War on cars

Mr Purple
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Re: War on cars

Postby Mr Purple » Wed May 31, 2023 9:51 am

Far be it from me to suggest that a small pebble jammed under the valve cap will achieve the same thing. And has the added bonus of falling out when they take the valve cap off, leaving a complete mystery as to why the tyre went down. Just seems less likely to be prosecuted for property damage.

I have my own anti-SUV campaign going in traffic. I'll be polite and let smaller cars in, the larger and more unnecessary your SUV looks the less likely I am to let you in. Ford Rangers are the exception, because if you don't let them in the methamphetamine will make them murder you. I just avoid those.

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Re: War on cars

Postby mikesbytes » Wed May 31, 2023 10:48 am

I see the issue being the design of the vehicles rather than a particular category. They need to be designed in a way that minimises the impact to Pedestrian's and cyclist's which is probably more about where the head strike occurs
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Re: War on cars

Postby warthog1 » Wed May 31, 2023 10:51 am

Mr Purple wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 9:51 am
Far be it from me to suggest that a small pebble jammed under the valve cap will achieve the same thing. And has the added bonus of falling out when they take the valve cap off, leaving a complete mystery as to why the tyre went down. Just seems less likely to be prosecuted for property damage.

I have my own anti-SUV campaign going in traffic. I'll be polite and let smaller cars in, the larger and more unnecessary your SUV looks the less likely I am to let you in. Ford Rangers are the exception, because if you don't let them in the methamphetamine will make them murder you. I just avoid those.
There are some people I like the most driving all sorts of cars and 4wds have a significant proportion. I have a 4wd and have spent a bit of time on some forums for tech/equipment advice and touring locations.
Some pretty far right people on there and cyclists are very unpopular with some.
I wouldn't be making it too obvious you are letting some in and not these drivers. That would be a path to dangerous unpleasant behaviour, at best imo.
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Re: War on cars

Postby find_bruce » Wed May 31, 2023 11:01 am

warthog1 wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 10:51 am
There are some people I like the most driving all sorts of cars and 4wds have a significant proportion. I have a 4wd and have spent a bit of time on some forums for tech/equipment advice and touring locations.
Some pretty far right people on there and cyclists are very unpopular with some.
I wouldn't be making it too obvious you are letting some in and not these drivers. That would be a path to dangerous unpleasant behaviour, at best imo.
I agree - it's the loose nut behind the wheel that's the issue. Lots of people on here complain about tradies, utes & SUVs. in my area I am far more likely to have trouble with the fifth hole of an audi or drug dealer in a masserati. Yesterdays moron was driving a POS sedan - Hyundai maybe
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Re: War on cars

Postby fat and old » Wed May 31, 2023 1:08 pm

find_bruce wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 11:01 am
warthog1 wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 10:51 am
There are some people I like the most driving all sorts of cars and 4wds have a significant proportion. I have a 4wd and have spent a bit of time on some forums for tech/equipment advice and touring locations.
Some pretty far right people on there and cyclists are very unpopular with some.
I wouldn't be making it too obvious you are letting some in and not these drivers. That would be a path to dangerous unpleasant behaviour, at best imo.
I agree - it's the loose nut behind the wheel that's the issue. Lots of people on here complain about tradies, utes & SUVs. in my area I am far more likely to have trouble with the fifth hole of an audi or drug dealer in a masserati. Yesterdays moron was driving a POS sedan - Hyundai maybe
Audi aye? Funny you should say that. Had an audi decide he wanted my lane right then, right now, so pulled across, evenly and same speed as me, slowly slowly pushing the point. Note that my bullbar was roughly widow height for him. Got a bit insistent and went a bit harder, grazing the corner of the bar. Then I noticed the dog on the parcel shelf....so backed off. Then realized at 7:00pm, all dark and raining he had no lights on. No indicators the entire time. Got next to him, he's a geriatric waving his fist at me :lol: That was last Friday.

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Re: War on cars

Postby Mr Purple » Wed May 31, 2023 1:15 pm

warthog1 wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 10:51 am
Mr Purple wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 9:51 am
Far be it from me to suggest that a small pebble jammed under the valve cap will achieve the same thing. And has the added bonus of falling out when they take the valve cap off, leaving a complete mystery as to why the tyre went down. Just seems less likely to be prosecuted for property damage.

