Don't leave home without...

computer_athlete
Posts: 21
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2022 12:21 am

Don't leave home without...

Postby computer_athlete » Fri May 06, 2022 9:57 pm

So I've finally made my first bike purchase since I was a teenager and I'm excited to start riding (I'm not picking up the bike until next week-ish).

Now my attention turns to the various accessories and other items I might need to make my new hobby a long, healthy, and fulfilling one. (My long-term plan is to first build up my fitness and savings, then purchase a nice IGH bike for day-trips and then eventually a proper road bike for longer trips and touring.)

But what exactly should I (or any new rider) have on my (or their) list?

There are some obvious things that I'll need even before I start riding, but then there are optional extras too. I'd love some advice on what I should include, which things I should always carry with me no matter what, and perhaps some pitfalls that I might encounter along the way.

The list I have so far is as follows:
  • helmet (of course)
  • lights (front and rear; obviously the front lights will need to be much brighter if I'm going to ride at night, and I am)
  • lock (I'll be keeping my bike indoors and in sight until I get a D-lock)
  • spare tubes (I don't really know what to look for here except that I need to make sure their valves match the bike's wheels' valves)
  • tools (it'd be cool if there's some kind of standard kit I can buy that includes all the basic things I might need?)
  • puncture kit (I was amused to note that when I googled puncture kits the one that came up is identical to the last one I bought...in about 1998...I guess punctures haven't changed much!)
  • pump (just something portable for starters)
I'm sure I'm missing some obvious things.

Then there's the matter of what I should be looking to replace or adjust on the bike itself. As I've bought a very entry-level single-speed bike for starters (the Reid Harrier 2.0), I recognise the parts are not going to be very high quality. But at this stage I'm just going to be commuting to and from work, so nothing too strenuous for me or the bike so far.

What should I change first though? My thinking is tyres, because the stock ones (listed as CST CZAR 25c) are pretty terrible, and potentially an immediate point of failure. If I replace the tyres right away I'll at least have the stock ones as backups until I get more. Or vice-versa. I've done some reading about tyres and though tubeless seems cool, I think I'll just look for some basic tube tyres with puncture resistance (I have the Maxxis Overdrive and Re-Fuse, Continental Gator Hardshell, and Mitas Flash on my list so far; am I heading in the right direction?).

What next? Should I look to replace the brakes as soon as possible too? Pedals strike me as another thing to change, but I doubt they're likely to affect safety in any significant way (though of course tyres and brakes might)? The saddle (we don't call them "seats", right? :) ) is probably next.
Last edited by computer_athlete on Fri May 06, 2022 11:59 pm, edited 3 times in total.

computer_athlete
Posts: 21
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2022 12:21 am

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby computer_athlete » Fri May 06, 2022 9:58 pm

I already forgot about high-vis clothing! I'm keeping an eye out for parts (like tyres and clothing) that include reflective strips on them.

User avatar
P!N20
Posts: 4039
Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 6:50 pm
Location: Wurundjeri Country

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby P!N20 » Fri May 06, 2022 10:33 pm

You’re over thinking it again. Just ride and enjoy yourself.

Spare tube, mini pump and tyre levers are all you need, and a spanner if your wheels aren’t quick release.

A multi tool can be handy, and a patch kit if you’re feeling unlucky.

Yep, lights if you’re riding at night and D-lock if you’re leaving it out of sight.

Tyres: there’s threads dedicated to them. It’s a balance between puncture resistance and ride quality. Everyone has their preference.
Last edited by P!N20 on Fri May 06, 2022 10:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

computer_athlete
Posts: 21
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2022 12:21 am

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby computer_athlete » Fri May 06, 2022 10:36 pm

P!N20 wrote:
Fri May 06, 2022 10:33 pm
You’re over thinking it again. Just ride and enjoy yourself.
I tend to find that difficult impossible to avoid. But hey, at least I bought something! :)

Thanks for the tips.

User avatar
P!N20
Posts: 4039
Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 6:50 pm
Location: Wurundjeri Country

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby P!N20 » Fri May 06, 2022 10:38 pm

You’ll learn as you go. You’ll make mistakes and have long walks home. It’s all part of the fun!

