First FTP test outdoors
-
- Posts: 4
- Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2018 2:07 pm
First FTP test outdoors
Postby mdaniels » Thu Mar 15, 2018 2:13 pm
Pretty new to cycling (10 hours a week for the past 3 months) and I have just bought
a power meter to get more valuable data to track my progress.
Going to try and complete my first FTP test. As I am doing it outdoors, does anyone know any good locations? I know there
is a small velodrome in Hawthorn, or just a nice road segment with minimal traffic lights more ideal?
Also any tips for completing the first test successfully would be greatly appreciated.
- MichaelB
- Posts: 14854
- Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 9:29 am
- Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby MichaelB » Thu Mar 15, 2018 3:03 pm
Head to the 'Training' section in the 'Road racing' sub-forum, and you'll get more reading material.
PS - it's not fun
-
- Posts: 1545
- Joined: Wed Sep 26, 2012 11:05 pm
- Location: West Gippy
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby macca33 » Thu Mar 15, 2018 3:15 pm
cheers
- g-boaf
- Posts: 21460
- Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 6:11 pm
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby g-boaf » Thu Mar 15, 2018 3:43 pm
Start out at a tough but sustainable pace, then last ten minutes gradually pick things up. Last two or three minutes absolutely flat out. When finished you should feel completely spent.
-
- Posts: 4
- Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2018 2:07 pm
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby mdaniels » Thu Mar 15, 2018 4:48 pm
Sorry I should have stated that in my original post! I live in Richmond, Melbourne.MichaelB wrote:No idea about where you live, but from what I have read and learnt here, you want a good hill that will take at least 20 min (30 min is better), has a constant gradient (or as constant as possible) and repeatable conditions.
Head to the 'Training' section in the 'Road racing' sub-forum, and you'll get more reading material.
PS - it's not fun
Thanks for the tips!
-
- Posts: 4
- Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2018 2:07 pm
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby mdaniels » Thu Mar 15, 2018 4:49 pm
Thanks for the suggestions! Haven't done the basin but heard its a pretty nice ride, will check it out.macca33 wrote:1 in 20 at The Basin may suit your needs if you want to do it on a 20-minute climb on the road, otherwise velodrome, or The Boulevard may suit you.
cheers
I live right next to the Bouldevard so was toying with this and the Veledrome in Hawthorn (But i guess this veledrom might be too small?)
-
- Posts: 4
- Joined: Thu Mar 15, 2018 2:07 pm
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby mdaniels » Thu Mar 15, 2018 4:50 pm
Thanks for the tips with pacing, does it matter how big the Veledrome is? I have a small one near my house in Hawthorn, but its a small circle. I guess its easier as I wont have to worry about any cars like you saidg-boaf wrote:Velodrome is best, away from cars or any other interruptions. Then you can just smash yourself.
Start out at a tough but sustainable pace, then last ten minutes gradually pick things up. Last two or three minutes absolutely flat out. When finished you should feel completely spent.
-
- Posts: 418
- Joined: Wed Aug 20, 2014 9:06 pm
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby BugsBunny » Thu Mar 15, 2018 7:29 pm
If you cannot find a 20min segment, then there is an alternative - which is of 8 minutes duration with a 0.90 factor to derive your FTP. You are supposed to do it twice - with a short 10 min break in between and then take the average. The 8 min one is particular suited to beginners who have not done a full 20 min FTP before. Might be a good one for you to start with until you build more endurance.
If you have access to an indoor trainer - then thats also an option.
Good luck!
- g-boaf
- Posts: 21460
- Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 6:11 pm
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby g-boaf » Thu Mar 15, 2018 9:16 pm
How big is it, 240m, or 430m?mdaniels wrote:Thanks for the tips with pacing, does it matter how big the Veledrome is? I have a small one near my house in Hawthorn, but its a small circle. I guess its easier as I wont have to worry about any cars like you saidg-boaf wrote:Velodrome is best, away from cars or any other interruptions. Then you can just smash yourself.
Start out at a tough but sustainable pace, then last ten minutes gradually pick things up. Last two or three minutes absolutely flat out. When finished you should feel completely spent.
Doesn't really matter, if nobody else is there, just sit in the sprinters lane, keep a nice steady line and gun it. Just have your timer going on the garmin screen, average watts for the lap and actual watts. Maybe cadence as well if you need to see that, otherwise most fairly switched on riders can know what rpm they are turning their pedals at fairly accurately without needing to see any numbers. You learn by feel.