I have my own anti-SUV campaign going in traffic. I'll be polite and let smaller cars in, the larger and more unnecessary your SUV looks the less likely I am to let you in. Ford Rangers are the exception, because if you don't let them in the methamphetamine will make them murder you. I just avoid those.
There are some people I like the most driving all sorts of cars and 4wds have a significant proportion. I have a 4wd and have spent a bit of time on some forums for tech/equipment advice and touring locations.
Some pretty far right people on there and cyclists are very unpopular with some.
I wouldn't be making it too obvious you are letting some in and not these drivers. That would be a path to dangerous unpleasant behaviour, at best imo.
Honestly it's probably more to do with the way they drive it rather than what they're actually driving, and the type of vehicle would only be the deciding factor in a tie breaker situation where I'd be giving way against the actual road rules. If they cut across three lanes of traffic to get into the merging lane to get around one car, then I won't be letting them in. And most likely if they've got the bullbar, the aerials and clearly use the thing offroad I'd be far more likely to be not worried about them. I've literally had drivers drive out of a carpark onto a road where I'm doing 60 in heavy traffic and honk at me for not giving way. Ok then.

Same with performance cars - generally I find the people who place care and attention on what they're driving (including modifying it sensibly) are much safer to be around. Because they care about their vehicle, and by extension normally have some level of self respect for their driving. I find the most dangeous cars on the road to be the boring and/or obviously decrepit ones. If someone's bought an MG ZS for example their level of self respect and personal care is likely to be on the hazardous side. Not always, but often.

I'm probably actually talking up my level of disrespect. I haven't had an issue while driving in traffic for years. On the bike, yes, occasionally. But I think that happens to all of us, and it's generally when someone almost kills us.

And yes, Audi, BMW and newer Range Rovers are the most dangerous vehicles on our roads. Except for Ford Rangers, but I think their danger is worsened by how ubiquitous they are.

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Re: War on cars

Postby warthog1 » Wed May 31, 2023 1:35 pm

Fair enough Mr P, don't disagree, and that seems pretty fair. :)
I just don't trust people anymore when behind the wheel, don't want you hurt by some tosser. You are smarter than I, so you will have it sorted anyway.
They have won with respect to my behaviour on the bike. I am trying to stay out of their way and that means being off the road a lot and very selective of where and when I ride it.
Survival strategy and stress reduction.
I ride for mental health largely and being nearly killed isn't conducive to improving it.
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Re: War on cars

Postby Mr Purple » Wed May 31, 2023 4:07 pm

Years of practice has taught me to avoid conflict. Though there may be occasions where I completely obliviously make a particularly idiot driver inconvenienced. There's a skill to doing it in such a way in that no-one's safety is impaired, and it's not clear you're doing it deliberately. Also only while driving, never on a bike, on a bike my only priority is survival.

Once I saw a particularly aggressive BMW SUV driver comprehensively boxed in. It was a thing of magic - he was weaving so erratically in and out of traffic three other drivers simultaneously decided to just surround him and then slow right down. It was done so smoothly you'd swear it was choreographed - highly amusing to watch the smoke pouring out of his ears at that point.

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Re: War on cars

Postby warthog1 » Wed May 31, 2023 4:13 pm

Mr Purple wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 4:07 pm
Years of practice has taught me to avoid conflict. Though there may be occasions where I completely obliviously make a particularly idiot driver inconvenienced. There's a skill to doing it in such a way in that no-one's safety is impaired, and it's not clear you're doing it deliberately. Also only while driving, never on a bike, on a bike my only priority is survival.

Once I saw a particularly aggressive BMW SUV driver comprehensively boxed in. It was a thing of magic - he was weaving so erratically in and out of traffic three other drivers simultaneously decided to just surround him and then slow right down. It was done so smoothly you'd swear it was choreographed - highly amusing to watch the smoke pouring out of his ears at that point.
Nice :)
:lol:
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Re: War on cars

Postby g-boaf » Wed May 31, 2023 4:47 pm

Mr Purple wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 1:15 pm
warthog1 wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 10:51 am
Mr Purple wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 9:51 am
Far be it from me to suggest that a small pebble jammed under the valve cap will achieve the same thing. And has the added bonus of falling out when they take the valve cap off, leaving a complete mystery as to why the tyre went down. Just seems less likely to be prosecuted for property damage.