User avatar
bychosis
Posts: 7265
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:10 pm
Location: Lake Macquarie

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby bychosis » Fri May 06, 2022 10:42 pm

Enjoy the riding, suffer the ‘adventures’.

Mobile phone is no 1 ‘spare’, not hard to call for backup these days. Even if it’s a taxi or Uber.

Spare tube and/or patch kit. A compact pump. Make sure you know what you are doing before you get stuck a long way from home.

I used to go ultra prepared. Lately, it’s spare tube only, but my commuter bike has tyre liners for puncture protection and the MTB is tubeless with sealant. It’s handy to carry a Schraeder adaptor if you’ve got presta valves so you can use a servo pump instead of a mini pump.

Don’t worry about upgrading your ride unless something fails. You’ll be better served by saving for a higher spec’d bike.
bychosis (bahy-koh-sis): A mental disorder of delusions indicating impaired contact with a reality of no bicycles.

User avatar
Tim
Posts: 2948
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2010 5:02 pm
Location: Gippsland Lakes

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby Tim » Sat May 07, 2022 6:09 am

For years and years all I have carried is a small pump, tube, tyre levers and a Lezyne pack of instant patches. Park Tools patches haven't worked for me but twice now the Lezyne patches have.
Good at-home maintenance has prevented any roadside mechanical failures (other than frayed shifter cables).
This is the pump. It's been good and reliable. Worth the price and squeezes in enough pressure to continue happily riding. Works on Presta and Schraeder valves;

https://www.bikebug.com/lezyne-sport-dr ... 20351.html
Last edited by Tim on Sat May 07, 2022 7:33 am, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
Gordonhooker
Posts: 683
Joined: Mon May 06, 2013 9:11 pm
Location: Redlands

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby Gordonhooker » Sat May 07, 2022 6:30 am

Don't be in a rush to buy everything you can think of until you are sure riding a bicycle is for you. Basic get out of trouble on ride kit, tube, tyre levers, spanner to fit wheel nuts and a multi-tool that includes allen keys. Welcome aboard the forum and enjoy your riding.
OI onya bike!!!

brumby33
Posts: 1944
Joined: Fri Sep 27, 2013 10:52 pm
Location: Albury NSW on the mighty Murray River

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby brumby33 » Sat May 07, 2022 8:38 am

Hey CA, depending on where you live eg City, suburban or regional (rural) it's starting to get a bit cold now, there's definitely a nip in the air so you might want to think of what you might wear whilst riding.

Layers are the best bet where you can shed them off as you get hot then you've got them when you're cooled down. Maybe a wet weather jacket of some kind. Doesn't have to be one of the real expensive light ones to start, I used my flouro wet weather jacket from work and it could can withstand an 80kph ride in wet weather home from work for about 35-40 minutes without any water getting in and I've ridden my bicycle with it too and it doesn't stick to you like some jackets do, it tends to breath ok if you don't push it. You can get them in any work wear store and they have a mesh inside to stop you sweating.....whilst it's a bit bulky to roll up, they arn't heavy.
With the bottoms in wet weather i use a simple pair of motorcycle pull over plastic pants (black) in winter they arn't too bad because generally you would have long pants or jeans on anyway. But if you want to go the whole hog with lycra everything, there's a lot available for you too unless you are a big bloke like me....cycling kit are made by those who think every cyclists are stick figures. Watch a few youtube videos to see how others ride in weather conditions that are worse than that in Australia, those who ride 12 Months of the year in locations like Canada and Europe have my respect lol.

You didn't mention what kind of bike you are buying at first but if it's possible to to put on a rear rack and 1 or 2 panniers bags on the back, it'll help to keep the weight off your body with backpacks and gives you somewhere to store your bicycling clothes and maybe a spot of shopping on the way home....believe me, unless your riding a full on road bike, you'll appreciate the storage options that panniers give.

Good luck and enjoy your new bike.

Brumby33
"ya gotta hold ya mouth right"

VWR Patagonia 2017
2003 Diamondback Sorrento Sport MTB

Andy01
Posts: 1275
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2020 7:31 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby Andy01 » Sat May 07, 2022 6:47 pm

Why do you think that the stock tyres, brakes, pedals etc are so bad that they need to be replaced immediately (I think "immediate point of failure" was the term used) ?

