Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

opik_bidin
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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby opik_bidin » Tue May 11, 2021 7:45 pm

https://bicyclensw.org.au/a-tale-of-two-sydneys/

North Sydney

At the first, residents and the Mayor of North Sydney Council spoke against plans for a cycleway ramp to enable more inclusive access for riders trying to access the Sydney Harbour Bridge Cycleway.

In spite of Transport for NSW efforts to design alternatives and provide funding, Mayor Jilly Gibson and some residents strongly oppose a ramp that would increase accessibility for riders with small children, heavy bikes and disabilities. The other end of the bridge couldn’t be more different.
City of Sydney Pop-up Cycleways

Bicycle NSW also attended the City of Sydney Council meeting to decide whether pop-up cycleways would be retained and planned new infrastructure built. Lord Mayor Clover Moore spoke in support not only of the benefits cycleways offered users, communities, business and the environment, but of the role that Sydney as a global city needed to play in reducing carbon emissions.

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AUbicycles
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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby AUbicycles » Wed May 12, 2021 6:52 am

'The Residents' is a thing. Years ago, Sydney boasted Luna Park with rides, crowds and the noise that goes with this on the weekends. It was there for ages and everyone knew but then new buildings were built and the residents complained.

Perhaps I would have complained about the noise as a resident too... and the massive apartment buildings are residential. What ever your view - there were enough influential residents to carry a bit of power and get Luna Park (virtually) shut down. Now only the perpetual sound of the traffic across the bridge lingers... almost soothing.

For cycling access across the bridge, I do struggle to see how residents would be strongly opposed, so much so that the state government needs to keep plans secretive and actively seek input or public commentary.

The real issue with bridge access however was that Transport for NSW were not really interested... it was just floated every now and again as a political gag for the current minister in charge to get kudos but the intention and political will was never serious that they would commit to resolve it.

The residents association and objections started much later - perhaps they are right in rejecting half-hearted options and even the loop de loop design is a clear demonstration that fundamental flaws are easy make. So with this in mind... yes - ensure the construction options are progressive and functional. For example, cycling is inevitable and if it is not supported now, future governments will have more expensive and more difficult challenges hacking in cycling infrastructure.

So a Sydney Harbour Bridge cycling solution needs to be planned to accommodate more cyclists until such time that the motor vehicle lanes can then be permanently swapped over for pedal transport. The residents will benefit from better cycling infrastructure so let's hope that they are pushing for better cycling infrastructure... and that is the topic, and not that they can't stand cyclists and prefer more cars.
Cycling is in my BNA

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familyguy
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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby familyguy » Wed May 12, 2021 4:24 pm

g-boaf wrote:
Mon May 10, 2021 12:54 pm
This mayor isn't too concerned about the heritage of the MLC building:

https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/fal ... 57piz.html

Actually I remember working in that building a long time ago. But I do not miss the commuting to and from North Sydney.
But how will you "attract workers" when they can't get there by (what may be their) preferred means? No big business is going to buy into North Sydney without either stacks of parking or being above the stations.

But wait, MLC is right next door to the new Victoria Cross station and could easily get subterranean access direct to the station gates...gee...would you look at that!

If she wants that replaced, maybe the Rag and Famish should be, too. It is one of the only 2-storey buildings within the North Sydney CBD, after all.

Forgive me for being cynical, but it's a natural response to calls of this nature.

opik_bidin
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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby opik_bidin » Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:51 pm

It becomes very heated as Jill n co foght back so hard

This is from sydney Bike Commuters FB group

https://www.facebook.com/groups/SydneyB ... 361746015/

And the proposal from North Sydnwy 10 years ago :

SHB Ramp - here is the revolutionary, uh, visionary design that Jilly Gibson is looking for - Supported by North Sydney Council over 10 years ago.

The HarbourLink cycle plan - still on the North Sydney Council web site - https://www.northsydney.nsw.gov.au/file ... anPjct.pdf

https://youtu.be/c_Lop53sxK0

Please get your submissions in and support the linear design

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g-boaf
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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby g-boaf » Thu Jun 17, 2021 5:53 am

opik_bidin wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:51 pm
It becomes very heated as Jill n co foght back so hard

This is from sydney Bike Commuters FB group

https://www.facebook.com/groups/SydneyB ... 361746015/

And the proposal from North Sydnwy 10 years ago :

SHB Ramp - here is the revolutionary, uh, visionary design that Jilly Gibson is looking for - Supported by North Sydney Council over 10 years ago.