I have my own anti-SUV campaign going in traffic. I'll be polite and let smaller cars in, the larger and more unnecessary your SUV looks the less likely I am to let you in. Ford Rangers are the exception, because if you don't let them in the methamphetamine will make them murder you. I just avoid those.
There are some people I like the most driving all sorts of cars and 4wds have a significant proportion. I have a 4wd and have spent a bit of time on some forums for tech/equipment advice and touring locations.
Some pretty far right people on there and cyclists are very unpopular with some.
I wouldn't be making it too obvious you are letting some in and not these drivers. That would be a path to dangerous unpleasant behaviour, at best imo.
Honestly it's probably more to do with the way they drive it rather than what they're actually driving, and the type of vehicle would only be the deciding factor in a tie breaker situation where I'd be giving way against the actual road rules. If they cut across three lanes of traffic to get into the merging lane to get around one car, then I won't be letting them in. And most likely if they've got the bullbar, the aerials and clearly use the thing offroad I'd be far more likely to be not worried about them. I've literally had drivers drive out of a carpark onto a road where I'm doing 60 in heavy traffic and honk at me for not giving way. Ok then.

Same with performance cars - generally I find the people who place care and attention on what they're driving (including modifying it sensibly) are much safer to be around. Because they care about their vehicle, and by extension normally have some level of self respect for their driving. I find the most dangeous cars on the road to be the boring and/or obviously decrepit ones. If someone's bought an MG ZS for example their level of self respect and personal care is likely to be on the hazardous side. Not always, but often.

I'm probably actually talking up my level of disrespect. I haven't had an issue while driving in traffic for years. On the bike, yes, occasionally. But I think that happens to all of us, and it's generally when someone almost kills us.

And yes, Audi, BMW and newer Range Rovers are the most dangerous vehicles on our roads. Except for Ford Rangers, but I think their danger is worsened by how ubiquitous they are.
I think young 20-30 something women in Mazda 3s are also pretty bad - some of them have a terrible temper and short fuse. :roll: seen too many of them.

The sooner technologically can take over and people no longer drive their own cars the better. ;)

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Re: War on cars

Postby DavidS » Wed May 31, 2023 7:47 pm

Mr Purple wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 4:07 pm
Years of practice has taught me to avoid conflict. Though there may be occasions where I completely obliviously make a particularly idiot driver inconvenienced. There's a skill to doing it in such a way in that no-one's safety is impaired, and it's not clear you're doing it deliberately. Also only while driving, never on a bike, on a bike my only priority is survival.

Once I saw a particularly aggressive BMW SUV driver comprehensively boxed in. It was a thing of magic - he was weaving so erratically in and out of traffic three other drivers simultaneously decided to just surround him and then slow right down. It was done so smoothly you'd swear it was choreographed - highly amusing to watch the smoke pouring out of his ears at that point.
Love it :D

I would agree about Audi drivers, especially Audi SUVs, most selfish gits I encounter.

The 4WDs with off road gear on them, someone mentioned them above, those have my respect, they have bought a vehicle for a specific purpose, no problem.

You just know that a fair majority of 4WDs and SUVs driven in the inner bayside suburbs of Melbourne would never have seen a dirt road, they are not fit for the purpose of dropping the kids off at school and shopping. They are the wrong vehicle for so many reasons.

Tradies in utes I rarely have any issues with, they go around me and if they can't I will make room when I can.

I do choose the roads I ride on and where I go for the bike path. I really don't want to be stuck in traffic on a bike, it shouldn't be my problem.

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Re: War on cars

Postby mikesbytes » Wed May 31, 2023 8:06 pm

Mr Purple wrote:
Wed May 31, 2023 4:07 pm
Once I saw a particularly aggressive BMW SUV driver comprehensively boxed in. It was a thing of magic - he was weaving so erratically in and out of traffic three other drivers simultaneously decided to just surround him and then slow right down. It was done so smoothly you'd swear it was choreographed - highly amusing to watch the smoke pouring out of his ears at that point.
Must get in front :D
If the R-1 rule is broken, what happens to N+1?

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Re: War on cars

Postby mikesbytes » Wed May 31, 2023 8:27 pm

I think this one has been mentioned before

https://www.news.com.au/technology/moto ... 49c61a52cd
If the R-1 rule is broken, what happens to N+1?

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Re: War on cars

Postby mikesbytes » Sun Jun 04, 2023 8:28 pm

If the R-1 rule is broken, what happens to N+1?