If you do think that these are so bad, why didn't you spend a bit more to get a bike with a better spec that didn't need these items replaced ? The Continental Gator Hardshell tyres are about $140 for a pair for starters.

You might be in danger of "over capitalizing" by spending more on upgrades than the cost of the bike.

As far as tubes go, the size (diameter & width) are obviously important, as well as the valve length. If you want to change the style of valve Presta to Schrader tubes for example, be aware that the hole in the rim is smaller for a Presta valve but it can easily be drilled out to take a Schrader valve.

A decent kit (not great quality but would get you started) is a Aldi BikeMate kit. They can also be found on eBay, Amazon etc I believe as Aldi bike special buys usually pops up around August/September.

A bike work stand is very useful as well, thought perhaps not that necessary as you have no derailleurs to fiddle with.

computer_athlete
Posts: 21
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2022 12:21 am

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby computer_athlete » Sat May 07, 2022 7:38 pm

P!N20 wrote:
Fri May 06, 2022 10:38 pm
You’ll learn as you go. You’ll make mistakes and have long walks home. It’s all part of the fun!
This is how I like to view things too!

bychosis wrote:
Fri May 06, 2022 10:42 pm
Enjoy the riding, suffer the ‘adventures’.

Mobile phone is no 1 ‘spare’, not hard to call for backup these days. Even if it’s a taxi or Uber.

Spare tube and/or patch kit. A compact pump. Make sure you know what you are doing before you get stuck a long way from home.

I used to go ultra prepared. Lately, it’s spare tube only, but my commuter bike has tyre liners for puncture protection and the MTB is tubeless with sealant. It’s handy to carry a Schraeder adaptor if you’ve got presta valves so you can use a servo pump instead of a mini pump.

Don’t worry about upgrading your ride unless something fails. You’ll be better served by saving for a higher spec’d bike.
Good point re the mobile phone — a lot less scary a situation to be stuck far from home these days.

Tim wrote:
Sat May 07, 2022 6:09 am
For years and years all I have carried is a small pump, tube, tyre levers and a Lezyne pack of instant patches. Park Tools patches haven't worked for me but twice now the Lezyne patches have.
Good at-home maintenance has prevented any roadside mechanical failures (other than frayed shifter cables).
This is the pump. It's been good and reliable. Worth the price and squeezes in enough pressure to continue happily riding. Works on Presta and Schraeder valves;

https://www.bikebug.com/lezyne-sport-dr ... 20351.html
Sounds great. Sounds like the pump, tube, a few tools and a patch kit will be enough of an early purchase.

Gordonhooker wrote:
Sat May 07, 2022 6:30 am
Don't be in a rush to buy everything you can think of until you are sure riding a bicycle is for you. Basic get out of trouble on ride kit, tube, tyre levers, spanner to fit wheel nuts and a multi-tool that includes allen keys. Welcome aboard the forum and enjoy your riding.
Thanks!

brumby33 wrote:
Sat May 07, 2022 8:38 am
Hey CA, depending on where you live eg City, suburban or regional (rural) it's starting to get a bit cold now, there's definitely a nip in the air so you might want to think of what you might wear whilst riding.

Layers are the best bet where you can shed them off as you get hot then you've got them when you're cooled down. Maybe a wet weather jacket of some kind. Doesn't have to be one of the real expensive light ones to start, I used my flouro wet weather jacket from work and it could can withstand an 80kph ride in wet weather home from work for about 35-40 minutes without any water getting in and I've ridden my bicycle with it too and it doesn't stick to you like some jackets do, it tends to breath ok if you don't push it. You can get them in any work wear store and they have a mesh inside to stop you sweating.....whilst it's a bit bulky to roll up, they arn't heavy.
With the bottoms in wet weather i use a simple pair of motorcycle pull over plastic pants (black) in winter they arn't too bad because generally you would have long pants or jeans on anyway. But if you want to go the whole hog with lycra everything, there's a lot available for you too unless you are a big bloke like me....cycling kit are made by those who think every cyclists are stick figures. Watch a few youtube videos to see how others ride in weather conditions that are worse than that in Australia, those who ride 12 Months of the year in locations like Canada and Europe have my respect lol.
Cheers. I'm in Melbourne and will be mostly riding through the CBD. I've been doing a bit of reading on the clothing topic and I think I've mostly decided to just brave the elements at least for my top half; I tend to sweat heaps around my chest anyway, so not much point trying to keep the rain out. The bottom half might need a bit more protection though. Also I probably fit the definition of big...6'6"?