If it's a short velodrome with steeper banking, just stay down just above the black line (which is above the cote d'azur). Take a few easy warm up laps to get the feel of that. Don't look closely at the immediate corner, look further ahead and it'll feel natural pretty quickly. Don't drift up either, climbing up the banking is not what you want to do, and certainly don't go below the black line.
https://www.velodromeshop.net/veloguide.bmp
If it's a flat velodrome, then just go kill yourself on there.
8 minute segment, done twice, that's the Carmichael field test isn't it (Chris Carmichael, of CTS). I've read his ideas about it.BugsBunny wrote:Ideally.... no traffic lights so you can complete the full 20 min w/o interruption, no traffic so its safe and you don't need to slow / pause too long, mild gradient - circa 5% seems good to keep a rather consistent cadence and not with too many steep pitches that drag your cadence down too low, don't overestimate your ability and start out too strong else you will suffer the pain in the latter half.
If you cannot find a 20min segment, then there is an alternative - which is of 8 minutes duration with a 0.90 factor to derive your FTP. You are supposed to do it twice - with a short 10 min break in between and then take the average. The 8 min one is particular suited to beginners who have not done a full 20 min FTP before. Might be a good one for you to start with until you build more endurance.
If you have access to an indoor trainer - then thats also an option.
Good luck!
Another method would be the MAP ramp test, with a 0.75 multiplication of whatever the watts are (where you blew up). That's also a decent option:
https://cyclingtips.com/2010/01/how-to- ... ramp-test/
If you mess it up, it isn't such a long test to do. That's one that is done on a smart trainer if the OP has access to one (ie, if a friend might have one). It's another option if the 20min or 2x8min tests don't work out.
-
- Posts: 572
- Joined: Mon Aug 03, 2015 5:13 pm
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby madmacca » Thu Mar 15, 2018 11:30 pm
I use the Hawthorn velodrome regularly for intervals and longer tests where I can focus on just holding a high level of power output without stopping or worrying about traffic. The length is a bit over 300 metres, although that shouldn't really matter - FTP effort requires sufficient mental focus that you won't get bored doing constant laps.mdaniels wrote:Thanks for the tips with pacing, does it matter how big the Veledrome is? I have a small one near my house in Hawthorn, but its a small circle. I guess its easier as I wont have to worry about any cars like you saidg-boaf wrote:Velodrome is best, away from cars or any other interruptions. Then you can just smash yourself.
Start out at a tough but sustainable pace, then last ten minutes gradually pick things up. Last two or three minutes absolutely flat out. When finished you should feel completely spent.
For an FTP test, you should be on the inside lane (the "slow" and "fast" lane signs haven't been repainted since it was resurfaced in December).
I agree with setting up the screen with timer, 3s power, lap average power and perhaps cadence. The other thing is trying to pick a calm day - switching from headwind to crosswind to tailwind every 10 seconds makes holding constant power harder.
- Alex Simmons/RST
- Expert
- Posts: 4997
- Joined: Fri May 02, 2008 3:51 pm
- Contact:
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby Alex Simmons/RST » Fri Mar 16, 2018 10:46 am
Just don't expect your first go to reveal all that you might wish for.mdaniels wrote:Also any tips for completing the first test successfully would be greatly appreciated.
I'd do a "trial run" first and then come back and do the test another day. We always go better after a bit of familiarisation.
Having somewhere you can ride uninterrupted for 20-60 minutes is best. I have a 333m outdoor velodrome not far from me that I have used for tests up to ~20-30 minutes.
In general I recommend those starting with a power meter just ride as they normally do for a couple of weeks before doing anything specific or testing. Best to work out any foibles with your unit, make sure you are confident in the processes so that the data is accurate and reliable. Also you need to learn to not look at it too much.
-
- Posts: 1703
- Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2016 3:08 pm
- Location: Brisbane
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby RobertL » Fri Mar 16, 2018 12:58 pm
* It's literally 3.5km from my house, and mostly downhill to get there. Riding from my house to the track is not even a proper warm up.
-
- Posts: 418
- Joined: Wed Aug 20, 2014 9:06 pm
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby BugsBunny » Fri Mar 16, 2018 1:08 pm
I must admit I'm not sure where the 8 minute FTP test originated. I did mine from within the TrainerRoad app. They recommended for newish riders or those first timers doing FTP to choose the 8 min version.