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Re: War on cars

Postby baabaa » Mon Jun 05, 2023 9:04 am

How do you feel about these anti-car activists?

https://www.tiktok.com/@philritz1/video ... ctGaBE1Np0

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Re: War on cars

Postby brumby33 » Mon Jun 05, 2023 12:12 pm

Perhaps the State Governments could encourage businesses in a form of tax incentives to make the workplace encourageable to employees to ride to work or other means like walking or combo public tpt and walking, riding & walking etc by installing showers, changerooms and lockers.
In my previous employment as a bus driver in Sydney, east and Inner West depots, (prior to privatisation) we had everything available to us and whilst many drivers and Managers did drive cars, any also rode bicycles, had their own lockers and used the showers if needed. Our Depots also had their own inter-depot sports clubs like Cricket, Soccer, running comps plus golfing and table tennis comps etc so all the facilities we had were brilliant. We also had our own dedicated bicycle parking racks that were not in the sight of the general public and were gated off.

My Current employer here in Albury isn't a large organisation and hasn't got lockers for us to use and only 1 shower, mostly used by the mechanics. It's hard to encourage cycling to work here mainly because many of our drivers live in more rural areas many kms from work. But then we don't have the traffic concerns of say Melbourne or Sydney.

If you took Parramatta road Western Sydney for example, from Parramatta to Lewisham before the start of the bus lane, they kept on making more lanes for traffic, narrowing the already placed lanes reducing space for cars making them bunch up in a more condensed space, you wouldn't ride a bicycle along there unless you had a death wish, same goes for Canterbury Road from Bankstown all the way to Petersham. Can't comment much about Melbourne but that Sydney Road looks like a nightmare. So many more bike lanes need to be built so people who can, will take advantage of them.

The Governments and Councils really got to get stuck in and build alternative paths now because within the next 30-50 years, the Population of Sydney could gain by another 50%, so there's a chance even those pathways will be very heavily utilised in that time. Bicycle Super Highways to certain parts of the Sydney and Melbourne areas could be covered by Korean like solar panels (Seoul to Busan), will not only shade cyclists from the elements but provide green power to help with the power grid.

My view is cycling won't reduce in the next 20 years but explode, E-bikes will be the new normal and when all other means become clogged to the point just like New York. The Government need to also really look at making bus travel more fluid in towards the City Centres. Maybe a Congestion tax with exemptions for Buses & Taxis could be a way to discourage unnecessary use of a car in CBDs. I think town and City planners have a huge job on their hands for the next 20 to 50 years when Sydney's & Melbourne's Population could burst towards 10 million.
Tokyo for example, cycling is the normal local transport as Tokyo is built up with multiple Cities that have joined up, incredible considering Tokyo was pretty much flattened only 80 years ago but 12 million people get around quite easily. Yes roads are busy,but no more than Sydney with only less than half the population, holiday time roads are packed all over Japan but in the local City areas you can get to where your going quite easily using the humble bicycle. Instead of Multiple car parking stations, many Japanese suburbs have multi level bicycle parking stations.

Most of what I've written here are not new ideas, they've been displayed before but not acted upon but I think are still very relavent, probably even more so today due to our migration and population levels.

We have tremendous opportunity in this country, it just needs acting upon.

brumby33
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Re: War on cars

Postby mikesbytes » Mon Jun 05, 2023 12:26 pm

baabaa wrote:
Mon Jun 05, 2023 9:04 am
How do you feel about these anti-car activists?

https://www.tiktok.com/@philritz1/video ... ctGaBE1Np0
I prefer to win people over rather than wrap them over the knuckles and I don't see this tactic as one that will win them over.
If the R-1 rule is broken, what happens to N+1?

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Re: War on cars

Postby g-boaf » Mon Jun 05, 2023 3:06 pm

brumby33 wrote:
Mon Jun 05, 2023 12:12 pm
Perhaps the State Governments could encourage businesses in a form of tax incentives to make the workplace encourageable to employees to ride to work or other means like walking or combo public tpt and walking, riding & walking etc by installing showers, changerooms and lockers.
In my previous employment as a bus driver in Sydney, east and Inner West depots, (prior to privatisation) we had everything available to us and whilst many drivers and Managers did drive cars, any also rode bicycles, had their own lockers and used the showers if needed. Our Depots also had their own inter-depot sports clubs like Cricket, Soccer, running comps plus golfing and table tennis comps etc so all the facilities we had were brilliant. We also had our own dedicated bicycle parking racks that were not in the sight of the general public and were gated off.