You didn't mention what kind of bike you are buying at first but if it's possible to to put on a rear rack and 1 or 2 panniers bags on the back, it'll help to keep the weight off your body with backpacks and gives you somewhere to store your bicycling clothes and maybe a spot of shopping on the way home....believe me, unless your riding a full on road bike, you'll appreciate the storage options that panniers give.

Good luck and enjoy your new bike.

Brumby33
Haha, oh, it's mentioned, just buried somewhere deep within the many paragraphs! ;) I'm getting — in fact I got — a single speed Reid Harrier 2.0. I like the idea of panniers too, and will definitely be looking into them more. I wouldn't even mind getting a basket though I suspect they're not too aerodynamic (something I care a little about) or cool (something I care not very much about). :D

Andy01 wrote:
Sat May 07, 2022 6:47 pm
Why do you think that the stock tyres, brakes, pedals etc are so bad that they need to be replaced immediately (I think "immediate point of failure" was the term used) ?
Basically that's what I've seen reading a few hundred forum posts, online comments and reviews. Many people mentioned the poor quality parts and builds for Reid bikes, and I looked up a few of the individual components and they tended to have bad reviews. With that said, the overall tenor of the opinions regarding Reid bikes was that they were still perfectly serviceable as a basic commuter ride. I also made sure to get a model with a chromoly frame; I don't know how much I'd have noticed the difference, but obviously the less weight the better.

If you do think that these are so bad, why didn't you spend a bit more to get a bike with a better spec that didn't need these items replaced ? The Continental Gator Hardshell tyres are about $140 for a pair for starters.

You might be in danger of "over capitalizing" by spending more on upgrades than the cost of the bike.
I completely understand your scepticism but basically I found this approach to balance the various possibilities I see for me in the short to medium-term: the bike should be basically okay (shorter lifespan of the components notwithstanding) as-is if I decide not to upgrade anything, but the fact that there are easy pathways to certain component upgrades is also attractive, because I want to learn more about the mechanics of the whole enterprise, and that will be easier if I get into the habit of tinkering around and changing parts myself. Of course, I could do that with the parts as they are (removing things and putting them back), but I also know myself, and without the extra incentive I probably never would. Essentially I'm kind of psychologically off-setting the costs of any new components with the benefits I think I'll accrue from learning and added motivation.

As far as tubes go, the size (diameter & width) are obviously important, as well as the valve length. If you want to change the style of valve Presta to Schrader tubes for example, be aware that the hole in the rim is smaller for a Presta valve but it can easily be drilled out to take a Schrader valve.

A decent kit (not great quality but would get you started) is a Aldi BikeMate kit. They can also be found on eBay, Amazon etc I believe as Aldi bike special buys usually pops up around August/September.

A bike work stand is very useful as well, thought perhaps not that necessary as you have no derailleurs to fiddle with.
Bike stand might be a good purchase eventually but the other stuff sounds handy now; thank you!

User avatar
trailgumby
Posts: 15469
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 5:30 pm
Location: Northern Beaches, Sydney
Contact:

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby trailgumby » Sat May 07, 2022 8:28 pm

computer_athlete wrote:
Sat May 07, 2022 7:38 pm
Cheers. I'm in Melbourne and will be mostly riding through the CBD. I've been doing a bit of reading on the clothing topic and I think I've mostly decided to just brave the elements at least for my top half; I tend to sweat heaps around my chest anyway, so not much point trying to keep the rain out. The bottom half might need a bit more protection though. Also I probably fit the definition of big...6'6"?
'
If I may make a suggestion, I'd reverse that. Upper half tends to feel the gold a lot more, because below the waist is where the action is. By which I mean your legs :P :lol:

Upper half has a lot less demand placed on it unless you are mountain biking, in which case you're getting a full body workout. I would even recommend a buff and cycling cap as you lose a lot of heat out of the top of your head. If you are using an unvented skate type helmet, that may change of course.