The HarbourLink cycle plan - still on the North Sydney Council web site - https://www.northsydney.nsw.gov.au/file ... anPjct.pdf

https://youtu.be/c_Lop53sxK0

Please get your submissions in and support the linear design
Facebook group is private.

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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby tpcycle » Thu Jun 17, 2021 11:50 am

g-boaf wrote:
Thu Jun 17, 2021 5:53 am
opik_bidin wrote:
Tue Jun 15, 2021 9:51 pm
It becomes very heated as Jill n co foght back so hard

This is from sydney Bike Commuters FB group

https://www.facebook.com/groups/SydneyB ... 361746015/

And the proposal from North Sydnwy 10 years ago :

SHB Ramp - here is the revolutionary, uh, visionary design that Jilly Gibson is looking for - Supported by North Sydney Council over 10 years ago.

The HarbourLink cycle plan - still on the North Sydney Council web site - https://www.northsydney.nsw.gov.au/file ... anPjct.pdf

https://youtu.be/c_Lop53sxK0

Please get your submissions in and support the linear design
Facebook group is private.
I don't want to look at it. I read it back in 2008 when I was a whole lot less cynical - now it just annoys me. What has happened since then? Motor vehicle traffic has got a lot worse - the roads around my place (in the North Sydney council area) are a parking lot during peak hours and on the weekends. I'm about the only person utility cycling for short trips - I see the occasional commuter pass through, weekend pelotons and a few pizza hut delivery riders - but it's a vanishingly small percentage of the road traffic.

39x25
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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby 39x25 » Wed Jul 21, 2021 12:24 pm

There are very few riders around NS LGA because the North Sydney section where most things are located is a cluster f**k and thats not counting the bridge ramp. Everything feeds to North Sydney but there is horrible/non existent safe cycling pathways within North Sydney proper. Between the Milson's Point roundabout up to Miller st.. you either take the offramp with highspeed bridge traffic or pinched Lavender Bay construction zone. Miller or Pac Hwy past on the north side, neither are good and only past Mclaren St do you get options to go into side roads with separation lanes.

The residents have too many "not in my backyard" mentality running the local stratas .. generally old white folks. They would love to see the lift only option to restrict riders so they can then complain about the line of riders at the lift waiting.

Personally I hope the council just stop all the appeasement and pick a ramp type and go with it... they will never make everyone happy.
Pick the safest most unobtrusive design.. which in my opinion the straight ramp next to the expressway and then move on to fix mess that is North Sydney.

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g-boaf
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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby g-boaf » Wed Jul 21, 2021 12:47 pm

39x25 wrote:
Wed Jul 21, 2021 12:24 pm
There are very few riders around NS LGA because the North Sydney section where most things are located is a cluster f**k and thats not counting the bridge ramp. Everything feeds to North Sydney but there is horrible/non existent safe cycling pathways within North Sydney proper. Between the Milson's Point roundabout up to Miller st.. you either take the offramp with highspeed bridge traffic or pinched Lavender Bay construction zone. Miller or Pac Hwy past on the north side, neither are good and only past Mclaren St do you get options to go into side roads with separation lanes.

The residents have too many "not in my backyard" mentality running the local stratas .. generally old white folks. They would love to see the lift only option to restrict riders so they can then complain about the line of riders at the lift waiting.

Personally I hope the council just stop all the appeasement and pick a ramp type and go with it... they will never make everyone happy.
Pick the safest most unobtrusive design.. which in my opinion the straight ramp next to the expressway and then move on to fix mess that is North Sydney.
Perhaps North Sydney council needs to be disbanded instead.

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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby AndrewCowley » Wed Jul 21, 2021 2:48 pm

With the section of Miller St between the Pacific Highway and Berry Street due to close (it's being converted into a pedestrian zone), that'll make it even harder getting through North Sydney. I use Miller Street and find it pretty safe in it's current form. It likely won't be legal to cycle through it once it gets converted.

When 'pop up' cycle paths were all the rage, it was proposed to build one heading up the Pacific Highway, past the Berry Street intersection, and past where Bike Bug used to be. That has been cancelled. I must say though, it looked pointless in that it didn't really go anywhere or connect with anything.

I am glad this wasn't built. North Sydney needs more meaningful cycle infrastructure than this. Which brings you back to the Harbour Bridge ramp and the lack of connecting links to it. What a mess.