My Current employer here in Albury isn't a large organisation and hasn't got lockers for us to use and only 1 shower, mostly used by the mechanics. It's hard to encourage cycling to work here mainly because many of our drivers live in more rural areas many kms from work. But then we don't have the traffic concerns of say Melbourne or Sydney.

If you took Parramatta road Western Sydney for example, from Parramatta to Lewisham before the start of the bus lane, they kept on making more lanes for traffic, narrowing the already placed lanes reducing space for cars making them bunch up in a more condensed space, you wouldn't ride a bicycle along there unless you had a death wish, same goes for Canterbury Road from Bankstown all the way to Petersham. Can't comment much about Melbourne but that Sydney Road looks like a nightmare. So many more bike lanes need to be built so people who can, will take advantage of them.

The Governments and Councils really got to get stuck in and build alternative paths now because within the next 30-50 years, the Population of Sydney could gain by another 50%, so there's a chance even those pathways will be very heavily utilised in that time. Bicycle Super Highways to certain parts of the Sydney and Melbourne areas could be covered by Korean like solar panels (Seoul to Busan), will not only shade cyclists from the elements but provide green power to help with the power grid.

My view is cycling won't reduce in the next 20 years but explode, E-bikes will be the new normal and when all other means become clogged to the point just like New York. The Government need to also really look at making bus travel more fluid in towards the City Centres. Maybe a Congestion tax with exemptions for Buses & Taxis could be a way to discourage unnecessary use of a car in CBDs. I think town and City planners have a huge job on their hands for the next 20 to 50 years when Sydney's & Melbourne's Population could burst towards 10 million.
Tokyo for example, cycling is the normal local transport as Tokyo is built up with multiple Cities that have joined up, incredible considering Tokyo was pretty much flattened only 80 years ago but 12 million people get around quite easily. Yes roads are busy,but no more than Sydney with only less than half the population, holiday time roads are packed all over Japan but in the local City areas you can get to where your going quite easily using the humble bicycle. Instead of Multiple car parking stations, many Japanese suburbs have multi level bicycle parking stations.

Most of what I've written here are not new ideas, they've been displayed before but not acted upon but I think are still very relavent, probably even more so today due to our migration and population levels.

We have tremendous opportunity in this country, it just needs acting upon.

brumby33
Parramatta Road used to be my commute, from Granville all the way in to Town Hall then George Street or Clarence Street and eventually to Circular Quay. This way before M4 tolls were introduced, it was not the best but early morning not terrible. Later it became crazy when the tolls came around and now you'd never do it.

We need something better.

I'd also like to see a crackdown on the loopholes encouraging all these "commercial" utes as family cars. That said even a small car is dangerous to riders if the person behind the wheel isn't doing the right thing.

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Re: War on cars

Postby brumby33 » Mon Jun 05, 2023 7:58 pm

Yes, fringe benefit tax loop holes do not apply to Utes or vans because they are classified as a commercial vehicle even if 95% of the time they are used for family commutes.

Maybe they should bring log books in for these utes so they have to declare whats for business and what's for pleasure.
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Re: War on cars

Postby DavidS » Mon Jun 05, 2023 9:59 pm

E-Bikes I reckon will go crazy, with population rising there is no way everyone can drive their cars everywhere. For a lot of us the human powered bike is preferred and we're fine, but many people don't want to get to work under their own steam. E-Bikes offer an opportunity for them to get to work, a lot less effort than a conventional bicycle and they use a hell of a lot less space on the roads.

As more people jump on E-Bikes they will demand more space for bicycles, which will be good for all of us.

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Re: War on cars

Postby fat and old » Wed Jun 07, 2023 6:29 am

brumby33 wrote:
Mon Jun 05, 2023 7:58 pm
Yes, fringe benefit tax loop holes do not apply to Utes or vans because they are classified as a commercial vehicle even if 95% of the time they are used for family commutes.

Maybe they should bring log books in for these utes so they have to declare whats for business and what's for pleasure.
For over 7 years I claimed my bicycle and related gear on tax as my primary vehicle, was never an issue (my business tho).

