler than that.



Amen to that.

And besides, if a driver can't be ar$ed to be in control of their speed, what makes you think they'll add another task and adjust their speed limiter ? :roll:

Maybe, with inbuilt micro-chips, we can have it inbuilt to the cars, that they only go as fast as the drivers are capable ......

There'd be some sloooooooow cars out there ...

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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby brumby33 » Fri Nov 16, 2018 8:46 am

It's got me wondering why that many of these accidents we see lately are in modern sophisticated vehicles with 7 airbags, 5 star safety ratings with crumple free passenger zones, ABS braking, stability controls etc that people still manage to kill themselves in motorcars. Yeah much of it is illegal driving, and it's not just speeding but people under the influence of drugs or alcohol, stolen vehicles....and then, there's been a recent spate of trucks and other cars driving into houses and McDonalds car parks out of control coz drivers have had a medical issue....so no matter how sophisticated motor vehicles get in the future, while man has any physical control over it.....there will be deaths.

A lot of people think that the older cars of the 60's and 70's were safer because they are more solid, that's actually wrong, the inertia of an accident of a solid car is far greater than a new car that's designed to crumple at certain zones, the handling of an older car is so much more primitive irrespective of how you beef up the suspension. 1 major advancement in motor safety I can see is the tyres we use today, but they still require tread patterns and arn't much good when they are worn out or bald due to burn-outs.

Driving the bus around all day in Sydney, I get to see all types of driving habits and it's not pretty....who in their right mind would chuck a U-Turn directly in the path of a bus or they'll cut in front from number 2 lane in front of a bus into a left turn street....does it ever sink in that my vehicle could actually kill them. Or they'll come flying out of side streets relying on their brakes and tyres to get them out of trouble at the last second....there are some idiots out there that's for sure....and don't get me started on Tradies :evil:

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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby ironhanglider » Fri Nov 16, 2018 10:45 am

Maybe what we need is for someone to install airbags that instead of protecting the occupents will shoot them like a shotgun if they are caused to be deployed. Perhaps that will encourage better driver behaviour.

Oh sorry, they already tried that and it didn't seem to reduce crashes.

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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby opik_bidin » Fri Nov 16, 2018 10:56 am

MichaelB wrote:
Tamiya wrote: ..
If you're incapable of staying IN CONTROL of your vehicle at all times you shouldn't be licensed to drive.

Can't get any simpler than that.



Amen to that.

And besides, if a driver can't be ar$ed to be in control of their speed, what makes you think they'll add another task and adjust their speed limiter ? :roll:

Maybe, with inbuilt micro-chips, we can have it inbuilt to the cars, that they only go as fast as the drivers are capable ......

There'd be some sloooooooow cars out there ...


You control the speed all the time, while with a speed limiter, you cannot go above a certain speed that has been set. so Even you want to speed or accidentally hit the pedal, it won't go above the speed you set

There is also talk about GPS speed limiters or road limiters, so whenever you entyer a road, your speed limit will be adjusted to what the roads allow to.

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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby MichaelB » Fri Nov 16, 2018 11:54 am

opik_bidin wrote:
You control the speed all the time, while with a speed limiter, you cannot go above a certain speed that has been set. so Even you want to speed or accidentally hit the pedal, it won't go above the speed you set


My wife's car (Opel Astra GTC) has a speed limiter, but it's a 'soft limiter' in the sense that it stops the car creeping over that set speed, but will go over it if you add enough accelerator.

It still requires the driver to set it.

opik_bidin wrote:
There is also talk about GPS speed limiters or road limiters, so whenever you entyer a road, your speed limit will be adjusted to what the roads allow to.


And that won't happen. How doe you retrofit ? You can't.

I still get back to self control. If you are incapable, you shouldn't drive. That doesn't stop people, but getting people to rely on someone/something else to control it for them is just dumb.

Sorry to be blunt, but it's just common sense, which I'm very aware, is not that common.

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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby jules21 » Fri Nov 16, 2018 12:28 pm

g-boaf wrote:And how many Ferrari and Mclaren cars give you grief on the road?

statistically, McLarens have a pretty scary hit rate on cyclists recently!

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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby opik_bidin » Fri Nov 16, 2018 12:41 pm

MichaelB wrote:
I still get back to self control. If you are incapable, you shouldn't drive. That doesn't stop people, but getting people to rely on someone/something else to control it for them is just dumb.

.


Sadly, with urban sprawl, zoning and these suburbs that requires you to own a car, many incapable drivers are on the road, even those who hate to drive.

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It's not the fall that kills you....

Postby Thoglette » Fri Nov 16, 2018 2:41 pm

Derny Driver wrote:You've been brainwashed by the 'Speed Kills" hogwash.
Speed doesn't kill.
Poorly skilled drivers kill.

Modern cars practically drive themselves. How people manage to crash them is beyond me.

Because most drivers have limited situational awareness and attention. That is, on busy roads, there's too much going on, too quickly for them to be "looking up the road" and taking in & processing all the information they need to make decisions.

You might have the situational awareness; cognitive skills; training and reaction times of a fast jet pilot but the vast majority of drivers don't.

Worse, they are blissfully unaware of their incompetence and will quite happily be bullied (by road design and other drivers) into driving faster than they can safely do so. With the result that drivers don't have the mental capacity to "see" anything other than cars and trucks. Never mind check what's hidden behind the A-pillar and mirror.

That's why bicyclists and pedestrians "come out of nowhere" and we get (genuine) "SMIDSY". Because the driver is trying to drive at (or only just a little bit above, m'lud) a too-high speed limit.