FWIW, a mate of mine (who's been riding "regularly" for about 12 months) who did the 20 min FTP and a few weeks later started on TrainerRoad and did the 8 min FTP had the exact same FTP outcome - from memory 200 vs 199 watts >>> 2.9w/kg.
- kb
- Posts: 2570
- Joined: Sun Nov 13, 2011 3:22 pm
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby kb » Fri Mar 16, 2018 1:21 pm
Depends on time and day though. If there are kids (or anyone that doesn’t know to keep right if going slower) it can make for a rather lumpy effort.g-boaf wrote:Velodrome is best, away from cars or any other interruptions. Then you can just smash yourself.
Start out at a tough but sustainable pace, then last ten minutes gradually pick things up. Last two or three minutes absolutely flat out. When finished you should feel completely spent.
- g-boaf
- Posts: 21460
- Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 6:11 pm
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby g-boaf » Fri Mar 16, 2018 1:49 pm
The 2x8 is good as well. Detailed a bit in the Time Crunched Cyclist book, not bad.BugsBunny wrote:@g-boaf
I must admit I'm not sure where the 8 minute FTP test originated. I did mine from within the TrainerRoad app. They recommended for newish riders or those first timers doing FTP to choose the 8 min version.
FWIW, a mate of mine (who's been riding "regularly" for about 12 months) who did the 20 min FTP and a few weeks later started on TrainerRoad and did the 8 min FTP had the exact same FTP outcome - from memory 200 vs 199 watts >>> 2.9w/kg.
- Alex Simmons/RST
- Expert
- Posts: 4997
- Joined: Fri May 02, 2008 3:51 pm
- Contact:
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby Alex Simmons/RST » Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:33 pm
The shorter the tests, and/or the fewer the test durations used, the lower the precision will be of an FTP estimate.BugsBunny wrote:@g-boaf
I must admit I'm not sure where the 8 minute FTP test originated. I did mine from within the TrainerRoad app. They recommended for newish riders or those first timers doing FTP to choose the 8 min version.
FWIW, a mate of mine (who's been riding "regularly" for about 12 months) who did the 20 min FTP and a few weeks later started on TrainerRoad and did the 8 min FTP had the exact same FTP outcome - from memory 200 vs 199 watts >>> 2.9w/kg.
- Alex Simmons/RST
- Expert
- Posts: 4997
- Joined: Fri May 02, 2008 3:51 pm
- Contact:
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby Alex Simmons/RST » Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:35 pm
Not all crit tracks are suitable for a quasi-steady state effort. Depends on how technical it is.RobertL wrote:Do you have a criterium track anywhere near you?
-
- Posts: 1703
- Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2016 3:08 pm
- Location: Brisbane
Re: First FTP test outdoors
Postby RobertL » Tue Mar 20, 2018 12:12 pm
Good point.Alex Simmons/RST wrote:Not all crit tracks are suitable for a quasi-steady state effort. Depends on how technical it is.RobertL wrote:Do you have a criterium track anywhere near you?
Return to “General Cycling Discussion”
- General Australian Cycling Topics
- Info / announcements
- Buying a bike / parts
- General Cycling Discussion
- The Bike Shed
- Cycling Health
- Cycling Safety and Advocacy
- Women's Cycling
- Bike & Gear Reviews
- Cycling Trade
- Stolen Bikes
- Bicycle FAQs
- The Market Place
- Member to Member Bike and Gear Sales
- Want to Buy, Group Buy, Swap
- My Bikes or Gear Elsewhere
- Serious Biking
- Audax / Randonneuring
- Retro biking
- Commuting
- MTB
- Recumbents
- Fixed Gear/ Single Speed
- Track
- Electric Bicycles
- Cyclocross and Gravel Grinding
- Dragsters / Lowriders / Cruisers
- Children's Bikes
- Cargo Bikes and Utility Cycling
- Road Racing
- Road Biking
- Training
- Time Trial
- Triathlon
- International and National Tours and Events
- Cycle Touring
- Touring Australia
- Touring Overseas
- Touring Bikes and Equipment
- Australia
- Western Australia
- New South Wales
- Queensland
- South Australia
- Victoria
- ACT
- Tasmania
- Northern Territory
- Country & Regional
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: Google Feedfetcher
- All times are UTC+10:00
- Top
- Delete cookies
About the Australian Cycling Forums
The Australian Cycling Forums is a welcoming community where you can ask questions and talk about the type of bikes and cycling topics you like.
Bicycles Network Australia
Forum Information
Connect with BNA
This website uses affiliate links to retail platforms including ebay, amazon, proviz and ribble.