computer_athlete
Posts: 21
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2022 12:21 am

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby computer_athlete » Sat May 07, 2022 8:43 pm

trailgumby wrote:
Sat May 07, 2022 8:28 pm
computer_athlete wrote:
Sat May 07, 2022 7:38 pm
Cheers. I'm in Melbourne and will be mostly riding through the CBD. I've been doing a bit of reading on the clothing topic and I think I've mostly decided to just brave the elements at least for my top half; I tend to sweat heaps around my chest anyway, so not much point trying to keep the rain out. The bottom half might need a bit more protection though. Also I probably fit the definition of big...6'6"?
'
If I may make a suggestion, I'd reverse that. Upper half tends to feel the gold a lot more, because below the waist is where the action is. By which I mean your legs :P :lol:

Upper half has a lot less demand placed on it unless you are mountain biking, in which case you're getting a full body workout. I would even recommend a buff and cycling cap as you lose a lot of heat out of the top of your head. If you are using an unvented skate type helmet, that may change of course.
As logical as that is, my experience (admittedly not riding a bike) is that even when it's my legs getting a workout, it's my upper body that gets hot and sweaty! At the moment I walk the 4km each way to work and back, and I'm usually very damp by the end of the journey; even if I start in a jacket or jumper I'm usually down to a t-shirt by the end, even in colder months.

Cycling's going to involve a bit more wind chill though, so we'll see how things change!

Edit: Just to be clear, I'm not saying the wind chill won't apply to me. I'll take the coolness factor into account when choosing what to wear or buying new clothing — thanks!

Andy01
Posts: 1275
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2020 7:31 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby Andy01 » Sun May 08, 2022 5:42 pm

"I also made sure to get a model with a chromoly frame; I don't know how much I'd have noticed the difference, but obviously the less weight the better."

I might be wrong with regard to bike frames, but as a mechanical engineer, chrome-moly is a steel alloy that has the same density as steel (give or take a smidgen). Now whether a steel framed Reid is lighter than a aluminium frame or not, I would not be certain, but I would doubt that it would be lighter than aluminium frame.

I am not familiar with the Melbourne CBD area - it may well be pretty flat, but living in Brisbane I would never consider a single speed bike - gears are very useful on a commute when a hill appears :D I suppose if the commute is only 4km, then unless there are steep hills that might involve getting off and walking, the short distance should be manageable even if the going gets a bit tough at times.

I hope it all works out for you.

computer_athlete
Posts: 21
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2022 12:21 am

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby computer_athlete » Sun May 08, 2022 9:19 pm

Andy01 wrote:
Sun May 08, 2022 5:42 pm
"I also made sure to get a model with a chromoly frame; I don't know how much I'd have noticed the difference, but obviously the less weight the better."

I might be wrong with regard to bike frames, but as a mechanical engineer, chrome-moly is a steel alloy that has the same density as steel (give or take a smidgen). Now whether a steel framed Reid is lighter than a aluminium frame or not, I would not be certain, but I would doubt that it would be lighter than aluminium frame.
Interesting! I'm trying to think back to what I explicitly read about the differences between steel and the chromoly/chrome-moly frames; I think I may have jumped to the conclusion that the latter would weigh less. Either way, people generally seemed to recommend it over steel — perhaps there are other reasons, or perhaps I misunderstood.

I am not familiar with the Melbourne CBD area - it may well be pretty flat, but living in Brisbane I would never consider a single speed bike - gears are very useful on a commute when a hill appears :D I suppose if the commute is only 4km, then unless there are steep hills that might involve getting off and walking, the short distance should be manageable even if the going gets a bit tough at times.
Flat enough! I actually had a single speed bike last year for a few short weeks before it was stolen, and I rode to work and back a couple of times; there are a couple of inclines but nothing that seemed strenuous to the point that it would force me to walk. I am lucky to be located where I am in that regard.

I hope it all works out for you.
Thanks. :)

User avatar
bychosis
Posts: 7265
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:10 pm
Location: Lake Macquarie

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby bychosis » Sun May 08, 2022 10:13 pm

Cro-mo is ‘better’ steel. Not sure the metallurgical reasons but could be improved strength and rust resistance. Combine those and you can build the same strength frame with less material (typically thinner sidewalks).