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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby 39x25 » Mon Aug 16, 2021 11:13 am


tpcycle
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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby tpcycle » Tue Aug 17, 2021 12:14 pm

39x25 wrote:
Mon Aug 16, 2021 11:13 am
https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/sta ... 58ivw.html

Dare We hope? Some progress?
My guess is it's just another delaying tactic and will result in a waste of money and more mothballed plans.

I like how the Lord Mayor of North Sydney says this is what she wanted all along - do these people have no shame?

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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby 39x25 » Tue Aug 17, 2021 3:10 pm

tpcycle wrote:
Tue Aug 17, 2021 12:14 pm
39x25 wrote:
Mon Aug 16, 2021 11:13 am
https://www.smh.com.au/national/nsw/sta ... 58ivw.html

Dare We hope? Some progress?
My guess is it's just another delaying tactic and will result in a waste of money and more mothballed plans.

I like how the Lord Mayor of North Sydney says this is what she wanted all along - do these people have no shame?
Ya the Major and local Member has stuffed this up long enough pandering to the local oldies who has the most time to harass them about those dirty bikers.

Hopefully this then takes it out of their hands.. and directly into state controlled process from design/tender and construction. Not saying the state isn't without its flaws but NS Council and local member has shown they have zero balls and completely at the mercy of the local well to do public of a certain demographic who wants to do everything they can to stop everyone else coming through "their" suburb.

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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby familyguy » Tue Aug 17, 2021 5:03 pm

Joined a "local" FB group to watch the mayor and her daughter claim the exact opposite of what the record states they actually did. I think she knows she's going to lose this battle, but figuring she might make herself look good for re-election though.

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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby AndrewCowley » Wed Sep 01, 2021 7:11 pm

North Sydney council strikes again.

https://www.bikenorth.org.au/2021/09/01 ... il-outrage

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queequeg
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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby queequeg » Wed Sep 01, 2021 9:55 pm

AndrewCowley wrote:
Wed Sep 01, 2021 7:11 pm
North Sydney council strikes again.

https://www.bikenorth.org.au/2021/09/01 ... il-outrage
Appalling discussion during the Traffic Committee Meeting. Listen to them!

https://youtu.be/-hU43XU6WoI?t=1738
'11 Lynskey Cooper CX, '00 Hillbrick Steel Racing (Total Rebuild '10), '16 Cervelo R5, '18 Mason BokekTi

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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby tpcycle » Thu Sep 02, 2021 1:45 pm

"I'm a cyclist too and I prefer Miller and Lavender".

"They don't like interacting with buses on Miller".

Do these &*## even listen to the junk spewing from their mouths? So the person at the start saying cyclist whizz past and she needs to protect pedestrian rights is Jilly Gibson? $2,500 in rates I had to pay these morons this year.

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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby hunch » Thu Sep 02, 2021 4:45 pm

He's addressing her as mayor, so the one doing the poor, set upon old duck impression is Jilly.

I'd assume all those on zoom are the councilors on the committee and David is a council officer addressing them.....or a token rider?

See that the council also gave up a 2.7 million grant for a cycleway from Kirribilli to Cremorne the other month. Need Planck's principal to operate, but another member of the Gibson family is also there to obstruct!

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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby familyguy » Thu Sep 30, 2021 4:30 pm

So, is there anyone with a Telegraph subscription that can look up todays article about the "possible ban" and "dangerous alternative" and "near misses" mentioned in this link? I'm guessing it's the result of Jilly not getting her way in banning the Arthur St to Blue St shared section?
https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/subsc ... our=append

Yes, I feel bad for posting it.

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queequeg
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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby queequeg » Thu Sep 30, 2021 5:49 pm

familyguy wrote:
Thu Sep 30, 2021 4:30 pm
So, is there anyone with a Telegraph subscription that can look up todays article about the "possible ban" and "dangerous alternative" and "near misses" mentioned in this link? I'm guessing it's the result of Jilly not getting her way in banning the Arthur St to Blue St shared section?
https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/subsc ... our=append

Yes, I feel bad for posting it.
https://www.bikenorth.org.au/2021/09/29 ... th-update/
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g-boaf
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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby g-boaf » Thu Sep 30, 2021 7:33 pm

familyguy wrote:
Thu Sep 30, 2021 4:30 pm
So, is there anyone with a Telegraph subscription that can look up todays article about the "possible ban" and "dangerous alternative" and "near misses" mentioned in this link? I'm guessing it's the result of Jilly not getting her way in banning the Arthur St to Blue St shared section?
https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/subsc ... our=append

Yes, I feel bad for posting it.
All I could see was another article with this image:

Image
Image

What a dangerous looking person with a commuter bike! Scary indeed! :roll: Daily Terrorgraph living up to its reputation as usual.