Unfortunately, the speed of MVs quite literally kills pedestrians and cyclists. Remember, when that MV finally hits you, however long it takes to travel 0.2m (the depth of your chest) is how long your body has to accelerate to that speed.

On country roads they're simply asleep at the wheel. Or perhaps watching a DVD or making tea?

In both cases they're lulled into a sense of safety by the modern car. Perhaps it's time to make driving dangerous again?
Last edited by Thoglette on Fri Nov 16, 2018 2:46 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby g-boaf » Fri Nov 16, 2018 2:42 pm

jules21 wrote:
g-boaf wrote:And how many Ferrari and Mclaren cars give you grief on the road?

statistically, McLarens have a pretty scary hit rate on cyclists recently!


Statistically speaking, the majority of riders get around without problem, so that is proof that we don't need 1m passing laws. I expect that you'll be in full agreement on that. It's the same kind of statistics that can be pulled out of thin air to prove a point.

Overseas I've been at considerably higher speeds on the road that what we allow here and the world didn't end.

It should also be noted that even electric cars can well exceed 230km/h, some are even able to out accelerate most sports cars - so should we be banning all Teslas or speed limiting them to 100km/h? Even a 1.5L 3 cylinder Ford Fiesta can do over 240km/h.

Virtually every car can do more than 100km/h, but it's not the exceeding 100km/h that causes the problem, it's the idiotic drivers that don't care to be observant of what is around them, or the ones who don't care about what is around them, or deliberately threaten bike riders.

Thoglette wrote:Perhaps it's time to make driving dangerous again?


How is making cars dangerously unsafe going to help protect riders from motorists intent on threatening the safety of cyclists (eg, close passes, deliberately hitting riders, etc)? An unsafe car can do all those things just as well as a safe one can.

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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby MichaelB » Fri Nov 16, 2018 3:53 pm

opik_bidin wrote:
MichaelB wrote:
I still get back to self control. If you are incapable, you shouldn't drive. That doesn't stop people, but getting people to rely on someone/something else to control it for them is just dumb.

.


Sadly, with urban sprawl, zoning and these suburbs that requires you to own a car, many incapable drivers are on the road, even those who hate to drive.


Aye ????? :?:

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Thoglette
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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby Thoglette » Fri Nov 16, 2018 4:47 pm

g-boaf wrote:
Thoglette wrote:Perhaps it's time to make driving dangerous again?

How is making cars dangerously unsafe going to help protect riders from motorists intent on threatening the safety of cyclists (eg, close passes, deliberately hitting riders, etc)? An unsafe car can do all those things just as well as a safe one can.


I thought this was the "speed limit and limiters" thread, not the "psychotic bastard" thread? Image

While there's a cross over both problems can be mitigated with: road/suburb design; public transport; regulation and education & enforcement. All of which are mostly missing in Australia.
Last edited by Thoglette on Fri Nov 16, 2018 4:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby opik_bidin » Fri Nov 16, 2018 4:49 pm

This is sidetracking

It's like this one which is in BBC
https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-45956792

It must be miserable: you’ve saved for a newly-built home past the town’s ring-road, but now you're trapped too often in a metal box with wheels.

You spend hours in traffic ferrying yourself and your children around because your estate has no shops; no pub; no doctor; no school; no jobs.

A report says this is the buttock-numbing fate of numerous young couples.

It's come about because planners allowed edge-of-town housing estates where car travel is the only option.

Intriguingly, the research by a new green group – Transport for New Homes - has been backed by a motoring group, the RAC Foundation.

Researchers visited more than 20 new housing developments across England in what they say is the first piece of research of its kind.

They found that the scramble to build new homes is producing houses next to bypasses and link roads which are too far out of town to walk or cycle, and which lack good local buses.

In a jam

Jenny Raggett, researcher at Transport for New Homes, said: "We were appalled to find so many new housing developments built around the car with residents driving for almost every journey.



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which could be like this, and is prevalent in Western Sydney, just look at the road patterns, this is a very compact version :
Image

and this is a good example of what kind of development forces you to use cars and what can make you other options
Image

If you open googlemap and see that your destination is 15 mins by car, 2 hour by bike, 3 hour by public transport and 6 hour by walking, people naturally would be forced to own a car.

----------------------

This is also why speed limiters can work to make people choose another option and that other option becomes doable and viable. Now public transport is the same speed as car, so i'll take the bus instead. Now Cars aren't as menacing. it's easier to cross the road and no sidewinds whn I ride a bicycle. Drivers also benefit as even they lose concentration for 2 to 10 seconds, the disaster wouldn't be as severe as when the sepped is not limited.

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Thoglette
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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby Thoglette » Fri Nov 16, 2018 4:55 pm

MichaelB wrote:
opik_bidin wrote:Sadly, with urban sprawl, zoning and these suburbs that requires you to own a car, many incapable drivers are on the road, even those who hate to drive.


Aye ????? :?:

At my old office in an industrial estate it was impossible to get there before pre-start without a car or a 5km walk (nearest early morning bus) or 10km bike ride (nearest train station).

Have you tried getting your dog to the vet (or the dog beach) on public transport?

I did buy a tandem to pick the kids up from post-school activities when they were small (teenagers do not stoke and do not wear helmets except when actually MTBing/BMXing/racing). Fortunately none of them played the double bass.
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Re: Speed limit and limiters on cars and trucks

Postby MichaelB » Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:52 pm

And you can’t get a trailer full of rubbish to the dump either, but what has that got to do with speed limiters ?

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