Cro-mo is preffered over aluminium by some, particularly on road bikes. Aluminium doesn’t rust, but it does suffer fatigue so any frame flex needs to be minimised which can lead to ‘harsh’ ride.
bychosis (bahy-koh-sis): A mental disorder of delusions indicating impaired contact with a reality of no bicycles.

DarkRider
Posts: 46
Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2022 9:40 am

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby DarkRider » Mon May 09, 2022 6:28 am

computer_athlete wrote:
Sat May 07, 2022 8:43 pm

As logical as that is, my experience (admittedly not riding a bike) is that even when it's my legs getting a workout, it's my upper body that gets hot and sweaty! At the moment I walk the 4km each way to work and back, and I'm usually very damp by the end of the journey; even if I start in a jacket or jumper I'm usually down to a t-shirt by the end, even in colder months.

Cycling's going to involve a bit more wind chill though, so we'll see how things change!

Edit: Just to be clear, I'm not saying the wind chill won't apply to me. I'll take the coolness factor into account when choosing what to wear or buying new clothing — thanks!
As someone who followed a similar path I can tell you my experience is not what I thought it would be. I used to walk 8-10ks every morning from about 5am. Unless it as really windy or raining before I left I'd walk the streets wearing only shorts and a hi-vis shirt be it summer or winter. Even morning where it was in the negative it didn't bother me, after the first half a kilometre or so I'd be warm enough that the cold wasn't an issue. I figured the bike would be the same deal but it's not.

The last two weeks or so temps have been down but not even into the negatives yet I've already bitten the bullet and bought long sleeves and long fingered gloves. I wont bother with long pants, but the wind chill factor at 2 degrees when I get over about 25kph is annoying. I can put up with it on my arms but not my fingers. I wont go as far as wearing a wind jacket so I don't know how hot they get but I find the long sleeve shirts don't get me any hotter than short sleeves, but they definitely cut down the wind chill on the arms.

Andy01
Posts: 1275
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2020 7:31 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby Andy01 » Mon May 09, 2022 8:03 am

computer_athlete wrote:
Sun May 08, 2022 9:19 pm
Andy01 wrote:
Sun May 08, 2022 5:42 pm
"I also made sure to get a model with a chromoly frame; I don't know how much I'd have noticed the difference, but obviously the less weight the better."

I might be wrong with regard to bike frames, but as a mechanical engineer, chrome-moly is a steel alloy that has the same density as steel (give or take a smidgen). Now whether a steel framed Reid is lighter than a aluminium frame or not, I would not be certain, but I would doubt that it would be lighter than aluminium frame.
Interesting! I'm trying to think back to what I explicitly read about the differences between steel and the chromoly/chrome-moly frames; I think I may have jumped to the conclusion that the latter would weigh less. Either way, people generally seemed to recommend it over steel — perhaps there are other reasons, or perhaps I misunderstood.

I am not familiar with the Melbourne CBD area - it may well be pretty flat, but living in Brisbane I would never consider a single speed bike - gears are very useful on a commute when a hill appears :D I suppose if the commute is only 4km, then unless there are steep hills that might involve getting off and walking, the short distance should be manageable even if the going gets a bit tough at times.
Flat enough! I actually had a single speed bike last year for a few short weeks before it was stolen, and I rode to work and back a couple of times; there are a couple of inclines but nothing that seemed strenuous to the point that it would force me to walk. I am lucky to be located where I am in that regard.

I hope it all works out for you.
Thanks. :)
Chrome moly steel is just steel with other "chemicals" (molybdenum etc) added to increase strength so that the wall thickness of the tube "might" be fractionally thinner than standard mild steel. Nothing more exotic than that.

computer_athlete
Posts: 21
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2022 12:21 am

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby computer_athlete » Mon May 09, 2022 11:00 am

DarkRider wrote:
Mon May 09, 2022 6:28 am
computer_athlete wrote:
Sat May 07, 2022 8:43 pm

As logical as that is, my experience (admittedly not riding a bike) is that even when it's my legs getting a workout, it's my upper body that gets hot and sweaty! At the moment I walk the 4km each way to work and back, and I'm usually very damp by the end of the journey; even if I start in a jacket or jumper I'm usually down to a t-shirt by the end, even in colder months.