Sounds like the local anti-bike council person is throwing her toys out of the pram again.

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queequeg
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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby queequeg » Fri Oct 01, 2021 1:04 pm

g-boaf wrote:
Thu Sep 30, 2021 7:33 pm

All I could see was another article with this image:

Image
Image

What a dangerous looking person with a commuter bike! Scary indeed! :roll: Daily Terrorgraph living up to its reputation as usual.

Sounds like the local anti-bike council person is throwing her toys out of the pram again.
See my link in the post above.
Great Result from Council Meeting 27 September, 2021

Thank you to all who responded to our calls regarding the issue of the shared path alongside the Pacific Highway between Arthur Street and Blue Street. While the Traffic Committee on 3 September had modified the original outrageous recommendation, we remained concerned that action to redirect all bike riders along Lavender Street was merely delayed and could be enacted without further consideration in February 2022.

We are delighted to report that this threat has now been averted with assistance from Deputy Mayor Kathy Brodie and Councillor Zoe Baker, who both proposed amendments to the Traffic Committee recommendation which were approved unanimously. While it was not possible to completely remove the existing item, we are now assured that:

· There will be a proper assessment of the concept options for an alternative cycling route prepared and brought back to Traffic Committee before any future consideration of action is to be taken

· Council works with Transport for NSW to build the Pacific Highway Cycleway to address the underlying issues.

Our thanks to these two Councillors for pro-actively ensuring this outcome and others who supported these amendments.
'11 Lynskey Cooper CX, '00 Hillbrick Steel Racing (Total Rebuild '10), '16 Cervelo R5, '18 Mason BokekTi

39x25
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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby 39x25 » Mon Dec 06, 2021 11:16 am

The 3 design finalists for the SHB Milson's Point ramp is up for viewing and feedback.
https://caportal.com.au/tfnsw/sydney-ha ... sign-teams

Submit your feedback (bottom right hand corner)... don't think it is a popular vote.. just feedback taken into "consideration".

Personally I think the Aspect Studios entry is by far the best out of the 3. Takes the traffic away from the station concourse , has the least ramp and cleanest design.

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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby tpcycle » Mon Dec 06, 2021 1:39 pm

Why does the ramp need a bend in the middle of it? Why do designers always seem to insist on putting superfluous bends in the middle of bicycle paths? Certainly not to improve sight lines. I see it again and again.

Anyway I'll believe it when I see it.

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familyguy
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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby familyguy » Mon Dec 06, 2021 1:47 pm

tpcycle wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 1:39 pm
Why does the ramp need a bend in the middle of it? Why do designers always seem to insist on putting superfluous bends in the middle of bicycle paths? Certainly not to improve sight lines. I see it again and again.

Anyway I'll believe it when I see it.
I believe it is to be clear enough of the awning at the entry to the station, which is probably heritage listed as part of the bridge fabric. Whilst I agree it's a little superfluous, I think a bend is wise to keep people aware. I don't like the 90° approach at the bottom end though, but I don't see many options there.

Jim

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Re: Sydney Harbour Bridge bicycle access saga

Postby Cyclophiliac » Mon Dec 06, 2021 2:34 pm

familyguy wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 1:47 pm
tpcycle wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 1:39 pm
Why does the ramp need a bend in the middle of it? Why do designers always seem to insist on putting superfluous bends in the middle of bicycle paths? Certainly not to improve sight lines. I see it again and again.

Anyway I'll believe it when I see it.
I believe it is to be clear enough of the awning at the entry to the station, which is probably heritage listed as part of the bridge fabric. Whilst I agree it's a little superfluous, I think a bend is wise to keep people aware. I don't like the 90° approach at the bottom end though, but I don't see many options there.

Jim
Isn't it also to slow cyclists down? I'm not claiming there's a general trend of cyclists to speed on these paths, by the way, but this is just the way some path designers seem to think: "Let's make it as inconvenient as possible for cyclists to use the path. Then they won't use it much, and we can then justify tearing it up, or not spending as much on maintenance".

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