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Re: War on cars

Postby brumby33 » Wed Jun 07, 2023 9:09 am

fat and old wrote:
Wed Jun 07, 2023 6:29 am
brumby33 wrote:
Mon Jun 05, 2023 7:58 pm
Yes, fringe benefit tax loop holes do not apply to Utes or vans because they are classified as a commercial vehicle even if 95% of the time they are used for family commutes.

Maybe they should bring log books in for these utes so they have to declare whats for business and what's for pleasure.
For over 7 years I claimed my bicycle and related gear on tax as my primary vehicle, was never an issue (my business tho).
Yeah really? hmmm...might look at getting an nice E-Cargo bike and do parcel deliveries around town.....I'd guess probably the only thing you could claim on is general wear n tear of bike and Battery including tyres, depreciation and insurance is claimable too.
I couldn't see a whole lotta money could be made from a town like Albury but who knows.
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Re: War on cars

Postby fat and old » Thu Jun 08, 2023 5:48 pm

brumby33 wrote:
Wed Jun 07, 2023 9:09 am
fat and old wrote:
Wed Jun 07, 2023 6:29 am
brumby33 wrote:
Mon Jun 05, 2023 7:58 pm
Yes, fringe benefit tax loop holes do not apply to Utes or vans because they are classified as a commercial vehicle even if 95% of the time they are used for family commutes.

Maybe they should bring log books in for these utes so they have to declare whats for business and what's for pleasure.
For over 7 years I claimed my bicycle and related gear on tax as my primary vehicle, was never an issue (my business tho).
Yeah really? hmmm...might look at getting an nice E-Cargo bike and do parcel deliveries around town.....I'd guess probably the only thing you could claim on is general wear n tear of bike and Battery including tyres, depreciation and insurance is claimable too.
I couldn't see a whole lotta money could be made from a town like Albury but who knows.
Absolutely. If you're a subbie doing deliveries, anything and everything to do with your delivery vehicle is tax deductible. Your work clothes are tax deductible. Your footwear is tax deductible. Your obscure, retro Brooks seat is. Your gloves are. Your sunscreen is. Your training is. Your helmet is!!!!! :shock: :lol: :P

And you'd probably be one of the early adopters/movers in e-cargo movement in Albury. Get in early, get the runs on the board, build up the clientele then start employing Rohingyas or Tamils or Afghanis at 2 bucks an hour (but give them a normal k-mart BSO), enjoy the recognition and admiration of all and sundry for employing downtrodden minorities, cop some sweet Federal grants for doing so, sit back and rake it in!

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Re: War on cars

Postby brumby33 » Thu Jun 08, 2023 6:33 pm

fat and old wrote:
Thu Jun 08, 2023 5:48 pm
brumby33 wrote:
Wed Jun 07, 2023 9:09 am
fat and old wrote:
Wed Jun 07, 2023 6:29 am


For over 7 years I claimed my bicycle and related gear on tax as my primary vehicle, was never an issue (my business tho).
Yeah really? hmmm...might look at getting an nice E-Cargo bike and do parcel deliveries around town.....I'd guess probably the only thing you could claim on is general wear n tear of bike and Battery including tyres, depreciation and insurance is claimable too.
I couldn't see a whole lotta money could be made from a town like Albury but who knows.
Absolutely. If you're a subbie doing deliveries, anything and everything to do with your delivery vehicle is tax deductible. Your work clothes are tax deductible. Your footwear is tax deductible. Your obscure, retro Brooks seat is. Your gloves are. Your sunscreen is. Your training is. Your helmet is!!!!! :shock: :lol: :P

And you'd probably be one of the early adopters/movers in e-cargo movement in Albury. Get in early, get the runs on the board, build up the clientele then start employing Rohingyas or Tamils or Afghanis at 2 bucks an hour (but give them a normal k-mart BSO), enjoy the recognition and admiration of all and sundry for employing downtrodden minorities, cop some sweet Federal grants for doing so, sit back and rake it in!
Hehehe...getting a bit long in the tooth now to become a bicycle Courier and whilst Albury is relatively flat, the hills that is has, go right up to the sky....or would seem like it :lol: :lol: :lol:
"ya gotta hold ya mouth right"

VWR Patagonia 2017
2003 Diamondback Sorrento Sport MTB

fat and old
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Joined: Sat Aug 30, 2014 12:06 pm
Location: Mill Park

Re: War on cars

Postby fat and old » Fri Jun 09, 2023 9:06 am

Been out along the rail trail to Tallangatta? Nice ride, especially with the lake so full!

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