Cycling's going to involve a bit more wind chill though, so we'll see how things change!

Edit: Just to be clear, I'm not saying the wind chill won't apply to me. I'll take the coolness factor into account when choosing what to wear or buying new clothing — thanks!
As someone who followed a similar path I can tell you my experience is not what I thought it would be. I used to walk 8-10ks every morning from about 5am. Unless it as really windy or raining before I left I'd walk the streets wearing only shorts and a hi-vis shirt be it summer or winter. Even morning where it was in the negative it didn't bother me, after the first half a kilometre or so I'd be warm enough that the cold wasn't an issue. I figured the bike would be the same deal but it's not.

The last two weeks or so temps have been down but not even into the negatives yet I've already bitten the bullet and bought long sleeves and long fingered gloves. I wont bother with long pants, but the wind chill factor at 2 degrees when I get over about 25kph is annoying. I can put up with it on my arms but not my fingers. I wont go as far as wearing a wind jacket so I don't know how hot they get but I find the long sleeve shirts don't get me any hotter than short sleeves, but they definitely cut down the wind chill on the arms.
This reminds me of when I lived in Toronto for a short period of time. It got down to minus fifteen a few times and it felt pretty cold. I was taking a trip to Montreal, where the temperature was similar, but I was warned about the wind chill. “How much worse could it be”, I wondered. A lot bloody worse, as it turns out. I lasted about fifteen minutes off the train before I had to buy thermals. So yeah, sounds like good advice — thanks.

User avatar
MattyK
Posts: 3256
Joined: Fri Oct 01, 2010 1:07 pm
Location: Melbourne

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby MattyK » Tue May 10, 2022 9:19 am

Andy01 wrote:
Mon May 09, 2022 8:03 am
Chrome moly steel is just steel with other "chemicals" (molybdenum etc) added to increase strength so that the wall thickness of the tube "might" be fractionally thinner than standard mild steel. Nothing more exotic than that.
As a mechanical engineer you'd know that you wouldn't spec a different (more expensive) material unless it was going to bring you benefits related to its properties. Cro-Mo is specified because it has a higher specific strength, which allows the designer to either use less of it, or make a stronger product, or both.

User avatar
antigee
Posts: 1033
Joined: Sun Sep 01, 2013 10:58 am
Location: just off the Yarra Trail but not lurking in the bushes

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby antigee » Tue May 10, 2022 11:51 am

Andy01 wrote:
Mon May 09, 2022 8:03 am

........................Chrome moly steel is just steel with other "chemicals" (molybdenum etc) added to increase strength so that the wall thickness of the tube "might" be fractionally thinner than standard mild steel. Nothing more exotic than that.
I guess 102years (or so) of drawing expertise and heat treatment refinement from Columbus should be relegated to the scams post 8)

Andy01
Posts: 1275
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2020 7:31 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby Andy01 » Tue May 10, 2022 1:31 pm

MattyK wrote:
Tue May 10, 2022 9:19 am
Andy01 wrote:
Mon May 09, 2022 8:03 am
Chrome moly steel is just steel with other "chemicals" (molybdenum etc) added to increase strength so that the wall thickness of the tube "might" be fractionally thinner than standard mild steel. Nothing more exotic than that.
As a mechanical engineer you'd know that you wouldn't spec a different (more expensive) material unless it was going to bring you benefits related to its properties. Cro-Mo is specified because it has a higher specific strength, which allows the designer to either use less of it, or make a stronger product, or both.
Different steels are more often specified for "other" properties than yield (or ultimate) tensile strength if there isn't a huge difference - things like workability, weldability, formability, the need (or lack/reduction of) for post-processing steps like stress relief or post-weld cleaning or heat treatment.

Obviously with larger sections it may mean the difference between a Schedule 80 or Schedule 160 pipe for example, but I am not sure that this would be the case with a cheaper bicycle frame, which most likely uses a standard sized pipe for the fabrication.

Having said that AISI 4140 ( a typical chrome moly steel) has a yield strength of 415MPa and AISI 1020 (a very general purpose steel, and may not be well suited to bicycle tubing - I have no idea) has a yield strength of 350Mpa, which is less than 20% lower.

I would guess (and may well be wrong) that most (especially cheaper) steel bike frames would use a "standard" off-the-shelf tube - meaning a standard diameter and wall thickness, so depending on what is available may dictate whether the 18% weight saving (due to higher strength) can be realised or not. It may, however, allow the frame to be rated for a higher weight rating ? But the weight rating was not mentioned by the OP - only the weight of the frame/bike.
Last edited by Andy01 on Tue May 10, 2022 1:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Andy01
Posts: 1275
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2020 7:31 pm
Location: Brisbane

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby Andy01 » Tue May 10, 2022 1:49 pm

antigee wrote:
Tue May 10, 2022 11:51 am
Andy01 wrote:
Mon May 09, 2022 8:03 am

........................Chrome moly steel is just steel with other "chemicals" (molybdenum etc) added to increase strength so that the wall thickness of the tube "might" be fractionally thinner than standard mild steel. Nothing more exotic than that.
I guess 102years (or so) of drawing expertise and heat treatment refinement from Columbus should be relegated to the scams post 8)
I am not sure exactly what you mean by this - I am guessing an attempt at sarcasm ?

I am not suggesting that it is not good practice to use a higher grade of steel to make frames. I am suggesting that unless a specific custom size (diameter and/or wall thickness) pipe is used, it seems unlikely that the weight saving would be realised unless the design required a larger size of standard steel compared to CrMo steel - which might be the case, but with a relatively small difference in strength (less than 20% - read post above) the pipes may fall within the same standard pipe dimensions because there is generally not a large variety of wall thicknesses available with small diameter steel pipes.

The OP was under that impression that his/her CrMo frame was better because it was a lighter material, which is not the case.

AISI 1020 has a typical density of 7800-7900kg/m³ and AISi 4140 (CrMo) has a typical density of 7700-8030kg/m³, so to all intents the CrMo is the same or slightly heavier than standard general purpose steel, so unless you can use a thinner wall thickness tube there is likely to be no weight saving - but if the same tube dimensions are used it should be around 18% stronger.

Unless a customer asks a steel mill for a special order custom size (wall thickness and/or diameter), which is usually prohibitively expensive (but perhaps with premium frames like Columbus, this IS the case, but I doubt that the same would apply for the frame of a $350 SS Reid bike), then a choice must be made from the standard pipe dimensions that are available. In practice weight savings (for the same frame design strength) may or may not be realised - it just depends on where the design spits out the dimensions and how they line up with standard commercially available pipe sizes.

User avatar
MattyK
Posts: 3256
Joined: Fri Oct 01, 2010 1:07 pm
Location: Melbourne

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby MattyK » Tue May 10, 2022 3:10 pm

That's the whole point. Frame makers DO use thinner walls on higher grade frames, BECAUSE the material lets them. Frame tubing suppliers (Columbus, Tange, Reynolds etc) know this, they make thinner and/or butted or ovalised tubing out of the higher grades to save weight, add compliance, etc without losing strength. They may be "commercially available" tubes but they're still very specialised, they're not plumbing or fencing pipes from Bunnings.

User avatar
Thoglette
Posts: 6618
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2009 1:01 pm

Re: Don't leave home without...

Postby Thoglette » Tue May 10, 2022 5:43 pm

Andy01 wrote:
Tue May 10, 2022 1:31 pm

Having said that AISI 4140 ( a typical chrome moly steel) has a yield strength of 415MPa and AISI 1020 (a very general purpose steel, and may not be well suited to bicycle tubing - I have no idea) has a yield strength of 350Mpa, which is less than 20% lower.
In much less time than it took you to type all of that, a decent search engine would have told you that 1020 and 4130 are common frame materials.

And that bicycle frame tube makers (Reynolds, Columbus, Tange to name just a few) have a long history (70+ years) of using proprietary tube profiles (especially “butting”) metals and heat treatment to manage weight, flexibility and ultimate strength.

There’s a short article which outlines most of the basics here

Section through a butted tube (tange)
Image from http://cyclespeugeot.web.fc2.com/remini ... ange86.htm

Anyway, to answer the OPs actual upgraditus question: yes, tyres !
Stop handing them the stick! - Dave Moulton
"People are worthy of respect, ideas are not." Peter Ellerton, UQ

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users